A YES vote for Lisbon is a YES vote for ushering in the New World Order.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

I gave them, your selective reading eh, not surprised

No, Diogenes gave example of "vote no" posters using fearful images to scare people into voting no.

mysterious wrote: »

From Europe.

Where from Europe? From who and when?
Back this claim up please.

mysterious wrote: »

Point out where I used scaremongering? pure and simple is the definition for what scaremongering

Pleaee state, where you bate my words.:)

Case and point.

What is happening here, is a false impreession of democracy. Give a man, country, superstate enough power it will turn into a one man power system.

We will see whos right in ten years time eh.

This is the direction of Europe, you might not see it yet though

And this is just the very latest example.
Pretty much all of your posts make some wild baselss accusation against Europe.

mysterious

Diogenes wrote: »

No you said

Yes, I did, your point IS, other than your intial argument was about my ego and that jazz. Funny how you deflect this

I'm thinking, Im counting, I'm singing and I'm not going to judge your actions. I'll let the readers decided that...........

Theres nothing in the Lisbon treaty about putting microchips in our babies arms, or nuclear war, or barcoding your head.

But a superstate is associated with that.

The idea of voting for lisbon, is the begiining of this.
You could associate these pictures with USA already. US of E in the coming generation.

Lisbon is the begining of these steps

I can see the logic behind these pictures.

YOU said using fear to influence an election is wrong. You're flim flamming about the No vote using fear. You're now saying that using posters that suggest what you think is the potential worse case scenario of a yes vote is okay.

These are examples of fear that is associated with a superstate.

Mushrooms clouds, wars, lack of privacy and all these injections and what not are real problems in todays world. That are happening, and with a super elite run super state Europe you can bet, this continent will be pairing with China and USA for the global slice of the pie.

Do you suffer from an irony deficiency?

This behaviour is inappropriate. Diogenes I hope a mod comes soon

Cus I'm really biting my lip on what your behaviour tells me.

Accept they are claiming that "this is what will happen if theres a yes vote" Without explaining which parts of yes vote will make this happen.

Perfect example of getting bogged down on a small detail. You see I've explained this argument, in the previous two post.

I really wonder what is the point of dicussing with you at all. I really have tried. But it seems you don't read and just attack and take my words out of context. The quote here is evident. I think I'll rest my case here on this.

By putting up posters with Mushroom clouds. No wait that'd be the "No" campaign.

A super Europe with a millitary. It will use it's power to reassure it's hegomy on the planet just like China and USA.

Mushroom clouds is what power and destruction represent.

Could you offer a real scenario based on the Lisbon treaty were children will be injected with microchips.

Yes, once this treaty is passed. Specifically this treaty. The next few treaties will further take our power and our world wil become completely controlled via these amendments, because we've signed them.

I'm saying just say yes to this treaty. And you could well see a controlled society within 20 years and dare I say it microchips implanted in us.

Theres no difference. Well there is, the "Yes" campaign didn't suggest that if we didn't vote yes to the Lisbon treaty by suggesting we'd be nuked, our children would be microchipped and we'd have barcodes on our heads.

Give a group, elite, man enough power he can and will do that

You've consistently claimed you have some mystical insight on all issues.

Where?:rolleyes:

You've made several broad claims in your last two posts, and havent backed them up.

I have you just don't agree with them.

No you just pointed out both leaders and claimed they were the same, you offered no examples.

I already posted in the previous two posts.

I'm beginning to think you don't read....

Ah so Obama, is dismantling the first amendment and it's like totally well documented, but you well can't find it.

Excuse me if I go on a lil nuts

You seriously don't read do you? I could post 100s of more, this proves you don't pay much attention to the world whatsover.

If you go on youtube, you will actually hear chatshows dicussing it. My housemate knew this before me. He said this to me during the election year. He's not even a C.Ts. Alex jones has talked about it. If you google it, there are 1000s of results.

www.abovetopsecret.com even has a dedicated thread to Obamas adminsitration hopes to dismantle it. It has been around quite a while just incase you haven't been paying attention.

Here is just a quick google
http://conservativeally.today.com/2008/09/19/obama-wants-to-censor-freedom-of-speech

Incase your eye missed that:P
You should read this might be interesting
http://www.prisonplanet.com/obama-sheeple-cheer-police-violation-of-free-speech.html.

This is really happening, and yes its happening faster than you could all imagine. The world is heading for a controlled robotic society. You just keep believing these treaties and keep yesing to these corruptions. But gaaaa I'll just make sure I keep my freedom and power to my hands.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

Case and point.

And this is just the very latest example.
Pretty much all of your posts make some wild baselss accusation against Europe.

It's not an accusation. I perfectly pointed out, how all superpowers end up like. Europe will not be special in this case.
It's a fact and well noted in the history books that this is what happens when you give a country, politican or a new superstate such as Europe this power. If your really on the ball. You will also know. This is how human nature goes hand in hand with power.

Power corrupts. You keep yessing this and you keep allowing Europe to have greater control and power. It will have greater control and power. It it will use this control and power to further their control and power. It's an infection. I'm not saying Lisbon is all this, but the infection begins now.


The ideology of this, will turn into destruction. This is the cycle of how power works on this planet. It will forever go in this pattern until you all become aware and learn not to fall into this past cycle. I do agree that Europe is not at this stage yet. But it will come to this stage. It's ony natural for it to be. This is how we humans operate. We are people who want to rule and be lead. It will be percieved this way, as history has always always shown this.

It's simple simple basic pshycology of any man/system in power. History books will prove it time and time again. Today you have USA in this position and now China. I'm not making it out to be some sort of an accusation against Europe purely. This is how humanity works whether you like ir or dont know it.


Where is your proof of scaremongering pure and simple. i'm stating past events and facts of what political system do and become. Where is my scaremongering?

Really I love how people twist my words to counter their own ready made attacks.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

It's not an accusation.
It's a fact and well noted in the history books that this is what happens when you give a country, politican or a new superstate such as Europe this power. If your really on the ball. You will also know. This is how human nature goes hand in hand with power.

Power corrupts. You keep yessing this and you keep allowing Europe to have greater control and power. It will have greater control and power. It it will use this control and power to further theri control and power. The ideology of this, will turn into destruction. This is the cycle of how power works on this planet. It will foever go like this until you all become aware and learn not to fall into this past cycle. I do agree that Europe is not at this stage yet. But it will come to this stage. It will be percieved this way, as history has always always shown this.

It's simple simple basic pshycology of any man/system in power. History books will prove it time and time again. Today you have USA in this position and now China. I'm not making it out to be some sort of an accusation against Europe purely. This is how humanity works whether you like ir or dont know it.


Where is your proof of scaremongering pure and simple. i'm stating past events and facts of what political system do and become. Where is my scaremongering?

Really I love how people twist my words to counter their own ready made attacks.

There is your scaremongering right there.
You're claiming that if we vote yes , then europe will go mad with power and take away all our rights and destroy the world.

So what exactly in the lisbon treaty will give Europe the power you think they'll have?

And at what point in history have the condition been the exact same?
I'm fairly certain they didn't have instant worldwide communication or near universal education in Rome.

K-9

mysterious wrote: »

Yes, once this treaty is passed. Specifically this treaty.

Why specifically this one?

Can you answer with specifics?

PS. It's a complicated legal document as you know yourself. There has to be something in there that will legally allow them to do all this stuff.

The EU are pressing ahead with plans to ban fluoridisation. Brilliant aren't they.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

There is your scaremongering right there.
You're claiming that if we vote yes , then europe will go mad with power and take away all our rights and destroy the world.

So what exactly in the lisbon treaty will give Europe the power you think they'll have?

And at what point in history have the condition been the exact same?
I'm fairly certain they didn't have instant worldwide communication or near universal education in Rome.

It's not scaremongering. seriously ffs.
King mob you must be a good fan of selective reading:D
Ok this will be the last time I do this, then if you do it again, your on ignore. I really shouldn't have to do this a third time. So here it goes again.

I never said Lisbon will create this. I again specifically said in my last post. Lisbon will not create this as the final result of what Europe is to become or might become if we keep passing these treatieB]s[/B [note plural]. But I did say that passing Lisbon, allows for the coming and beginning of more of the same and a supestate run Europe. Step by step by taking more control and eventually this becoming a super state. If you look back at 10 years ago and look at the development you wouldn't of thought that Europeans could travel freely through countries and use the same currency. You see it's all step by step process.

I state my points clearly on this forum, and my points are pretty much the same. I don't hold the scaremongering tactics. I'm not even here to stick up for no voters or yes voters.

I never said lisbon in itself would create that ending. So I'm going to publically say don't disort my words. Lisbon is the first step to a greater control of the EU of our nations.

Where did I state they will destroy the world. Again taking my words out of context.

I'm asking myself why am I replying to this crap?

K-9

K-9 wrote: »

Why specifically this one?

Can you answer with specifics?

PS. It's a complicated legal document as you know yourself. There has to be something in there that will legally allow them to do all this stuff.

The EU are pressing ahead with plans to ban fluoridisation. Brilliant aren't they.

mysterious wrote:

I never said Lisbon will create this. I again specifically said in my last post. Lisbon will not create this. But I did say that passing Lisbon, allows for the coming of more treaties. Step by step by taking more control and eventually this becoming a super state. If you look back at 10 years ago and look at the development you wouldn't of thought that Europeans could travel freely through countries and use the same currency. You see it's all step by step process.

You did mysterious, I quoted you before your edit.

Please state why specifically this treaty?

Seeing as you've read it, were are these specifics?

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

It's not scaremongering. seriously ffs.
King mob you must be a good fan of selective reading:D
Ok this will be the last time I do this, then if you do it again, your on ignore. I really shouldn't have to do this a third time. So here it goes again.

I never said Lisbon will create this. I again specifically said in my last post. Lisbon will not create this. But I did say that passing Lisbon, allows for the coming of more treaties. Step by step by taking more control and eventually this becoming a super state. If you look back at 10 years ago and look at the development you wouldn't of thought that Europeans could travel freely through countries and use the same currency. You see it's all step by step process.

I never said lisbon in itself would create that. So I'm going to publically say don't disort my words. Lisbon is the first step to a greater control of the EU of our nations.

Where did I state they will destroy the world. Again taking my words out of context.

I'm asking myself why am I replying to this crap?

And how do you know that more treaties will take more control?

Or are you just assuming that it will?
Because if you've nothing to back that up it's a baseless accusation.
And if you use that accusation to try and change someone opinion through fear, that's called scaremongering.

mysterious

K-9 wrote: »

Why specifically this one?

Can you answer with specifics?

Because with this treaty.

There are adamant they want it passed. To me in my opinion. This tells me that whatever happens after onced passed, is a continuation of the elite agenda to carry onto the next treaty or next goal.

The other reason why I specify this one is because
It's a revote

Another is because of the behaviour coming from the EU elite. I don't approve of it.

Another reason, because it's the beginning of what it is to come.

PS. It's a complicated legal document as you know yourself. There has to be something in there that will legally allow them to do all this stuff.

The EU are pressing ahead with plans to ban fluoridisation. Brilliant aren't they.

Can you post me a link on this I do find this quite interesting to say the least

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Another reason, because it's the beginning of what it is to come.

The beginning of what exactly? How do you know what's to come?

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

And how do you know that more treaties will take more control?

Or are you just assuming that it will?
Because if you've nothing to back that up it's a baseless accusation.
And if you use that accusation to try and change someone opinion through fear, that's called scaremongering.

Well you could say assuming, but I'm looking back over the years and looking at the direction where EU is heading. One can easily guess what.

A super Europe. With the idea of free movement, more EU countries with advanced english, greater EU power in courts, same currency, the nice treaty and now lisbon.

Everything leads onto the next. The logical view, would the next would be the case. The direction is still going towards greater EU power all the time.

The fact the they really want this passed, would also be clear in anyones mind the next step is already prepared.;)

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

The beginning of what exactly? How do you know what's to come?

One country.:(

K-9

mysterious wrote: »

Because with this treaty.

There are adamant they want it passed. To me in my opinion. This tells me that whatever happens after onced passed, is a continuation of the elite agenda to carry onto the next treaty or next goal.

The other reason why I specify this one is because
It's a revote

Another is because of the behaviour coming from the EU elite. I don't approve of it.

Another reason, because it's the beginning of what it is to come.

That isn't a specific answer mysterious,. They need legal power for all this. It has to be somewhere in a Treaty.

You read Lisbon, you must have a vague recollection of how they can do this

mysterious wrote:

Can you post me a link on this I do find this quite interesting to say the least

The majority don't have it. Sweden is a leading proponent against it. That leads me to believe that the EU is fighting fluoridisation.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Well you could say assuming, but I'm looking back over the years and looking at the direction where EU is heading. One can easily guess what.

A super Europe. With the idea of free movement, more EU countries with advanced english, greater EU power in courts, same currency, the nice treaty and now lisbon.

Everything leads onto the next. The logical view, would the next would be the case. The direction is still going towards greater EU power all the time.

The fact the they really want this passed, would also be clear in anyones mind the next step is already prepared.;)

So no, you can't back up your accusations with anything tangible, just your own guesses?

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

One country.:(

And how do you know?

K-9

I find it strange mysterious, that for somebody who has read the Treaty, you cannot provide references to articles in it.

mysterious

K-9 wrote: »

That isn't a specific answer mysterious,. They need legal power for all this. It has to be somewhere in a Treaty.

You read Lisbon, you must have a vague recollection of how they can do this

No your not giving me a specific your changing the tune here.

Nowhere did I say that the Lisbon treaty will make a super Europe and of course it's not going to state on the paper ffs. i SAID that lisbon is like a seed. you don't see what it becomes until it grows.

Lisbon is not the actual creation of a super Europe nor does hold words in the documents to state so. But it's the first step to allow Europe to begin it's system. I'll try explain it in another term. Try bear with me.

Okay I will give you a word. POWER.

Lisbon treaty does not show power

• But lisbon passed - P
• Next treay - O
• Next treaty - W
• Next treaty - E
• Next treaty -R

Yet the lisbon treaty is one part of the whole. There is no specific form of the elite wanting to control or create a superstate in print. But this format is the way they are going about it.

You wall don't believe that the end result or the word power wont come up, cus it has to show up in the first case scenerio, i.e Lisbon. Do you really think the elite would give it away like that. If they did this, we would destroy their chances immeadiately by sacking this treaty. But the elite are doing it the above way as I've shown.
Does ideology clearer to you. A step by step process to create the actual result. This way it's easier to get us to vote for each treaty as in a segment. This way it's seems like its pretty much what it says on the print. But each treaty has its merit for the next.

The majority don't have it. Sweden is a leading proponent against it. That leads me to believe that the EU is fighting fluoridisation.

Sweeden been against it doesn't mean all of Europe is against it. In the UK they are trying to make it a reality. Southampton got their water flouridated recently despite fierce opppostion by the people of Southampton.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

And how do you know?

By been aware

Learning and seeing what happened in the past and what is going on now

This gives you a clear idea as to what might happen in the future. Taking into consideration that humanity has had this power struggle since we first became man.

Nimrod first king, first civilisation wanted a NWO and global empire, like all super powers. The idealogy of Europe is no different to what was, what's is now and what is there now

Maybe its just been in synch to the world

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

So no, you can't back up your accusations with anything tangible, just your own guesses?

Where's all of what I said were guesses, show me and I'll back them up:P;)

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

By been aware

Learning and seeing what happened in the past and what is going on now

This gives you a clear idea as to what might happen in the future. Taking into consideration that humanity has had this power struggle since we first became man.

Nimrod first king, first civilisation wanted a NWO and global empire, like all super powers. The idealogy of Europe is no different to what was, what's is now and what is there now

Maybe its just been in synch to the world

So no, you don't know.
You're just basing off your simplistic view of history and your own belief in a non existent new world order.
And the only thing you have to support these beliefs is "you're more in tune with nature."

Very convincing.

But tell me, and answer honestly and clearly, what do you call using an accusation that you can't back up for the purpose of changing someones opinion through fear?

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Where's all of what I said were guesses, show me and I'll back them up:P;)

mysterious wrote: »

Everything leads onto the next. The logical view, would the next would be the case. The direction is still going towards greater EU power all the time.

The fact the they really want this passed, would also be clear in anyones mind the next step is already prepared.;)

By all means back this up.

Not some waffle on "history" or you being aware. Verifiable and reliable sources please.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

By all means back this up.

Not some waffle on "history" or you being aware. Verifiable and reliable sources please.

I did in previous posts, on current events with Europe, the past of previous empires. I mean we could do a whole history lesson now here,

PM me, and I'll post ya loads of history stuff about the world:)

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

So no, you don't know.
You're just basing off your simplistic view of history and your own belief in a non existent new world order.
And the only thing you have to support these beliefs is "you're more in tune with nature."

Very convincing.

But tell me, and answer honestly and clearly, what do you call using an accusation that you can't back up for the purpose of changing someones opinion through fear?

Acussation? Tell me what was an accusation, since you do selectively read and distort my posts even after I've answered it.

I must be blessed by god, to have such paitence with you.:)
And to put a sock in that argument. You brought this accusation up twice, each time I explained my points.

ok?

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

I did in previous posts, on current events with Europe, the past of previous empires. I mean we could do a whole history lesson now here,

PM me, and I'll post ya loads of history stuff about the world:)

No it's relevent to the discussion.
What about previous empires is indicative to Europe's intentions and how does it prove that they seek the power you claim?

Also is this actual history or the history you think is being suppressed or is hidden or anything?

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Acussation? Tell me what was an accusation, since you do selectively read and distort my posts even after I've answered it.

I must be blessed by god, to have such paitence with you.:)
And to put a sock in that argument. You brought this accusation up twice, each time I explained my points.

ok?

umm the accusation that Europe wants more power and to take away democracy?
You've been making it a lot.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

umm the accusation that Europe wants more power and to take away democracy?
You've been making it a lot.

Well since you asked me twice and I already dealth with this topic.

This proves you didn't bother to read it.

If I was stupid enough I'd post it a third time. However I'm sticking to the topic. Until I see actual feedback and two way communication, I will intervene and help you out. Not until then.:)

I'm not here to repeat to you in mulitple times when you dont actually read what was said.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Well since you asked me twice and I already dealth with this topic.

This proves you didn't bother to read it.

If I was stupid enough I'd post it a third time. However I'm sticking to the topic. Until I see actual feedback and two way communication, I will intervene and help you out. Not until then.:)

I'm not here to repeat to you in mulitple times when you dont actually read what was said.

You've offered absolutely nothing to support this accusation (or anything else.)

And 36 pages in and we've still to hear a valid reason based on reality and facts not to vote for Lisbon.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

You've offered absolutely nothing to support this accusation (or anything else.)

And 36 pages in and we've still to hear a valid reason based on reality and facts not to vote for Lisbon.

if you were given 39 more pages, you'd be asking but I need more proof. I know the type you are in this case. You've made up your mind. So kudoos to your stance:D I don't think 40 pages is going to change your mindset. Youve already dismissed past events into any present case as a scenerio. So I doubt you will actually listen to anything else. The proof your looking for is, something retarded and not going to come to a reality. Your looking for sarcosy to just spit out the agenda. You want someone to scream it out this is it, this is it like Brian Cowen is going to give you the news.

I mean it's obvious you go on deaf ears to alot of whats dicucssed, Cus everytime I clarify a topic or bring a point, you immeadiately don't see it. and forget that I even brought your point on board. So you go and post same question again. God your gas.

Shall I back this up,
You repeat the same question, even when you dismiss what I previously said. I'd say you didn't even look at it.

No I'm not a fan of been an eejit. So Kingmob. I shown you the path, believe what you want.

I will have the last laugh when the times comes;)

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

if you were give 39 pages, you'd be asking but I need more proof. I know the type you are. You've made up your mind. So kudoos to your stance:D

I mean it's obvious you go on deaf ears to alot of whats dicucssed, Cus everytime I clarify a topic or bring a point, you immeadiately don't see it.

Shall I back this up,
You repeat the same question, even when you dismiss what I previously said. I'd say you didn't even look at it.

No I'm not a fan of been an eejit. So Kingmob. I shown you the path, believe what you want.

I will have the last laugh when the times comes;)

you haven't clarified any points. You just made vague statement of what you believe is fact.

But seeing as you are the only one who knows the truth.
Why should I not vote yes?
Can you supply one solid reason?
Or are you going to the stick to "Europe might go mad with power?"

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

You've offered absolutely nothing to support this accusation (or anything else.)

Of course when you don't read it. I would agree with you, if I didn't read the post.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

you haven't clarified any points. You just made vague statement of what you believe is fact.

But seeing as you are the only one who knows the truth.
Why should I not vote yes?
Can you supply one solid reason?
Or are you going to the stick to "Europe might go mad with power?"

did I state go mad anywhere?

I think I'm going to be the better person here and ignore this immaturity.

King Mob

This is getting ridiculous.

Would you just answer my question?

Why should I vote no to lisbon?

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

This is getting ridiculous.

Would you just answer my question?

Why should I vote no to lisbon?

I shouldn't be the one te tell you to vote no. It is your decision. I'v made my points clear on this thread. I'm not here to tell anyone to vote no or yes because.

That is clasisic sheeple mock.
Why don't you answer your own question.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

I shouldn't be the one te tell you to vote no. It is your decision. I'v made my points clear on this thread. I'm not here to tell anyone to vote no or yes because.

That is clasisic sheeple mock.
Why don't you answer your own question.

I'm not asking you to tell me to vote no. I'm asking why you think people should vote no.
Why is it so hard to get a straight answer?

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

I'm not asking you to tell to vote no. I'm asking why you think people should vote no.
Why is it so hard to get a straight answer?

I'm not here to answer this either. My third time, telling you that I've explained my points and my position on what may happen once lisbon is passed. You obviously didn't read my posts, you make it clear by repetitive questioning.

On three pages so far, you haven't adressed any of my questions. So practise what ypu preach sir.

Diogenes

mysterious wrote: »

Yes, I did, your point IS, other than your intial argument was about my ego and that jazz. Funny how you deflect this

I'm thinking, Im counting, I'm singing and I'm not going to judge your actions. I'll let the readers decided that...........

Yeah you said one side was using fear to persuade voters, I gave you several examples of the No side using fear. You've done loads of singing and dancing about how it's different, but its loads of sound and fury. You've not explained how, other than when your side does its okay, when the other side does it, its bad.

And if you can provide me with one exampleof the yes campaign saying that rejecting Lisbon could lead to mushroom clouds or any other such hyperbola I'd love to see it.

But a superstate is associated with that.

IN. YOUR. MIND.

Jesus.

The idea of voting for lisbon, is the begiining of this.
You could associate these pictures with USA already. US of E in the coming generation.

But and I feel I am running around in circles the Lisbon treaty enshrines states individual rights in several areas.

Pathetic scarmongering won't change that fact.

Lisbon is the begining of these steps

PST Lisbon isn't the first EU treaty!!!!!

I can see the logic behind these pictures.

When you say logic, you mean "pathetic scarmongering" right?

These are examples of fear that is associated with a superstate.

Baseless fears not supported by anything in the treaty, it's whipping up public hysteria without a shred of proof to support their claims.

Wow is that your 4-D truth?

Mushrooms clouds, wars, lack of privacy and all these injections and what not are real problems in todays world. That are happening, and with a super elite run super state Europe you can bet, this continent will be pairing with China and USA for the global slice of the pie.

Again, no facts to support this?

This behaviour is inappropriate. Diogenes I hope a mod comes soon

Ah so it's not the use of smilies, it's the number of smilies, tell me how many smilies is too inappropriate? :cool::cool::cool::cool::p:p:p:p:D:D:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Perfect example of getting bogged down on a small detail. You see I've explained this argument, in the previous two post.

Because you haven't in the slightest.

A super Europe with a millitary. It will use it's power to reassure it's hegomy on the planet just like China and USA.

Mushroom clouds is what power and destruction represent.

You mean a single EU military which the Lisbon treaty gives us an opt out clause from! :eek:

Yes, once this treaty is passed. Specifically this treaty. The next few treaties will further take our power and our world wil become completely controlled via these amendments, because we've signed them.

Any evidence to support this assertion?

www.abovetopsecret.com even has a dedicated thread to Obamas adminsitration hopes to dismantle it. It has been around quite a while just incase you haven't been paying attention.

Waving me in the direction of a web forum.

Here is just a quick google
http://conservativeally.today.com/2008/09/19/obama-wants-to-censor-freedom-of-speech

It's a really stupid google.

This is from the campaign. A Conservative talk show host asked for someone from the Obama campaign to come debate the Bill Ayers terrorist "issue". This was a non story, Ayers was a man who renounced terrorism decades previously and had a passing relationship nearly 30 years after his brief time on the weathermen. Rather than give this conservative nonsense the oxygen they craved they ignored it. The station (and lets be honest isn't exactly biased) claimed it received letters from Obama supporters asking them not to air the piece).

A) Was this an attempt to use the power of the president to subvert 1st amendment rights? No. Obama wasn't president.

Was this an example of Partisan politics during a very nasty political campaign? Yes.

C) Can this be used as proof that the Obama administration is suppressing the first amendment? No.

Incase your eye missed that:P
You should read this might be interesting
http://www.prisonplanet.com/obama-sheeple-cheer-police-violation-of-free-speech.html.

Attempting to disrupt a public meeting. Reminds me of that don't taz me bro idiot.

Okay I will give you a word. POWER.

Lisbon treaty does not show power

* But lisbon passed - P
* Next treay - O
* Next treaty - W
* Next treaty - E
* Next treaty -R

This is just batguano

1. P isn't the first letter of the alphabet. You've picked it out of thin air.

2. There were five other EU treaties before Lisbon.

3. There were 8 ECB and EEC treaties before that.

You're basically saying if we pick the 13th treaty assign it the assign it the what 18th letter of the alpahabet and imagine there will be five more treaties it spells DUM DUM DUM! "POWER".

Mysterious, you're making astrology and numerology look like freaking science here.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

I'm not here to answer this either. My third time, telling you that I've explained my points and my position on what may happen once lisbon is passed. You obviously didn't read my posts, you make it clear by repetitive questioning.

That's it precisely. What may happen. The things you suggested are very exaggerated worst case scenarios if the EU was run by Doctor Doom. So far you've offered nothing to support your idea of what may happen.

Furthermore stating your idea of what might happen should Lisbon be pass with the intent of using the fear of the situation to change peoples opinion is scaremongering.

mysterious wrote: »

On three pages so far, you haven't adressed any of my questions. So practise what ypu preach sir.

And what questions where these exactly?

K-9

mysterious wrote: »

No your not giving me a specific your changing the tune here.

Nowhere did I say that the Lisbon treaty will make a super Europe and of course it's not going to state on the paper ffs. i SAID that lisbon is like a seed. you don't see what it becomes until it grows.

Lisbon is not the actual creation of a super Europe nor does hold words in the documents to state so. But it's the first step to allow Europe to begin it's system. I'll try explain it in another term. Try bear with me.

Okay I will give you a word. POWER.

Lisbon treaty does not show power

• But lisbon passed - P
• Next treay - O
• Next treaty - W
• Next treaty - E
• Next treaty -R

Yet the lisbon treaty is one part of the whole. There is no specific form of the elite wanting to control or create a superstate in print. But this format is the way they are going about it.

You wall don't believe that the end result or the word power wont come up, cus it has to show up in the first case scenerio, i.e Lisbon. Do you really think the elite would give it away like that. If they did this, we would destroy their chances immeadiately by sacking this treaty. But the elite are doing it the above way as I've shown.
Does ideology clearer to you. A step by step process to create the actual result. This way it's easier to get us to vote for each treaty as in a segment. This way it's seems like its pretty much what it says on the print. But each treaty has its merit for the next.

If we don't vote no to this one, we can with the next one, or the next, or the next one..............

mysterious wrote:

Sweeden been against it doesn't mean all of Europe is against it. In the UK they are trying to make it a reality. Southampton got their water flouridated recently despite fierce opppostion by the people of Southampton.

But, but, if the UK is for it, it doesn't mean the EU is.

Classic EU nitpicking.

You specifically mentioned fluoridisation and the EU. When it's pointed out Sweden and indeed other countries have withdrawn, you pick a case in Southampton.

Open your eyes Mysterious or you'll get brainwashed. The EU does not want to fluoridise our water. FACT.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

That's it precisely. What may happen. The things you suggested are very exaggerated worst case scenarios if the EU was run by Doctor Doom. So far you've offered nothing to support your idea of what may happen.

No they were not exaggerated and no, I never usesd words such as mad, crazy, armaggeddan, end of the world.

As you keep putting into my mouth to make is appear my reasonings were exaggerated.I made points on other superpowers and what has happened throughout history. Are these facts exaggerated. So no they are not. My paitence is running very thin with your constant crap of nit picking, twisting and disorting my words. This selective reading is really apathetic.

I emphasised the point, of what has happened with power and history most importantly. I stated this is the general direction of where Europe is heading like any superpower. As the last 10 years will show the same idealogy of Europe becoming closer and closer, by each passing of treaties and amendment to a Superstate. Europe is closer now than 10 years ago, and you could say the same once Lisbon and the next few treaties in 10 years time.

So Knock it off will you. You still have to show me where I have been scaremongering. I also told you to vote yes if you want.

Furthermore stating your idea of what might happen should Lisbon be pass with the intent of using the fear of the situation to change peoples opinion is scaremongering.

And what questions where these exactly?

Why don't you go back and read my post properly and maybe you will learn to be more constructive in communicating back to me.

mysterious

Diogenes wrote: »

Yeah you said one side was using fear to persuade voters, I gave you several examples of the No side using fear. You've done loads of singing and dancing about how it's different, but its loads of sound and fury. You've not explained how, other than when your side does its okay, when the other side does it, its bad.

I've explained my points.

You should practise what you preach and go read my answer to Kingmob on it. I won't discuss and waste time to this.

And if you can provide me with one exampleof the yes campaign saying that rejecting Lisbon could lead to mushroom clouds or any other such hyperbola I'd love to see it.

I have. You didn't read them. I gave to long posts in that question.

Pathetic scarmongering won't change that fact.

You need to be more specific as to what's scaremongering?
When we are talking about a super power here.

PST Lisbon isn't the first EU treaty!!!!!

Never state it was, but I did say it's the beginning of whats to come once passed.

When you say logic, you mean "pathetic scarmongering" right?

Diogenes what age are you? Do you realise I'm only replying back, because I'm a nice guy and after this I doubt I will put with this behaviour.

Baseless fears not supported by anything in the treaty, it's whipping up public hysteria without a shred of proof to support their claims.

The pictures associated can be used with the Bush Administration. The idea of microchips,war and a controlled society has already started. A stronger superstate Europe is the step towards these measures.

There are far from baseless.

Wow is that your 4-D truth?

:rolleyes:

Ah so it's not the use of smilies, it's the number of smilies, tell me how many smilies is too inappropriate? :cool::cool::cool::cool::p:p:p:p:D:D:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Your on ignore. I don't like to dicuss like children on this board.

It's a really stupid google.

So can I ask you this. When you gained evidence from google to your argument is it then deemed not stupid and superior.

This is from the campaign. A Conservative talk show host asked for someone from the Obama campaign to come debate the Bill Ayers terrorist "issue". This was a non story, Ayers was a man who renounced terrorism decades previously and had a passing relationship nearly 30 years after his brief time on the weathermen. Rather than give this conservative nonsense the oxygen they craved they ignored it. The station (and lets be honest isn't exactly biased) claimed it received letters from Obama supporters asking them not to air the piece).

Stop beating around the Bush.

A) Was this an attempt to use the power of the president to subvert 1st amendment rights? No. Obama wasn't president.

Was this an example of Partisan politics during a very nasty political campaign? Yes.

C) Can this be used as proof that the Obama administration is suppressing the first amendment? No.

It can and it's already starting. We are becoming this society of tip toeing around each other, whish whish, I better not say this i might get in trouble, I better not speak out the truth I will get penalised, I better not dissagree with the government I will get guatanomo torture.

Attempting to disrupt a public meeting. Reminds me of that don't taz me bro idiot.

But is listening to lies and bull**** from our leaders just as right?

1. P isn't the first letter of the alphabet. You've picked it out of thin air.

2. There were five other EU treaties before Lisbon.

3. There were 8 ECB and EEC treaties before that.

You're basically saying if we pick the 13th treaty assign it the assign it the what 18th letter of the alpahabet and imagine there will be five more treaties it spells DUM DUM DUM! "POWER".

Mysterious, you're making astrology and numerology look like freaking science here.

No Diogenes your proving you can't understand my point. I think K-9 understands what I mean by this example.

Power was just a word, I could use any word. The word was example that is not said, but each treaty eventually after all the treaties, the word and the agenda is made clear. The elite are not going to be able to pass such agendas or power in this way momentarily or by force. They need to plan it out over many years.

You obviously miss the point, and went on to embarrass yourself quite frankly.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

No they were not exaggerated and no, I never usesd words such as mad, crazy, armaggeddan, end of the world.

As you keep putting into my mouth to make is appear my reasonings were exaggerated.I made points on other superpowers and what has happened throughout history. Are these facts exaggerated. So no they are not. My paitence is running very thin with your constant crap of nit picking, twisting and disorting my words. This selective reading is really apathetic.

I emphasised the point, of what has happened with power and history most importantly. I stated this is the general direction of where Europe is heading like any superpower. As the last 10 years will show the same idealogy of Europe becoming closer and closer, by each passing of treaties and amendment to a Superstate. Europe is closer now than 10 years ago, and you could say the same once Lisbon and the next few treaties in 10 years time.

So Knock it off will you. You still have to show me where I have been scaremongering. I also told you to vote yes if you want.

Furthermore stating your idea of what might happen should Lisbon be pass with the intent of using the fear of the situation to change peoples opinion is scaremongering.



Why don't you go back and read my post properly and maybe you will learn to be more constructive in communicating back to me.

You've stated that how superpowers end up but offered no evidence to show how this applies for Europe.
Which superpowers do you believe are in anyway similar to the European Union?

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

You need to be more specific as to what's scaremongering?
When we are talking about a super power here.

mysterious wrote: »

The pictures associated can be used with the Bush Administration. The idea of microchips,war and a controlled society has already started. A stronger superstate Europe is the step towards these measures.

.

There is your scaremongering.
What evidence do you have to support this claim?

mysterious

K-9 wrote: »

If we don't vote no to this one, we can with the next one, or the next, or the next one..............

In a serene, non corruptive society that would be the case. But as I said by passing of each treaty they are gaining more power. The direction of a super state will keep going. They have mastered these treaties with clever writing and wording. So it will get passed.

I do hope your right people will see the bigger picture and realise that lisbon is only a small fraction of the agenda here with the elites.


The important thing, is to be aware of this. It's important to question the agenda here. It's important to use some foresight and suspect best and worst case scenerios that may happen. There needs to be dicernment here? We are talking about power, politics and elite agendas.

The other thing to point out. Since we "live in a democracy";) cough. They don't force by power or fist. They put there power to us via signing over of these treaties. Your probably asking but whats wrong with it. Not much from looking at it. But each treaty is a step up the ladder. To what will be really wrong.

But, but, if the UK is for it, it doesn't mean the EU is.

Classic EU nitpicking.

No your nitpicking.

You nitpicked yourself

Sweeden is against it, so EU is against it

I just pointed out, UK isn't. Read before you jump on the attack.

You specifically mentioned fluoridisation and the EU. When it's pointed out Sweden and indeed other countries have withdrawn, you pick a case in Southampton.

You now say other countries.

What other countries, I asked for links and you said there is none.

Open your eyes Mysterious or you'll get brainwashed. The EU does not want to fluoridise our water. FACT.

When I see it happening I will believe it.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

There is your scaremongering.
What evidence do you have to support this claim?

Mushroom clouds, and a controlled society can be associated with superowers

Bush admin raged two illegal wars killled thousands in Afghanistan, created a false flag operation within their own country and used it to gain support in wars. Killed over a million Iraqs, Destroyed the country. Built 17 pernament bases there. Destroyed much of Bagdad. USA is a superpower

Big brother society. Government can invade your privacy. They can use torture, they can't suspect your terrorists if they feel so. They can invade any country they want if they feel so even against their own peoples choices. A la Iraq. The president can overwrite this, as Bush Did theatrically.

This is an example of what a superpower, once it has enough power. It will use it to gain more power


This is not scaremongering. This is a reality and this happens. Scaremongering would be saying this is going to happen because I'm posting pictures up. A super state Europe will behave like this, it's the nature of a superpower.

China is now a huge seller of arms and in the geoenergy war with America another superpower. Europe will be no dffierent once it keeps going in the direction it's heading.

These pictures are trying to wake you up

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Mushroom clouds, and a controlled society can be associated with superowers

Bush admin raged two illegal wars killled thousands in Afghanistan, created a false flag operation within their own country and used it to gain support in wars. Killed over a million Iraqs, Destroyed the country. Built 17 pernament bases there. Destroyed much of Bagdad. USA is a superpower

Big brother society. Government can invade your privacy. They can use torture, they can't suspect your terrorists if they feel so. They can invade any country they want if they feel so even against their own peoples choices. A la Iraq. The president can overwrite this, as Bush Did theatrically.

This is an example of what a superpower, once it has enough power. It will use it to gain more power


This is not scaremongering. This is a reality and this happens. Scaremongering would be saying this is going to happen because I'm posting pictures up. A super state Europe will behave like this, it's the nature of a superpower.

China is now a huge seller of arms and in the geoenergy war with America another superpower. Europe will be no dffierent once it keeps going in the direction it's heading.

These pictures are trying to wake you up

Then if it's a reality then why not back it up?
What exactly is Europe doing that would lead to "Mushroom clouds, and a controlled society?"
If you can't actually back it up it's scaremongering.

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

Then if it's a reality then why not back it up?
What exactly is Europe doing that would lead to "Mushroom clouds, and a controlled society?"
If you can't actually back it up it's scaremongering.

Like since you haven't read my points, what would you want backed up

My phonecall with sarcosy. The trigger here with you is, if you don't agree with something you keep shouting more back up please. When I give you my evidence. You repeat question and repeat more back up.


This kind of behaviour shows that your deliberately trying to ignore the actual point you refuse to want to accept.:D


We live in a demanding society where he dont need to research or dicern, just ask the next person to tell me. Lazyness is one the main traits in humans. This just keeps been clarified directly to me. My evidence is the responses.

You always here it, when someone disagrees or ignores the evidence. You get no thats not back up I WANT more back up. When you give more. no I want more back up.

When your aware of this sillyness. You wonder what are they really looking for:rolleyes:

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

Like since you haven't read my points, what would you want backed up

My phonecall with sarcosy. The trigger here with you is, if you don't agree with something you keep shouting more back up please. When I give you my evidence. You repeat question and repeat more back up.


This kind of behaviour shows that your deliberately trying to ignore the actual point you refuse to want to accept.:D


We live in a demanding society where he dont need to research or dicern, just ask the next person to tell me. Lazyness is one the main traits in humans. This just keeps been clarified directly to me. My evidence is the responses.

You always here it, when someone disagrees or ignores the evidence. You get no thats not back up I WANT more back up. When you give more. no I want more back up.

When your aware of this sillyness. You wonder what are they really looking for:rolleyes:

You haven't given anything close to evidence.

You claimed that Europe will take away our sovereignty and lead to mushroom clouds and a controlled society. We ask you to show some to support this. You say "It's happened before with other superpowers." That's not exactly evidence.
We ask which old superpower are you referring to and how are they the same, you ignore the question.

So lets be clear, you believe that if Lisbon is passed it will allow Europe to take more and more power from it's members till it becomes a superpower and then it will lead to a controlled society and nuclear war?

mysterious

King Mob wrote: »

You haven't given anything close to evidence.

You claimed that Europe will take away our [EDIT BY MYSTERIOUS EVENTUALLY sovereignty] and lead to mushroom clouds and a controlled society. We ask you to show some to support this. You say "It's happened before with other superpowers." That's not exactly evidence.

Yes it is, and it's something happens alot. Unless a super state Europe is special and immune to how human nature works with power.

We ask which old superpower are you referring to and how are they the same, you ignore the question.

No

I've given three posts to this and used two existing superpowers as examples. I gave examples clearly of what a superpower needs to do in order to sustain the status/power duo.

Europe is no different. You have a severre issue with not reading what I stated clearly.

So lets be clear, you believe that if Lisbon is passed it will allow Europe to take more and more power from it's members till it becomes a superpower and then it will lead to a controlled society and nuclear war?

No, I said, once Lisbon is passed, it will be the beginning of the eites beginning the agenda of a controlled society.

Please stop nit picking. I've explained a diagram and hypothosis as to what may happen once lisbon is passed. It will involve far more passing of treaties. It would take at least 20 years to become fruition. This treaty is the start of this. Probably my fifth time saying this.

King Mob

mysterious wrote: »

No, I said, once Lisbon is passed, it will be the beginning of the eites beginning the agenda of a controlled society.

Please stop nit picking. I've explained a diagram and hypothosis as to what may happen once lisbon is passed. It will involve far more passing of treaties. It would take at least 20 years to become fruition. This treaty is the start of this. Probably my fifth time saying this.

And you have shown nothing but your own opinion to back this up.
No mention of particlars of treaties in the works, no examples from the lisbon treaty to show how other treaty would do anything you claimed.
Nothing except your personal belief claimed as fact.

meglome

mysterious wrote: »

No, I said, once Lisbon is passed, it will be the beginning of the eites beginning the agenda of a controlled society.

Please stop nit picking. I've explained a diagram and hypothosis as to what may happen once lisbon is passed. It will involve far more passing of treaties. It would take at least 20 years to become fruition. This treaty is the start of this. Probably my fifth time saying this.

The way I see it mysterious is that you've said a lot of things but proving them is not something you are able to do. It appears because you believe it we must be stupid or ignorant that we don't. You are a stranger to us so your intuition or gut feelings don't add up to a hill of beans. Either prove it or stop going on.

And as others have said if a treaty comes along I don't like I'll vote no. Nothing has even remotely changed to stop me voting no any other time I like. I didn't vote the last time as I didn't understand what I was voting for but I'll be voting yes in the second vote. And in all honesty I'm not crazy on votes being re-run but it really looks like people have changed their views on it.