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Cant change large notes?
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In fairness, what were you trying to do with a €200 note buying petrol. If I had a €200 I would have entered the shop first, apologised and asked would they have enough change.
Small shops and petrol stations are prime targets for junkies and other armed raiders. For this reason, they will only keep a float of about €200 in the till in the first place. Even if they had the change to give you, they might have ended up giving all their fivers and tenners and leave them with no change for normal customers for the rest of the day. The other reason is that just 1 forged €200 note could eliminate that day's profits. Many small shops garage have signs saying they won't take anything over €50 notes. The small shops that don't have the signs don't bother because they assume that their customers have enough cop-on.
So what if it's legal tender? Just because it is legal tender, doesn't mean that it's not bloody inconveniant/impossible for a small shop.
Why didn't you pay by credit/debit card? Where did you get this €200 note? Who (legitimately) deals in these high denomination notes?0 -
Just to clarify, this garage isnt a small backstreet type, its on a busy road with a rather large shopping area, several aisles, etc.
Note was from the bank, although the relevence to where it came from or what money I carry is nil. If you feel the need to ask a stores cashier if they have enough change to process the transaction in full, well and good. I dont, nor should I or anyone else, have to.0 -
ManyQuestions wrote: »Just to clarify, this garage isnt a small backstreet type, its on a busy road with a rather large shopping area, several aisles, etc.
Note was from the bank, although the relevence to where it came from or what money I carry is nil. If you feel the need to ask a stores cashier if they have enough change to process the transaction in full, well and good. I dont, nor should I or anyone else, have to.
You've obviously never worked in a small shop/garage/pub so...0 -
About the sign that state €200/€500 not accecpted and I asked a bank person one day about it and they said a retailer can do it if he wants.
I know the OP said that there was no sign but simply put where is it stated in law that they HAVE to take it? There is no denying its legal tender or its validity but the risk of €30 petrol against €200 is probably too much for them.
Taking into account secuirity measures many places no longer use "pens" as they are not legally binding and UV light is a joke I've seen false €50 pass. CCTV will catch crooks but if your going directly to a forecourt with €200 against €30 even the stupidest criminal will mask his/her reg plate.
The garage has a policy and thats final sadly your bad luck for the day. Maybe they should have highlighted it better ie. at the pumps before you fill up etc at least they were willing to let you leave with just your details on a piece of paper.
What if they said to leave your money and come back for the change later? you wouldnt would you?0 -
In fairness, what were you trying to do with a €200 note buying petrol. If I had a €200 I would have entered the shop first, apologised and asked would they have enough change.
Small shops and petrol stations are prime targets for junkies and other armed raiders. For this reason, they will only keep a float of about €200 in the till in the first place. Even if they had the change to give you, they might have ended up giving all their fivers and tenners and leave them with no change for normal customers for the rest of the day. The other reason is that just 1 forged €200 note could eliminate that day's profits. Many small shops garage have signs saying they won't take anything over €50 notes. The small shops that don't have the signs don't bother because they assume that their customers have enough cop-on.
So what if it's legal tender? Just because it is legal tender, doesn't mean that it's not bloody inconveniant/impossible for a small shop.
Why didn't you pay by credit/debit card? Where did you get this €200 note? Who (legitimately) deals in these high denomination notes?
Again, properly trained staff could easily identify a forged 200 Euro note and a properly run shop would have change of a 200 Euro note. Instead the OP has obviously run into a poorly trained gimp who was more intent on covering his arse with form filling than looking after the customer. This standard of customer service is something that crept in the with celtic tiger unfortunately...0 -
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Again, properly trained staff could easily identify a forged 200 Euro note and a properly run shop would have change of a 200 Euro note. Instead the OP has obviously run into a poorly trained gimp who was more intent on covering his arse with form filling than looking after the customer. This standard of customer service is something that crept in the with celtic tiger unfortunately...
whatever about fully trained staff etc I agree with but they obviously have a very badly publicly notified policy because the op states that the attendant went straight away for the manager0 -
Most shops will not accept notes bigger than €100
It is very difficult to detect a forged note, the pens etc aren't 100% accurate, however, the machines that the banks use to check the notes are a lot more accurate than anything that a shop would use.
The shop has no comeback on the bank ie if the bank say that the note is a forgery, they will simply reverse the transaction and retain the note. It is therefore very unfair to expect a retailer to accept high value notes. A note is only legal tender if it is genuine (I know that this seems very obvious!) and therefore, if there is any doubt as to the autenicity of the note then it would technically not be legal tender and the shop would be under no obligation to accept it in payment.
Did the OP not have any cards or other cash on them?0 -
Why didn't you pay by credit/debit card? Where did you get this €200 note? Who (legitimately) deals in these high denomination notes?
Not everyone has / wants a debit card, not everyone has a balance in their laser account.
A €200- 00 note is not all that uncommon, I think that 4 or 5 have passed through my hands in the last month, and no problem getting change either.
During the summer I went to local veg. shop shortly after 8am. and purchased €30-00 approx., I handed over a €200-00 note, they had no change, and I had forgot to bring my laser card.
The manager was called and he just rang off the till, minused out the amount and said "the next time your in you can pay".
I know I was a reasonably regular customer in that shop, but that gesture of trust has made me a more regular customer.
Common sense prevails.0 -
No, no cards or other cash, unfortunately.
It makes you wonder why the bank gave it out, or even why these 200 notes are out there, not to mention the 500 notes, when stores wont/cant take them.
200 isnt that bad, or so I thought, but is there a reason why someone should need a 500 note?0 -
Someone might be buying a car with cash and not want massive bundles!ManyQuestions wrote: »No, no cards or other cash, unfortunately.
It makes you wonder why the bank gave it out, or even why these 200 notes are out there, not to mention the 500 notes, when stores wont/cant take them.
200 isnt that bad, or so I thought, but is there a reason why someone should need a 500 note?
Someone might win big down the local bookies!0 -
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Not everyone has / wants a debit card, not everyone has a balance in their laser account.
Why don't they? and why wouldn't they want want one? And a person would have a decent balance on their account if they weren't going around with large denomination notes.During the summer I went to local veg. shop shortly after 8am. and purchased €30-00 approx., I handed over a €200-00 note, they had no change, and I had forgot to bring my laser card.
The manager was called and he just rang off the till, minused out the amount and said "the next time your in you can pay".
I know I was a reasonably regular customer in that shop, but that gesture of trust has made me a more regular customer.
As regards what happened to you in your veg shop, do we know if the op was a regular in this garage? Given the fact that he had an argument with the "foreign" manager, I'm sure they will remember him, but doubt they'll be doing him any favours. Again, perhaps if he had dealt with the situation more amicably, they might have offered him this resolution.
Very true. On both sides.Common sense prevails.0 -
I'd be very wary of taking in, as a retailer, a 200e or 500e note. I've yet to see an ATM that gives over denominations of 50e, and I've never had a bank teller give me anything larger than that, unless I requested it, though I'm not doubting the OP. Fact is, it's very standard procedure for shops to not accept anything over 50e or 100e. Is this legal? Obviously it is. Shops have been doing this since the days of the punt. Was the OP wrong? No. The petrol station, since practically 100% of filling stations are fill first, pay later, should have had a sign up saying they can't accept anything that large. It's bad communication, on both parts.0
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gerrycollins wrote: »whatever about fully trained staff etc I agree with but they obviously have a very badly publicly notified policy because the op states that the attendant went straight away for the manager
In this situation, there is no point in having a policy advertised at the counter, after a customer has filled up with a tank of fuel at the pump. With regard to laser/debit cards, if the authorisation goes through, you will be paid, so this argument is not relevant to this discussion.
Here's another example... Last night I bought a bottle of wine, priced on the bottle and again on the shelf that the bottle was sitting on, as costing 10.95 Euro. I go to pay for it, and it scans in at 11.95 Euro. When I pointed out that it is advertised at 10.95 Euro, you wouldn't fu*kin believe it but your wan at the till says, "I'm sorry, that's the price and I can't change it"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I brought her from behind her till to see the lower price TWICE on the shelf and she continues to insist that "the price at the till is the price you pay"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I made a complete itinerant out of myself and ended up getting the bottle of wine at the price advertised, under protest from this UPSTART of a manager!!!
Morale of the story, believe nothing of what you hear and half of what you see and stand your ground. The Celtic Tiger is over and all the crap that came with it is over...
Being fussy/gimpish over notes, is a thing of the past...
Turning your nose up at transactions under a certain amount, in the past...
Declined transactions, a new reality, so get used to it...0 -
ManyQuestions wrote: »No, no cards or other cash, unfortunately.
It makes you wonder why the bank gave it out, or even why these 200 notes are out there, not to mention the 500 notes, when stores wont/cant take them.
200 isnt that bad, or so I thought, but is there a reason why someone should need a 500 note?
Yeah i refuse point blankly to take notes larger than 50's being honest off a bank. Had to get a large sum out there a few months back and the teller wanted to give me a few 200's and 500's and I said no way as I have also come across this before not being able to pay for something because same situation as you op bank gave me a 200 on a previous occaison. Difference is I had one of my mates with me that day so he had to bail me out.0 -
tallaghtoutlaws wrote: »Yeah i refuse point blankly to take notes larger than 50's being honest off a bank. Had to get a large sum out there a few months back and the teller wanted to give me a few 200's and 500's and I said no way as I have also come across this before not being able to pay for something because same situation as you op bank gave me a 200 on a previous occaison. Difference is I had one of my mates with me that day so he had to bail me out.
In 6 months time, see how many dopes are turning down legal tender because they have a funny feeling...0 -
Of course you do realise that it could have said 0.01 euro on the shelf - it means nothing.Here's another example... Last night I bought a bottle of wine, priced on the bottle and again on the shelf that the bottle was sitting on, as costing 10.95 Euro. I go to pay for it, and it scans in at 11.95 Euro. When I pointed out that it is advertised at 10.95 Euro, you wouldn't fu*kin believe it but your wan at the till says, "I'm sorry, that's the price and I can't change it"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I brought her from behind her till to see the lower price TWICE on the shelf and she continues to insist that "the price at the till is the price you pay"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I made a complete itinerant out of myself and ended up getting the bottle of wine at the price advertised, under protest from this UPSTART of a manager!!!
It's an invitation to treat and nothing else. The shop is not bound to sell at that price.
If I were you I'd take deep breaths and relax.0 -
Here's another example... Last night I bought a bottle of wine, priced on the bottle and again on the shelf that the bottle was sitting on, as costing 10.95 Euro. I go to pay for it, and it scans in at 11.95 Euro. When I pointed out that it is advertised at 10.95 Euro, you wouldn't fu*kin believe it but your wan at the till says, "I'm sorry, that's the price and I can't change it"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I brought her from behind her till to see the lower price TWICE on the shelf and she continues to insist that "the price at the till is the price you pay"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I made a complete itinerant out of myself and ended up getting the bottle of wine at the price advertised, under protest from this UPSTART of a manager!!!
Morale of the story, believe nothing of what you hear and half of what you see and stand your ground. The Celtic Tiger is over and all the crap that came with it is over...
Being fussy/gimpish over notes, is a thing of the past...
Turning your nose up at transactions under a certain amount, in the past...
Declined transactions, a new reality, so get used to it...
This is slightly off topic, but she was actually in the right in this instance. The price that is displayed is only a guideline, I think Invitation to Treat is the correct term. so the label could say 1 cent for all it matters, but they do not need to sell you the wine for that price.
However once they are alerted to the fact that the display price is incorrect they are required to correct it. Most shops (but not all) will give the lower price as a goodwill token but they are not obliged too.
Edit: beaten to it by bluetonic4.3kWp South facing PV System. South Dublin
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I wouldn't think it would be obvious, its legal tender, all shops have some sort of security device now, even if its just the pen to check the notes. In a petrol station they probably have your license plate recorded on cctv so i would think it would be fairly easy for them to find you through the gardai if you had passed a forged note.
A €500 note is also legal tender, but no sensible person would make the assumption that a shop would be willing to change it. It's not necessarily a question of forgery risk either - how much do you think a petrol station uses as a till float? If they try to change a €200 note at the start of a shift, it could wipe out all their change. Then the next dumbass who comes in with a €200 note can't pay with it either (or a €50, for that matter).
Edit: Sorry, I see the float issue has been pointed out in a previous post.0 -
I worked part time in a petrol station for years while I was in school and college. This happened to me twice when dealing with a customer.
The garage took in large amounts of cash each day and we would do regular safe-drops throughout the day. The till would beep and let us know that there was too much money held there. We also had absolutely no access to the safe once we had dropped the cash.
The first time it happened to me, I had just done a safe drop and there was €300 left in the till. A man came in and wanted to pay for €10 worth of petrol with a €500 note. He was very annoyed when I told him I didn't have change. Unfortunately there was nothing I could do at the time. The manager didn't want large amounts held in the till and €300 was large enough tbh. The man got very irate, shouted about legal tender and how I had to take it while I tried to explain that I simply didn't have that much in the till.
The second time it happened was with a man who needed change from a €200 note. Unfortunately for him the customer before him had needed change from a €200 note also. Again, I didn't have enough change to give him as a safe drop had been done about 10 minutes previously. This guy was polite about the whole thing and he used a card.
It's all well and good to rant about crap staff and a poorly run business but petrol stations get robbed frequently and the staff are told by management not to have too much cash in the till. Some tills, like the one I used, won't let you make anymore transactions until you drop enough money from it.
How do you know the cashier didn't get her till cleared out by a customer ahead of you who also had a large note? Should garages keep thousands in the tills just in case?0 -
NinjaTruncs wrote: »This is slightly off topic, but she was actually in the right in this instance. The price that is displayed is only a guideline, I think Invitation to Treat is the correct term. so the label could say 1 cent for all it matters, but they do not need to sell you the wine for that price.
However once they are alerted to the fact that the display price is incorrect they are required to correct it. Most shops (but not all) will give the lower price as a goodwill token but they are not obliged too.
Edit: beaten to it by bluetonic
"Invitation to Treat"... Have never heard of this phrase once in my life, sounds like a phrase RGDATA have dreamed up to cover their members. For as long as I have been buying things in this country, Price Advertised Equals Price Payable. Now apparently we have some wannanbe legal eagles throwing out jargon like, "invitation to treat" and all sorts of horse sh*t to scare people from the fact that a price advertised, is the price you are ENTITLED to purchase that product/service at.0 -
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Now apparently we have some wannanbe legal eagles throwing out jargon like, "invitation to treat" and all sorts of horse sh*t to scare people from the fact that a price advertised, is the price you are ENTITLED to purchase that product/service at.
I'm afraid that is just plain wrong. Look up "The Sale of Goods and Supply of Services" act 1980.0 -
"Invitation to Treat"... Have never heard of this phrase once in my life, sounds like a phrase RGDATA have dreamed up to cover their members. For as long as I have been buying things in this country, Price Advertised Equals Price Payable. Now apparently we have some wannanbe legal eagles throwing out jargon like, "invitation to treat" and all sorts of horse sh*t to scare people from the fact that a price advertised, is the price you are ENTITLED to purchase that product/service at.
Then I suggest you go back to school and redo 1st year business.
Irish Consumer website - http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Learning_Zone/FAQs/Price_display/
Copied from above link
Q2. The price on a shelf edge label was less than price showing on the till when the product was scanned. Do I have a right to buy the product at the lower price?
You do not have an automatic right to the product at the lower price. A price indication on a product is what's called an "invitation to purchase".
If you were advised of the correct price before purchasing, you are not entitled to the goods at the lower price. In this case, you have the choice of rejecting the goods and not buying them, or accepting the higher price and making the purchase.
If you were not informed of the correct price before purchasing, we suggest you go back to retailer and make them aware of the discrepancy.
The store is not legally obliged to refund the difference, but many stores will refund under a "no quibble policy". You should bring your receipt or proof of purchase to prove that you had been charged a price higher than the displayed price. You should also bring the item.
If the price charged is higher than the price indicated, then this is a misleading commercial practice under the Consumer Protection Act and you should inform the NCA.0 -
"Invitation to Treat"... Have never heard of this phrase once in my life, sounds like a phrase RGDATA have dreamed up to cover their members. For as long as I have been buying things in this country, Price Advertised Equals Price Payable. Now apparently we have some wannanbe legal eagles throwing out jargon like, "invitation to treat" and all sorts of horse sh*t to scare people from the fact that a price advertised, is the price you are ENTITLED to purchase that product/service at.
LOL.
Anyone who has done Business studies in secondary school will have heard this phrase.0 -
"Invitation to Treat"... Have never heard of this phrase once in my life, sounds like a phrase RGDATA have dreamed up to cover their members. For as long as I have been buying things in this country, Price Advertised Equals Price Payable. Now apparently we have some wannanbe legal eagles throwing out jargon like, "invitation to treat" and all sorts of horse sh*t to scare people from the fact that a price advertised, is the price you are ENTITLED to purchase that product/service at.
Some stores will offer the "price displayed" option as a good will gesture. As far as the law you haven't a leg to stand on. However, as you said, if the person behind the counter is also unaware of it you can indeed shout till you win.
The OP should have let them call out the cops. They probably wouldn't have and he probably would have gotten his petrol for free.0 -
"Invitation to Treat"... Have never heard of this phrase once in my life, sounds like a phrase RGDATA have dreamed up to cover their members. For as long as I have been buying things in this country, Price Advertised Equals Price Payable. Now apparently we have some wannanbe legal eagles throwing out jargon like, "invitation to treat" and all sorts of horse sh*t to scare people from the fact that a price advertised, is the price you are ENTITLED to purchase that product/service at.
sorry Darragh but you are not entitled to purchase anything at the advertised price and the principle of Invitation to Treat has been established in contract law since 1953 in a case involving Boots Chemist, I wont go into details I'll just quote the Judge
"In the case of an ordinary shop, although goods are displayed and it is intended that customers should go ahead and choose what they want, the contract is not completed until, the customer having indicated the articles which he needs, the shopkeeper, or someone on his behalf, accepts that offer. Then the contract is completed."
So basicly the price at the till is the price you pay not the price on display, but this is off topic.
I think anyone who has ever worked on a till would be conscious of trying to pay a €30 bill with €200 note while someone who never has might just assume that the till is full to the brim and can hand out change of any denomination. I've worked on tills for years in pub, clubs, shops etc and would always be aware of the denomination of note I was using.
As an aside as far as I know the Irish Mint doesnt produce €200 and €500 notes because of this very problem. All these notes are notes that have been brought into Ireland from the other Eurozone countries.0 -
In this situation, there is no point in having a policy advertised at the counter, after a customer has filled up with a tank of fuel at the pump. With regard to laser/debit cards, if the authorisation goes through, you will be paid, so this argument is not relevant to this discussion.
Here's another example... Last night I bought a bottle of wine, priced on the bottle and again on the shelf that the bottle was sitting on, as costing 10.95 Euro. I go to pay for it, and it scans in at 11.95 Euro. When I pointed out that it is advertised at 10.95 Euro, you wouldn't fu*kin believe it but your wan at the till says, "I'm sorry, that's the price and I can't change it"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I brought her from behind her till to see the lower price TWICE on the shelf and she continues to insist that "the price at the till is the price you pay"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I made a complete itinerant out of myself and ended up getting the bottle of wine at the price advertised, under protest from this UPSTART of a manager!!!
Morale of the story, believe nothing of what you hear and half of what you see and stand your ground. The Celtic Tiger is over and all the crap that came with it is over...
Being fussy/gimpish over notes, is a thing of the past...
Turning your nose up at transactions under a certain amount, in the past...
Declined transactions, a new reality, so get used to it...
I did note in an earlier post that it should be noted at the pumps the counter is too late.
Dont forget prices advertised are an invitation to treat however a bit of cop on would sell you the wine at the price shown in hope for your return business. I hope this was an isolated incident for you because as a retailer myself nothing p****s me off more than incorrect pricing because a simple system (called a human being with a brain) can prevent it so easily. sorry going off topic0 -
Again, properly trained staff could easily identify a forged 200 Euro note and a properly run shop would have change of a 200 Euro note. Instead the OP has obviously run into a poorly trained gimp who was more intent on covering his arse with form filling than looking after the customer. This standard of customer service is something that crept in the with celtic tiger unfortunately...
another person who has obviously never worked in retail. No retail outlet i have ever worked in would have change of a 200 note available. And the last retail outlet in the world who did have that much available stopped doing it the hundredth time they were robbed that week0 -
Oh dear. :rolleyes:"Invitation to Treat"... Have never heard of this phrase once in my life, sounds like a phrase RGDATA have dreamed up to cover their members. For as long as I have been buying things in this country, Price Advertised Equals Price Payable. Now apparently we have some wannanbe legal eagles throwing out jargon like, "invitation to treat" and all sorts of horse sh*t to scare people from the fact that a price advertised, is the price you are ENTITLED to purchase that product/service at.0 -
Not everyone has / wants a debit card, not everyone has a balance in their laser account.
A 200- 00 note is not all that uncommon, I think that 4 or 5 have passed through my hands in the last month, and no problem getting change either.
During the summer I went to local veg. shop shortly after 8am. and purchased 30-00 approx., I handed over a 200-00 note, they had no change, and I had forgot to bring my laser card.
The manager was called and he just rang off the till, minused out the amount and said "the next time your in you can pay".
I know I was a reasonably regular customer in that shop, but that gesture of trust has made me a more regular customer.
Common sense prevails.
in fairness that's a completely different situation and you know it. One is a regular customer in a small local grocer dealing with the owner and the other is a nameless guy making a one off payment in a large corporation that doesn't like it when the tills don't add up at the end of the day
in your situation telling you to pay him next time made perfect "common sense" but in the op's it would make no sense0 -
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