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Limerick City Building Projects
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This is why you are a nobody and everyone is disagreeing with u and neil delemare is on da telly hahaha. only messing. But there is a recession. its not worse that any other time but there still is one. I'm sure you wouldn't saying all this if you were employed in Dell out in Raheen.... where over 600 people are scared of being laid off at any time. and it is going to happen. loads of call centers are dissappearing off to india. taxes have been raised to scare away multinationals... there are loads of things that are going on and the buget has made it all worse by cutting spending in education and poor areas. if u think that this is only a blip, u obviously have never been unemployed or been in an unstable job. imagine u got laid off out of the blue and was trying to find a job for ages and couldn't get one. Then relegating yourself to drawing the dole with all the heroin addicks and homeless people??? u have to broaden the picture. I don't give into the media that much but my family have been affected, my old friends in college can't get jobs in IT so are working in supermarkets if they can get ahead of the polish, My mates from school who are all plumbers and other trades can't get work, my parents moved to england to get work.... u just havn't been effected
If you look back over all of my posts man, you'll see that i've constantly said there is a recession.
I've stated time and time again that there is one.
I've simply stated that it's not as devastating as the media, and most people make out.
We have had a plastic economy with people living outside their means for 10 years.
Those people are now asked to live within their means, and they think it's the end of the world.
It's not.
Anyone who's studied world economics will vouch for that.
Black Monday in 87 has a lot more devastating than anything that's happened so far.
The economy will be weak for a few years, then it will start to grow all over again.
All I've said repeatedly, is that it's not the end of the world.0 -
lads, seriously stop with all the bickering. This thread was about building projects in Limerick not the god damn recession ( which to clarify we are in one and whoever says were not is either a millionaire untouched by financial difficulty or they are plain and simple delued)- END OF STORY!! Get back to the point of the thread.0
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I don't mean to be annoying but in fairness, I have a degree in Business and IT and have studied Economics for 4 years. This is a recession but recessions don't really do anything else. It's not like a war or anything. It may not seem like a nig deal to you or me as a matter of fact because its not hitting you directly. A recession puts people out of work and makes the cost of living more expensive. That is whats happenging. It's not the end of the world but what else do you expect from a recession. They come and go you are right. that doesn't make it ok. It's still very harsh on some family's or people. I don't think you understand. You have explained everything that is going on in the recession.... but u don't realise the impact that it has on some people. Also your comment on unemployment, People that don't work are not defined as unemployed if they choose not to work. A scumbag that doesn't want to work and collects the dole is not registered as unemployed. Someone actively looking for work and who has had a previous job is unemployed. This is why that unemployment figure does not actually mean that much. Thousands of polish people are here, collecting the dole and working handy jobs here and there, they don't count as unemployed people even though they are. We all know there is a recession on. for most people, it's not that bad at all. for some, it can be devastating. the onus is on all of us to help everyone who is effected. Not sit back and be in denial just because your life is perfect and your oblivious to what is going on aroung you. thats all I'll sayKarmafaerie wrote: »If you look back over all of my posts man, you'll see that i've constantly said there is a recession.
I've stated time and time again that there is one.
I've simply stated that it's not as devastating as the media, and most people make out.
We have had a plastic economy with people living outside their means for 10 years.
Those people are now asked to live within their means, and they think it's the end of the world.
It's not.
Anyone who's studied world economics will vouch for that.
Black Monday in 87 has a lot more devastating than anything that's happened so far.
The economy will be weak for a few years, then it will start to grow all over again.
All I've said repeatedly, is that it's not the end of the world.0 -
Well said Irishman yupirishman2008 wrote: »lads, seriously stop with all the bickering. This thread was about building projects in Limerick not the god damn recession ( which to clarify we are in one and whoever says were not is either a millionaire untouched by financial difficulty or they are plain and simple delued)- END OF STORY!! Get back to the point of the thread.0 -
Karmafaerie wrote: »If you look back over all of my posts man, you'll see that i've constantly said there is a recession.
I've stated time and time again that there is one.
I've simply stated that it's not as devastating as the media, and most people make out.
We have had a plastic economy with people living outside their means for 10 years.
Those people are now asked to live within their means, and they think it's the end of the world.
It's not.
Anyone who's studied world economics will vouch for that.
Black Monday in 87 has a lot more devastating than anything that's happened so far.
The economy will be weak for a few years, then it will start to grow all over again.
All I've said repeatedly, is that it's not the end of the world.
Your "study" of economic theory seems limited to a few wikipedia pages on the subject.
I don't think you realise the extent of the problems this time around, and just how bad things are going to get.
Recessions are cyclical, no doubt about it. But when the very core of the worlds financial system is in doubt, which is a far greater problem than the world had in recent recessions, and the only reason why banks and institutions are solvent at this point is because government assistance, you should be worried.
When the gov announces that the national pension fund will be used to recapitalize irish banks, that are basically insolvent anyway, you should realise that perhaps, there are greater problems than you can see.
And you rant about uraguay and beef, whatever website you pulled that from, funnily enough missing the fact that iceland now bankrupt.
Do you listen to the news at all?
Regarding the money for limerick, until the project starts, and there is money in the bank, I am afraid I can't see this happening anytime soon, unless willie invents a money printing device.
While I'd love to share your optimisim, i'm afraid I can't given the situation we now find ourselves in.
Analysis such as this paint a pretty grim picture.
http://www.smartmoney.com/Investing/Economy/Crisis-Turns-Global-Economies-Upside-Down/
When switzerland is in worse shape than nigeria, you know you have problems.0 -
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Karmafaerie wrote: »If you look back over all of my posts man, you'll see that i've constantly said there is a recession.
I've stated time and time again that there is one.
I've simply stated that it's not as devastating as the media, and most people make out.
We have had a plastic economy with people living outside their means for 10 years.
Those people are now asked to live within their means, and they think it's the end of the world.
It's not.
Anyone who's studied world economics will vouch for that.
Black Monday in 87 has a lot more devastating than anything that's happened so far.
The economy will be weak for a few years, then it will start to grow all over again.
All I've said repeatedly, is that it's not the end of the world.
Sorry the Loc, i have to agree with him, please dont beat me up in work, we havent even hit close to life in the 80's yet.0 -
Your "study" of economic theory seems limited to a few wikipedia pages on the subject.
I don't think you realise the extent of the problems this time around, and just how bad things are going to get.
Recessions are cyclical, no doubt about it. But when the very core of the worlds financial system is in doubt, which is a far greater problem than the world had in recent recessions, and the only reason why banks and institutions are solvent at this point is because government assistance, you should be worried.
When the gov announces that the national pension fund will be used to recapitalize irish banks, that are basically insolvent anyway, you should realise that perhaps, there are greater problems than you can see.
And you rant about uraguay and beef, whatever website you pulled that from, funnily enough missing the fact that iceland now bankrupt.
Do you listen to the news at all?
Regarding the money for limerick, until the project starts, and there is money in the bank, I am afraid I can't see this happening anytime soon, unless willie invents a money printing device.
While I'd love to share your optimisim, i'm afraid I can't given the situation we now find ourselves in.
Analysis such as this paint a pretty grim picture.
http://www.smartmoney.com/Investing/Economy/Crisis-Turns-Global-Economies-Upside-Down/
When switzerland is in worse shape than nigeria, you know you have problems.
God I hate wikipedia.
Anyone you can use google thinks that they're an expert these days.
But what's even worse is that people with half a clue, automatically assume that everyone who disagrees with them is a wikiphile!
Much worse than the actuall wiki users, ass they have an excuse.
You claim to try and educate on world economics, but know nothing about Uruguay in the 50's!
Maybe you should look it up on Wiki!
If you honestly believe that the 70's, 80's, and early 90's weren't worse than now, you are beyond reasoning with.0 -
I don't mean to be annoying but in fairness, I have a degree in Business and IT and have studied Economics for 4 years. This is a recession but recessions don't really do anything else. It's not like a war or anything. It may not seem like a nig deal to you or me as a matter of fact because its not hitting you directly. A recession puts people out of work and makes the cost of living more expensive. That is whats happenging. It's not the end of the world but what else do you expect from a recession. They come and go you are right. that doesn't make it ok. It's still very harsh on some family's or people. I don't think you understand. You have explained everything that is going on in the recession.... but u don't realise the impact that it has on some people. Also your comment on unemployment, People that don't work are not defined as unemployed if they choose not to work. A scumbag that doesn't want to work and collects the dole is not registered as unemployed. Someone actively looking for work and who has had a previous job is unemployed. This is why that unemployment figure does not actually mean that much. Thousands of polish people are here, collecting the dole and working handy jobs here and there, they don't count as unemployed people even though they are. We all know there is a recession on. for most people, it's not that bad at all. for some, it can be devastating. the onus is on all of us to help everyone who is effected. Not sit back and be in denial just because your life is perfect and your oblivious to what is going on aroung you. thats all I'll say
TL, do me one favour please and re-read my posts in this thread.
Cause you seem to have no clue as to what I'm saying.
I'll sum it all up again, just for emphasis.
-I never once said there was no recession.
-I said, and I quote "People who buy into the massive doom and gloom are worse than those who ignore it.
The government, and media put out this idea of an economic doomsday, and it's amazing how many people buy it hook line and sinker".
Right there, in my first sentance, I clearly say there's a recession.
-The media should be more responsible, as there are people out there (and here it would seem), who honestly believe that the world is coming to an end!
-We live in the sky news generation, where everyone seems to think that everything is happening for the first time.
-People have been living outside their means for over a decade, and it's simply time for them to kop on.
Simple.
Now as for your ideas on the unemployment figures, I'm sorry man, but you make no sence.
A sumbag who doesn't work isn't unemployed?!!!
Where do you think the unemployment figures come from?!!
You may not count them, but the official figures, those printed in the media, do.
And your argument about foreign nationals getting paid nder the counter works against you!
That would mean that there are less unemployed than is made out! (Also, it's fair to say that there's every bit as many Irish getting paid on the side!)
There has been a slight increase in unemployment.
And it will rise for a few years, but then it'll decrease again for a few years.
Lastly, I don't know what you seem to think I am, but you seem to have the impression of me living on a marble spire drinking tea our of a golden cup with my pinky turned up!
I know first hand about the recesion.
I have friends and family who have lost work.
And are having trouble to get more work.
I grew up with next to nothing, and that instilled in me the kop on to make sure that I never wasted.
I have a very real idea of what a differrence the economic downturn will have on some people, but the reaction of the majority of people because of this whole media bombardment, is one of "oh my God the sky is falling, we're doomed! DOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMEEEEEEDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!!!!".
I'm simply saying that it's not good, but it's not the end of the world.
And don't forget, for every company in economic trouble, there're two making a massive profit but the media won't sell papers reporting that.
Extra.
Extra.
Read all about it.
Most companies in the world still raking in trillions.
Anyway, I'm out.
Say hi to your mother for me.0 -
jesus no offence but I think you're a bit on the special side... I know you said there was a recession you clown. I said that you were right on some aspects of your argument.
"I'm simply saying that it's not good, but it's not the end of the world." This is exactly what I said. I honestly think you are mentally slow. As for the unemployment figures, if you don't believe me, you should look it up or actually study economics. Because thats a fact. The gov do NOT regard people who do not want to work as unemployed.
Anyway there is no need to slag people's mothers for no reason. you should be getting reported for being so arrogant and well, one of those rich rugby jocks who think they know everything about everyone. Don't be such a loser.0 -
Chill out LOC.0
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Arre you asking me to chill out??? did you not see what he wrote??? for no reasone???? "Say hi to your mother for me." What kind of a toss says that?Builderfromhell wrote: »Chill out LOC.0 -
TheLoc, honestly, just leave it. This is getting to nowhere. Trust me. You're wasting your time. We all have our experience here with that poster...0
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Ok thanks for the advise. I'll leave it.talkingclock wrote: »TheLoc, honestly, just leave it. This is getting to nowhere. Trust me. You're wasting your time. We all have our experience here with that poster...
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jesus no offence but I think you're a bit on the special side... I know you said there was a recession you clown. I said that you were right on some aspects of your argument.
"I'm simply saying that it's not good, but it's not the end of the world." This is exactly what I said. I honestly think you are mentally slow. As for the unemployment figures, if you don't believe me, you should look it up or actually study economics. Because thats a fact. The gov do NOT regard people who do not want to work as unemployed.
Anyway there is no need to slag people's mothers for no reason. you should be getting reported for being so arrogant and well, one of those rich rugby jocks who think they know everything about everyone. Don't be such a loser.
You don't get out much, do you?!
"Say hi to your mother for me", is a very popular quote from a massively viewed SNL skit by Adam Sandberg on Mark Wahlburg.
A skit that's been all over the internet for a month or so.
It's a joke on how Mark Wahlberg ends all conversations, so I did the same.
I was being topical.
Which of course, lead to you repeatedly trying to insult me by implying I had a mental disorder.
Personally, I don't give two f***s what you think about me.
I do however believe that the very fact that you consider having a mental disorder to be an insult says a lot about the kind of person you are.
Speaking as somebody who has worked with mentaly challenged children in the past, I think you should be looking in a mirror, and reporting yourself.
Wahlberg had the sketch pretty much removed, but I'm sure you'll get the idea from this.
Feeling better now?!!
P.S: I'm as far from rich, and a jock as you can get.
But way to go with your generalising again. I'm a munster fan, therefore I fit into whatever mold you want.
Not a David McWilliams fan by any chance, cause with your penchant for defunct stereotyping, it would explain a lot of your economic beliefs.0 -
talkingclock wrote: »TheLoc, honestly, just leave it. This is getting to nowhere. Trust me. You're wasting your time. We all have our experience here with that poster...
Ahh TC, how I've missed you.
Your little hissyfits.
You hidding in the corner with your hands over your ears going "la la la I can't hear you".
The fact that you actually come out and say things like facts shouldn't have a place in a discussion!
In fact, if my memory serves me correctly, the last time we were in a little chat, three or four posters deciding to ignore you.
But don't worry my friend, I'll never ignore you.
you're way too entertaining.
But I'm sure you won in your own head, and that's what really matters isn't old boy.0 -
*yawn* why isnt this thread locked yet, its gone way off topic !0
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Ara no - there is so much we can learn about Uruguay in the 50's.....Zzzzzz.
Beef!
Beef!
Uraguay.
Zzzzz
I would have thought that the icelandic experiance would be a lot more relavant to us, but you seemed to have missed what happened there.
We're only starting this downcycle, hence the unemployment is low. Expect all companies to reduce their workforce by ~10% or more in the near future, and see how that looks on your graph. The government will be forced to do a similar move in the public sector (a good thing here at least), and the fun will start then.
I hope you were not relying on a pension from the gov, as they are about to give it away, to keep some irresponsible bankers afloat. Considering it's your money as well as everyone elses, you should be concerned.0 -
The Limerick forum has been nothing but a joke the last few days,every thread seems to be dragged off topic.0
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Ok - to recap.
Gov got no money.
This project is dead.0 -
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listen lads seriously your ruining this thread, if you want to talk about the recession then go and make your own thread. Just stop using this to display your theories (wikipedias actually) and stop trying to be economists for christ sake its getting sad......really really sad.0
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Ara no - there is so much we can learn about Uruguay in the 50's.....Zzzzzz.
Beef!
Beef!
Uraguay.
Zzzzz
I would have thought that the icelandic experiance would be a lot more relavant to us, but you seemed to have missed what happened there.
We're only starting this downcycle, hence the unemployment is low. Expect all companies to reduce their workforce by ~10% or more in the near future, and see how that looks on your graph. The government will be forced to do a similar move in the public sector (a good thing here at least), and the fun will start then.
I hope you were not relying on a pension from the gov, as they are about to give it away, to keep some irresponsible bankers afloat. Considering it's your money as well as everyone elses, you should be concerned.
I'm sorry, but is Iceland actually bankrupt?
Iceland is still officially the fifth richest country in the world (per capita).
And it's got an unemployment level of 2.3%
Now anyone who knows as much as you will surely be able to explain exactly what problems Iceland is facing right now?!
No.
Allow me then.
Iceland became rich for one eason.
It took a massive risk and pretty much developed it's economy on banking.
The whole country became a massive bank.
Which is exactly what Uruguay did, when it had one of the largest economies in the world, over 70% of which was in the beef industry, as Uruguay used to supply about half of the worlds armies with beef.
Now Iceland is in nowhere near as bad a situation, as it is not completely reliant on the banking industry.
Iceland has plenty of time to enact a soloution, while when the beef market crashed, Uruguay had nothing.
Iceland was an artificially rich country.
It will now fall down the rich list, and will go as low as around 50 I'd say.
It will effet most of the country in a very serious way, but as most of the workforce in Iceland is not employed by the industry in jeapordy, it will not have anywhere near the same effect as the complete collapse of the Uruguayan market.
Personally I'd guess that Icelands unemployment rate may rise as high as 10%.
Which as bad as that is, is still roughly the rate in France for instance on a constant level.
Now the very fact that you brought up Iceland as an example of how we're all doomed, shows how much the media are effecting peoples oppinions.
Iceland is not "bankrupt", and even if it was, it would in now way, shape, or form, effect the general populace in the ways suggested here.
It will be bad.
It'll be very bad.
But Within 5-10 years they'll be comfortable and stable.
Now even if Iceland was colapsing completely, the only similarity to Ireland, would be the almost identical spelling of the countries names!
Ireland is not reliant on only one industry.
Iceland can not attract a fraction of the foreign investment that we can.
Our politicians have wasted our economy, not gambled with it. There's a difference.
And as for your suggestin that all of our companies are going to shed 10% of their workforce!
Wow!
You should be writting gothic poetry.
Now if you want further education on the miriad of ways that Iceland has very little bearing on us, how about we do it elsewhere.
This thread is about the numerous building works that are going ahead in Limerick.
Which they are, which is really funny, seeing as the economy is in the s****r and 10% of the population is about to be lad off according to you!0 -
Great analysis, considering you are missing 2 key points.
Irish economy of late was based on two things.
Building, which made up 25% of our economy, is now in the toilet, and multinationals, who are here primarally becasue of our low corporation tax rate, since we eroded our cost advantages by selling each other overpriced houses, creating a boom out of debt, which was an intresting concept, that failed spectacularly. Multinationals on a whole are reviewing their operations here, and you have seen, and will see large scale job losses,
The rest have goverment jobs, which do nothing but suck money from the states coffers.
At least uruaguay and iceland managed to export someting they produced, whether it was beef or banking.
We don't even have the umbrella of that. We are exposed to circumastances beyond our control, with a goverment that failed to take advantage of a temporary gold rush like boom in revenue to shore up the nations accounts for the long term.
Most people in iceland have lost ALL their savings. People like you claim to be, who saved and lived within their means and financially ruined.
But heh - don't believe me...
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/09/business/icebank.php
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,3772529,00.html
But it's just a normal old recession you say.
The NY times today thinks it's a bit worse...After 10 straight months of job losses, the ranks of the unemployed swelled to 10.1 million in October, for a jobless rate of 6.5 percent, the highest since 1994. Worse, the rate would be 11.8 percent if it included Americans who are working part time because they cannot find full-time work and jobless workers who have given up looking for work because their prospects are so dim. Worse still, well over one in five jobless Americans — some 2.3 million people — have been out of work for six months or more, a level of long-term joblessness not seen in the early stages of any recession since World War II.
That is not the only way this recession is atypical. Mortgage defaults often rise in a downturn because losing a job makes it impossible for some borrowers to keep up. But this time around, unemployment-related defaults will come on top of millions that have already occurred — and are to come — because of spiking payments on adjustable-rate loans and falling home prices. Rising unemployment, combined with the fallout from junk lending, will prolong the financial crisis and the recession.
I cannot see how ireland will not follow that path, given the amount of debt the average person has, in relation to the value of their underlying assets, and the job situation, and which way it's going to go.
But sure we're grand. The building plan for limerick has everything bar the one thing it needs - money.
And there won't be much of that coming anytime soon.
Or maybe the media are making it all up and things are grand.0 -
Great analysis, considering you are missing 2 key points.
Irish economy of late was based on two things.
Building, which made up 25% of our economy, is now in the toilet, and multinationals, who are here primarally becasue of our low corporation tax rate, since we eroded our cost advantages by selling each other overpriced houses, creating a boom out of debt, which was an intresting concept, that failed spectacularly. Multinationals on a whole are reviewing their operations here, and you have seen, and will see large scale job losses,
The rest have goverment jobs, which do nothing but suck money from the states coffers.
At least uruaguay and iceland managed to export someting they produced, whether it was beef or banking.
We don't even have the umbrella of that. We are exposed to circumastances beyond our control, with a goverment that failed to take advantage of a temporary gold rush like boom in revenue to shore up the nations accounts for the long term.
Most people in iceland have lost ALL their savings. People like you claim to be, who saved and lived within their means and financially ruined.
But heh - don't believe me...
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/09/business/icebank.php
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,3772529,00.html
But it's just a normal old recession you say.
The NY times today thinks it's a bit worse...
I cannot see how ireland will not follow that path, given the amount of debt the average person has, in relation to the value of their underlying assets, and the job situation, and which way it's going to go.
But sure we're grand. The building plan for limerick has everything bar the one thing it needs - money.
And there won't be much of that coming anytime soon.
Or maybe the media are making it all up and things are grand.
Cancan, want to complete this somewhere else?
I'm fed up with being more OT in a thread, than I've ever been before!;)
As for our economy however, almost half of it is industry based, which emloyees a third of our country's workers. Over 3/4's of that is exported by the way.
To call them multinationals is a bit off.
About two thirds of our employed are in the teritary sector.
The likes of call centers, and legal secratries, and tourism.
O2, UPC, the Marriot groups, are technically all multinationals, but they're not going to be leaving anytime soon now are they!
That's 2/3 of our workforce that's fairly safe.
As for the Icelandic savings, they're not lost yet.
They're at a cross roads, and a fairly major one, but as I've said a dozen times already, don't believe all that you read in th papers.
And for a building plan for Limerick that has no money, it's doing an amazing job of getting built.
I live in one of the recently built buildings, on one of the recently remodled streets, and I work for a company that's posting profit increases of an average of 25% for the last 4 quarters.
Of course, you hear nothing about that in the media, cause who wants to hear stories about the companies that are doing well.
One last thing however.
When I spend three pages talking about how the media is painting an overly bleak picture, using an exerpt from the media is a bit pointless don't you think?0 -
Sure we'll ignore everyone media - sure what would they know.
We'll ignore every indicator out there that is flashing red, indicating that there is a huge crisis at hand.
We'll ignore that just about every company out there is having earnings troubles and credit troubles.
We'll ignore the mass layoffs, the bleakout global outlook.
We'll ignore our countries finances.
We'll ignore the fact that our tourism industry is in finished, as we have priced ourselves out of what we provide, and if it wasn't for weddings, most hotels are technically insolvent.
We'll ignore the low level of household savings are so low, most households are not in a position to handle a minor gale, never mind a storm.
I am not going to change your mind. I'll leave the next 12 months do that....0 -
Seriously guys, set up another thread if want to continue ye'r bickering!
Back on topic now FFS0 -
karma..fairy could you stop acting like a know-it-all because im in university studyn economics and I dont go on about the f**k**g economies of iceland so grow up and get a life. Youve destroyed the thread I made and Im now asking for a moderator to lock this thread because its turned into a farce primarily because of cancan and karma..fairy acting like idiots trying to indulge their fantasies of being an intellectual..sorry pasting facts from wikipedia or your so called ''sources'' doesnt count. youd be more in your line of venturing into the real world instead of scouring the boards for comments about the economy.0
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.....eh, i'm building a big wall around me garden next tuesday. no government funding!0
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