home owners not "allowed" to have pets

maidawg

When I retired and move to a condo in Florida, I was shocked to find that pets were not allowed. Evidently this is a VERY common occurrence in 55+ housing complexes.

I am trying to reach other pet lovers to let them know about this travesty.

Responsible pet owners/guardians should be allowed to have pets. Replace no-pet deed restrictions with more reasonable pet guidelines.

seanybiker

thats a bit strange.

seamus

It's common enough and fairly understandable where you have high-density housing, particularly apartment blocks. While pet guidelines are all well and good, it's very difficult to actually do anything about someone who has a noisy pet. In order to fine them or bring them to court you would need proof that the pet is noisy and disruptive. If you blanket say, "No", then you don't need as much effort.

Saying that, in our place the only rule is that you cannot keep a pet who poses a nuisance or disturbance. Which basically allows you to keep any animal, provided that they're not noisy or don't **** all over your neighbour's doorstep.

maidawg

REASONABLE pet guidelines would make a lot more people happy and would save the lives of thousands upon thousands of animals. There are some examples of reasonable pet guidelines at http://www.petsincondos.org/SuggestedPetGuidelines.htm.

It is really a tragedy for many seniors who live in 55+ housing complexes to not be able to have a companion animal.

Top Dog

While I don't agree with it, surely it is stated in the fine print when moving in to such complexes? Many might sign up for this very reason, as they can be guaranteed there wont be any pets wandering about defecating on their properties.

Genuine pet lovers wouldn't sign up and so choose to live somewhere else.

Thoie

I live in an apartment complex, and pets are not allowed - the terms of the lease make this clear. Saying that, I doubt if anyone would notice/care if I had a goldfish.

The fact of the matter is that many places just aren't suitable for pets. If you don't have direct street access there is also the matter of how do you get the pets in an out - the only way is through communal areas. Other residents may have allergies that could be set off.

I'm also not sure why your guidelines allow cats and dogs, but not reptiles - cats and dogs are far more likely to be noisy. You're requesting special designated dog walking areas - not all complexes have the facilities for this.

This issue does not only affect those aged 55+, so I'm not sure why you keep mentioning that.

maidawg

Thank you for your thoughtful reply, Thoie.

First of all, the issue is about home OWNERS not being able to have pets. I feel very strongly that people who own their homes should be able to decide how to live in them, as long as they are not impacting their neighbors. I believe in reasonable pet guidelines, rather than no-pet deed restrictions.

Renters are a whole other story. They are not the ones who have financial interest in the dwelling.

You say, "I'm also not sure why your guidelines allow cats and dogs, but not reptiles..." I guess I will have to think about this more. Our non-profit organization, Citizens for Pets in Condos, Inc, is having enough of a problem trying to get commonly accepted companion animals in.

The only reason I mention the issue in 55+ housing, is that the restrictions against pets are more prevalent. I agree that it happens in all-age communities, as well. Seniors, many of whom are alone, as a group are even more in need of animal companionship.

Thoie

maidawg wrote: »

Thank you for your thoughtful reply, Thoie.

First of all, the issue is about home OWNERS not being able to have pets. I feel very strongly that people who own their homes should be able to decide how to live in them, as long as they are not impacting their neighbors.

Ah - there might be a slight difference between America and Ireland - Irish apartment complexes are a bit like the complexes you're talking about. I own my apartment outright (well, with a mortgage, but you know what I mean), however the communal areas are owned by the management company (of which I, as an owner, am part of). There are a variety of apartment styles within the complex - 1 bed apt, 2 bed, 3 bed, 4 bed, duplexes. Some units have direct access to the grounds, others share a front door to the grounds, and have their own internal front door as well. The majority of residents have a financial interest in the building, though obviously some people are renting from an owner.

Personally, while I hate and detest reptiles and love dogs, I think properly cared for reptiles/spiders/fish and rodents (rabbits, hamsters etc) are far more suited to condo living than dogs and cats. Reptiles etc do not cause noise that may impinge on other owners, nor are they likely to shed fur or leave droppings in communal areas.

I think another area to look at is why the 55+ group are living in condos in the first place. In Ireland that kind of retirement complex is usually for more elderly people who need help - for example people with limited mobility, or health issues that may require someone to check on them regularly. We'd more normally call that Sheltered Housing. If someone chooses to purchase in a 55+ housing development you have to consider if they are properly capable of caring for a pet.

You mention that people should be allowed to do what they want as long as they are not impacting their neighbours - sadly the biggest impact on neighbours from most pets would be noise, and some dogs are just yappy. I once lived in a house with two dogs - one a pekinese and one a jack russel. Both got the same love, care and attention, but the pekinese was just a yapper. It used drive me nuts sometimes, and I think if there'd been any immediate neighbours it would have impacted them.

Something else to consider - would there be a limitation on the size of dog allowed? If this rule is passed could I keep 2 Great Danes in my 2 bedroom residence? From my experience, Great Danes are very gentle dogs that don't bark much (with the exception of one young male who was nearly 6 ft on his hind legs, and delighted in greeting me with a hug and a single deep bark right in my eardrum )Some of your links contain reference to dogs below a certain weight, so perhaps you've already thought of this.

I understand that this area is something you feel very strongly about, but I think you need to look at this from all angles, not just that of an animal lover. I think it's worthwhile discussing this with all your neighbours (perhaps at a residents meeting) and see what kind of response there is in your own complex first.

chrisdr

If you are in a condo you probably have a Home Owners Association. They make the rules regarding pets and that is pretty much law. You know the rules and regulations that govern appearances, outdoor modifications, trash removal and the like. As a homeowner you must of signed a document upon buying/and or renting where you currently live and were given a book regarding the rules and policies. Since you have to pay a homeowners association fee on a monthly basis.

Check your homeowner rules for pet policies. If you are wanting to change the rules. You might want to first contact your neighborhood representative or the association itself and see what you can do to change the rules. As apartments and anywhere you live here in the U.S. there are places that are pet friendly and allow you to keep so many animals. There are also city policies that are in place regarding pets as well and the number you can keep.

The only people that can have what they want are those that live in single family dwellings.

I know this does not address your complaint but when you live in a Condo you are pretty much at the mercy of the Home Owners Association. The only other thing is if the rule does not change you might want to move elsewhere.

maidawg

To Thoie - It had honestly never occurred to me that this discussion group was international. Here in the United States, 55+ condos are considered independent living. It sounds like 55+ complexes in Ireland are more like what we would call assisted living. While there are some more elderly people, some of whom hire aides to help them, there are many people perfectly capable of taking care of a pet. Some assisted living places even allow pets, but the workers there assist with self-care and pet care.

Mandated housing or association-run housing, is a type of home ownership, sometimes in stand-alone houses and sometimes in apartment houses. There are various kinds of housing in this category: condominiums (condos), HOAs (home owner associations), co-operatives (co-ops), townhomes, mobile home parks...

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To chrisdr

Our organization is working to get some laws to help people who want to responsibly have pets, regardless of association rules. You can see our action items at www.petsincondos.org for our current campaigns to clarifiy the right to have emotional support animals.

California is the only state in the US to have already passed positive legislation (back in 2001) to allow a unit owner (regardless of the "rules") to have at least one companion animal. Here is some of the wording right from California Civil Code section 1360.50:

’No governing documents shall prohibit an owner of a separate interest within a common interest development from keeping at least one pet within the
common interest development subject to reasonable rules and regulations of the association." The law also applies to mobile home parks.
Under California law, "governing documents," by the way, includes "operating rules."’

chrisdr

I wish you luck in your quest. But you might also wish to contact your Senator that represents your particular district and see if he will introduce legislation or if you know someone on the Florida Bar? More lawyers always help....

http://www.flsenate.gov/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0720/ch0720.htm

Thoie

maidawg wrote: »

To Thoie - It had honestly never occurred to me that this discussion group was international.

You'll find that the majority of people on this forum are Irish residents or ex-pats (though obviously there are other members as well) - hence some of my confusion. The ".ie" part of the address shows that this is an Irish registered website. In Ireland if we wanted laws like the Californian one quoted introduced, we'd contact our TDs (elected government officials) - I'm not very well up on US politics, but I think it would equate to a Senator in the US.

Demonique

Sorry, but I WILL NOT sign a petition that does not include reptile owners

Dublin13

I have a guinea pig and live in an apt block, she's a great pet to have for that kind of living. there are people in my block who own dogs, and bring them for walks and also are very quiet and it works fine... I think it would just really depend on who wants what and what your neighbours think. At end of the day, there isnt really alot the Mgt company can do even if you have a dog and someoen complains about it.. believe me, they have very little authority over very much, even though they pretend they do.

Demonique

Dublin13, this is in FLORIDA, not Dublin. Management companies have a lot more power over there.

Residents Associations in the US can be a right nuisance as well, forcing people to cover their houses in tacky Christmas lights regardless of whether they want to or not

Dublin13

Wow thats crazy. Ye things are deffo different over here. Its amazing how mgt companies in some places have completely different status than in other countries. Over here, they say one thing, and mean another, plus we have absolutely no rights over what we get. At present i'm with an estate run by a mgt company, who have pulled 90% of the services from the estate due to lack of funds, yet we have no choice but to pay our service charge this year, even with no services bar the essential.