Dublin Outer Orbital Route (DOOR)

loyatemu

emfifty wrote: »

any takers on the official naming convention?:rolleyes:

I am going with M40 (as there is no n40!);)

M9

mysterious

John Lynch Ph.D wrote: »

Why? because you live in the area? The whole project should go ahead without question but if sections had to be prioritized then it would have be the connections between the M4 and M7.

They are the busier roads.

:rolleyes: No I don't live in the area, I just happen to be a road expert.;)

Navan has 30,000 and Drogheda has 30,000. Mulingar, Tullamore and Atlone all connect to the east coast via the N52, N51. It's a good idea to build an offline motorway that will get rid of the substandard road that is currently there.

There is already an outer ring road connecting Tallaght Clondalkin and Lucan. Which is a second western Ring around Dublin.

An upgraded N52, will move most of the cross country traffic away from the M7 and M50, which is the purpose of DOOR. You clearly have no idea what your talking about nor do you know the actual points I've made on this.

John Lynch Ph.D

mysterious wrote: »

:rolleyes:

There is already an outer ring road connecting Tallaght Clondalkin and Lucan. Which is a second western Ring around Dublin.

If I wanted to get from N4 to N7 I would use the M50 not that road, its designed more for traffic within Dublin.

As for your argument on population figures, far more people live between Naas/Newbridge and North Kildare (Maynooth,Kilcock).

Tech3

This DOOR project should be firmly put on the backburner as there is so many projects that badly need to be built well before this even gets to the planning stages. The national primary roads are still goats tracks like the N18, N21, N24, N17, N15 etc.. The M50 will be efficient for the next decade at the very least unless we have a massive population increase which is not very likely.

mysterious

John Lynch Ph.D wrote: »

If I wanted to get from N4 to N7 I would use the M50 not that road, its designed more for traffic within Dublin.

As for your argument on population figures, far more people live between Naas/Newbridge and North Kildare (Maynooth,Kilcock).

There is two ring roads for the M7, M4 to use. Upgraded M50, or ORR. There is also the R404 or something. there isn't exactly thousands of cars using it to specifically go between the M7 and M4.

Your missing the point, an upgraded M51,M52 would mean M7, M8 traffic can use the trunk network to connect to the other motorways.

You can use the local roads provided between the M4 and M7, bet your from around there or something because you keep overstepping the point I KEEP pointing out.

mysterious

tech2 wrote: »

This DOOR project should be firmly put on the backburner as there is so many projects that badly need to be built well before this even gets to the planning stages. The national primary roads are still goats tracks like the N18, N21, N24, N17, N15 etc.. The M50 will be efficient for the next decade at the very least unless we have a massive population increase which is not very likely.

Which is why I think upgrading the N52 seems most logical for the time being. I don't think Ireland needs another M50 style motorway going through the greater Dublin area its completely unecessary imo. We don't have a holland type population to warrent such a route. It would be all fine and well if we had a motorway like it as a luxury, but I think luxurious are way off the radar now.

Seth Brundle

mysterious wrote: »

I don't think Ireland needs another M50 style motorway going through the greater Dublin area its completely unecessary imo. We don't have a holland type population to warrent such a route.

Surely it has less to do with population & public needs and more to do with the fact that FF builder contacts are all short of work at the moment?

Irish and Proud

emfifty wrote: »

any takers on the official naming convention?:rolleyes:

I am going with M40 (as there is no n40!);)

Me too!!!

M40

Irish and Proud

emfifty wrote: »

Forget about upgrades to the n52:(. The days of building half arsed roads are over. the reason for the push on this new motorway is the fact that it is a ppp. there are several spanish and other european contactors who are gagging to get their hands on new irish motorway projects. plus they have the finance to follow through.

While on the surface Mysterious might have a point about building more motorways when upgraded national roads might be better suited to the traffic needs of rural areas, the DOOR (or LOOR) could be a glorious opportunity to forge a better commuting model. My thinking is that with an outer ring like the DOOR along with fibre-optics etc, towns like Drogheda, Navan, Newbridge etc could be transformed into major employment centres (with proper strategic planning). Railways in the vicinity would become a lot more viable then, as you would have people commuting in both directions alongs lines such as the Northern Line and proposed Navan Line. With less empty trains and more people travelling shorter distances, there would be less waste and congestion. Also, there would be scope for opening up the Navan-Drogheda Line for passengers too. Also, very importantly to this whole concept is the development to Bremore Port (not a speculative plan) which would feed off the DOOR. Oh, and to stop the over-use of the motorway by commuters, parking before 10am could be severely curtailed thereby encouraging the use of public transport and thereby conserving more fuel.

Regards!

coolperson05

I think if your talking linking towns then a more public transport solution could help? A DART system for Navan, Drogheda, Naas etc....better train service or something...If people are looking for a true road bypass of dublin then your looking at goin up the middle of the country really...Aiming to join the M9, M8, M7, M6 in the centre rather than close to Dublin... Public transport should get the preference over billion euro motorways, already its far quicker to drive than use trains in certain places...how can public transport sell itself?

spacetweek

Irish and Proud wrote: »

Me too!!!
M40

I have always assumed this road would be called M40 also.

cullenswood

So are we looking at at least 10 years before this is built if ever?

lukejr

The NRA has details of the feasibility report and route maps on their website, the route appears to be called the Leinster Orbital Route.

http://www.nra.ie/News/NewsAnnouncements/htmltext,16140,en.html

Amtmann

Thread on that feasibility report here.

JeffK88

Thought might bump this back up. Now that the Cork South Ring Road has taken the number of N40 what is left for this road. M35 , M45 ??

Sponge Bob

Nothing. This scheme is not needed any more and is a distraction from the necessary upgrades to the N52 and N80 which would become a genuine orbital serving Dundalk/Navan/Mullingar/Tullamore/Portlaoise and Carlow and allowing people to track across from motorway to motorway which is a right pain nowadays.

Upgrades are also required around Dublin outside the M50, one is underway between the N2 and N3 north of Blanchardstown right now and the Lucan Citywest Tallaght segment is complete ( bar Newlands Cross) but these will be regional roads...instead of the country boreens that are there now.

expectationlost

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/dublin-by-pass-plan-way-down-the-priority-list-says-varadkar-598704.html#.Ucx7u-FH020.twitter The Transport Minister has said that plans for a massive by-pass of Dublin through the midlands and Leinster is now way down the agenda.

veryangryman

Possibly a decent time to bump this again. With recent population rises in the suburbs, perhaps suburb to suburb connection need to be looked at (road and transport).

Consonata

I don't think another orbital road is the answer really. It'll only be as congested as the M50 is currently.

Real answer is to discourage private car usage and fix the mess of a bus system.

magicbastarder

if you build it, they will come.

Seth Brundle

magicbastarder wrote: »

if you build it, they will come.

Fingal CoCo want to build a dual carriageway going from Leixlip to Clonee through St. Catherines Park.
This will include the first bridge built that crosses the Liffey and is sure to become an alternative to the M50 (but without the toll cost).
Waste if money IMO.

daheff

Consonata wrote: »

I don't think another orbital road is the answer really. It'll only be as congested as the M50 is currently.

Real answer is to discourage private car usage and fix the mess of a bus system.

Why is the answer always to discourage private car usage?


Surely if you provide proper commuting options people will have a choice of how they travel and not need to commute by car. The stick approach doesnt work if there is no other option for people.

bk

daheff wrote: »

Surely if you provide proper commuting options people will have a choice of how they travel and not need to commute by car. The stick approach doesnt work if there is no other option for people.

Unfortunately it doesn't work that way. Even if their are good commuting options, many people still take the car, even if it is longer (see all the people trying to drive into Dublin City Center every day!).

Part of the problem is the sunk cost of the car. Car's are so expensive to buy in up front costs, people feel it is a waste to leave it sitting there in the drive way. Also once you have a car, the running cost for a journey is the same or less then the cost of public transport for the same journey.

A lot of people prefer to sit in bumper to bumper traffic and just complain about it, while folks on buses and bikes in the lane beside them fly past!

daheff

bk wrote: »

. Even if their are good commuting options, many people still take the car,

Don't make me laugh. We don't know the meaning of good commuting options. You live anywhere near a commuter train line you pay a high premium for it. You dont live near one, you dont have a reasonable option (even commuter train lines arent great).

Try living in a big city London/Munich/Frankfurt and you'll see what good commuting options are.

Deedsie wrote: »

I am a driver, don't see how more people don't see it the same way as me.

Try being a commuter...see how inefficient and slow (and bloody unreliable) it is. Just because there are buses/trains on a timetable doesnt mean they turn up on time, empty enough for you to get on or even at all!

n97 mini

Deedsie wrote: »

And totally unnecessary destruction of a public park and the remnants of an ancient forest so we can bypass the bypass of Dublin. I wonder what will happen in 10 years time. Will we need a DOOOR I wonder?

Not gonna happen as there is too much local opposition.

From what I read the plan is to toll the road also, to stop it from draining all traffic off the m50 toll.

_Kaiser_

Deedsie wrote: »

I am a commuter. I travel 10km each way everyday.

10km? Try 100km each way as many who are "clogging" the roads are now forced to do thanks to poor, impractical, or non-existent public transport and spiraling housing and rent prices in Dublin.

This isn't an outlier case either as the N/M 1, 3, 4, 7, and 11 will show every day.

bk

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

10km? Try 100km each way as many who are "clogging" the roads are now forced to do thanks to poor, impractical, or non-existent public transport and spiraling housing and rent prices in Dublin.

And whose fault is that?

We are to blame. It is the fault of the typical Irish mentality that you have to have a 3 bedroom, two storey house, with two car spaces out the front and a garden out back, the Irish dream!

But that just isn't possible in a quickly growing city, thus people have to buy a house way out and drive insane distants every day.

A city can either grow up or grow out. We unfortunately have decided on out and it is a terrible mistake imo.

_Kaiser_

bk wrote: »

And whose fault is that?

We are to blame. It is the fault of the typical Irish mentality that you have to have a 3 bedroom, two storey house, with two car spaces out the front and a garden out back, the Irish dream!

But that just isn't possible in a quickly growing city, thus people have to buy a house way out and drive insane distants every day.

A city can either grow up or grow out. We unfortunately have decided on out and it is a terrible mistake imo.

I don't disagree.. it's frankly nonsensical in a city/country that likes to position itself as an equal to major European cities that we don't have properly-sized high rise in the capital. If it were up to me I'd demolish the entire Sherrif St end out as far as Fairview. At the very least I'd be building on the plenty of green spaces around the M50.

But until there are places for people to affordably and sustainably live long term then you can't penalise them for taking the only realistic option they have to get to/from work on time and reliably.

n97 mini

bk wrote: »

And whose fault is that?

We are to blame. It is the fault of the typical Irish mentality that you have to have a 3 bedroom, two storey house, with two car spaces out the front and a garden out back, the Irish dream!

But that just isn't possible in a quickly growing city, thus people have to buy a house way out and drive insane distants every day.

A city can either grow up or grow out. We unfortunately have decided on out and it is a terrible mistake imo.

In fairness there is a chronic shortage of all types in Dublin at the moment. Singles would be into high rise apartment blocks like a rocket, if they existed. Instead councillors are voting to build 4000 houses in Celbridge...

Consonata

Deedsie wrote: »

It's your own fault if you choose to live 100km from where you work and piss and moan that it is someone else's fault but your own.

This is a separate issue. Can't cycle to work if there are no houses in the city to cycle from. Its a matter of availability not choice. Pretending otherwise gives cyclists everywhere a bad name.