Rules proposed to be changed for new fully licensed drivers

Tech3

I just came across an article in the irish times today about a td complaining about some new law against newly passed full licensed drivers. Didnt really go into detail but said it needed to be looked at fast. Tried locating it online but no luck.

NRA stated that its not whether your on your full or provisional its the experience they reckon is causing accidents and they propose to the minister a new rule for unexperienced full licensed drivers like limiting them to the size of vehicle they can drive. Anyone know much more about this?

Senna

I did hear talk of a R-plate similar to the UK for newly qualifiedly drivers, i'm guessing it would some limits on them.
The plan of limiting them to small cc cars has been talked about for ages but cant see it ever happening.

Traumadoc

Where statistics ever provided that show that people on provisional licenses were more likely to be involved in RTAs?

Berty

One thing that I could say is that usually I sit outside the license testing centre which doubles nicely as the Maldron hotel in Limerick. Im there using the WIFI from the car park.

You would be amazed how bad the drivers are that are actually being given pass certificates. I dont see them driving out on the roads but its the ones who cannot get in or out of a space, stall the car constantly, ones without L-plates, one with defective lighting and the number of them who hit the kerbs. They still pass.

Maybe the TD has a point. There are soo many in the backlog that "possibly" they are just being given the scope to move them along as fast as possible not unlike the late 70's when people were "sold" driving licenses to clear the backlog.

JoeySully

Traumadoc wrote: »

Where statistics ever provided that show that people on provisional licenses were more likely to be involved in RTAs?

there RTC's as in Road Traffic collision's. Accident implies there is no one is at fault :D

craichoe

quirke_folder wrote: »

One thing that I could say is that usually I sit outside the license testing centre which doubles nicely as the Maldron hotel in Limerick. Im there using the WIFI from the car park.

You would be amazed how bad the drivers are that are actually being given pass certificates. I dont see them driving out on the roads but its the ones who cannot get in or out of a space, stall the car constantly, ones without L-plates, one with defective lighting and the number of them who hit the kerbs. They still pass.

Maybe the TD has a point. There are soo many in the backlog that "possibly" they are just being given the scope to move them along as fast as possible not unlike the late 70's when people were "sold" driving licenses to clear the backlog.

How do you know they passed.

javaboy

Traumadoc wrote: »

Where statistics ever provided that show that people on provisional licenses were more likely to be involved in RTAs?

I think that's the point of these measures though. That it's not what licence you hold but the experience you have.

javaboy

quirke_folder wrote: »

One thing that I could say is that usually I sit outside the license testing centre which doubles nicely as the Maldron hotel in Limerick. Im there using the WIFI from the car park.

You would be amazed how bad the drivers are that are actually being given pass certificates. I dont see them driving out on the roads but its the ones who cannot get in or out of a space, stall the car constantly, ones without L-plates, one with defective lighting and the number of them who hit the kerbs. They still pass.

Not being able to get in or out of a space is first of all not part of the test and can be put down to nerves during the test as can stalling the car.

I don't believe you that people with no L-plates, defective lights and people hitting the kerb are passing the test. I'm sure there are the odd exceptions of course.

So how do you know they are passing the test and how long do you follow them on their test for? :rolleyes:

andrewh5

Senna wrote: »

I did hear talk of a R-plate similar to the UK for newly qualifiedly drivers, i'm guessing it would some limits on them.
The plan of limiting them to small cc cars has been talked about for ages but cant see it ever happening.

The UK as a whole do not have an R plate. They are only used in the north. They have to be displayed for 1 year and there is a maximum speed limit imposed on the driver of IIRC 45MPH.

Wishbone Ash

quirke_folder wrote: »

the ones who cannot get in or out of a space, stall the car constantly, ones without L-plates, one with defective lighting and the number of them who hit the kerbs. They still pass.

If they have no L plates and defective lighting, the test would be abandoned! What makes you think that they have passed?

quirke_folder wrote:

There are soo many in the backlog

What backlog? The waiting time is down to a few weeks!

quirke_folder wrote:

not unlike the late 70's when people were "sold" driving licenses to clear the backlog.

Only those who had a 2nd Provisional Licence in category C (now category and who had already applied for a test on or before a date six months before the announcement of the amnesty were furnished with a full Driving Licence.

Berty

craichoe wrote: »

How do you know they passed.

Im sitting outside the test centre right now in my usual space. They all park next to me so I see them arrive and leave. I see them when they go in and I see them when they come out.

Without noticing the jumping up and down and joyfully talking down the phone to loved ones how else would I notice, you may ask. Well the quiet ones are also easy to see. You either get a fail sheet or you get a printed sheet for you to present to the Licensing office which also comes with a pink slip.

L1011

I didn't jump up and down joyfully when leaving the test centre despite passing...

Berty

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

If they have no L plates and defective lighting, the test would be abandoned! What makes you think that they have passed?

What backlog? The waiting time is down to a few weeks!

Only those who had a 2nd Provisional Licence in category C (now category and who had already applied for a test on or before a date six months before the announcement of the amnesty were furnished with a full Driving Licence.

RE- L-plates and defective lighting. I can tell you that it does happen because its right here in front of me. A girl just drove past me on her test with somebody sitting in the back seat. It must be an examiner because I dont think you can drive with a friend. Anyway whoever that person is they are not wearing their seatbelt. This stuff is happening!!!

Re: Backlog. If you say that its only down to a few weeks. Thats all good and well but think about what i was saying. How do you think it might have gotten down to a few weeks. Im suggesting they are going too easy on them and passing them too quickly.

Re: What license they have. Well, of course I do not know what kinds of licences they have other than that they are provisional.

Another girl just went past on her way out of the car park. Only half of her eye level LED brakelight is working. Is that acceptable? Who knows?

A girl just came out the front door. I know she failed. I cannot see what she was handed because its not in her hands(handbag maybe). How do I know she failed? She is crying and her male friend is comforting her. I saw her arrive back a few minutes ago with a stony faced instructor.

javaboy

quirke_folder wrote: »

RE- L-plates and defective lighting. I can tell you that it does happen because its right here in front of me. A girl just drove past me on her test with somebody sitting in the back seat. It must be an examiner because I dont think you can drive with a friend. Anyway whoever that person is they are not wearing their seatbelt. This stuff is happening!!!

Driving testers are routinely accompanied by supervisors to ensure the test is fair. This stuff is supposed to happen!!!

And a tester isn't required to wear a seatbelt.

Re: Backlog. If you say that its only down to a few weeks. Thats all good and well but think about what i was saying. How do you think it might have gotten down to a few weeks. Im suggesting they are going too easy on them and passing them too quickly.

They hired a private company which was more efficient at processing tests. The pass rate with SGS is only marginally higher than with RSA.

Re: What license they have. Well, of course I do not know what kinds of licences they have other than that they are provisional.

He's just explaining that the licence amnesty wasn't the free for all some people exaggerate it to be.

Alanstrainor

Just to agree with wishboneash, the waiting times are down to weeks, quite an achievment considering how bad they were a couple of years ago.

Biro

No harm in restricting it somehow. But it should be by bhp not cc.
On another motoring forum I visit on occasion there was a girl who got herself an Impreza Turbo, apparently tuned to 440bhp. This girl claimed numerous times how good a driver she felt she was, yet only had her lisence 8 months. The boyfriend who also was supposed to be a fab driver and is driving 6 or 7 years is still on a provisional.

javaboy

Alanstrainor wrote: »

Just to agree with wishboneash, the waiting times are down to weeks, quite an achievment considering how bad they were a couple of years ago.

I know a couple of people who have applied in the last two months and are complaining about not getting a test date yet. It's a good sign of how things have progressed that people start to complain that early. I know I didn't start moaning about not getting a test date until about 9 months after applying!

Sean Quagmire

ridiculous, if you pass the test you should be able to drive what you want. if there is evidence of you being a clown behind the wheel then put restrictions on what they can drive or something to that effect.

I know of a provisional driver who drives an OPC astra and has no intention of even applying for the full test. the responce i got when i asked how the hell are you getting away with it was, they wouldnt think a learner would have the balls to drive around in that car so they never got asked to porduce a licence!

Berty

As I sit outside this test centre I can only comment on what occurs here. What I see here is that people with defective car lighting and no L-plates are being tested and are passing. People hitting the kerbs leaving the car park are also passing.

Wishbone Ash

quirke_folder wrote: »

Another girl just went past on her way out of the car park. Only half of her eye level LED brakelight is working. Is that acceptable? Who knows?

Yes it is. A centre brake light is not a statutory requirement and therefore a person cannot be penalised if it is not working. It's the same for fog lights, reverse lights, auxillary lights etc.

I noticed you dodged the L plate issue! Now, as I have said, L plates must be displayed or the test is abandoned.

javaboy

Biro wrote: »

No harm in restricting it somehow. But it should be by bhp not cc.

If we start going down that road, you'll eventually have someone saying torque at the wheel, lb. feet per kg, Nm per axle and all sorts of rubbish.

They'd be better off sorting out driver education and the testing system instead of making minor changes and improvements to a seriously flawed system.

Biro

Sean Quagmire wrote: »

ridiculous, if you pass the test you should be able to drive what you want. if there is evidence of you being a clown behind the wheel then put restrictions on what they can drive or something to that effect.

I know of a provisional driver who drives an OPC astra and has no intention of even applying for the full test. the responce i got when i asked how the hell are you getting away with it was, they wouldnt think a learner would have the balls to drive around in that car so they never got asked to porduce a licence!

That guy is a tool. Why can't he just sit the test? Is he afraid of failing like the failure he probably is? Also is it insured properly?

Berty

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I noticed you dodged the L plate issue! Now, as I have said, L plates must be displayed or the test is abandoned.

I did not dodge it. I just figured I had mentioned it enough at this stage.

In reply to that: Not apparently in the Maldron Hotel Test Centre in Limerick City on Monday morning 9:20am. Red VW Polo reg.

Biro

javaboy wrote: »

If we start going down that road, you'll eventually have someone saying torque at the wheel, lb. feet per kg, Nm per axle and all sorts of rubbish.

They'd be better off sorting out driver education and the testing system instead of making minor changes and improvements to a seriously flawed system.

They would, but that'll take 100 years to take full effect when todays bunch of muppets have kicked the bucket!

javaboy

quirke_folder wrote: »

I did not dodge it. I just figured I had mentioned it enough at this stage.

In reply to that: Not apparently in the Maldron Hotel Test Centre in Limerick City on Monday morning 9:20am. Red VW Polo reg.

Since you steal their WiFi on a regular basis and these things are happening so often, can you get a video of some of it in action?

Berty

javaboy wrote: »

Since you steal their WiFi on a regular basis and these things are happening so often, can you get a video of some of it in action?

You cannot steal something which is free. Wirless Free Internet(WIFI)

I will try to get a photo on my Digital camera or a movie on it. The zoom is not good but worth a try.

javaboy

quirke_folder wrote: »

You cannot steal something which is free. Wirless Free Internet(WIFI)

It might be free WiFi all right but WiFi doesn't stand for Wireless Free Internet.

I will try to get a photo on my Digital camera or a movie on it. The zoom is not good but worth a try.

A video would be best. Make sure it shows a tester getting into a car with no L-plates.

Wishbone Ash

I just find it extremely difficult to believe that someone could pass a driving test without L plates displayed. It's one of the most basic requirements and the first thing the examiner checks when brought out to the vehicle.

javaboy

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I just find it extremely difficult to believe that someone could pass a driving test without L plates displayed. It's one of the most basic requirements and the first thing the examiner checks when brought out to the vehicle.

Me too. It will be interesting to see if he manages to get proof on video.

t-ha

What do people think of the original question though - License v's Experience? Will it be based purely on the length of time you've held your license?

Personally I think the idea of basing a drivers ability on the length of time they've held their license is a load of crap. Whether you drive around badly for 1 year or 10 years you're still a bad driver, and the same goes for a good driver.

I got my full motorbike license a couple of years ago and had the usual initial restricition on what bikes I could drive. I've since been using a car exclusively yet I can now legally drive powerful motorbikes if I want simply on the basis of the length of time I've had my license.

Of course if it's a case of having to pass suplementary driver training courses to drive certain cars then I guess I'd be broadly in favour of that.

javaboy

t-ha wrote: »

What do people think of the original question though - License v's Experience? Will it be based purely on the length of time you've held your license?

I think it's idiotic tbh. Let the insurers implement their statistical stereotyping if they want but creating two tiered systems in law is wrong imo.

If experience makes you a better driver and the passing of the test doesn't really affect it much, you'd think they would realise there is something badly wrong with the driving test. You might as well do away with the test at that rate.

Of course if it's a case of having to pass suplementary driver training courses to drive certain cars then I guess I'd be broadly in favour of that.

+1. I wouldn't be opposed to that idea although I think if they sorted out the original driving test it wouldn't be necessary.