Conor Lenihan to visit UCD this Wednesday

panda100

The threat of fee's still hasnt gone away.........

Conor Lenihan, Fianna Fail TD and Minister for State is coming to UCD this Wednesday, November 12th, to talk at a debate.

FEE (Free Education for Everyone) firmly believes that the access to campus of any government minister or representative should be blocked. This government has proved time and time again that they wish to impede our access to education, they wish for its commercialisation, and by doing so deteriorate its quality and directly oppose the true nature of what a positive and proactive educational system stands for.

"If they block our access to education, we'll block their access to our campus"

Zounds

What's the debate on?

Dave!

Hurrahh!

Why is he racist?

rainbow kirby

One of my local TDs, what a twat.

Frank Grimes

Zounds wrote: »

What's the debate on?

It's the religious symbols debate

Dave! wrote:

Why is he racist?

He made an idiotic remark about kebabs in the Dail a few years ago when Joe Higgins was making a case for Turkish workers who were being underpaid by a construction company.

The_Minister

Frank Grimes wrote: »

He made an idiotic remark about kebabs in the Dail a few years ago when Joe Higgins was making a case for Turkish workers who were being underpaid by a construction company.

And he is now Minister for Integration.

He looks nothing like that btw.

Frank Grimes

The_Minister wrote: »

And he is now Minister for Integration.

Yeah, thought I'd let someone else point out that irony

spudington16

Why do these groups insist on making the rest of us look inhospitable and plain rude with their blunt harrassment tactics? Protest by all means, but this is a bit too far...

Would it kill them to actually open up the floor for a genuine discussion on the matter of fees instead of just restating their "fees are bad" mantra?

Stepherunie

I would never support a demonstration with a slogan implying people were racist with no firm grounds.


The Union are also holding a protest, I hope to god we stay well away from people who insist on coming out with such disgraceful comments.

spudington16

Incidentally, is the "UCD Global Action Society" - the group running this mess of a protest and responsible for that disgrace of a poster - actually a registered soc in the college? If they're not, I don't think they're meant to be plastering the place with their nonsense posters (AFAIK) and if they are whoever the watchdog is for posters should really have put a halt to some of its content, as Stephurnie pointed out.

panda100

Stepherunie wrote: »

I would never support a demonstration with a slogan implying people were racist with no firm grounds.


The Union are also holding a protest, I hope to god we stay well away from people who insist on coming out with such disgraceful comments.

It was Conor Lenihan that came out with the disgraceful comments. Back in 2005 he told Joe Higgins publicly in the Dail to 'Stick to the kebabs' referring to Joe's relentless pursuit for Justice for Turkish workers who were being paid €2/hour,living in inhumane conditions and working 24/7 building our national roads.

Calling a whole nation 'kebabs' was an insult to Turkish people and a racist slur against GAMA workers.

Raphael

spudington16 wrote: »

Incidentally, is the "UCD Global Action Society" - the group running this mess of a protest and responsible for that disgrace of a poster - actually a registered soc in the college? If they're not, I don't think they're meant to be plastering the place with their nonsense posters (AFAIK) and if they are whoever the watchdog is for posters should really have put a halt to some of its content, as Stephurnie pointed out.

They seem to be. Guess the FEE crowd learned their lesson from last time, when Richard Butler went strolling up the concourse after the Thursday morning postering rush, ripping down the Lenihan posters as he went.

Tom65

spudington16 wrote: »

Incidentally, is the "UCD Global Action Society" - the group running this mess of a protest and responsible for that disgrace of a poster - actually a registered soc in the college?

Also, are they aware that the acronym of their name is UCD GAS?

spudington16

Have you really no qualms with harassing a guest to UCD who is coming in good faith to debate an entirely different issue to that of fees? Petty actions like this will only serve to hinder the good work societies and clubs do to provide extra-curricular activities on campus.

Incidentally, you didn't respond on the issue of your group's society status, and whether it was within its rights putting up those posters. UCD's official societies page doesn't actually list you. Clarification, perhaps?

Also, your group is still stubbornly refusing to debate the potential merits of reintroducing fees, and is content just to shout the idea of fees down. Given the trying economic climate in which we find ourselves, surely it's only sensible to consider all possibilities of increasing revenue to the third level sector? People worked in the past to put themselves through college, and it could be done again.

imp

panda100 wrote: »

Calling a whole nation 'kebabs' was an insult to Turkish people and a racist slur against GAMA workers.

Is one recanted, ill-considered remark enough to make someone racist?

Edit: Also attempting to forcibly prevent someone from being allowed to participate in a debate is completely immoral imho, and this is what the poster seems to imply.

delta_bravo

Ah he's also an alumni of UCD, we cant turn on ourselves now . The characatuire (sp?) looks a tad crazy. Also it is very unfair to brand him as racist based on one remark he made over 3 years ago.

Cant really see what this will acheive as his brief has little or nothing to do with education.

panda100

spudington16 wrote: »

Petty actions like this will only serve to hinder the good work societies and clubs do to provide extra-curricular activities on campus..

Please explain how we hinder clubs and societys?

spudington16 wrote: »

Incidentally, you didn't respond on the issue of your group's society status, and whether it was within its rights putting up those posters. UCD's official societies page doesn't actually list you. Clarification, perhaps?..

UCD Global Action Society is an official society in UCD.

As Raphael said ,Before the Brian Lenihan protest the clubs and society's officer,Richard Butler, tore down many of the FEE posters because we were not a recognised society.

However his approach to unrecognised society's is not very consistent.While he took vehement action against FEE's poster's he did not remove posters and leaflets for the 'Stripped' D2 lap Dancing club and the 'Barley Legal' bonanza in some dodgy club in town .

I should add that I am not a spokesperson for FEE but I completely support their actions

spudington16 wrote: »

Also, your group is still stubbornly refusing to debate the potential merits of reintroducing fees, and is content just to shout the idea of fees down.

We've had at least five public meeting on the subject
We had a representative from FEE speaking at the fee's debates
We've had a representative from FEE speak on Belfield FM.
We have stalls every week in the arts block to explain our position on fee's
We hand out informative leaflets each week on our position on fee's

I dont see how this is a stubborn refusal to debate........

Inglorious

panda100 wrote: »

Please explain how we hinder clubs and societys?

The L&H have invited him in so that he can speak at a debate, the topic of which is relevant to his office as Minister for Integration.
By preventing him to enter into the debate, you are hindering that society's event.

Raphael

panda100 wrote: »

However his approach to unrecognised society's is not very consistent.While he took vehement action against FEE's poster's he did not remove posters and leaflets for the 'Stripped' D2 lap Dancing club and the 'Barley Legal' bonanza in some dodgy club in town .

See, that's because the FEE posters were put up at the crack of half 8 on a Thursday morning while Mr. Butler was already out there supervising the postering. On his way back to his office, he, near as I could tell, removed all the ones he saw. He didn't, nor is obliged to, patrol the campus tearing down any poster which doesn't have a society logo. This is, frankly, your job. And my job. And anyone who cares about its job - If you see a poster that shouldn't be there, take it down. I do it all the time, because as the committee of a society, people taking the on-campus postering space who shouldn't be, piss me off.

Tayto2000

imp wrote: »

Edit: Also attempting to forcibly prevent someone from being allowed to participate in a debate is completely immoral imho, and this is what the poster seems to imply.

Yup, old ground again regarding free speech. The further left you go, the more it starts to look like the far right.... Disturbing.

TBH, based on previous policy, he'll probably just cancel, TDs only seem to be showing up to big official UCD organised events, maybe it's hard to justify the cost of security for the smaller society organised ones?

Breezer

As I said the last time, heckle him all you want (he may not be here to debate fees but he will doubtless support any decision made by his party colleague O'Keeffe on the matter). But I don't support an attempt to physically restrict his access to the building. Nor do I condone calling him racist (although he had no qualms about using similar language regarding Leo Varadkar relatively recently). It's a very serious allegation and he has long-since apologised for the 'kebabs' remark.

Steph, what is the story with this union protest?

Leitrim-Mick

Right, a couple of points on this -

1) FEE would be protesting the visit of the Fianna Fail Minister regardless of his racist opinions over the last couple of years.
It wasn't just one isolated incident, as well as the infamous Kebabs statement, he also made a Nazi salue in the direction of Fianna Gael's Leo Varadkar in the Dail recently, and two years ago advocated discrimination against members of the Muslim Community joining the Gardai.

2) FEE have constantly tried to explain their position on fees in structured debates and public meetings. The LawSoc Debate on Free Education and last Thursday's public meeting were two such occassions where FEE explained why they are for Free Education and anyone who wanted to challenge them on it or have a discussion with them were more than welcome to come along.

3) UCD Global Action Society are a recognised society and as such have as much right as any other society to put them up around campus.

spudington16

Are you referring to the fact that members of the Sikh faith are not permitted to wear turbans with the Garda Siochána uniform?

When Government Ministers visit cultures different from that of Ireland, they are expected to accept and abide by local customs, traditions and laws. Why should non-nationals be treated any differently here?