1st Years shouldn't be allowed run for SU positions

evil-monkey

This is a point I raised in another thread, but as it was a tad off topic, and didn't get seen there by those who'd have an interest in it, I felt it warranted its own thread. I'd be interested in ye're thoughts on the following;

At the risk of being flamed, I think that first years should not be allowed to run in elections for Student Union office...

Now before ye all have a freak, hear me out;

1. First years win elections because they bring along droves of friends. Students in later years can't do this because their class sizes are much smaller (especially in Science and Engineering etc) and they generally don't have the time to organize such political support in the face of assignments etc.
2. Elections are early in the year. What can a student who has been around 2 months really know about the college?
3. First years can be, at times, somewhat immature. Let's not forget that a lot of them aren't even 18. Proof of point: the projects officer elections this year. The only speech that wasn't embarrassing was that of the second year. An example of some of the points made by two of the first year candidates; "Vote for me and we'll have a constant party. In fact, it's my birthday next week and ye're all invited." And of course, "The way this college is run is a joke. If elected I'll sort those f*ckers up in Dublin flying everywhere in their own private jets." Or something close enough along those lines.
4. First years don't have anywhere near the pressure of later years, and while this gives them more time, their college priorities are a lot different to later year students. When I was in first year, I had two things on my mind; and they were both drunken sex.
5. Vote for a first year in October, and they may not even be in CIT come January. I know this could be said for all years, but a lot of students last a few months in college before they are never seen again. At least a student in a later year has proved that they are in fact in it for the long hall.

So as I said, at the risk of being flamed, first years shouldn't be allowed to run for SU positions. Any thoughts??

deegs

If they get the votes allow them. Anything else is un-democratic.

evil-monkey

deegs wrote: »

If they get the votes allow them. Anything else is un-democratic.

Well that's the point. They always get the votes because they bring their entire class along with them.

deegs

evil-monkey wrote: »

Well that's the point. They always get the votes because they bring their entire class along with them.

If first years are the only ones voting then TBH they should have a person who represents them... a first year!

Sometimes democracy suks, but if we all signed up to it we gotta run with it.

evil-monkey

deegs wrote: »

If first years are the only ones voting then TBH they should have a person who represents them... a first year!

Sometimes democracy suks, but if we all signed up to it we gotta run with it.

Yes but democracy often has controls; conditions which candidates must meet before they can run. 1st Years could be represented just as well by a 2nd, 3rd or 4th years...whereas the same cannot be said for 1st years representing them. An example of this would be at this year's AGM, where the three 1st year candidates demonstrated that they haven't a clue what's going inside the college apart from parties and parking.

deegs

evil-monkey wrote: »

Yes but democracy often has controls; conditions which candidates must meet before they can run. 1st Years could be represented just as well by a 2nd, 3rd or 4th years...whereas the same cannot be said for 1st years representing them. An example of this would be at this year's AGM, where the three 1st year candidates demonstrated that they haven't a clue what's going inside the college apart from parties and parking.

Maybe thats the opinion of the majority of students! Perhaps you are the minority, even if you disagree you must consider it.

Parties and parking sounds like good concerns to me

evil-monkey

deegs wrote: »

Maybe thats the opinion of the majority of students! Perhaps you are the minority, even if you disagree you must consider it.

I am the minority?? In what way exactly?? Because I'm not a first year??

deegs wrote: »

Parties and parking sounds like good concerns to me

:rolleyes: Can I ask what year and course you're in??

pablomakaveli

Who cares? i see your point but let them do what they want. Most students don't really care about whos elected and students who have enough common sense don't get involved in the SU.

deegs

pablomakaveli wrote: »

and students who have enough common sense don't get involved in the SU.

evil-monkey

pablomakaveli wrote: »

Who cares? i see your point but let them do what they want. Most students don't really care about whos elected and students who have enough common sense don't get involved in the SU.

Lot's of people care. For example, everyone who has posted a complaint of some sort on this forum ought to care...

razorblunt

As I said before I'm of the opinion anyone that wants to run for SU shouldn't be allowed.

wpb_gog

elections are in may not october!!! da project officer one was held in october because ur man sean voted last yr couldnt do it this yr as he dropped out so it went up for reelection in october

only first yrs applied for the role

evil-monkey

wpb_gog wrote: »

only first yrs applied for the role

:rolleyes: well ya see now that's just not true...the only female candidate, Kim I think her name was, is in second year...

wpb_gog

ur point bein??? she didnt get it. fish got it and bein honest he was the better candidate. ur man who brought all the support nigel didnt get voted because he made a mockery of the thing he didnt even no what the postition was bout. eric the other candidate repeated kims speech. there were only two candidates actually in the running from the beginning and it came down to the two of em. if ur so convinced first yrs shouldnt run for the positions then perhaps run urself. i think its great that they even show an interest in the college and they wanna change things. if ur basing ur entire argument on nigels speech at project officers election....what bout the non sabt's in their this yr?? they were first yrs when they ran and they seem to be workin on different issues around coll such as fees, bus shelter outside, working towards gettin a merchandising shop and a book shop and last but not least the college bar. this yrs union seem to b actually getting somewer with it and guess what they're made up of students who were first yrs who ran last yr

evil-monkey

wpb_gog wrote: »

ur point bein??? she didnt get it. fish got it and bein honest he was the better candidate.

He wasn't the better candidate - my point is he has a bigger class than her. How many are in second year engineering compared to first year business admin?? His campaign revolved around his "parking in CIT is a joke" slogan - which it isn't. Her speech was the only one that made any sense - and she was the only one of the candidates that looked like she'd be still around come the summer.

wpb_gog wrote: »

if ur so convinced first yrs shouldnt run for the positions then perhaps run urself.

I have 12 in my year - which is my point.

wpb_gog wrote: »

i think its great that they even show an interest in the college and they wanna change things.

Things they haven't been around long enough to understand. I would much prefer someone with some decent experience of the college representing me, rather than someone who has been around for only a few months...

wpb_gog wrote: »

if ur basing ur entire argument on nigels speech at project officers election....what bout the non sabt's in their this yr?? they were first yrs when they ran and they seem to be workin on different issues around coll such as fees, bus shelter outside, working towards gettin a merchandising shop and a book shop and last but not least the college bar.

All issues that 3rd and 4th years couldn't really be bothered with...

wpb_gog wrote: »

this yrs union seem to b actually getting somewer with it and guess what they're made up of students who were first yrs who ran last yr

Another thing that's just not true. All of the influential positions are held by students who were not first years last year.

wpb_gog

yeaa thats tru presideant and the vices are held by older students who have been around college but where do u think those ppl started off?? how do u think they got to no the issues? by working with the union since first yr.

CantGetNoSleep

The SU do f*ck all anyway so why not let someone from any year be part of this doing f*ck all

evil-monkey

wpb_gog wrote: »

yeaa thats tru presideant and the vices are held by older students who have been around college but where do u think those ppl started off?? how do u think they got to no the issues? by working with the union since first yr.

But they didn't hold officer positions. Fact is, if the guy that won wasn't in first year business admin, and had brought his whole course along, the girl in engineering would have won and we'd all be better represented. They can have their opportunity to run - just not in first year.

CantGetNoSleep wrote: »

The SU do f*ck all anyway so why not let someone from any year be part of this doing f*ck all

I think this post speaks for itself...

wpb_gog

the guy who won is repeating....is it jus u think hes incapable of doing a good job? he seems pretty decent. he has the radio station goin and working on the bus stop as well. i mean some of the problems in college can b solved pretty easily. park and ride cud probably be done in conjuction with another car park such as the overflow in mahon point. thats only used on sat and sundays and during peak periods lik the wk before christmas and the month of jan when we're off anyway.in return they cud prob advertise in coll for free and on the campus radio there'd prob b a hefty fee which cud prob b covered the paid parking thing anyway or els they cud jus have security on the gates goin in checking cards coz i mean ppl are prob parking in coll and heading to town for the day and their car is sorted for day and all they pay for is a return bus fare.

that was my rant. anyway i think the point i was trying to make was it doesnt take a genius to do the non sabt's roles. i mean its entertainments (organise a party every so often) , communications (take a few photos and write a magazine which most is copied and pasted) and projects.....ive heard the term the unions bitch thrown around

o and gearoid did hold officer positions, he was communications and projects. which is prob y hes doin a good job

evil-monkey

wpb_gog wrote: »

the guy who won is repeating....

:rolleyes: Doesn't exactly inspires confidence...

wpb_gog wrote: »

is it jus u think hes incapable of doing a good job? he seems pretty decent. he has the radio station goin and working on the bus stop as well.

I'm sure the final year students will be delighted that we now have a radio station and are in the process of getting a bus shelter...

wpb_gog wrote: »

i mean some of the problems in college can b solved pretty easily. park and ride cud probably be done in conjuction with another car park such as the overflow in mahon point. thats only used on sat and sundays and during peak periods lik the wk before christmas and the month of jan when we're off anyway.in return they cud prob advertise in coll for free and on the campus radio there'd prob b a hefty fee which cud prob b covered the paid parking thing anyway or els they cud jus have security on the gates goin in checking cards coz i mean ppl are prob parking in coll and heading to town for the day and their car is sorted for day and all they pay for is a return bus fare.

that was my rant. anyway i think the point i was trying to make was it doesnt take a genius to do the non sabt's roles. i mean its entertainments (organise a party every so often) , communications (take a few photos and write a magazine which most is copied and pasted) and projects.....ive heard the term the unions bitch thrown around

I think you're missing my point. My point is based on figures. Just say for example, the world's greatest leader was in 3rd year Chemistry; they would NEVER manage to get themselves elected against a first year. In CIT elections, the best candidate is not being elected, the candidate with the biggest course is - which a lot of the time, is a first year doing something like business. I mean look at 3rd/4th year computer courses - you've got what, 20 people max?? Look at 3rd/4th year business - 200 easily. I'm not picking on our current project officer, but as he was brought up, he was NEVER going to loose that election, even though the Eng student was a better candidate. Why?? He is in a course that has high numbers - she isn't. The speeches were a waste of time. The people who were there, the majority of them anyway, were brought along by a certain candidate and were never going to sway their vote; regardless of the debate...

towel401

the radio station has been around for years but nobody knows about it. they won't get a proper transmitter and instead have a line running somewhere accross the college broadcasting on very low power AM. they should get a proper transmitter really but the process of setting up a radio station legally is a right pain in the arse

wpb_gog

were u there for the counting of the votes??

can i ask den wot third and 4th yr students actually want den?

evil-monkey

wpb_gog wrote: »

were u there for the counting of the votes??

What exactly has this got to do with anything??

wpb_gog wrote: »

can i ask den wot third and 4th yr students actually want den?

70% of my course went...that's about 6 of us; which reiterates my point...

wpb_gog

because if u were there u wud have known it was pretty close in the final thing.

u didnt mention wot 3rd and 4th yr student want?

the students who run in may r ppl have been there for the yr and are usually involved in the union for the yr as reps or entertainment crew things etc

i agree wit em not running in october if the positions are open to re election but in fairness how many older students are interested in those positions

(posting not as a mod in case anyone is wondering)

If 1st years aren't allowed run, why should they vote? 1st years tend to vote more than any other year so if you take that away the % of people voting might get very embarressing

Besides, in any election it's up to the electorate to decide. If someone won who is taking the piss well then the person they ran against didn't do enough to show that the position is serious.

Edit: wpb gog, please don't use txt spk - it makes people's eyes bleed.

evil-monkey

wpb_gog wrote: »

because if u were there u wud have known it was pretty close in the final thing.

u didnt mention wot 3rd and 4th yr student want?

the students who run in may r ppl have been there for the yr and are usually involved in the union for the yr as reps or entertainment crew things etc

i agree wit em not running in october if the positions are open to re election but in fairness how many older students are interested in those positions

OK, could you repost that please with the inclusion of punctuation of some form...thanks

Myth wrote: »

(posting not as a mod in case anyone is wondering)

If 1st years aren't allowed run, why should they vote? 1st years tend to vote more than any other year so if you take that away the % of people voting might get very embarressing

Which just proves that they are only there to support their buddies.

Myth wrote: »

If someone won who is taking the piss well then the person they ran against didn't do enough to show that the position is serious.

The speeches given by the first years at the Project Officer election would have, to many people, suggested that they were all taking the piss...or just stupid...

Myth wrote: »

Edit: wpb gog, please don't use txt spk - it makes people's eyes bleed.

I can't +1 this enough...

jk47

i agree with evil monkey. most of the responses here have just proven his point further cos they have poorly put together and shown a total lack of understanding. and someone pointed out that the person who won the election is repeating. good to know we have a guy who cant pass first year business administration representing us *note the sarcasm*