One-year freeze on drink prices

tribulus

super_furry wrote: »

Still no-one able to explain why a tiny bottle of coke should cost €3.50.

Jesus man, did you not see the effort involved in filling the bottle!

Those little feckers get paid a fortune as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R1NnyE6DDnQ

Darragh29

Slow Motion wrote: »

A good pub doesn't need any of the above, all it needs are decent surroundings, friendly staff and reasonable prices!

I'd put friendly staff at top of the list, followed by reasonable prices and decent surroundings. I can't understand how pubs commit seven digit figures to a pub and don't look at the smallest of things like friendly staff...

Slow Motion

Darragh29 wrote: »

I'd put friendly staff at top of the list, followed by reasonable prices and decent surroundings. I can't understand how pubs commit seven digit figures to a pub and don't look at the smallest of things like friendly staff...

True! In my local there is one barmaid who is a complete and utter ignorant cnut, myself and other punters have complained several times about her and nothing is done, I and others have actually left the pub when she comes on shift on more than one occasion, I used to go there several times a week and would stay for a few hours, now it might be a couple of pints after work and then home with a few tinnies!

Quint

Agree about the ignorant staff. I went down to my local, ordered a guinness, and asked if they would turn on a football match that setanta were showing.
The geebag behing the bar said no, because it wasn't one of the advertised matches they have on the list of live sports they're showing that week.
There was an england poland under 21 match on that no one was watching on and she wouldn't change it! And the pub has about 10 TV's! Anyway, i walked out, went up the road, rang my mates i was supposed to be meeting, and we spent €150 in a different pub!

Terry

Darragh29 wrote: »

I'd put friendly staff at top of the list, followed by reasonable prices and decent surroundings. I can't understand how pubs commit seven digit figures to a pub and don't look at the smallest of things like friendly staff...

Indeed.
With friendly staff you are more than likely going to get a good pint.
If you get a dirty glass, they will also have no problem replacing your drink for you and you don't need to worry about someone dipping their balls into your drink.

Quint

witnessmenow wrote: »

Its been a while since I studied Economics, but a pint is not your typical economic good, dropping the price does not instantly = more pints sold. On a night out you are more than likely going to spend X amount, regardless of how much drink that X amount buys you.

But you'll go out more often instead of buying from the off-licence and staying at home

witnessmenow wrote: »

The pub i work in has the cheapest pint in Athlone (as far as i'm aware), Fosters @ €3. They also have pitchers of Bud, Heineken and Coors for €10, this was introduced a few weeks ago and its just not selling that well, proof that pints arent an elastic good. (is that right?!?) EDIT: BTW a regular pint is €4.20 just for comparison

Why do you have to buy a pitcher for €10? Why not just have pints for €3.30 assuming there's 3 pints in a pitcher? Because the owner knows no one will buy a pitcher! Why is it only fosters and not heineken that's €3 a pint? Cos the bar man knows it's terrible and no one will buy it so he won't lose money!

witnessmenow wrote: »

Everybody has less money to spend so they are drinking at home and coming into town later than before.

If the owner lowered the prices, people would stop drinking at home, and spend that money on drink in the pub! Show him this thread, hundreds of people really want to drink in a pub instead of at hime!

Peteee

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Does anyone have a break down of the cost of a pint ?
21.5% VAT / Excise / wholesale price / how much it costs to make / publicans margin
and how it has changed over the years.

Lets not let facts get in the way of a good bitch now, eh

super_furry

Well let's see the facts then!

James Forde

they can stick their prize freeze up their arse!

two slabs of beer 50euro in tesco is the answer

Smart Bug

super_furry wrote: »

Well let's see the facts then!

Price of a keg (of Guinness) is roughly €140. Diageo says the average price of a pint in Ireland is roughly €4.

50 litres in a keg. 92 pints in a keg.

€368 gross per keg

Tax is 21.5% (of 368) ~ €77

Therefore:

Profit = €151 per keg.

It'd roughly be about €2.00 per bottle - Bottles avg around €5 and are sold for about €2 by Musgraves, although there are other cheaper suppliers.

More profit is made on splits and spirits.

Source: 2 uncles who ran bars & numerous Internet searches.

witnessmenow

Quint wrote: »

But you'll go out more often instead of buying from the off-licence and staying at home


Why do you have to buy a pitcher for €10? Why not just have pints for €3.30 assuming there's 3 pints in a pitcher? Because the owner knows no one will buy a pitcher! Why is it only fosters and not heineken that's €3 a pint? Cos the bar man knows it's terrible and no one will buy it so he won't lose money!


If the owner lowered the prices, people would stop drinking at home, and spend that money on drink in the pub! Show him this thread, hundreds of people really want to drink in a pub instead of at hime!

You want to drink in a pub but pay offie prices, you cant have everything? A price drop of 50c is hardly going to have you back in droves is it? The increase in volume sold would not make up for the drop in profit per drink.

Fosters cost less to buy than Heineken hence it can be sold for less, its not that hard to understand is it?

The idea behind it is that a few of you will come in a split a pitcher, its a price reward for buying in volume, a pretty standard practice amongst business', do you give out when tesco does a buy 2 get one free deal?

EDIT:

Smart Bug wrote: »

Price of a keg (of Guinness) is roughly €140. Diageo says the average price of a pint in Ireland is roughly €4.

50 litres in a keg. 92 pints in a keg.

€368 gross per keg

Tax is 21.5% (of 368) ~ €77

Therefore:

Profit = €151 per keg.

It'd roughly be about €2.00 per bottle - Bottles avg around €5 and are sold for about €2 by Musgraves, although there are other cheaper suppliers.

More profit is made on splits and spirits.

Source: 2 uncles who ran bars & numerous Internet searches.

Im pretty sure there is more tax than just Vat on a pint.

Also not that it would make a massive diffrence but there is no way you'd sell all 92 pints in a keg, with waste etc

EDIT EDIT: I have no idea how much gas costs , could be fairly negligible but its possible that also comes into it

rubadub

IvySlayer wrote: »

The economy breaks down and people are worried about the price of alcohol

I know people who spend more per week on drink than on food or rent, it is a big deal to many.

witnessmenow wrote: »

On a night out you are more than likely going to spend X amount, regardless of how much drink that X amount buys you.

Don't know many like that, most I know set out to get drunk or tipsy and want X amount of drinks.

witnessmenow wrote: »

The pub i work in has the cheapest pint in Athlone (as far as i'm aware), Fosters @ €3. They also have pitchers of Bud, Heineken and Coors for €10, this was introduced a few weeks ago and its just not selling that well, proof that pints arent an elastic good.

Or proof people do not like pitchers, they go flat and most barmen cannot pour a good one, also unlike TV & movies where people ask for "beer" most people have different preferences and want different drinks. Also do you actually state how much volume is in a pitcher? They could think it is costing the same or more.

super_furry wrote: »

Still no-one able to explain why a tiny bottle of coke should cost €3.50.

Because fools pay it. That is like €35 for a 2L, ~20 times the price of a supermarket.

Smart Bug wrote: »

92 ~88pints in a keg.

witnessmenow wrote: »

The idea behind it is that a few of you will come in a split a pitcher, its a price reward for buying in volume, a pretty standard practice amongst business', do you give out when tesco does a buy 2 get one free deal?

It is a very unusual practice amongst pubs. I know very few places that do pitchers. Why does the bar not offer the same volume but in individual glasses for the same price? If my pub gave me discounts getting 2 pints at one time I would, never heard of that practice though. Also discounts for volume in off licences is a relatively new thing too. It just doesn't happen in the drink industry really. Go to dunnes and get the price of a can or 500ml bottle of coke and compare it to a 2L bottle. Now do the same with flagons & cans of cider, no real discount.

witnessmenow

rubadub wrote: »

I know people who spend more per week on drink than on food or rent, it is a big deal to many.


Don't know many like that, most I know set out to get drunk or tipsy and want X amount of drinks.

I would have though people only have X amount left over from there wage or whatever but what your saying is fair enough, but a pub isnt going to make more money out of people with your philosophy of buying drink by dropping price.

rubadub wrote: »

Or proof people do not like pitchers, they go flat and most barmen cannot pour a good one, also unlike TV & movies where people ask for "beer" most people have different preferences and want different drinks. Also do you actually state how much volume is in a pitcher? They could think it is costing the same or more.

Its a good point about the volume, it is not stated anywhere how much volume is in a pitcher, Its generally accepted that pitchers have 3-3.5 pints in them, but it should be made clear.

rubadub wrote: »

It is a very unusual practice amongst pubs. I know very few places that do pitchers. Why does the bar not offer the same volume but in individual glasses for the same price? If my pub gave me discounts getting 2 pints at one time I would, never heard of that practice though.

Also a good point

Smart Bug

witnessmenow wrote: »

Im pretty sure there is more tax than just Vat on a pint.

Also not that it would make a massive diffrence but there is no way you'd sell all 92 pints in a keg, with waste etc

Point 2; you'd be right, roughly 88 - 92 pints per keg (as another poster pointed out).

Point 1; VAT is charged at point of sale and in this scenario there's two points of sale, being 1. Brewer (keg distributor) and 2. Bar.

A fixed rate of 47c excise duty is charged on every pint. The rest is profit and tax, which rise hand-in-hand.

toiletduck

rubadub wrote: »

If my pub gave me discounts getting 2 pints at one time I would

You are getting a discount, 2 half pints are (in most places) dearer than a pint :pac:

seamus

Smart Bug wrote: »

Point 1; VAT is charged at point of sale and in this scenario there's two points of sale, being 1. Brewer (keg distributor) and 2. Bar.

VAT is only payable by consumers. Although DIAGEO may be required to charge VAT on their kegs, the pub passes this directly onto the customer and shouldn't apply it again.

That is, if we are to assume that the price they pay Diageo of €140 is VAT inclusive, then the VAT on that is ~€25, and the ex-VAT price is €115, which is what it really costs the pub. If the pub makes €352 revenue per keg, then the VAT payable by the drinker is ~€62, and the excise was 88*0.47 =~ €42.

So the total in taxes to the consumer was €104, the pub bought the keg for €115, and the profit left for the pub is €133. Which is a profit margin of 37%.

Since this is static regardless of location and the average price of a pint in Dublin is €5, this increases the pub's profit margin to 50%.

Of course, this depends on two things which I'm not sure of:

Is that €140 inclusive of VAT?
Is that €140 inclusive of Excise?

It would be helpful if someone could answer these questions.

rubadub

witnessmenow wrote: »

I would have though people only have X amount left over from there wage or whatever but what your saying is fair enough, but a pub isnt going to make more money out of people with your philosophy of buying drink by dropping price.

You were saying you were a student so may have less disposable income so may only have X money to dip into. You do have a good point about spending X though, some will do this, i.e. only have X to spend, in which case they will get tanked up at home and then head to the pub. My point is really I do not see peoples sobriety being dictated by what they can afford, rather what & where they drink is dictated, they get pissed regardless.

Even though I have the money to pay, there is such a difference in price that I have stashed drink into gigs recently. The reason being 2 fold, being charged 5 times the price for a drink I do not even particularly like (i.e. poor choice in gigs, coupled by a badly poured drink in a poxy plastic cup), AND the refusal to have adequate staff and/or setup in gigs. You often have to queue for ages in a blind spot to the music, missing out on the gig that tickemaster have already raped you on!

When I started drinking ~15years ago a pint was about twice the price as a can in the offie. I got heineken at 62c a bottle with tesco deals, some lad paid €6.20 in dicey reileys for a bottle of bud, 10 times the price. (works out at €10.67 per pint BTW!)

toiletduck wrote: »

You are getting a discount, 2 half pints are (in most places) dearer than a pint :pac:

That is a point though, the difference is really to encourage you to drink a pint so the barman goes through one transaction rather than 2, and having to clean 2 glasses. With a pitcher it takes around as long to pour, but they end up with glasses AND the pitcher to wash.

Terry

witnessmenow wrote: »

You want to drink in a pub but pay offie prices, you cant have everything? A price drop of 50c is hardly going to have you back in droves is it? The increase in volume sold would not make up for the drop in profit per drink.

50c off a pint would have me back in the pub straight away.

It's the difference between five pints out of €20 instead of four.

Darragh29

I go to Cyprus once or twice a year and over there, and the same happens in many other destinations as well, if you've spent the bones of 50 Euro in a bar, they'll insist on giving you a drink for the road on the house, usually a brandy or something like that, to thank you for your custom. They don't make a big deal out of it but you do feel that you are appreciated as a customer.

Back on the ranch, you don't even get a drink on the house at Christmas time in your local...

Quint

witnessmenow wrote: »

You want to drink in a pub but pay offie prices, you cant have everything? A price drop of 50c is hardly going to have you back in droves is it? The increase in volume sold would not make up for the drop in profit per drink.

Fosters cost less to buy than Heineken hence it can be sold for less, its not that hard to understand is it?

The idea behind it is that a few of you will come in a split a pitcher, its a price reward for buying in volume, a pretty standard practice amongst business', do you give out when tesco does a buy 2 get one free

No one in the country expects offie prices in pubs, they just don't want to be ripped off.
You said a heineken costs 4.20 a pint. But the owner can make a profit on heineken at 3.30 a pint in his pitchers, obviously no one wants pitchers, just charge it for 3.30 a pint! Most people will have 3 pints anyway, i know I'd stay all night at 3:30 a pint! You also said the amount of money people spend there has reduced drasticly and the pitchers aren't selling, so maybe he should take on board what some customers want and show him this thread.

But seems that he's purposly reducing the price of stuff that people won't buy, people aren't interested in that (you say yourself it's not selling) just reduce the prices of the normal pints!

Darragh29

Darragh29 wrote: »

Back on the ranch, you don't even get a drink on the house at Christmas time in your local...

In fairness we always get a pint on the house Christmas eve in my local. This probably isnt very common though!!

Darragh29

Cory Squeaking Whirlpool wrote: »

In fairness we always get a pint on the house Christmas eve in my local. This probably isnt very common though!!

It used to be but in my local they seem to have done away with it. I think this is the height of scabbiness...

I am pie

I'm wondering if the industry is in tune with the distinct lack of sympathy for their plight. The common sentiment seems to be they have had it good and bled us dry for as long as was possible.

Pubs should view this as an opportunity to win back some customers from the 'Cafe-Bars' and from restaurants. If they served good competively priced food perhaps...drop the prices on a bottle of wine to off license levels, maybe food and a bottle of wine specials, get the price of pint down to a level which is in tune with what the consumer will pay. Applies to the whole industry. The feeling out there is that the price of a pint is artificially inflated simply cos it was possible when the good times were rollin'

Hopefully we'll see the back of some overpriced kips in town....soulless dumps cocktail bars charging 6 quid for a pint! I'll celebrate everyone that closes. :cool:

raindog.promo

So say the day of the pub is over. Do you think that coffee shops etc. will be able to start serving?

If not, why not? If the general feeling in the country is that they bled people dry as much as they could and now won't have loyal customers keeping them open, maybe it's time for them to go.

Perhaps the mega pubs will dry up and smaller (cosier and better) pubs will survive and lessons on customer service and appreciation will have been learnt.

Professey Chin

Phototoxin wrote: »

Cheaper ways to socialise:

Dungeons and Dragons - the book and set dice cost about €35 and that's about 1/2 of a night on the p*ss. Infinte fun


Warhammer army costs about €200. A couple of nights on the p*ss but again re-useable you dont
p*iss it up against the wall at the end of the night

Draughts/Chess set - €15 the king of games

Dungeons & Dragons? Warhammer?
Hows about no

JohnCleary

Just got me 2 crates of beer in Tesco for €50 - Fcuk the pubs!

Capt'n Midnight

if prices were lower people could afford taxis home :pac:

BraziliaNZ

pubs are different in ireland than elsewhere. I drank in the same pub in dublin for years and the barstaff never knew my name or said hello or anything, even though it was the same ones all along. In other countries i've lived in such as Canada and NZ and now Oz, they tend to talk to you more, and pour you free drinks sometimes, and run up tabs for you, etc. They're usually a lot more friendly. I don't get it really. Although there is a bit more professionalism to it in Ireland I prefer the more laid back friendly approach they have in other countries.

Darragh29

BraziliaNZ wrote: »

pubs are different in ireland than elsewhere. I drank in the same pub in dublin for years and the barstaff never knew my name or said hello or anything, even thought it was the same ones all along. In other countries i've lived in such as Canada and NZ and now Oz, they tend to talk to you more, and pour you free drinks sometimes, and run up tabs for you, etc. They're usually a lot more friendly. I don't get it really. Although there is a bit more professionalism to it in Ireland I prefer the more laid back friendly approach they have in other countries.

They're too busy screwing you over here to notice you...

mikeruurds

seamus wrote: »

Is that €140 inclusive of VAT?
Is that €140 inclusive of Excise?

I would think that it would be inclusive of excise and exclusive of VAT.

The Revenue Commissioners would collect excise from Diageo and the cost would be fully loaded into the VAT excl. price.

The pubs and Diageo wouldn't quote the retail price of a keg inclusive of VAT as all pubs would be able to claim the VAT inputs. I believe the 2007 keg price quoted earlier was reported by Diageo - it would suit them to quote it as cheaply as possible, so therefore excl. of VAT. Also, prices quoted to trade are usually quoted ex. VAT.

Could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure this would be correct.