o2 Iphone returns help/advise

damian89

I've had the world of problems with o2 and the Iphone, I highly recommend not purchasing one with o2. Heres a copy of an email I've sent to the o2 cresent store. Its a bit long but worth a read. Any advise or input is most welcome



To the manager of o2 in the cresent, please be reasonable, I only want what I'm entitled to as per your own companies policy on your website. I know my rights and I must insist on them. Could you please read the response I've prepared for the media and ring me on 0877455558 about the issue when you can. If you are unable or unwilling to resolve the issue my next option is asking you over a more public forum. This is the mail I will send to the following email addresses if my problem isn't resolved to my satisfaction by the close of business 29th of November i.e. today.

cai@consumerassociation.ie - Consumer Association
news@limerickpost.ie - Limerickpost news paper
grs@rte.ie - Gerry Ryan show
studio@live95fm.ie - 95fm's radio station
info@spinsouthwest.com Spin southwest radiostation
jimjim@rte.ie - Colm and Jim Jim breakfast show

If a new unit or refund is provided to me as per your policy then I will have no need to send this email and I will be once again a happy customer and consider the matter resolved to my satisfaction. I haven't spoken to you and this could all be one big mix up and I hope it is and that you can see how I feel cheated and hard done by and see that the points I'm making are valid and see reason. I think I've been reasonable in all the steps I've taken so far and feel that I'm left with no other option. Every o2 representative I've spoken to so far has seen my point but none of them seem to have the power or willingness to deal with my problem, I sincerly hope you can help me



To whomever it concerns,

I don't know if this is the type of story you are interested in but given the time of year I think it might interest you. I recently bought an Iphone from o2 for 569 euro. It worked ok for less than 3 weeks. I was just listening to some music and it stopped working. I figured fair enough so I decided to return it to the o2 store in the crescent where I recently purchased it.

First off I have to say that I found the sales assistant quite rude to me! I felt she was trying to fob me off with apples customer support, she was quite insistent that I ring apple and sort it out with their customer support not o2. She was treating me like I was using the phone incorrectly, like an idiot. The joke was on her as I have a degree in computer systems and (still a student) on a masters I might add. So I was very insistent that the phone was indeed broke and it wasn't user error. She then told me I wasn't entitled to a new unit but only a repair, which I was initially happy with. She practically man handled my phone, which is the same price as most laptop computers. "5 days to repair she said". What erks me is 9 days later not a peep! They don't even answer their phones in that store. I had to nag for a replacement while it was in repair, the replacement is a subpar phone not fit for use by someone who needs email functionality the prime
reason I went for an Iphone not a blackberry.

The bit I have a massive problem with, if it was any other phone within a 30 day period I would have been entitled to a full refund or off the shelf brand new unit if failure occurred of my handset according to o2’s policies. This policy (allegedly) conveniently excludes there flagship overpriced premium Christmas product the Iphone. I was never told buying the phone that it was excluded from any of the standard o2 policies. I think this is important to be told before purchase as the Iphone is (Allegedly) the only phone out of dozens it doesn’t apply to in the store. Like in Argos any time you buy a product excluded from the 16 day money back guarantee you are told before you purchase it.

http://www.o2online.ie/wps/wcm/connect/O2/Home/Personal/Help/Help+&+Support/Shop/Returns+&+repairs heres the link to the policy.

If your “phone was less than 30 days” you are entitled to “either a refund or a new replacement phone” according to the policy on o2’s website .I was told that this policy precludes the Iphone from the afore mentioned policy by “Shane” the unhelpful sales assistant in store today. So I decided to check it myself and this simply is not the case. If you read the police it states “If your phone becomes faulty within the first 30 days of purchase, then you are entitled to a fully boxed replacement phone or a refund - whichever you prefer.” There is no preclusion of the Iphone from this policy I can see. It does preclude the Iphone later on in the document from “If you receive a phone as a Speak easy Christmas gift, we will provide you with a refund within 30 days of the 25th of December, if the phone has become faulty. This only applies to Speak easy New or Speak easy Gift phones (excluding iPhone)” Which is not what I’m looking for!

The other thing that really erks me and is possibly illegal is the policy states "If your Iphone develops a fault, you will need to contact Apple directly to arrange for it to be repaired or replaced under the manufacturer’s warranty"! Isn't that not illegal? , isn't the onus on the seller to provide repairs or replacements? I'm almost positive this is a misleadingly illegal statement and needs to be rectified immediately. This goes against “The Sale of goods and Supply of services act 1980”. To quote the Consumers association of Ireland “’It’snot our fault. Write to the manufacturer’This response is very common, but it is wrong. Your contract is with the retailer, not the manufacturer. Remind the retailer that he is legally responsible for rectifying your problem under the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act 1980. If he wants to contact the manufacturer later, that is his prerogative but it has nothing to do with you.” The retailer
in this case is o2, apple the manufacturer.

I then called customer support and I have to say the woman who dealt with my call was most pleasant and listened to what I had to say and promised to ring me back. However I felt that she has no intentions of getting to the key issues at the heart of the matter, she was only suggesting she would check the status of my repair. I feel hard done over my o2 and I would like a replacement or refund like every other phone on their shelves.

I then called into the store informed of the rights granted to me by o2s own policy and was told bare face lies and inaccurate misinterpretations of their own policy. I was told off hand Iphones weren’t covered under the policy with no proof. I then directed the sales assistant to the information I uncovered and then picked apart his ridicules argument piece by piece until I had shown him the error of all his points but still he would not concede to his companies own policy. He advised me that the manager would see it he’s way too and there was no point returning. I will however return once more to see if the manager can rectify the situation, I feel that I should try this final avenue of recourse before I give up on o2’s complaints system.

I feel that this highlights many important issues especially for people who will purchase Iphones for Christmas who are assuming they have the same rights when purchasing there Iphone as other phones in store. As it stands now I'm without my Iphone and no idea when I'll be getting it back only promises which they keep breaking. There’s a reason o2 felt that a new phone should be issued in the case of fault on phones under 30 days. When you pay 570 for a phone you don't want a refurbished or repaired unit after 3 weeks of use. I had it for 20 days and its away for repair 10 days with no sign of it being returned, that’s ridicules

I think this is the kind of issue that would interest the media in the run up to the Christmas season, possibly the management at o2 could do without this publicity and will now deal with my complaints after a more public forum is used and offer me a new unit like I’m entitled to under their own policy. They’ve taken the joy out of my Christmas present and even after I get it back now I will never feel the same about it, it will only be a reminder of the horrid treatment of me by o2 and its sales assistance!

It’s not too late before I bring this complaint to the last venue available to me, the one last heaven the "littleman" has against massive corporations who don’t know how to treat customers with the respect and rights they deserve; the small court. The fair suggestion I propose would be a new replacement for myself available in store today! And to stop further misunderstandings about o2’s non existant special Iphone returns policy I would suggest that a memo went out to all o2 retail stores advising customers when they purchase the Iphone that it is indeed covered under this mythical special Iphone policy! I hope that upon receiving this email the limerick store manager will ring me offering me the new replacement as per their own policy which I deserve, if this happens I would consider the matter resolved to my satisfaction and be once again be a happy o2 customer!

Regards,
Damian O'Donoghue

Tom Young

This was placed in legal but seems more appropriately placed here.

Sam Vimes

i didn't read it all but i think the gist is you got an iphone and it was faulty within 30 days and the o2 store are sending you to apple.

at the top you say that you recommend no one buy it in o2 but i'm afraid where someone buys it makes no difference because that's apple's policy and not o2's.

i worked in two shops that sold apple products (neither was o2) and it was the same. i think you're right when you say the policy is illegal because you're supposed to be able to go back to the place you bought it but that's not what apple wants to do and the shops don't have a say in the matter


the good side is that apple's returns system is quite good and if you call them on 1850 946 191 you should get it sorted in a few days.

matchthis

Agreed with Sam Vimes. This is apple's policy everywhere it sells the iphone. I had a faulty iphone before and went back to the shop. I was advised to call apple and they fixed the problem over the phone at my pc. Few months later a different fault occured and had to send it away. I did this with the store and got a replacement in 6 days(working).
Sounds like you had it bad, why it is taking so long to repair is odd. If you ring apple with your imei number they might be able to tell you more or even highlight the issue with them

craichoe

Don't even need to call them:

https://depot.info.apple.com

Box out via courier to return it in, around 5 - 7 days turnaround, repair or replacment as necessary.

Its in the blurb that came with it

wmpdd3

From O2's point of view they adhere to the sale of goods and services act completely because if an item develops a fault, it will be rectified above and beyond their basic liability but I agree with the stipulation that your contract is with the retailer.
The only difference is that you have to make that phone call.

foggy_lad

it does not matter what apple's policy is on this as apple do not sell the iphone to consumers in Ireland, o2 sell it and they alone are responsible for after sales care. people can sometimes get a faster return from dealing with apple but there can be no obligation on customers to deal directly with apple as they have no contract with apple and as such apple have no responsibility towards o2 customers.

snappieT

I used to work in a major retail store that took quite a number of Apple returns. The customer was offered to deal with Apple directly themselves for speedier service, but if they decided to leave it with us, we just called Apple ourselves.

We never gave a cash refund on Apple products. It was only ever a replacement (within 30 days) or a repair (after 30 days).

tony1kenobi

I imagine you didn't get a response from the manager. That kind of approach will probably result in the email being forwrded to o2's customer care and promptly ignored. That store manager would only have final say if he/she stumps up the money for a phone themselves. The only thing it sounds like you were misled on was how quickly the repair and return would be completed.

If you had dealt with Apple directly, as advised, you'd have your phone back now.

Instead you have taken the "why should I have to do anything" approach and made everything difficult for yourself.

craichoe

foggy_lad wrote: »

it does not matter what apple's policy is on this as apple do not sell the iphone to consumers in Ireland, o2 sell it and they alone are responsible for after sales care. people can sometimes get a faster return from dealing with apple but there can be no obligation on customers to deal directly with apple as they have no contract with apple and as such apple have no responsibility towards o2 customers.

Thats all well and good but most of the time the "Its broken and doesn't work" statement from a customer is down to user error. The staff in the shop are not technicians, they are sales people. Having your device returned with No Fault Found is more frustrating when it could be resolved by a few troubleshooting steps.

MOH

You might want to take your phone number out of the post

Sam Vimes

MOH wrote: »

You might want to take your phone number out of the post

oops :P

An Scoil Dlí

damian89 wrote: »

I've had the world of problems with o2 and the Iphone, I highly recommend not purchasing one with o2. Heres a copy of an email I've sent to the o2 cresent store. Its a bit long but worth a read. Any advise or input is most welcome



To the manager of o2 in the cresent, please be reasonable, I only want what I'm entitled to as per your own companies policy on your website. I know my rights and I must insist on them. Could you please read the response I've prepared for the media and ring me on 0877455558 about the issue when you can. If you are unable or unwilling to resolve the issue my next option is asking you over a more public forum. This is the mail I will send to the following email addresses if my problem isn't resolved to my satisfaction by the close of business 29th of November i.e. today.

cai@consumerassociation.ie - Consumer Association
news@limerickpost.ie - Limerickpost news paper
grs@rte.ie - Gerry Ryan show
studio@live95fm.ie - 95fm's radio station
info@spinsouthwest.com Spin southwest radiostation
jimjim@rte.ie - Colm and Jim Jim breakfast show

If a new unit or refund is provided to me as per your policy then I will have no need to send this email and I will be once again a happy customer and consider the matter resolved to my satisfaction. I haven't spoken to you and this could all be one big mix up and I hope it is and that you can see how I feel cheated and hard done by and see that the points I'm making are valid and see reason. I think I've been reasonable in all the steps I've taken so far and feel that I'm left with no other option. Every o2 representative I've spoken to so far has seen my point but none of them seem to have the power or willingness to deal with my problem, I sincerly hope you can help me



To whomever it concerns,

I don't know if this is the type of story you are interested in but given the time of year I think it might interest you. I recently bought an Iphone from o2 for 569 euro. It worked ok for less than 3 weeks. I was just listening to some music and it stopped working. I figured fair enough so I decided to return it to the o2 store in the crescent where I recently purchased it.

First off I have to say that I found the sales assistant quite rude to me! I felt she was trying to fob me off with apples customer support, she was quite insistent that I ring apple and sort it out with their customer support not o2. She was treating me like I was using the phone incorrectly, like an idiot. The joke was on her as I have a degree in computer systems and (still a student) on a masters I might add. So I was very insistent that the phone was indeed broke and it wasn't user error. She then told me I wasn't entitled to a new unit but only a repair, which I was initially happy with. She practically man handled my phone, which is the same price as most laptop computers. "5 days to repair she said". What erks me is 9 days later not a peep! They don't even answer their phones in that store. I had to nag for a replacement while it was in repair, the replacement is a subpar phone not fit for use by someone who needs email functionality the prime
reason I went for an Iphone not a blackberry.

The bit I have a massive problem with, if it was any other phone within a 30 day period I would have been entitled to a full refund or off the shelf brand new unit if failure occurred of my handset according to o2’s policies. This policy (allegedly) conveniently excludes there flagship overpriced premium Christmas product the Iphone. I was never told buying the phone that it was excluded from any of the standard o2 policies. I think this is important to be told before purchase as the Iphone is (Allegedly) the only phone out of dozens it doesn’t apply to in the store. Like in Argos any time you buy a product excluded from the 16 day money back guarantee you are told before you purchase it.

http://www.o2online.ie/wps/wcm/connect/O2/Home/Personal/Help/Help+&+Support/Shop/Returns+&+repairs heres the link to the policy.

If your “phone was less than 30 days” you are entitled to “either a refund or a new replacement phone” according to the policy on o2’s website .I was told that this policy precludes the Iphone from the afore mentioned policy by “Shane” the unhelpful sales assistant in store today. So I decided to check it myself and this simply is not the case. If you read the police it states “If your phone becomes faulty within the first 30 days of purchase, then you are entitled to a fully boxed replacement phone or a refund - whichever you prefer.” There is no preclusion of the Iphone from this policy I can see. It does preclude the Iphone later on in the document from “If you receive a phone as a Speak easy Christmas gift, we will provide you with a refund within 30 days of the 25th of December, if the phone has become faulty. This only applies to Speak easy New or Speak easy Gift phones (excluding iPhone)” Which is not what I’m looking for!

The other thing that really erks me and is possibly illegal is the policy states "If your Iphone develops a fault, you will need to contact Apple directly to arrange for it to be repaired or replaced under the manufacturer’s warranty"! Isn't that not illegal? , isn't the onus on the seller to provide repairs or replacements? I'm almost positive this is a misleadingly illegal statement and needs to be rectified immediately. This goes against “The Sale of goods and Supply of services act 1980”. To quote the Consumers association of Ireland “’It’snot our fault. Write to the manufacturer’This response is very common, but it is wrong. Your contract is with the retailer, not the manufacturer. Remind the retailer that he is legally responsible for rectifying your problem under the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act 1980. If he wants to contact the manufacturer later, that is his prerogative but it has nothing to do with you.” The retailer
in this case is o2, apple the manufacturer.

I then called customer support and I have to say the woman who dealt with my call was most pleasant and listened to what I had to say and promised to ring me back. However I felt that she has no intentions of getting to the key issues at the heart of the matter, she was only suggesting she would check the status of my repair. I feel hard done over my o2 and I would like a replacement or refund like every other phone on their shelves.

I then called into the store informed of the rights granted to me by o2s own policy and was told bare face lies and inaccurate misinterpretations of their own policy. I was told off hand Iphones weren’t covered under the policy with no proof. I then directed the sales assistant to the information I uncovered and then picked apart his ridicules argument piece by piece until I had shown him the error of all his points but still he would not concede to his companies own policy. He advised me that the manager would see it he’s way too and there was no point returning. I will however return once more to see if the manager can rectify the situation, I feel that I should try this final avenue of recourse before I give up on o2’s complaints system.

I feel that this highlights many important issues especially for people who will purchase Iphones for Christmas who are assuming they have the same rights when purchasing there Iphone as other phones in store. As it stands now I'm without my Iphone and no idea when I'll be getting it back only promises which they keep breaking. There’s a reason o2 felt that a new phone should be issued in the case of fault on phones under 30 days. When you pay 570 for a phone you don't want a refurbished or repaired unit after 3 weeks of use. I had it for 20 days and its away for repair 10 days with no sign of it being returned, that’s ridicules

I think this is the kind of issue that would interest the media in the run up to the Christmas season, possibly the management at o2 could do without this publicity and will now deal with my complaints after a more public forum is used and offer me a new unit like I’m entitled to under their own policy. They’ve taken the joy out of my Christmas present and even after I get it back now I will never feel the same about it, it will only be a reminder of the horrid treatment of me by o2 and its sales assistance!

It’s not too late before I bring this complaint to the last venue available to me, the one last heaven the "littleman" has against massive corporations who don’t know how to treat customers with the respect and rights they deserve; the small court. The fair suggestion I propose would be a new replacement for myself available in store today! And to stop further misunderstandings about o2’s non existant special Iphone returns policy I would suggest that a memo went out to all o2 retail stores advising customers when they purchase the Iphone that it is indeed covered under this mythical special Iphone policy! I hope that upon receiving this email the limerick store manager will ring me offering me the new replacement as per their own policy which I deserve, if this happens I would consider the matter resolved to my satisfaction and be once again be a happy o2 customer!

Regards,
Damian O'Donoghue

How did you go with this?

Is there any conclusion?

You know that O2 have an online forum where the staff are second to none and are usually in a position to rectify these type of issues there?

Its http://forums.o2online.ie/forums

Random

I don't know why that big long first email is really required. Who's 95fm? Who cares what Colm and JimJim say?

O2 will send your iPhone to Apple for you or you can do it yourself. It will take longer if you go via O2 because then you're dealing with a middle man. Yes, you're legally bla bla bla bla but why? Why would you want to delay your problem getting resolved?

Giving someone (the manager) less than about 3 hours (post was after half 3 and assuming COB is 6pm) to resolve a problem is just stupid. The email might not even be read until tomorrow, the manager might be off, etc etc.

Just stop whinging. Bullet point your problems and get on to O2 about them. Don't be writing storys as no one (in the shop) wants to read them.

The link to the O2 website with their returns policy covers online purchases and not shop purchases I believe. It's very misleading about the iPhone though I would agree.

An Scoil Dlí

It’s a shame the original poster seems to have vanished. It would have been nice to see what the outcome was….

Maybe he or she has been abducted by the iPhone squad?

It’s a funny old world………..

krudler

foggy_lad wrote: »

it does not matter what apple's policy is on this as apple do not sell the iphone to consumers in Ireland, o2 sell it and they alone are responsible for after sales care. people can sometimes get a faster return from dealing with apple but there can be no obligation on customers to deal directly with apple as they have no contract with apple and as such apple have no responsibility towards o2 customers.

Except they do, at apples request, same goes for most apple products, I worked in a music store for 5 years and all ipods went back to apple, its their own policy, facts are fun arent they? do you ever give people correct advice on these matters? some of the stuff you've posted in the mobile forum about peoples "rights" is hilarious

and seriously, OP, what in the blue hell are Colm and Jim Jim going to do for you?

Solair

To the original poster,

While I can completely understand your frustration with O2 and their policies, your e-mail or written communications of this type need to be much more concise.

In dealing with companies like this, I have found it is far more effective to keep my complaint as brief and legalistic as possible. Avoid conversational language, ranting and threats. It does not come across as something that will be taken seriously and it is quite likely that your email will not achieve anything.

You could explain your entire problem in 2 or 3 paragraphs max.
Put in key dates, the store address and the phone's details (IMEI) etc in and stick to the bare facts.
Set out a time frame during which you expect a reply and explain that if you do not receive a satisfactory response by whatever date that you will be forced to pursue the matter further.

Send one copy to the store manager (on paper)
One copy to O2 Customer Care Centre, McLaughlin Road National Technology Park, Limerick
and one copy to O2 Retail HQ, Carraig House, Brookfield tce, Blackrock Co. Dublin

PUT CC: and list those addresses on the end of each letter.

Send the whole lot by registered post.

Random

Solair wrote: »

To the original poster,

While I can completely understand your frustration with O2 and their policies, your e-mail or written communications of this type need to be much more concise.

In dealing with companies like this, I have found it is far more effective to keep my complaint as brief and legalistic as possible. Avoid conversational language, ranting and threats. It does not come across as something that will be taken seriously and it is quite likely that your email will not achieve anything.

You could explain your entire problem in 2 or 3 paragraphs max.
Put in key dates, the store address and the phone's details (IMEI) etc in and stick to the bare facts.
Set out a time frame during which you expect a reply and explain that if you do not receive a satisfactory response by whatever date that you will be forced to pursue the matter further.

Send one copy to the store manager (on paper)
One copy to O2 Customer Care Centre, McLaughlin Road National Technology Park, Limerick
and one copy to O2 Retail HQ, Carraig House, Brookfield tce, Blackrock Co. Dublin

PUT CC: and list those addresses on the end of each letter.

Send the whole lot by registered post.

That address is not correct for O2 Retail. They are in SJRQ, Dublin 2.

krudler

Solair wrote: »

To the original poster,

While I can completely understand your frustration with O2 and their policies, your e-mail or written communications of this type need to be much more concise.

In dealing with companies like this, I have found it is far more effective to keep my complaint as brief and legalistic as possible. Avoid conversational language, ranting and threats. It does not come across as something that will be taken seriously and it is quite likely that your email will not achieve anything.

You could explain your entire problem in 2 or 3 paragraphs max.
Put in key dates, the store address and the phone's details (IMEI) etc in and stick to the bare facts.
Set out a time frame during which you expect a reply and explain that if you do not receive a satisfactory response by whatever date that you will be forced to pursue the matter further.

Send one copy to the store manager (on paper)
One copy to O2 Customer Care Centre, McLaughlin Road National Technology Park, Limerick
and one copy to O2 Retail HQ, Carraig House, Brookfield tce, Blackrock Co. Dublin

PUT CC: and list those addresses on the end of each letter.

Send the whole lot by registered post.

Sounds fabulous, or, he culd just ring apple and get them to sort it, since thats what he'll have to do anyway

foggy_lad

krudler wrote: »

Except they do, at apples request, same goes for most apple products, I worked in a music store for 5 years and all ipods went back to apple, its their own policy, facts are fun arent they? do you ever give people correct advice on these matters? some of the stuff you've posted in the mobile forum about peoples "rights" is hilarious

and seriously, OP, what in the blue hell are Colm and Jim Jim going to do for you?

facts are amazing like if o2 sell you a phone made by apple or nokia or whatever company then o2 are solely responsible for after sales care and repairs for that phone whether they repair the phone themselves or send it to apple or anywhere it is the responsibility of o2 to look after their customers!
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0021.html#zza16y1980s21

some people may chose to deal directly with the manufacturer but there is no obligation on any customer to do this and dealing with the manufacturer once does not preclude the customer from dealing solely with o2 for future after sales care.

also o2 can not just tell people that they must deal directly with apple as this infringes on their statutory right to deal solely with the seller as in paragraph 4 below
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0011.html#zza16y1980s11

cgarvey

krudler wrote: »

Except they do, at apples request

I'm amazed at the number of people, like krudler, who are ignorant of their basic legal entitlements when it comes to the iPhone. They're on every forum.

Anyway, krudler, foggy_lad is 100% correct.

For the record, any foggy_lad post I can recall in Mobile, BB, or Consumer Issues, has always factual and correct. They're often backed up, like above, by solid references.

So to reference your question "do you ever give people correct advice...", I'd challenge that and ask has he(she?!) ever given incorrect advice?

Sam Vimes

cgarvey wrote: »

For the record, any foggy_lad post I can recall in Mobile, BB, or Consumer Issues, has always factual and correct. They're often backed up, like above, by solid references.

So to reference your question "do you ever give people correct advice...", I'd challenge that and ask has he(she?!) ever given incorrect advice?

yes indeed he has, many many times. have a search of my posts for foggy or foggy_lad for examples

craichoe

foggy_lad wrote: »

facts are amazing like if o2 sell you a phone made by apple or nokia or whatever company then o2 are solely responsible for after sales care and repairs for that phone whether they repair the phone themselves or send it to apple or anywhere it is the responsibility of o2 to look after their customers!
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0021.html#zza16y1980s21

some people may chose to deal directly with the manufacturer but there is no obligation on any customer to do this and dealing with the manufacturer once does not preclude the customer from dealing solely with o2 for future after sales care.

also o2 can not just tell people that they must deal directly with apple as this infringes on their statutory right to deal solely with the seller as in paragraph 4 below
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1980/en/act/pub/0016/sec0011.html#zza16y1980s11

Retailers such as O2 Do not repair goods, they send it to a third party and the Manufacturer is billed for the return or repair of the product. So, Hence when you get a repair as per your consumer rights, the Retailer is acting as a middle man during this period and it makes the whole process slower.

You can cut out the middle man and get the repair/replace part done much quicker, as people who are trained on the product will have to verify there is a fault, the customer cannot be taken at their word because alot of the time they are wrong.

foggy_lad

but a lot of the time customers send back new phones only to have them replaced with refurbished/repaired phones when they should be/are entitled to another new handset.

if you bring your handset back to the store you can point out the problem to the staff and if they are any use at all they will want to and be able to deal with it!

the problem is that so many store staff are not trained in basic trouble shooting OR basic consumer rights/law but they are given a job and a title and told they are in charge. bring back the days when shop staff had to do an apprenticship and we might get some proper customer service in phone shops!

but to be fair all these shops will have their policies but they let themselves down badly and show themselves up as small-time shopkeepers by not clarifying to customers that their policies do not in any way infringe on their statutory rights.

foggy_lad

Sam Vimes wrote: »

yes indeed he has, many many times. have a search of my posts for foggy or foggy_lad for examples

care to point out the bad advice i have given? please dont use examples where i am simply telling people that they have the right to deal solely with some retailer that has sold them a product or that store policy is not worth the paper it is printed on, although mostly it is not printed but verbal.

Walkman

how do you know how well trained staff an phone shops and nowadays foggy? Are you not banned from nearly every phone shop in carlow? Were you also not going to picket the 3 store due to the fact that some sites you wanted to view could not be viewed on a mobile phone, not exactly 3's fault you would have been better off getting onto the site admin's

Sam Vimes

foggy_lad wrote: »

care to point out the bad advice i have given? please dont use examples where i am simply telling people that they have the right to deal solely with some retailer that has sold them a product or that store policy is not worth the paper it is printed on, although mostly it is not printed but verbal.

it's not so much bad advice as general paranoia, made up laws and wrong information. at the risk of going OT but you requested it:

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57439055&postcount=34
paranoia. shops insist on having packaging for returns so they can wipe the phone and sell it as new

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56549318&postcount=11
paranoia. argos deliberately sells faulty stock because they think some people won't bother complaining

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56549337&postcount=12
says "3 year insurance poilcy is really only for two years because your statutory rights cover you for the first year. insurance covers things that aren't covered by your statutory rights so its not "really only for two years"

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55752028&postcount=25
doesn't hold himself to the same standards as he does everyone else, ie it's ok to screw a company you owe money to as long as they can't hurt you


http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55108650&postcount=1
over simplified understanding of the situation to try to make out that its a scam

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55097674&postcount=3677
somebody deliberately changed his date of birth on 3's system for some reason. it couldn't possibly be a mistake

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55088703&postcount=1
not having something in stock that's supposed to be on special is a scam

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54880685&postcount=36
boards and meteor are conspiring together against him

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54876878&postcount=25
meteor asking for a deposit is a scam. assumes they'll make it difficult to get back so you won't leave

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57443290&postcount=36
making an incorrect assumption to make out that it's a scam

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57297105&postcount=35
misreading of statement. says "they can't go back on something" when it was never actually offered


http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57135276&postcount=4
all terms and conditions should be explained at sign up time (do you have 5 hours?)

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56979699&postcount=12
you can get out of your contractual obligations if they don't suit you by cancelling the direct debit and not giving them the money

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56624235&postcount=36
being awkward and vastly over estimating how difficult the proposed solution was because he wants to "insist on his rights" when a perfectly reasonable alternative is being offered

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56561100&postcount=21
changing his statement when i point it out to be wrong and saying i don't understand what he's talking about. it's as if i can't just go back and quote what he said

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56519460&postcount=19
imagining unfair terms that a company MIGHT have

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56360778&postcount=13
when returning something to a shop, the shop assistant will trawl through credit card transactions to find out if the item was a present so that he can say that the person in the shop is not the original purchaser so he won't return it

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56079346&postcount=18
makes flawed assumptions about something a meteor agent told him and says they're trying to prevent him leaving

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55976701&postcount=10
making assumptions about irish law

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55975000&postcount=9
making things needlessly awkward and threatening court just for the sake of it

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55823722&postcount=19
singles out one sentence of my reply and says i've proved his case. i only proved it if he misunderstood that sentence and ignored the rest

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55820672&postcount=17
a pre pay operator must take any credit instantly, no delay is allowed. (this was repeated several times over the months and never became true surprisingly)

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55666093&postcount=28
if something is on offer in a shop and its out of stock so the manager puts something else in to fill the gap, he's trying to trick people into buying the more expensive item

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55637935&postcount=8
mini atm's charge €10 per transaction

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55223874&postcount=14
asks a question, ignores the answer and says i've confirmed his suspicions. i clarfiy. he still says i'm confirming his suspicions. repeat. original question was could a company steal money from your credit card, with the automatic assumption that they would if they could

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55094894&postcount=50
they will not deactivate voicemail for pre pay customers (they of course will)

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55012368&postcount=9
making up laws

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55003801&postcount=12
says bringing your phone to mprc will void the warranty

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54880092&postcount=1
saying that i and dal made programs and gave them away for free so that we could steal people's login details and do direct marketing to them

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055213493&highlight=foggy_lad
made a scene because he was asked for his address for a refund as most shops do. couldn't just put down fake details, had to make a scene

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54265793&postcount=11
not including a techinical fault report with a repaired phone means "they have something to hide"

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54047099&postcount=50
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=53925235&postcount=16
he used to love 3 and i warned him

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=53926464&postcount=19
he also used to hate meteor and say everyone should move to 3

and that's just a small sample

Walkman

ha ha best post i have seen here in years. Thanks sam!! I think we should all acknowledge sam's effort im this post.

david

Pwnd. Some would say you have way too much time on your hands :P

Nody

Sam Vimes wrote: »

it's not so much bad advice as general paranoia, made up laws and wrong information. at the risk of going OT but you requested it:

Not to go any further OT but in Foggy's defence it also has to be stated that he has greatly improved over the last months in terms of backing up his statements.

foggy_lad

it's not so much bad advice as general paranoia, made up laws and wrong information.

why change your story when challenged?

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57439055&postcount=34
your wrong information stating shops decide on repair replacement or refund and also if a repair doesnt work people are told it must be sent three times for repair!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56549318&postcount=11most shops sell items that are faulty as most times it is worth their while as customers dont always return faulty goods depending on the price and qulity of the item.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56549337&postcount=12

says "3 year insurance poilcy is really only for two years because your statutory rights cover you for the first year. insurance covers things that aren't covered by your statutory rights so its not "really only for two years"

awh you got me on this one!

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55752028&postcount=25

doesn't hold himself to the same standards as he does everyone else, ie it's ok to screw a company you owe money to as long as they can't hurt you

and this one but the thread is about intrim justicia!

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55108650&postcount=1
my house is wired up completly for a phone line but that is not what eircom mean so they should make the wording of their offer clearer

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55097674&postcount=3677

somebody deliberately changed his date of birth on 3's system for some reason. it couldn't possibly be a mistake

a mistake could only be made if someone was accessing my account details and why would they be editing my DOB anyway? i was just ratifying how awful and incompetant three are to deal with.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55088703&postcount=1

not having something in stock that's supposed to be on special is a scam

many companies wait until they are out of stock of items before putting them on sale! and having only 2 of 3 items required for a discount in EVERY store is more than coincidence!

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54880685&postcount=36

boards and meteor are conspiring together against him

it did appear so when people were arguing their mis-information was right and also law

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54876878&postcount=25

meteor asking for a deposit is a scam. assumes they'll make it difficult to get back so you won't leave

meteor bill-pay is a nothing but trouble anyway as i found out from others on bill-pay with them.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57443290&postcount=36

making an incorrect assumption to make out that it's a scam

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57408090&postcount=1 read the op's firts post!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57297105&postcount=35
misreading of statement.

says "they can't go back on something" when it was never actually offered

but a refund was offered in the form of a credit note which the op did not have to accept
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57135276&postcount=4

all terms and conditions should be explained at sign up time (do you have 5 hours?)

people are not even told where to find the terms and conditions and as for 5hours YES if that's what it takes to get mobile phone companies to do the right thing!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56979699&postcount=12

you can get out of your contractual obligations if they don't suit you by cancelling the direct debit and not giving them the money

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56953771&postcount=1
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56624235&postcount=36

being awkward and vastly over estimating how difficult the proposed solution was because he wants to "insist on his rights" when a perfectly reasonable alternative is being offered

insisting that people deal with the manufacturer when they have no contract with them is basic consumer issues stuff thought in junior cert
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56561100&postcount=21

changing his statement when i point it out to be wrong and saying i don't understand what he's talking about. it's as if i can't just go back and quote what he said

quoting several posts from the same thread only shows you dont have much to base your arguments on
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56519460&postcount=19

imagining unfair terms that a company MIGHT have

thread about those premium texts offering free phone credit but you must follow the terms to the letter or you lose out
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56360778&postcount=13

when returning something to a shop, the shop assistant will trawl through credit card transactions to find out if the item was a present so that he can say that the person in the shop is not the original purchaser so he won't return it

i simply pointed out that the sale of goods act does not cover gifts and if something was found to be a gift it the shop would not be obliged to provide after sales care!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=56079346&postcount=18

makes flawed assumptions about something a meteor agent told him and says they're trying to prevent him leaving

your so insistant that meteor did not do what was posted you may as well come right out and call me a liar!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55976701&postcount=10

making assumptions about irish law

and if this ended up in court the op would most likely be told to pay the amount back at their leisure as the company had for so long been uninterested in collecting the debt!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55975000&postcount=9

making things needlessly awkward and threatening court just for the sake of it

see above.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55823722&postcount=19

singles out one sentence of my reply and says i've proved his case. i only proved it if he misunderstood that sentence and ignored the rest

it is unreasonable to make customers wait several hours before their accounts are updated and also unlawful to charge them when they can not know they are being charged as their account is not up to date!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55820672&postcount=17

a pre pay operator must take any credit instantly, no delay is allowed. (this was repeated several times over the months and never became true surprisingly)

see above
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55666093&postcount=28

if something is on offer in a shop and its out of stock so the manager puts something else in to fill the gap, he's trying to trick people into buying the more expensive item

this is always happening through laziness or intent to confuse customers into buying dearer items.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55637935&postcount=8

mini atm's charge €10 per transaction

oh did you catch me out again?
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55223874&postcount=14

asks a question, ignores the answer and says i've confirmed his suspicions. i clarfiy. he still says i'm confirming his suspicions. repeat. original question was could a company steal money from your credit card, with the automatic assumption that they would if they could

so it rarely happens that companies charge peoples card without proper authorisation? when you give your card details you are usually unknowingly giving authorization for 6months or more!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55094894&postcount=50

they will not deactivate voicemail for pre pay customers (they of course will)

whenever i asked i was told it was not possible for prepaid customers
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55012368&postcount=9

making up laws

so it is just policy then and nothing to do with consumers statutory rights.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55003801&postcount=12

says bringing your phone to mprc will void the warranty

if they are considered competant then it is acceptible but some are not as competant as they should be and should not be allowed do warrenty repairs!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54880092&postcount=1

saying that i and dal made programs and gave them away for free so that we could steal people's login details and do direct marketing to them

saying you had the opportunity to access people's accounts if ye so wished.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055213493&highlight=foggy_lad

made a scene because he was asked for his address for a refund as most shops do. couldn't just put down fake details, had to make a scene

like your mobile phone shop policies just because it is the shops policy does not make it law
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54265793&postcount=11

not including a techinical fault report with a repaired phone means "they have something to hide"

it is only paper and would make the customer think they did more than take the battery out and wipe the contacts!
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=54047099&postcount=50
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=53925235&postcount=16

he used to love 3 and i warned him

i still have two three phones one billpay and a prepay and they are the cheapest network but the indian call centre are not aware of irish legislation regarding usage billing etc and the fact they never give anything in writing now works to my advantage.
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=53926464&postcount=19

he also used to hate meteor and say everyone should move to 3

again i still have two meteor prepay accounts and will be keeping them for the free texts and mms