New schools to give Communion lessons during classtimes

JC 2K3

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Some people just love ranting.

Such as yourself?

Stercus Accidit

Zillah wrote: »

I have received some really nasty backlashes in the past for saying that I have no intention of telling my children Santa is real. I don't want to encourage them to think like that and I feel it would be hypocritical of me.

I also firmly believe that the reason children regard Christmas as so special is because they get presents, not because a fat magical man supposedly broke into their home.

Have wondered how I would handle this myself, thread worthy maybe?
Would be more light hearted than most of the stuff in here, and with my hangover would be far more appealing!

Maybe an elaborate lie about the order of santa, a cult that have passed down the title and robes of saint nick through the centuries, and deliver presents.

Maybe I'll tell the truth, bah! Why do I an atheist now have a moral dilemma involving lies for kids, this should be a no brainer!

But I did enjoy the santa myth as a kid.

lostexpectation

you would have hoped and it may be the case that they would have come up with a new broader curriculum even if they were going to teach communion during schools hours.

the detail isn't there if they are teaching communion in class where will the other kids be?
its sounds impractical.

its melding of church and state again, that is problem.

lostexpectation

Tim Robbins wrote: »

This is something that really irritates me. I don't know what's more annoying:
1. Government policy
2. All the atheists / agnostics / secularists that moan and moan and moan and moan about it and do absolutely nothing about it. Join the humanist society or the educate together movement or shut up.

If the these movements had the hundreds of thousands of Irish people that feel this way, the government could not - repeat could not - ignore them.

They don't. And hence the government can treat them as irrelevant moaners while they listen to a well organised religious machine.

That's the way politics works. Government look to see whose hasseling them most, how much support they have and then act - when they have to and only when they have to. They don't care what's fair or what's right.

According to the last census there are alomst 200,000 people ticking the unreligious box. It's probably double that considering all the Mothers who tick the boxes. But, the humanist association only have 300 members. Educate Together put a public internet petition for its schools and had only 3,000 signatures.

So from Government perspective small organisations can be ignorned.
Because they are not politically powerful.

So get active or shut up moaning I say.

the meek shall inherit the earth huh?

but they have an advantage they get to teach their rubbish to most of the kids in the country.


you have no clue tim robbins just happy with the archaic status quo, you pretend its a level playing field, the government now not just the church itself have been actively hindering the setting up of news schools for decades, refusing to allow other group to be patrons, refusing to take on a public education system rather then leaving to private religious groups, refusing to set up a proper system for getting schools into new community groups, its not moaning its the government job to build a proper non-sectarian educational system on our behalf not to work in conjunction with church groups.

we shouldn't have to lobby for it.

lostexpectation

Folex wrote: »

Maybe I'm missing the point a bit here, but I don't really see what the issue is. Not all children in the school(s) are being "force-taught" Catholicism; just the children who's parents request it. Parents who choose to raise their children Catholic will, more than likely, avail of this. Parents who choose to raise their children with different / no religious views will not avail of this.

I really think the question of "forcing religion upon children" is an entirely different matter. Also, regarding the options of *other* religions / choices being taught in primary schools:



Well then you'll have to work with those in charge of FSM (i.e. the equivalent of the bishops / Catholic Church) to get them involved in the school system. That's not an issue for O'Keeffe, at least not until the other religious bodies get involved and request that they would like their views to be taught in the school.

I'm 27 and a Catholic. The primary school I went to taught us Catholicism and indeed we said the Angelous at noon. However, when I went home after lunch, at least half of the kids I went and played with were Protestant. The only difference we saw at that age was that we had to go to *different* schools; we would've loved to be in the same school!

There was never ever a feeling that some kids were "weird" because they had a different religion. We were all taught to have an inherent tolerance of others, and I think *that's* the most important factor when teaching children about religion. I know that Ireland is more of a multi-denominational country nowadays, but it still holds true.

that _is_ the problem folex.

Tim Robbins

lostexpectation wrote: »

you pretend its a level playing field, the government now not just the church itself have been actively hindering the setting up of news schools for decades, refusing to allow other group to be patrons, refusing to take on a public education system rather then leaving to private religious groups, refusing to set up a proper system for getting schools into new community groups, its not moaning its the government job to build a proper non-sectarian educational system on our behalf not to work in conjunction with church groups.

I know all that. That is why I support HAI and educate together.

we shouldn't have to lobby for it.

Of course we shouldn't. But if life was perfect we wouldn't even need a government. Everyone would magically get on, magically compromise or magically all want the exact same thing.

getz

i know that in the uk religious run schools have to have a percentage of pupils from other religious dominations before they can get a goverment grant-i noticed a strange thing last year in the local newspaper ,a girls catholic school was asking for protestant girls to fill there quota-i found out that that many muslim parents wanted to send there girl children to the catholic school[something to do with not mixing boy/ girl together] but they could not get children from other dominations--this school is i north manchester

ChocolateSauce

I attended a UCD debate last Wednesday entitled "This house would ban religious symbols in schools", and there were really two debates going on: The motion, and the direction of religion in schools.

The overwhelming opinion was that all religions should be accomodated by the school system and that they should be taught in a PC way which neither confirmed nor denied their factuality.

Myself, I'm in favour both of their (religion) total excision from public schools and also of the right of students to wear what they want.

lostexpectation

which nutcase did ucd invite this time?

ChocolateSauce

Conor Lenihan, Minister of Sate, and the Archbishop of Dublin/Primate of all Ireland were to two keynote speakers, but Mr. Lenihan was forced to cancel due to militant anti-government protests on the night.

lostexpectation

pity these debates often lack a government /state representative.

although who was arguing the secular side.