Choosing (pretty standard) Wine

humbert

I like wine, usually red, but absolutely hate trying to choose a bottle.

I'm not talking about something fancy just your bog standard bottle of wine easily available from Oddbins, Tesco, Marks & Spencer, etc.

I know it's probably an individual preference but generally when you do encounter a decent wine there's some consensus on the subject.

I'm wondering is there anything to look out for when choosing a wine, or even any internet site with people's opinions/reviews on the types available from mainstream retailers?

It's just very annoying to come home only to find out what you've just bought tastes like piss and price doesn't seem to be a very good measure of quality.

BaZmO*

As you've hinted it really is about personal tastes.

You need to just take note of what you like and then try to buy similar wines the next time your buying a bottle. And every now and then get one slightly dearer than what you normally pay as sometimes (but not always) paying that bit extra gets you something nicer.

There's two general things to look out for when you want to take stock of what you like. There's New World and Old World wines.

Old World (France, Italy, Spain) wines tend to use blends of different types of grapes or have a particular grapes common to a region so each region would have it's own style/taste. So you'd get, Bordeaux, Burgundy, Beaujolais, etc. from France. Rioja being the main region of Spain. And I'm not hugely familiar with Italian wines but you get wines like Chianti & Amarone etc.

New World (Australia, Chile, America, Chile, Argentina) wines tend to just use the one grape type, grapes like (Reds) Shiraz, Merlot, Pinot Noir, Cabernet Sauvignon, Malbec, etc. (Whites) Chardonnay, Sauvignon, Semillion, Chenin Blanc, etc.


As a starter you should maybe buy a Malbec from Chile and if you like it get a Malbec from Chile by a different producer and see it you like that too. If you don't like that, try a Shiraz from Australia and so on. You'll soon learn what grapes/wine types you like from each country/region, but it really is a matter of taste.

muckety

Just a couple of points, it is rare that you will get anything 'nice' under about 11 euro but there is plenty around that price that will be good. Also, wines of the 'old world' have classifications that will help you - Appellation d'Origine Controlee in france (so a wine from, say, Bordeaux will have Appellation d'origine Bordeaux controlee on the bottle) means that it has reached a certain standard to be able to put that on the label. You will find plenty of opinion on the internet but its best to learn by tasting (more fun too) and form your own opinion. There are plenty of books on the subject that will give you the basics of what to look for if you want to find out more.

Marks and Spencer have some pretty good wines at around the tenner+ mark - and do good discounts frequently just now too! Try a few different regions/grapes per prevoius poster following the above guidelines until you get a feel for what you like. Try their Ribera del duera (about 15 euro) which is a Tempranillo; Rasteau for a good gutsy inexpensive S. french or Fleurie (french light red/Gamay grape) as a few different styles to start with. And enjoy it!

BaZmO*

muckety wrote: »

Marks and Spencer have some pretty good wines at around the tenner+ mark - and do good discounts frequently just now too!

Yeah I'd definitely recommend M&S wines. Great value and they grade the wine on the labels and give a description so you can learn that way too.

TeenageKicks

if its Italian wine make sure it has

denominazione origine controllata

written on the front this is like the Q for Quality mark for Italian wines awarded by their wine board

humbert

Thanks a million guys. They sound like really good tips. I'll have to put them into practice and see if I can find something that takes my fancy

enda1

As regards french wine and the appelation rules be careful is all I'll say. Having AOC is not a guarantee of quality by any means and doesn't imply it.

As long as the maker follows a certain set of rules (different depending on the appelation) which involve permitted grapes, fermentation, aging, bottling, etc. then they are allowed put the AOC on their bottle, but this does not (necessarily) mean it wil be good! This is particualrly true nowadays for a number of reasons.

One reason is that marketing and chemistry in wine making have learned how to stick to the rules but still cost cut everywhere by.

Another is that peoples tastes have changed. With the serious emergence of "new world" and the power of American and British taste, certain styles and characteristics of wine are becoming more popular while others are declining. Think when's the last time you have a bottle of 12% red wine?

Climatic change and soil changes. If you take Burgundy for example. The wine classification were made by the monks there years ago (16th c maybe, can't remember). Many things have changed since. At the time they decided which grapes varieties were suited to each piece of land depending on terroir, attitude and weather. These conditions have changed however along with the emergence of more varieties of grapes. But you cannot grow in any other way than defined by the appelation's rules and retain the appelation name.

Some growers have decided to flaunt the appelation name in knowledge that they will lose the AOC name and be put down to Vin de Pays or Vin de Table (depending) because they feel that the rules are too restrictive and limit thte maker from improving his product. However other's do this to bring in techniques which seriously improve yield but reduce quality. This is where it gets difficult.

So some advice for reliably choosing a French wine.
1. Look for the words mis en boutelie a Chateau/a properite (sorry for spelling).
Meaning that the grapes were pressed, fermented, stored and bottled at the vineyard (maybe not exactly but that's the jist of it).

2. do a bit of research! Find an appelation which you like. For the cheaper budget of wine you can drink today, look into the not so popular appelations for Anglo-Saxon taste, such as some of the Bergerac appelations (a favourite of mine is Pecharmont)! Otherwise northern Rhone and Languedoc (more risky!) are god bets.

More risky choosing...
Here's one method that is surprisingly reliable. Wine in france is steeped in tradition, which particularly shows in the label. So for a french wine to have a non traditional label can be quite a statement. Here's where you have to be careful! A lot of makers will do this to try to appeal better to the foreign markets.

So English on a label is a clear telling point! Try looking for a quirky label of a vin de pays which is from a region you like. Make sure the label is French and you'd imagine its appealing more to a young/trendy French market rather than foreign market but that its somehow slipped over here.

I now realise I've gone completely off topic... Try some wines, find out what you like and enjoy!

To be honest if your looking for nice reliable wines which you can find in every retailer, you may be dissapointed. Mostly you will be getting a lowest common denominator which will appear in every shop.

Try sticking to oddbins if there is one handy for you and do your wine shopping there? You can still pick up some good wine and descent prices in these shops I find.

Good luck.

humbert

Thanks for the effort Enda, a very informative post! There is an oddbins not too far from me luckily enough.

Actually, on the subject of where, is there anywhere in Dublin(or nationwide, like oddbins) people would particularly recommend?

muckety

If you have a local wine shop they will probably do regular tastings, which is a good way to try before you buy. Apart from the couple of bottles that they will have open they may run the odd night where they open several bottles, eg a focus on Australian wines, or Burgandy or whatever. Also they will be able to give you good advice.

Look for tasting notes too so that you know what to look for when you taste the wine (sounds strange but sometimes it helps to know what to look out for!).

sdep

enda1 wrote: »

Try sticking to oddbins if there is one handy for you and do your wine shopping there? You can still pick up some good wine and decent prices in these shops I find.

Hopefully Oddbins is returning to form. I used to buy pretty much all my wine there in the 90s in the UK, and later when they opened up here. Then they were sold to winemaking giant Castel, which filled the stores with its own dull labels. For about 5 years, there were fewer wines on sale, and fewer unusual additions to the list. They've just been sold again, and Tim Atkin thinks it could be the start of a revival (article here).

M&S is impressive at the moment. A few years ago, they just sold overpriced, unexciting, traditional-area wines, but they've become much more innovative. Tescos have some good bargains in their 'Finest' range too.

In the last couple of years, one of my favourite places to buy in Dublin has been 'The Corkscrew' on Chatham St. It isn't the cheapest (though discounts are available, if somewhat dependent on extent of patronage), but they've a lot of interesting wine, and the staff are keen, irreverent, and know their stock well. They'll point you towards things they like, and steer you away from bottles that are over the hill. All a bit like the Oddbins I've been missing.

enda1

I don't live in ireland anymore actually so haven't been to oddbins in ages actually so (probably) shouldn't have assumed that it was any good.

a friend worked in castel and says she would never buy anything from them for reasons I shouldn't go into but if what you say is correct then that bodes well for oddbins.

I was in Nicolas there the other day (the European brother or so i thought?) and picked up some unusual wines, so don't know what that means?

MattKane

I believe you can get a good wine below 11 euro. If you're not a wine buff you probably won't know the difference between an 11 euro bottle and a good 8 euro bottle. Stick to Chilean and maybe S.African as these are representing the best value for money.

Depending on your style, if you like the light reds try a Pinot Noir, and for a fuller red get your hands on a Carmenere or a Shiraz. Try moving away from the supermarkets and try something with a more personal service. Even in some of the Odd Bins, there are staff that really know their stuff and can recommend the ones for you.

Otherwise, go head first and try a mixed case (12 bottles) from a retailer or an online retailer (which I've seen start at under 100 euro). Then you can suss out your favourite over a number of weeks without even leaving the house!