Importing a BRAND new car from UK

Brewster

Folks, im familiar with situation importing a car less than 6 months old or less than 6000k on clock i.e. you do not pay VAT in Uk and you pay VAT and VRT on import.

Is the situation any different for brand new cars? I understand that there is a significant fee for the first registration of a vehicle in the UK. Can anyone confirm this? Is it possible to put temporary plates on car for the purposes of driving it over to Ireland and get a reduction in purchase price?

ninty9er

Brewster wrote: »

Folks, im familiar with situation importing a car less than 6 months old or less than 6000k on clock i.e. you do not pay VAT in Uk and you pay VAT and VRT on import.

Is the situation any different for brand new cars? I understand that there is a significant fee for the first registration of a vehicle in the UK. Can anyone confirm this? Is it possible to put temporary plates on car for the purposes of driving it over to Ireland and get a reduction in purchase price?

You don't need to register a car to get temporary plates. HMRC would be the people to talk to though.

Brewster

HMRC, is that Revenue in Uk?

I wonder do the VRT implications change if the car was not first registered in the country of import?

Biro

Might I ask why you're buying the car over there? It'll work out dearer for most makes and models. Is it a special model that can't be sourced over here?

Brewster

Well I wont be doing anything unless I can sell my own 05 Golf which is proving most frustrating! It wouldnt be a special model, I know I will be better off in Uk. I would need about 25% discount on list price on similar Irish car to compete? I dont think this is possible? Maybe im wrong?

Voodoomelon

5% is the best you'll get here.

Brewster

I think youd do better than that. If I went in 2moro id expect 10%.. i.e 40k car, id be shocked if I couldnt buy it straight for 36k.....

robbie99

Brewster wrote: »

I think youd do better than that. If I went in 2moro id expect 10%.. i.e 40k car, id be shocked if I couldnt buy it straight for 36k.....

The pre-tax cost of your car must be cheaper in the UK than here. Have you factored in any discount you might get from the UK dealer? New car market in the UK is apparently on its knees as much as it is here.

Owen

I'd question the logic of bringing in a brand new car from the UK. Firstly, most pre-tax prices are actually cheaper here, than the UK. So excluding your ferries, flights, and hotel costs, you're probably going to be a little more out of pocket before you begin (Depending on the car).

Also, you must pay the VAT in the UK when you purchase the vehicle (I think anyway, this is definitely the way it's done if you're exporting a car from Ireland, so I'm guessing it's the same). After you export it and re-register in Ireland, you pay VAT and VRT here, and then reclaim the VAT back from the UK.

You can arrange temporary plates from the AA, they're ZZ plates which are universally used for exporting througout Europe, and come with a day's insurance too.

My experience of this process was helping a customer to export a car to Switzerland a while back, and this was the method used here in Ireland. I would imagine the UK system with VAT is similar to here.

Brewster

Folks, I must say its interesting to hear your opinions. If you buy a new car in the UK, you do not pay VAT. You pay for the car net of VAT using Revenue form 411 and when you import it in Ireland you pay VAT and VRT at that stage. So in this regard, with current exchange rates, its much cheaper to buy in UK. There are some serious discounts to be had on new cars in UK, list prices of 34k pounds being sold at 27/28 pounds. Ferry and flights costs dont exactly come into my thinking, couple of hundred euros. Im speaking thousands here.

Owen

Brewster wrote: »

Folks, I must say its interesting to hear your opinions. If you buy a new car in the UK, you do not pay VAT.

Can you provide a link for that? Would be a good reference for the rest of us to have. It's news to me, so I wouldn't mind learning something new today, if it's correct that is.

Brewster wrote: »

Ferry and flights costs dont exactly come into my thinking, couple of hundred euros. Im speaking thousands here.

I've always factored in transport costs into the equation. In the last case I did, it worked out at around 700 Euro - 160 for ferry, about 100 for the flight, 80 for trains (Long journey from Leeds to Aberdeen - 4 different trains), 15 for the taxi between the plane and the train, a hotel for the night @ 110, and three and a half tanks of fuel for the trip home - thirsty girlie that she is.

Brewster

ned78 wrote: »

Can you provide a link for that? Would be a good reference for the rest of us to have. It's news to me, so I wouldn't mind learning something new today, if it's correct that is.



I've always factored in transport costs into the equation. In the last case I did, it worked out at around 700 Euro - 160 for ferry, about 100 for the flight, 80 for trains (Long journey from Leeds to Aberdeen - 4 different trains), 15 for the taxi between the plane and the train, a hotel for the night @ 110, and three and a half tanks of fuel for the trip home - thirsty girlie that she is.

Her Majesty's Custom and Revenue website has all the information. Cant access link just now. Google VAT Form 411 maybe. This is 100% accurate. My original question was there another saving to be made on not registering vehicle!

If you were saving 12k on a car, I wouldnt worry about costs of getting her home! Fly early morning, drive back that evening. 350 euro tops....

Alas, if only I could sell my 05 VW golf...... 42k miles, 3 dr, TDI sportsline?! Anyone interested, giving it away!

Brewster

Exporting your motor vehicle to another EU country from the UK
If you buy a new motor vehicle in the UK to take to somewhere else in the EU, you'll have to pay VAT on the vehicle in the other country when you arrive there. You won't have to pay UK VAT when you buy the car if you do all three of these things:

you or your authorised chauffeur personally take delivery of the new vehicle in the UK
you export it within two months of its supply to you
you and your supplier complete and sign form VAT 411 and send it to the address on the form
If you sell a new vehicle to someone who is moving to another EU country within two months, you may be entitled to a refund of VAT. This only applies if you aren't registered for VAT in the UK, and you can demonstrate that you have paid UK VAT on the vehicle.

Obtain form VAT 411 New Means of Transport

robbie99

Biro wrote: »

Might I ask why you're buying the car over there? It'll work out dearer for most makes and models.

ned78 wrote: »

I'd question the logic of bringing in a brand new car from the UK. Firstly, most pre-tax prices are actually cheaper here, than the UK.

Not true anymore. With the price of sterling, I'll stick my neck out and say that you won't find any car that's more expensive pre-tax in the UK than here. I can give many examples. Last time I checked, (six months ago) I couldn't find a brand new BMW that was less than 10% cheaper pre-tax in the UK. Price difference would be to the order of another 5% greater with the recent drop in price of sterling. I don't like having to point this out as I feel for the Irish motor industry but I think it's plain false stating that Irish prices are cheaper.

ned78 wrote: »

Also, you must pay the VAT in the UK when you purchase the vehicle (I think anyway, this is definitely the way it's done if you're exporting a car from Ireland, so I'm guessing it's the same). After you export it and re-register in Ireland, you pay VAT and VRT here, and then reclaim the VAT back from the UK.

Another point that needs to be corrected. New cars can be bought VAT free in the UK. Details here. Simple Form to fill in here.

EDIT: I'm a bit slow here! Points already addressed!

Brewster

No problem Robbie. Its a no-brainer. I agree with you 100% I think alot of people possibly didnt realise the VAT implications of buying new in UK. Have you any knowledge of registration issues? From what I can see I dont think it makes any difference if you get the garage to register car to themselves and then you just drive her out of garage or whether u put temporary plates on it. I dont think there are any financial implications.

Stevie Dakota

At the risk of putting another nail in the coffin or Irish car sales, lets have some examples!

Brewster

Ill second Robbie's comments on Irish Motor Industry. Money talks unfortunately.

Brewster

I dont want to get into any debates here. Im quite certain of the savings I can make.

Stevie Dakota

Brewster wrote: »

I dont want to get into any debates here. Im quite certain of the savings I can make.

I have no doubt, and I'm not debating the economics with you. I'm just curious to see what kind of saving you have achieved or are on offer.

Padraig Mor

Stevie Dakota wrote: »

I have no doubt, and I'm not debating the economics with you. I'm just curious to see what kind of saving you have achieved or are on offer.

I ran the figures the other day on a new base spec 520d SE from Motorlogix (which doesn't even match the WhatCar target price)......you can bring it in all taxes paid for €37500 plus whatever transport costs you.

The main problem you will run into (besides dealers thinking it's a scam because you don't want to pay VAT) is that discounts are often dependent on the dealer registering the car to a UK address. They CAN register it 'temporarily' to their address but chances are most of them won't have a clue. dealers in NI near the border are most likely to know......but least likely to discount!

edit: I've attached an Excel sheet I use to work out approx prices. Currency prices are based on using XETrade - about 0.5% commission.

Owen

Thanks for the info on the VAT guys, good to know!

robbie99

Brewster wrote: »

No problem Robbie. Its a no-brainer. I agree with you 100% I think alot of people possibly didnt realise the VAT implications of buying new in UK. Have you any knowledge of registration issues? From what I can see I dont think it makes any difference if you get the garage to register car to themselves and then you just drive her out of garage or whether u put temporary plates on it. I dont think there are any financial implications.

I don't really know much about the first time registration tax and how to deal with it. The first time registration tax would be included in the list price of the car. I'd guess that if you asked the dealer to apply for the temporary export plates you won't have to pay it and therefore it would work out cheaper but I don't think it's a lot. I bought a three month old BMW earlier this year and I was able to get a refund on the unused UK road tax. You'd be able to do the same. I've no idea if the first time registration tax portion of the UK road tax will be refundable in the same way. I think that UK dealers will prefer to register the car as a UK car because that is what they know and AFAIK that is how their targets are measured.

robbie99

Brewster wrote: »

I wonder do the VRT implications change if the car was not first registered in the country of import?

Oh, I guess you won't have a V5 form if you go down the temporary export plates route so make sure you get the EU Certificate of Conformity with the car. In the UK they might call this the Type Approval Cert or something different.

Drummerboy08

Ok. At the risk of getting kicked out here, I'm gonna say this. As someone in car sales over here, i have to laugh at a person buying a new/nearly new car in the UK.

Ok, he might save money. BUT. When something goes wrong with this car (the days of "ah sure nothing can go wrong - its a new car" are long gone im afraid) and brings it into a dealer to get fixed or looked at, he'll be in trouble.

The first question a service advisor will ask is "was the car bought here?" "No it was bought in the UK"..... "Oh....Right well sorry but were actually booked up for the next three weeks so nothin i can do really..." Irish dealerships are notoriously territorial so thats potentially a problem. So you say, my best mate is a mechanic, I'll get him to service it. In three years time, would you buy a car with a service history stamped by a main dealer or by "tom,dick, and harry motors"?

Second. If its a warranty job, the munufacturer will have an issue of an English car getting its work done in the Republic. I've experienced few cases where the manufacturer will NOT pay out on the warranty issue - even if it is genuine. Again, its all well and good to go and save your few pound buying a car in the UK, but if and when something goes wrong with this vehicle, an Irish dealer wont be there to pick up the pieces.

Just some food for thought. I know that the irish car market mainly has itself to blame for the downturn, i'm not defending its actions, im just a lowly car sales guy, (who's actually quite honest). It's also people like this who are contributing to the depression in this country. If we were all to go and buy our goods in the North/UK, where would we be?.....

Rob.

Stevie Dakota

Total BS. I've had NO issues at Irish dealers with a UK BMW, Merc, Renault and Ford. Warranty work, no problem? It was NEVER raised as an issue, in fact Renault told ME they would cover the car for 3 years, given that it was a UK car, I didn't even have to ask them.

Drummerboy08

Hey lads, lose the attitude... I'm just saying this out of my experience in the trade.

I also said, "where was the car bought", not "was the car bought in Ireland" - Big difference.

I'm not defending the Motor trade - stupid things have been done by irish dealers over the years for the sake of a few bob. I'm admitting that.

OK. Go ahead and buy ALL your products in the north because your fed up of being ripped off by Irish retailers. Get your friends and family to do the same, and get them to pass it on to their friends and family. Now all of a sudden your job in Manufacturing is gone because nobody is buying products from Ireland, in turn your accountant of a cousin is out of business because he has no money of yours to count, etc. Fairly soon you'll all be on the dole que que with the rest of us for the sake of a few cents on the price of a, lets say, apple.

Its a vicious circle, and if we all dont support irish business, fairly soon we'll be in even more of a depression.

Eric Cartman

id try get some off the price of the car, uk dealers are begging to shift cars and the sterling is gone so good you can get a real deal new or 2nd hand,

Neilw

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

OK. Go ahead and buy ALL your products in the north because your fed up of being ripped off by Irish retailers. Get your friends and family to do the same, and get them to pass it on to their friends and family. Now all of a sudden your job in Manufacturing is gone because nobody is buying products from Ireland, in turn your accountant of a cousin is out of business because he has no money of yours to count, etc. Fairly soon you'll all be on the dole que que with the rest of us for the sake of a few cents on the price of a, lets say, apple.

The extent to which we are being ripped of here is far more then a few cents, an example relevant to the motoring forum.

I needed a new brake master cylinder for my car, priced one from a main dealer in Dublin €190ish plus vat. I then rang a dealer in the north, £89sterling inc vat, plus £10 postage to Dublin...guess which one I bought :rolleyes:

It's the same with electronics, LCD TV in Dublin Currys €1299, quick drive to Newry save a couple of hundred €.

Brewster

Pm sent Stevie....

Brewster

robbie99 wrote: »

I don't really know much about the first time registration tax and how to deal with it. The first time registration tax would be included in the list price of the car. I'd guess that if you asked the dealer to apply for the temporary export plates you won't have to pay it and therefore it would work out cheaper but I don't think it's a lot. I bought a three month old BMW earlier this year and I was able to get a refund on the unused UK road tax. You'd be able to do the same. I've no idea if the first time registration tax portion of the UK road tax will be refundable in the same way. I think that UK dealers will prefer to register the car as a UK car because that is what they know and AFAIK that is how their targets are measured.

Robbie from what I can gather the price to register a car is 55 pounds so neither here nor there. I dont know, but I would have thought that garage would register car as a demo in this case and simply sell it out like any car. I have seen cars registered in Uk showrooms with 10 miles on clock.

robbie99

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

Ok. At the risk of getting kicked out here, I'm gonna say this. As someone in car sales over here, i have to laugh at a person buying a new/nearly new car in the UK.

Ok, he might save money. BUT. When something goes wrong with this car (the days of "ah sure nothing can go wrong - its a new car" are long gone im afraid) and brings it into a dealer to get fixed or looked at, he'll be in trouble.

The first question a service advisor will ask is "was the car bought here?" "No it was bought in the UK"..... "Oh....Right well sorry but were actually booked up for the next three weeks so nothin i can do really..." Irish dealerships are notoriously territorial so thats potentially a problem. So you say, my best mate is a mechanic, I'll get him to service it. In three years time, would you buy a car with a service history stamped by a main dealer or by "tom,dick, and harry motors"?

Second. If its a warranty job, the munufacturer will have an issue of an English car getting its work done in the Republic. I've experienced few cases where the manufacturer will NOT pay out on the warranty issue - even if it is genuine. Again, its all well and good to go and save your few pound buying a car in the UK, but if and when something goes wrong with this vehicle, an Irish dealer wont be there to pick up the pieces.

Just some food for thought. I know that the irish car market mainly has itself to blame for the downturn, i'm not defending its actions, im just a lowly car sales guy, (who's actually quite honest). It's also people like this who are contributing to the depression in this country. If we were all to go and buy our goods in the North/UK, where would we be?.....

Rob.

I think you should talk to your colleagues in your parts and service department more often.

When I was buying my car I was willing to buy new here. I was willing to pay a couple of k more here for the peace of mind of having good customer service if I ever had issue with my car. I was open with the sales reps here and let it be known that buying from the UK was an option for me but my preference was to buy here. I couldn't get a discount anywhere near what I could get in the UK so I bought there but the thing is that when I asked the sales reps here if the UK waranty would be honoured here they said no, I'd have to bring the car back accross the water to get it fixed. Well guess what, on the drive back from the UK I got minor damage that involved needing to repair the front bumper. Rather than turn back I carried on home and brought it into my local BMW dealer still with the UK plates on and no problem at all they'd repair it (insurance paying) and they'd even print me up the Irish plates. I asked them about the situation with waranty and the service department said had absolutely no problem doing waranty work on UK imports. I asked about the 3rd year of UK waranty which Irish cars don't get and service dept said no problem, they're able to claim that directly from BMW UK. I've since had a free BMW winter inspection and a waranty issue with a headlight washer unit sorted (along with a courtesy car) at BMW Ireland expense. Totally contradictory to what the sales guys were saying.

In fact, my previous car, a Hyundai (Irish), I bought as a three year old. When I went to get it serviced (way before people started importing) the first question I was asked was "Did you buy the car here?" by a Hyundai main dealer in Fairview. I could only stumble in reply, "Eh, I actually bought this secondhand but I think the lady who owned it might have bought it new here is that ok?". "We don't have that car on record". So ironically I get better service and attention with a UK import than I did with an Irish car. :rolleyes: