Should it be okay to be allowed make unsubstantiated accusations against another team

Thanx 4 The Fish

Nope, reported posts are the way to go when you see something that is in breach of the charter and you want to bring it to the attention of the moderators of that forum.

_blank_

Thanx 4 The Fish wrote: »

The fact that you say you never troll (with or without) a smilie is astonishing btw.

This is the second time you've made claims about me in this thread.

Claims that you can't, or won't, back up.

Exactly the behaviour of the users that this thread is about.

The irony, I'm sure, isn't lost on you.

So finally he admids it. Don't report posts in soccer folks, the mods don't take any notice if you do it too often.

Still, the points raised in my original PM remain unanswered.

circle the wagons again.

copacetic

Des wrote: »

I've just done a search on the soccer forum, using "hope Ireland lose" paired with my username as the searchable items.

No results.



I never troll.

I may give unpopular opinion, but so what? I always back up my arguments, and on the few occasions where I got abusive I was goaded into it, took my ban and didn't complain about it.

I personally don't agree with how soccer is moderated, but have to say I can't believe you are seriously saying this Des.

From my experience of your posts, which of course isn't universal you troll all the time. I certainly remember stupid trollish statements like I hope Ireland lose and I absolutely hate liverpool (while at the same time saying that had nothing to do with your opinion) on threads that such statements could only be described as serious trolling.

Outright denying it takes away from a lot of what I believe are valid points.

Surprised your search didn't find anything, I'm sure someone with a bit of time will find plenty of stuff to damn you with.

PHB

Ok, this **** is really starting to piss me off.

Des, you have some bloody nerve.

(someone was called a "cúnt of the highest order", took a week for the charter breech to be dealt with. Acceptable? No)

We missed this, no doubt about it.

But to complain about this after you report every single post you disagree with is pretty astonishing.

---
Removed. Apologies.
---

So yeh, we missed a reported post. Get over it. It happens, when you brought it to our attention again, we infracted the guy.

This is what my email normally looks like.




It's not helped when you report every ****ing post under the sun cause you're in a bad bloody mood.

---

So now that we've dealt with that
Listen very carefully:

People who disagree with you are not trolling.

You get lots of protection under these rules aswell in the Irish National team threads. If we were to follow the rules in your head, we'd have banned you twenty times for your 'trolling' in the Irish National team threads

That's why some people like copacetic think you're a troll. But we think its just an opinion you have. Just like some people think the LoI is a joke of a league, you think the FAI is a joke of an association. We let you post about it in the national thread, just like we let others post about the LoI in the LoI threads,

copacetic

I don't think it is on to post his reports?

_blank_

Posting posts from a private forum? Hmm?

I have no problem with you posting them, but you have to give the context here.

It was after EVERY Soccer Mod ignored my PM, didn't even acknowledge receipt of it.

Still no answer to that by the way.

And still no back up to the claims that

down to us not paying as much attention to your reported posts any more

What, exactly, should I do if I feel a post is breaking the charter?

Say it on thread or report it?

PHB

Apologies. I honestly forgot that not everybody can see the reported posts forum. I removed them.

---

No, I really don't have to give context. That **** is just flat out unacceptable. End of. It doesn't matter if we hadn't responded to your pm.

Maybe we should have acknowledged the pm, we were dealing with it. It doesn't justify you spamming our bloody inboxes with insulting comments, threads to take it to a CMod, and also abuse of other posters ironically enough.

What, exactly, should I do if I feel a post is breaking the charter?

Say it on thread or report it?

Report the posts. However when reporting the post, think about whether or not its actually against the rules. When I get 10 reported posts from you in a row, and you start off with a statement that you're going to report every single one of his posts, I'm less inclinced to listen to you, just like everyone else would be.

_blank_

PHB wrote: »

Apologies. I honestly forgot that not everybody can see the reported posts forum.

Good one yeah. :rolleyes:

Oh.

And we now have had the four Soccer mods post in this thread, wonder of wonders, and not one of them has addressed the points

a. in my original PM
b. in this thread

All they've done is make unsubstantiated claims to attack me.

What, exactly, is going on here?

PHB

Des wrote: »

Good one yeah. :rolleyes:

Oh.

And we now have had the four Soccer mods post in this thread, wonder of wonders, and not one of them has addressed the points

a. in my original PM
b. in this thread

All they've done is make unsubstantiated claims to attack me.

What, exactly, is going on here?

It seems you're not reading the thread.

My above post was exactly responding to a complaint you made in the original PM? ABout '**** of the highest order' not being responded to.

Dub13 asked you to produce some examples. You did. PSI responded to them explaining our decisions in each case.

So what are you talking about?

_blank_

PHB wrote: »

It seems you're not reading the thread.

Nope, it seems the mods are picking and choosing which parts to respond to, and which parts to circle the wagons about.

PHB wrote: »

My above post was exactly responding to a complaint you made in the original PM? ABout '**** of the highest order' not being responded to.

One, tiny, part of the PM.

I mean, the response

RuggieBear wrote: »

we're looking at these issues

What does that even mean?

How long are you going to "look at" them for?

Until the complaint goes away again?

This is par fort he course in the Soccer Forum now.

People complain, mods shout them down with vague one line responses, or dodge the issues completely, or slavishly repeat the posts of the senior mods, and nothing gets done.


And, again, I'll ask

And if so, what can I do about this?

report less posts?

back seat mod?

what?

Also, what about post #30 in this thread.

Ignored too.



And STILL.

No back up to the claims that two of the mods in question have now made about me.

therecklessone

Des, I don't know how you can accuse anyone else of trolling when you do it yourself.

Recently you referred to contributors to the Gary Dempsey/€20 betting thread as trolls, yet around the same time you were posting the Bohs directors were "probably" guilty of corruption, with little in the way of content to back up that serious statement.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57846492&postcount=35

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57838444&postcount=2

A recent contribution to Sunderland's position in the table was short and sweet:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57844875&postcount=3

Good times, good times.

I hope they go down.

You regularly refer to people who don't follow football the way you do as barstoolers and daytrippers, yet God forbid anyone would say a thing out of line about the LOI (see, I dropped the Eirom just for you;)).

One of the threads you got your knickers in a twist about:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055412182

At a push premierstone was borderline, yet the usual accusations of mod indifference and PL favouritism were wheeled out.

You need to use the ignore button more often TBH.

_blank_

therecklessone wrote: »

Des, I don't know how you can accuse anyone else of trolling when you do it yourself.

Here we go again.

therecklessone wrote: »

Recently you referred to contributors to the Gary Dempsey/€20 betting thread as trolls,

I think that was a part of my recent ban though

therecklessone wrote: »

yet around the same time you were posting the Bohs directors were "probably" guilty of corruption, with little in the way of content to back up that serious statement.

The evidence was in the courtroom, tbh.

therecklessone wrote: »

A recent contribution to Sunderland's position in the table was short and sweet:

How the hell is that trolling?

I don't like that club, I do hope they go down. It's an opinion of mine, which I always back up when questioned on it.

Which is the nub of the issue here.

People come into the LoI and Celtic threads, post wild claims, and then disappear without backing them up. Just. To. Cause. A. Shítstorm.

The mods don't care, actually dismissing a reported post as "couldn't give a crap".

Nice. Real nice.

therecklessone wrote: »

You regularly refer to people who don't follow football the way you do as barstoolers and daytrippers, yet God forbid anyone would say a thing out of line about the LOI

You see.

I stopped doing that a long time ago.

I, simply, don't do that anymore.

Find the most recent example of it for me.

therecklessone wrote: »

One of the threads you got your knickers in a twist about:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055412182

At a push premierstone was borderline, yet the usual accusations of mod indifference and PL favouritism were wheeled out.

in that thread, that poster was acting the maggot to get a rise.

That is plain and simple trolling.

therecklessone wrote: »

You need to use the ignore button more often TBH.

Meh, why should I change my behaviour because of a few people whom I consider muppets.

They never hang around anyway, which is part of the problem.

_blank_

I'm not the only one who thinks it either

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57811998&postcount=48

I get it up to here with this ****ing forum sometimes. If somebody makes snidey comments about Manu or Liverpool in a thread opened to discuss football matters only, there is (quite rightly) uproar. Yet it's open season for trolls when it comes to LOI threads?

I'm out now, but I will find more examples of these type of comments, and post them here.

therecklessone

Des wrote: »

The evidence was in the courtroom, tbh.

You have the source to back that up (i.e. the corruption bit)? As in a statement upheld by legal judgement?

I could also have pointed to your "karma's a bitch statements" in relation to the same topic, which could be described as inflammatory. Indeed, for all the perceived LOI-trolling, that thread was started by a Rovers fan putting the boot in.

Des wrote: »

How the hell is that trolling?

I don't like that club, I do hope they go down. It's an opinion of mine, which I always back up when questioned on it.

And if poster X says they hate the LOI, and call it a pub league with sh1t facilities, surely that is their opinion?

You see.

I stopped doing that a long time ago.

I, simply, don't do that anymore.

Find the most recent example of it for me.

7th November:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57825399&postcount=35

Who will support your new clubs?

The barstool brigade won't, the day trip brigade won't and the current LoI supporters won't support a franchise.

That's ignoring the other hit in the OTT, but I assumed that was light hearted.

Meh, why should I change my behaviour because of a few people whom I consider muppets.

They never hang around anyway, which is part of the problem.

Estie spent his last two or three weeks on this forum saying he hoped Spurs were relegated, and that the reason we were bottom of the league was because the players were stupid. Hardly lucid and reasoned debate, so I simply ignored it and moved on to something else. Always worth a try Des.

therecklessone

Des wrote: »

I'm not the only one who thinks it either

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57811998&postcount=48

I'm out now, but I will find more examples of these type of comments, and post them here.

Yeah, I saw that as well. "Open season" is a gross exaggeration tbh.

GuanYin

I didnt have the time or inclination to go searching for all the examples of Des trolling soccer (by his definition not mine), so thank you to the other soccer posters for highlighting them.

I must retract an earlier accusation, Des did not say he hoped Ireland would lose, he said he hoped that Germany would "hammer them".

Of course, this is an opinion and why would it upset people when posted in a thread full of Ireland supporters? Surely they can deal with an opposing view?

Much like when Irish International threads turn into EPL vs. LoI threads because certain posters want to make the point that there is more to Irish soccer than the EPL - of course pulling a thread off topic and speaking ill of Irish internationals is just an opinion and again, surely these Irish supporters can deal with opposing views.

Des, you've done these things and the incidents mentioned in the other posters posts. Yet you continue to make a hoohaa about every minor incident you can find that you don't like.

It reminds me much of another poster in soccer who was prone to getting very upset when anything negative was posted about his team, all this despite the fact he would post unpopular opinions about other teams to the point he was considered the most biased poster on the forum. Thankfully after a quite word that poster matured, at least in terms of learning the merits of give and take.

The bottom line is.

1. We missed some posts, it happens in every forum, we're sorry but we try not to.
2. We will appoint new mods when we see fit, not before, end of discussion.
3. We do not and will not appoint mods based on affiliation.

Dub13

GuanYin wrote: »

The bottom line is.

1. We missed some posts, it happens in every forum, we're sorry but we try not to.
2. We will appoint new mods when we see fit, not before, end of discussion.
3. We do not and will not appoint mods based on affiliation.

Yes I think its silly to suggest that any of the soccer mods would threat a user different because of the team he supports.I try to treat everybody the same not just here on boards but in life in general,I am not going to treat you different because of the club you support.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

PHB

ziggy wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Oh I forgot to respond to this crap. I didn't say I didn't care if the post was racist, I said I couldn't give a **** if somebody else thought it was racist. But lets not let the truth get in the way of a good story.

Kinetic^

Oh noes, somebody said something against my team! :rolleyes: Grow the hell up. It's only a game. The amount of whining you lot do over your teams is absolutely retarded. I think 1 of the admins suggested a good while ago that Soccer get shut down as it causes too much trouble, well +1 to that.

Dub13

Kinetic^ wrote: »

Oh noes, somebody said something against my team! :rolleyes: Grow the hell up. It's only a game. The amount of whining you lot do over your teams is absolutely retarded. I think 1 of the admins suggested a good while ago that Soccer get shut down as it causes too much trouble, well +1 to that.

This does not add much to the thread,football/soccer is a lot more than 'just a game' to loads of people its understandable that sometimes they get worked up about the forum as it means a lot to people.

Some people would say warcraft is retarded.

witnessmenow

Dub13 wrote: »

Some people would say warcraft is retarded.

I'd imagine quite a considerable amount more would say that compared to soccer being retarded



:pac:

bobbysands81

Dub13 wrote: »

Moved to Feeback.



People have to be allowed have their opinions I agree but the soccer forum is not the place for politics,sectarianism etc etc.

But you allowed these sectarian comments to stand on the James McCarthy thread even after they were reported to you! The accusations on the thread were utterly absurd and prejudiced and the offending posters should have been dealt with. If I call all Liverpool fans murderers (and don't back it up with any evidence) it would be wrong but damn sure I would be banned and my posts would be removed. Why didn't this happen in the James McCarthy thread?

As for politics, are we not allowed talk about James McCarthy now as he has made a decision to choose Ireland over Scotland... as that could be deemed "political"? Where then can you and do you draw the line? It is impossible to separate sport and politics, that we are having this conversation is proof of that.

Are we also not allowed talk about racism in football?

Politics, sectarianism and racism are ALL in football, sure even supporting one football team over another can be construed as sectarian if you use a strict interpretation of the word. These three things happen in the context of football and therefore should be discussed in the context of football.

Finally, the lies on the James McCarthy thread are a disgrace to this Board, that they haven't been dealt with makes it all the more disgraceful. Shame on the Mods.

tbh

bobbysands81 wrote: »

If I call all Liverpool fans murderers (and don't back it up with any evidence) it would be wrong but damn sure I would be banned and my posts would be removed.

here's the thing tho. I'm a liverpool fan, and to the best of my knowledge, I've never murdered anyone. So, if you posted the message "all Liverpool fans are murderers", I'd just think you were a bit of an idiot, and you didn't really have anything to say that'd be worth listening to. My mind would then employ a technique called "not paying any attention to what you are saying" - in laymans terms, whenever I'd see a post from you, I'd think "there's the guy who thinks that all liverpool fans are murderers" and my next thought would be :rolleyes: and my next action would be to skip over your post and read the next one.

I know it's a pretty complicated technique, but i think it would be very useful in the soccer forum. I'm available to give lessons on this technique for a nominal fee.

stovelid

Des wrote: »

I'm not the only one who thinks it either
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57811998&postcount=48

I'm out now, but I will find more examples of these type of comments, and post them here.

Des is quoting me here. In that particular thread, I got really annoyed because LOI threads often invite off-topic comments. The one in that thread is a classic example. Somebody is basically ridiculing the fact that Irish football fans feel that Irish players should be considered for the Irish national team.

At other times, you get (no doubt) well intentioned, but off-topic comments in LOI threads about why teams should be merged; the league should be wound up; why it is sub-standard. Not exactly trolling, but off-topic unless the immediate subject at hand is about these issues.

I think fans of bigger clubs sometimes have an issue with grasping the fact that LOI fans love their clubs, even though they are small and unsuccessful. No real fan should be constantly taking the chance to suggest teams should merge, clubs should wind down or other insulting, if well-intentioned off-topic advice

It would be like me feeling the need to frequently post in Man Utd or Liverpool topics about how those teams has lost their soul, or are just corporate multinational businesses.

For example, I can't find the thread to hand, but I can go and find it. A common weekly thread is the LOI weekend fixture discussion. Somebody made a mistake before and omitted the Irish from the title. Some (non-LOI) posters had a knowing joke by jokingly discussing obscure fixtures from other countries, before the title was updated. Now, I thought it was moderately funny myself, but still reported it, because if this kind of joke was made in a Liverpool or Man United, you wouldn't hear yourself for the GTFOs.

I myself am a Manchester United supporter, so I don't have a bugbear about English teams.

I understand that the big EPL team threads probably need more moderation sometimes. I think the point is that we should enforce the rules re: off-topic posting right across the board.

And I also agree that anybody who doesn't post on soccer shouldn't post in this thread, Especially not with reductionist drivel about how soccer fans get worked up about this or that. It's not your concern. Likewise your interests to me.

_blank_

lol @ the warcraft mod calling soccer fans retarded.

Irony. You have it.

Nerin

Lets just agree that we're all a little re....wait a minute...

bobbysands81

tbh wrote: »

here's the thing tho. I'm a liverpool fan, and to the best of my knowledge, I've never murdered anyone. So, if you posted the message "all Liverpool fans are murderers", I'd just think you were a bit of an idiot, and you didn't really have anything to say that'd be worth listening to. My mind would then employ a technique called "not paying any attention to what you are saying" - in laymans terms, whenever I'd see a post from you, I'd think "there's the guy who thinks that all liverpool fans are murderers" and my next thought would be :rolleyes: and my next action would be to skip over your post and read the next one.

I know it's a pretty complicated technique, but i think it would be very useful in the soccer forum. I'm available to give lessons on this technique for a nominal fee.

Very helpful input, thank you.

Steven

You guys are probably confusing "Warcraft" with "World of Warcraft". Just thought I'd point that out.

... I'll be going then.

Anti

Steven wrote: »

You guys are probably confusing "Warcraft" with "World of Warcraft". Just thought I'd point that out.

... I'll be going then.

Looks like it.