Car won't start ... occasionally !

vodkasoda

Maybe somebody on here can help ...

My wife has a 1998 Nissan Micra automatic that, generally, is no problem.

However, once when I was out in it I parked at the bank, drew cash out and when I got back in, just 2 or 3 minutes later, it wouldn’t start … I tried 2 or 3 times and it just seemed dead (as far as I remember, this was a good few months ago, I don't recall the engine "clicking") … then the next time I tried it … it started !!!

No more problems until 2 or 3 months ago when my wife did a similar thing, drove down to the school to pick up our son & when she got back in the car it wouldn't start, but apparently was clicking … the mechanic up the road jump started it for her & told her she needed a new battery … but does she ?!?

Most of the last few mornings have been very cold here, heavy frosts, which we haven’t had before since we've had this car. On Monday her car wouldn’t start, all of the lights and radio were fine, but if you turned the ignition it sounded like the car was going to start, but only for a couple of seconds, then it went TICK TICK TICK TICK TICK (apparently this is what it did outside the school) … I jumped it from my car and it started fine. It was then OK for the rest of the day and was perfect yesterday, which was not frosty ... it started fine

This morning is frosty again & it’s done the same, it won’t start & we get the TICK TICK TICK TICK TICK noise … but it wasn’t frosty the time at the bank or the school, so not sure if that’s relevant !!!

JoeySully

yeah id say its the battery alrite.

Paddy001

Yep put in a new battery. The cold always does them in

Scottie99

starter motor.......coz everyone said battery :-)

vodkasoda

Paddy001 wrote: »

Yep put in a new battery. The cold always does them in

But the first twice it happened was in the Spring & Summer ... and when the engine had already been running, not on a "cold start"

JoeySully

well then if you dont wat to accept our advice and the advice of a professional mechanic then it could be the starter motor - or the wires going into it. i had a problem with a car once sounded like a dying starter motor turned out to be a loose connection going into the starter motor. it only occured once or twice a month then got more frequent.

craichoe

Starter motor brushes need to be cleaned, ticking noise is indicative of motor not turning over. May need to be replaced if the brushes are worn, could be possible to get it reconditioned too !

vodkasoda

JoeySully wrote: »

well then if you dont wat to accept our advice and the advice of a professional mechanic then it could be the starter motor - or the wires going into it. i had a problem with a car once sounded like a dying starter motor turned out to be a loose connection going into the starter motor. it only occured once or twice a month then got more frequent.

It's nothing to do with not accepting your advice, the comment I replied to said "The cold always does them in" ... but as I said, it originally happened in the Spring & Summer, when it wasn't cold ... well, not as cold as this, anyway ... I think it was a logical response !!!

My understanding of batteries is that if they are not working properly, or failing, then there is a lack of power from them ... there seems to be no lack of power here, the car just starts making a big CLICK, CLICK, CLICK noise instead of turning the engine over ... I don't know or understand, I'm not a car person, which is why I asked here ... and the count is 2-2 on battery v starter motor now !!!

AlanAhern

The ticking noise is the starter trying to tick over but its not getting enough power. Either its dead or the altinator needs to be changed. But as the battery is new and seems to be holding power (you said the lights and radio worked) the altinator is doing its job, so i reckon change the starter motor.

maggy_thatcher

We had the same problem before and it was the starter motor. One option to check -- when you turn the key, if it doesn't start, have someone tap lightly the starter motor in the engine with a wrench or something. If that allows it to start, then it definitely is the starter motor. With a battery problem, you'd most likely find that when you turned the key, everything would go dark -- the clock might reset / radio need re-coding etc.

black & white

Similar thing happened to my wife ( an 01 Micra manual ) Turned out it was a relay on the ignition circuit. Cost about 60 Euro including the labour.

vodkasoda

maggy_thatcher wrote: »

We had the same problem before and it was the starter motor. One option to check -- when you turn the key, if it doesn't start, have someone tap lightly the starter motor in the engine with a wrench or something. If that allows it to start, then it definitely is the starter motor. With a battery problem, you'd most likely find that when you turned the key, everything would go dark -- the clock might reset / radio need re-coding etc.

I will try this later on ... when I have found out where the starter motor is and what it looks like !!!

Can anybody help ?!?

vodkasoda

black & white wrote: »

Similar thing happened to my wife ( an 01 Micra manual ) Turned out it was a relay on the ignition circuit. Cost about 60 Euro including the labour.

Just when I thoght I was getting somewhere:( !!!!

Oh well, that's about the same price as a battery if it turns out to be that, thanks ...

maggy_thatcher

vodkasoda wrote: »

I will try this later on ... when I have found out where the starter motor is and what it looks like !!!

Can anybody help ?!?

There is a picture of what the starter motor looks like at http://fileshare.eshop.bg/downloadsm/30270/Nissan_Micra%20%5Bver.%20K12%5D.html -- along with wiring diagrams etc, which is probably a little more detailed than you want
I haven't seen a Micra engine, so don't know for sure -- but from that doc, it looks like it is in the bottom right corner at the front of the engine. Either way, it's generally a cylindrical object somewhere.

AlanAhern

vodkasoda wrote: »

I will try this later on ... when I have found out where the starter motor is and what it looks like !!!

Can anybody help ?!?

Normally behind the engine and attached to the block and gearbox.

Its easy to change if you have the tools and knowhow, otherwise bring it to a mechanic

Paddy001

vodkasoda wrote: »

But the first twice it happened was in the Spring & Summer ... and when the engine had already been running, not on a "cold start"

ya it could be that a cell is gone or something. Not a starter, jump start would not sort that.

Paddy001

Sorry just saw that it was clicking, thats brushes in the starter. A belt of a hammer on the starter should sort that but you need a new one or get yours reconditioned

JackieChan

Paddy001 wrote: »

Sorry just saw that it was clicking, thats brushes in the starter. A belt of a hammer on the starter should sort that but you need a new one or get yours reconditioned

That reminds me of my first car, a Renault 5. I had chunks taking out of the starter motor before I got around to changing it.....the hammering did the job though.
I had the exact same issue as OP. Sometimes car would start fine, other times all I could here was the solenoid clicking, over time this got worse.

Paddy001

JackieChan wrote: »

That reminds me of my first car, a Renault 5. I had chunks taking out of the starter motor before I got around to changing it.....the hammering did the job though.
I had the exact same issue as OP. Sometimes car would start fine, other times all I could here was the solenoid clicking, over time this got worse.

was easier in the old days.... Could cross the solenoid with a hammer or whatever! For now hit it with anything at hand, thats what i do to one of mine, started at it the other day!

mickdw

Certainly your original problem was not the battery as it failed to start one minute then next minute it was fine. So that could have been anything.
With slow turning and then clicking, that could well be battery or starter. It could also be a loose earth from the starter.
Take it to a mechanic. they will check it out easily

vodkasoda

Thanks to everybody ... my main problem is that I'm unemployed and don't even have Social payments coming in at the moment as they say I'm Self Employed but I maintain I'm not ... long story ... so I can't really afford to go to a mechanic yet.

I'll try the Starter Motor / hammer thing tomorrow and see if it resolves it, if it does I'll see about getting it sorted ASAP ... if it doesn't, I'll be back, as somebody once said !!!

Thanks again ...

Darragh29

Replace the battery.

ianobrien

maggy_thatcher wrote: »

One option to check -- when you turn the key, if it doesn't start, have someone tap lightly the starter motor in the engine with a wrench or something.

To back that up, tap it lightly!!!

I had a car with a sticky bendix on the starter, and a "friend" offered to tap the starter as I turned the key. He hit it so hard he sheared a mount off it!

Check the wiring for loose/poor connections at both the starter and battery as well!

unkel

It can be a lot of things but here's how I'd start (no pun intended):

Short trip to the school -> car won't start again
Short trip to the bank -> car won't start again

On a car that does a lot of short trips, the alternator doesn't get a chance to charge the battery fully. Take the car for a 20 minute drive regularly and see if the problem disappears. This will cost you nothing apart from some extra petrol

If it does, check the date of the battery (usually clearly visible on the battery. If it is old (>5years), just replace it. This is relatively cheap

Good chance your problem is solved at this stage. If not, move onto the other suggestions

Let us know here on the thread how you're getting on!

vodkasoda

unkel wrote: »

It can be a lot of things but here's how I'd start (no pun intended):

Short trip to the school -> car won't start again
Short trip to the bank -> car won't start again

On a car that does a lot of short trips, the alternator doesn't get a chance to charge the battery fully. Take the car for a 20 minute drive regularly and see if the problem disappears. This will cost you nothing apart from some extra petrol

If it does, check the date of the battery (usually clearly visible on the battery. If it is old (>5years), just replace it. This is relatively cheap

Good chance your problem is solved at this stage. If not, move onto the other suggestions

Let us know here on the thread how you're getting on!

Not forgotten to let you know, just not bothered sorting it out yet !!!

My knee was playing up so I just left it until today ... and the battery is completely flat !!! So going to charge it today and try it tomorrow morning ...

vodkasoda

vodkasoda wrote: »

Not forgotten to let you know, just not bothered sorting it out yet !!!

My knee was playing up so I just left it until today ... and the battery is completely flat !!! So going to charge it today and try it tomorrow morning ...

OK ... put the newly charged battery & the car started first time (as it normally does!) ... so, does that insinuate that the battery is NOT getting charged by the alternator and is slowly running down, or that there IS a problem with the starter motow, but only when it's freezing outside ?!?!?

I know it's not easy to answer without hands-on but I'm not working and can't afford to replace the battery if there's nothing wrong with it & same goes for the starter motor !!!

Zube

vodkasoda wrote: »

I know it's not easy to answer without hands-on but I'm not working and can't afford to replace the battery if there's nothing wrong with it & same goes for the starter motor !!!

If the battery is going flat, then you have a bad battery, alternator or connections.

If the lights/dash indicate that the battery os OK but the starter sometimes doesn't turn, it could be contacts in the starter motor. As well as tapping the motor, try turning the key and keeping it turned for several seconds: an iffy motor may kick in after a delay (like 5 seconds sometimes).

BnA

Paddy001 wrote: »

Sorry just saw that it was clicking, thats brushes in the starter. A belt of a hammer on the starter should sort that but you need a new one or get yours reconditioned

Not at all Paddy.

The clicking noise that the OP describes is a common symptom of a weak battery. i.e. Not one that is completely flat, but one that hasn't enough charge in it to turn the starter. Like you said, a belt of a hammer would often get it going.

I'm an awful hoor for leavin' the lights on in the car. In fact, I have my wife's car with me today because my own is at home with the exact same clicking noise. I left the lights on last Friday for about an hour (before the postman knocked on the door and told me - fair play to him). All it needs is a jump start and I'm back in action, but I keep forgetting to bring the Jump leads home with me.

Anyway, back to the OP, IMO, the fact that it can be started with Jump Leads completely rules out the starter as the problem. It is almost certainly the battery. And if not that, the Altanator. (orhoweverthehellyouspellit)

If I was the OP, I would :

Find your battery, and top up all the cells with water. One or more cells might have gone dry. Now, ideally, you should probably change the battery if they have been dry for a while because they are probably irreversibly damaged, but topping them up with water can often work and give you another few months or so out of the battery.

If that doesn't work and cash is tight, call into your local scrap yard. You might pick up a second hand battery for 20 or 30 quid.

If that still doesn't work, you probably do have to go to a mechanic.