EliteXC Done

Fozzy

f4wonline.com is reporting that fighters were told today that CBS has pulled out of talks to buy the company, which was their last hope of surviving

It was Seth Petruzelli's comments on that radio show about being offered a bonus to keep the fight standing that soured CBS on the deal

Fighters scheduled to fight on their next show have been told that the show's off, but nothing official has been announced yet. I think Nick Diaz, Scott Smith, Robbie Lawler, Eddie Alvarez and Feijao were scheduled for that

I'd say that Affliction will pick a few of them up before they go out of business themselves. There's a few who I'd like to see in the UFC (Kimbo :pac:)

Fozzy

A few more notes courtesy of Dave Meltzer:

The management of some fighters have been calling the UFC tonight looking to see if there's any interest in their fighters

Meltzer was 100% sure that the CBS deal would be done before Petruzelli made those comments. CBS were very positive about EliteXC in the days after the last show and it was specifically the scandal caused by what Petruzelli said that made the deal collapse

ShawnRaven

This was in the post for a while though.
Affliction's chances of survival look dim to me as well, they had to reschedule their last card to January 09 after only having 1 PPV under their belt, which doesn't indicate a great start to me.

Fozzy

ShawnRaven wrote: »

This was in the post for a while though.

Not really. If CBS had bought them (which they were set on doing until the controversy following Petruzelli's comments) then they'd have survived

ShawnRaven

Fozzy wrote: »

Not really. If CBS had bought them (which they were set on doing until the controversy following Petruzelli's comments) then they'd have survived

I meant in the sense that EliteXC has been on shaky ground for a while. And a deal is never a deal until pen hits paper, and you know as well as I do that a signing can be put off forever and a lifetime.

As for Seth Petruzelli's comments, they'll probably be forever be remembered as the final nail in the coffin for EliteXC. That said, he did knock the f*ck out of Kimbo Slice in what, 14-15 seconds? Dana White may or may not see dollar signs in him, despite his previous UFC record. Times do indeed change.

rovert

LOL KIMBO

Oh to be Dana White today. :P

rovert

I havent listened to the audio yet but poor Gina is all Ive got to say.

Charlie3dan

Wouldn't like to be Seth Petruzelli right now....

If it means some of the fighters from Elite XC end up in UFC and we get to see exciting fights that may not have happened otherwise, then it's no bad thing.

Poor Gina indeed

Dragan

Fozzy wrote: »

Not really. If CBS had bought them (which they were set on doing until the controversy following Petruzelli's comments) then they'd have survived

You can't just talk about EliteXC though, thats like talking about the business side of the UFC without mentioning Zuffa, which at the end of the day is where the money comes from.

It's won't ever be the UFC going bankrupt, it will be Zuffa that make the decision to stop backing the brand, which is obviously the steps that ProElite have finally taken.

As such, ProElite were always ****ed and this was coming for a while. Banking on a sale to ensure the survival of your brand is also a bad idea.

I also think it's a bit much to rate the entire deal falling through on Seth's comment. Sure, it may have played some part of it but the venture was either going to be finacially viable or it wasn't and for me, the fact that one fighters comments could be given so much weight shows exactly how in the **** EliteXC was from ProElite mismanagement.

rovert

Dragan wrote: »

I also think it's a bit much to rate the entire deal falling through on Seth's comment. Sure, it may have played some part of it but the venture was either going to be finacially viable or it wasn't and for me, the fact that one fighters comments could be given so much weight shows exactly how in the **** EliteXC was from ProElite mismanagement.

The deal with CBS was as close to being signed as any deal could be it WAS the Seth deal which lead CBS to back out. CBS didn’t what to associated via the media perception with fight fixing whether it actually happened or not.

dunkamania

This is bad news for fans, even if you never watched an EliteXc fight.
Zuffas stranglehold on the industry just got stronger

Colm_OReilly

Yep, the UFC does indeed have all the cards. I wonder, hypothetically

a) what would a show have to do to survive in the States?
b) could someone take Zuffa to court over it's monopoly?

Dragan

Colm_OReilly wrote: »

Yep, the UFC does indeed have all the cards. I wonder, hypothetically

a) what would a show have to do to survive in the States?
b) could someone take Zuffa to court over it's monopoly?

At the end of the day the reason the UFC have such a monopoly is because they are better managed than any of the other Orgs. They have been around longer, they have put in a massive amount of work in the States to get things legalised, to get cleared by AC's in the States that still do not allow MMA.

Pride turned out to be crooked, the IFL was managed into the ground, EliteXC the same. Personally i find it impossible to blame Zuffa because of the failings of their competition.

People can talk about Zuffa running programing directly against other Orgs but if you are in a position to do something, then you do it. There is no law against two shows of a similar nature being shown at the same time. Thankfully.

And to take Zuffa to court for their monopoly would be, for me, a slap in the face to everyone in that company who ever worked to get it to the level it is at. I see that same thing happening all the time in business, people complaining about monopoly and companies hogging the market.

Well the simple, harsh truth is, no one is required to hold your hand, or make it easy for you to succeed, and why should they. A competitor can either come up with a product that people want to see, or they can't.

If Afflicition folds people will say the same thing, when, at the end of the day, they are paying fighters who are NOT draws way too much to fight for the American market.

I think people are far more giving of these others Orgs and the **** ups that they make, simply because they don't like Zuffa.

mirwillbeback

they pinned their hopes on Kimbo, which some on here, and I won't say who, said was a good thing.

Dragan

mirwillbeback wrote: »

they pinned their hopes on Kimbo, which some on here, and I won't say who, said was a good thing.

At the end of the day they never would have reached the audiences that they did without Kimbo. Sure, they may have had someone in the position that we, as people who understand the fight game, would see as a more fitting person but the simple fact is, from a business aspect, if that person would have been a bigger draw than Kimbo then they would have had his spot.

As such, Kimbo was the draw and they would have been morons not to use him.

The truth is that Zuffa is a well run company with brand recognition. thats the most important thing. As many casual fans know the sport as "UFC" as there are ones who know it as "MMA". Its the same as NFL in that way. The name of the company is synonomous with the brand at this stage. Which would mean that UFC going out of business with severely hurt the sport.

I'm not suprised about this. The problem promotions have is that a lot of fans feed off of personalities and pro wrestling style "angles" as much as they do the actual fights. UFC had TUF as a vehicle to get their fighters and the coaches known. people say that TUF made Forrest/Bisping/Serra's etcs careers, but the coaches reaped the benefits just as much. Look at the popularity of the lieks of Liddell/Randy/franklin etc and the bad guy element built up for the likes of Hughes/Leben/Koscheck etc helped their careers in equal measures.

No other promotion thus far has come up with a means to advertise the characters, just the fights.

For me though, EXC's biggest mistake was betting the house effectively on Kimbo. they had legit guys like Frank Shamrock, Robbie Lawlor, Cung Le etc but they banked on a youtube phenomenon who was always gonna attract a fickle following. Sure they reaped the rewards big early on but the longevity wasnt there. It was showing as he was exposed more and more as the fights went on.


Sad for us fans though with EXC gone, Affliction struggling, DREAM on the ropes and the UFC pulling counter programming stunts every time anything new comes along, we may be stuck with a UFC monopoly for a long time until a serious investor steps up.

rovert

Deleted User wrote: »

Sad for us fans though with EXC gone, Affliction struggling, DREAM on the ropes and the UFC pulling counter programming stunts every time anything new comes along, we may be stuck with a UFC monopoly for a long time until a serious investor steps up.

New capital will be VERY hard to come by for at least the next two years. So things do look bleak.

ShawnRaven

Just to add the exclamation point to rovert's statement, one has to remember that the economy over in the US is as bad if not worse than ours right now. So companies are gonna be very careful on where their money is going. Especially with the stock market crash. People are gonna be VERY wise on what they invest their money in.

I'm not so sure if CBS were as definite to sign that deal as people say they were. What Petruzelli said after the fight was vague enough. But enough for any unsure investor to pull the plug.

UFC and Zuffa have been very smart in recent years primarily because most of the time, with the fighters that they have are giving people reason to tune in on a monthly basis, either through Fight Night, their PPV's or TUF. Cornering each market they can on an MMA scale. They're catering for their consumer, and it's smart business. That and the fact that the Fertittas own casinos tend to help, not only for the capital, but it immediately gives them venues for the fights. A big advantage that their competition do not have.

But you're not being informed here of anything you don't already know, are you?

rovert

Fears have been raised by some as they think UFC are pricing themselves out of the market with there ticket prices in the States. So UFC's revenue will likely dip as well.

ShawnRaven

rovert wrote: »

Fears have been raised by some as they think UFC are pricing themselves out of the market with there ticket prices in the States. So UFC's revenue will likely dip as well.

Now that you mention that...
Maybe they already have, it might explain UFC's 2 PPV's this month? If they already own the venue's then 2 not full houses in one month will still generate revenue than one.

Roper

Colm_OReilly wrote: »

Yep, the UFC does indeed have all the cards. I wonder, hypothetically

a) what would a show have to do to survive in the States?
b) could someone take Zuffa to court over it's monopoly?

Not that I'm an expert on US anti-competition laws, but from my limited understanding of anti-monopoly legislation I would say that all they're really guilty of is overpaying lower scale fighters and increasing wages so that they attract the big names away from smaller promotions. They're not offering their product for free or something as per Microsoft and their not doing loss leadership. They're just splashing the cash which they've made by being very, very clever.

As for a) I think they'd just have to beat the UFC at their own game, in other words have lots if cash. Either that, or come up with some sort of unique selling point like perhaps the Golden Boy/ Affliction dealy that was mooted a while back. Other than that I can't see it happening. Elite tried to basically copy the UFC model and it has failed, every other gimick promo like Yamma has flopped. The GFCs, Dreams and Rumble on The Rocks of this world will never be more than just fan favourites. They won't have the popular appeal of the UFC franchise.

rovert

Colm_OReilly wrote: »

b) could someone take Zuffa to court over it's monopoly?

Unlikely as they got to their position due to out promoting other companies the same way WWE did. It is a free market.

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Now that you mention that...
Maybe they already have, it might explain UFC's 2 PPV's this month? If they already own the venue's then 2 not full houses in one month will still generate revenue than one.

The reason why UFC is running two shows this month is to be omipresent in the States while still continung their international expansion.

rovert

Dana reacts :cool: :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jm3iG5NpTtI

ShawnRaven

Dana White is God, end of.

rovert

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Dana White is God, end of.

ShawnRaven going back the point you were talking about UFC and MMA in addition tying it into the video, Dave Meltzer wrote:

Elite XC did get a gigantic increase from the CBS show, but UFC got the same kind of bump on that day, and more interest, which shows that more casual fans than not believed they were watching UFC. That should make Dana White cringe even more. In fact, in the days after the show, with the controversy regarding the fight, you see the UFC getting a slight bump and Elite XC getting no bump at all, so again, your average Internet person (let alone someone on the street who would follow it less closely) believed it was a UFC story, so from a perception standpoint in the short run, a lot of people believed it was a UFC scandal.

Derek Coleman

Wouldn't America be great if it was run by him instead of politicians who blow smoke up your ass. He has verbal diarrhea. I don't think he ever holds back.

ShawnRaven

Derek Coleman wrote: »

Wouldn't America be great if it was run by him instead of politicians who blow smoke up your ass. He has verbal diarrhea. I don't think he ever holds back.

I wouldn't say Dana has verbal diarrhea. That would imply that Dana talks sh*t. But a lot of what Dana said in that video made a f*ckload of sense.

rovert

http://www.f4wonline.com/content/view/7179/

Elite XC cleared in probe
The Florida State Boxing Commission formally closed its investigation into the Kimbo Slice vs. Seth Petruzelli match, ruling that nothing illegal took place in the match.

The irony is that it was this investigation that led to Showtime pulling out of negotiations to purchase the company, which will close its doors tomorrow. Pro Elite filed for bankruptcy because after Showtime pulled out of negotiations, Showtime claimed a breach in its loan to the company by not maintaining enough of a bank account balance, called in the loan, which forced the bankruptcy filing.

This was never in doubt but still what a sorry turn of events.

Bubs101

Could Gina not benefit from the death of Elite XC. She was a massive draw but getting a pittance due to her contract, surely someone's going to pick up women's MMA in a big way and Gina will benefit?

Fozzy

Bubs101 wrote: »

Could Gina not benefit from the death of Elite XC. She was a massive draw but getting a pittance due to her contract, surely someone's going to pick up women's MMA in a big way and Gina will benefit?

Like who? Affliction are the only ones who would be able to make any impact with a women's division at the moment, but they probably won't be around long. There's problems with a women's division too, as Gina is the only draw

Meltzer did a show the other day where he sounded really frustrated at how a lot of journalists and others are misreporting what killed EliteXC. Kimbo didn't kill them, bad management didn't kill them, it was the scandal that came about because of Seth Petruzelli's comment that killed them. CBS were dead set on buying the company after the last show's rating came in and it was specifically the controversy that made them change their mind. Without that they'd have been fine, and Kimbo would have almost single-handedly made the company survive

Dragan

Fozzy wrote: »

Meltzer did a show the other day where he sounded really frustrated at how a lot of journalists and others are misreporting what killed EliteXC. Kimbo didn't kill them, bad management didn't kill them, it was the scandal that came about because of Seth Petruzelli's comment that killed them. CBS were dead set on buying the company after the last show's rating came in and it was specifically the controversy that made them change their mind. Without that they'd have been fine, and Kimbo would have almost single-handedly made the company survive

Well i hate to say it but Meltzer is wrong. Plain and simple.

What killed EliteXC was that the needed that sale to survive.

They were bankrupt, plain and simple.

Hundreds of thousands of business don't go bust everyday because someone didn't buy them.

Elite were in the ****, needed the sale to dig them out.

Seth's comments might have stopped CBS from buying, but the point remains that EliteXC needed that sale in the first place.

And they got to that point LONG before Seth's comment.

Why are we ignoring 2 years of history, in favour of one brief comment?

Fozzy

Dragan wrote: »

Well i hate to say it but Meltzer is wrong. Plain and simple.

How dare you :pac:

They were always going to lose money anyway. Every MMA promotion in their position has so far. Good management could have limited how much they lost, but in the end they were going to need this sale anyway. And there was one thing that halted the sale

Three weeks ago all was well and good in the EliteXC world

Meltzer explained it much better than me in a huge article in the Observer this week

rovert

It was bad management from the beginning which lead the failure of the company.

rovert

According to graciefighter.com:

EliteXC representatives have vowed that they will continue operations and will be planning a show in early 2009. Most of the major EliteXC fighters under contract have been notified.

Lead counsel for the organization has informed us that contrary to popular beleif, EliteXC has not filed for bankruptcy and has merely scaled down their staff.

This will be a setback for all EliteXC fighters currently under contract as they will be unable to fight in other organizations without the express written permission of EliteXC. Barring a judicial ruling, EliteXC fighters could be hampered from signing with another organization.

However, Nick Diaz will be able to fight in Japan if terms are agreed upon with a Japanese organization due to a previous agreement with EliteXC. It is assumed that Eddie Alvarez will also be able to fight in the Far East without any EliteXC restrictions due to his previous contract with Dream.

Charlie3dan

Flogging a dead horse?

And it means they are basically preventing fighters from fighting? I wasn't all that upset to hear elite xc were done because it potentially meant we'd see some great fights happen in the ufc. But this seems the worst of both worlds.

They'll need that show in early 09 will need to be a big one, if it actually happens.

rovert

Seth from Halloween:

JohnMc1

Bubs101 wrote: »

Could Gina not benefit from the death of Elite XC.

Gina has the American Gladiators gig to fall back on so she won't be struggling to pay her bills anytime soon. If she continues in MMA she'll likely end up in Strikeforce since Kim is fighting on an upcoming card.

Gary Shaw's comments were alot more damning than Seth's. Seth's could of easily been written off as a guy being on cloud 9 following the biggest win of his career. If Shaw had a brain he would of said they gave him a bonus for either stepping up at the last minute [making Kimbo look like a legit threat] or they gave him a bonus for KO'ing Kimbo [ala UFC's KO & other "_____" of the night bonuses] Shaw for all intents and purposes admitted they fixed the fight hoping for Kimbo to KO Seth [Jarred screaming "NO!" like a woman at ringside didn't help either]

Fozzy

Their assets are up for public auction now: http://www.mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/templates/dailynews.asp?articleid=7496&zoneid=2

That will obviously include the tape library, but I wonder how many fighter's contracts might be included