Noob/Rookie looking for Advice

RichTea

I'm looking to have a gaming rig made. From looking around the internet its pretty clear that buidling your own is apparently the way to do this (with Dell and Alienware charging quite staggering prices for their set-ups). I haven't the foggiest idea of how to go about this at all and have no experience whatsoever

So from looking at Komplett.ie, Dabs.ie and PC World I've come up with some numbers and a wee budgety thing.

Graphics Card - €130.00 - PC World
Memory - €60.25 - Komplett (4 Gb)
Processor -€200
Case - €115
Mainboard - €120


I'm pretty sure I'm missing out on some things and was wondering if there were places where you could have someone put together a compute of the components you bought.

Cheers for any help/advice.

Solitaire

Back later, just one observation: PCWorld is pure fail 90% of the time. Get the graphics card online. What was it anyway? We'll tell you if its a good deal or not

AlmightyCushion

Solitaire wrote: »

Back later, just one observation: PCWorld is pure fail 90% of the time. Get the graphics card online. What was it anyway? We'll tell you if its a good deal or not

Some of their graphics cards are pretty good value at the moment (thread in bargain alerts about it).

RichTea - If you are going to buy online you should probably stay with the one site so as to save on shipping costs

Solitaire

Bargain alerts here or the main retail BA thread? I was in a PCWorld a few days ago and saw a few nice prices (the reason I said they were only 90% fail ) but nothing significantly superior to the interwebs. EDIT: I did see that offending 9800GT, good enough deal now that the etailer prices for nVidia cards have suddenly shifted upward again. But the comparable ATi card, the HD4830, is down around €100 online now on pixmania and HWVS which makes ALL 9800GTs look a bit wet at the mo Besides, a few more quid nets you a considerably superior HD4850

RichTea: Guessing from your post you have something around €600-700 for a budget.

First big question: Do you need anything from the following: monitor, keyboard, mouse, OS license (in other words, a Windows installation. If you haven't got a spare one to transfer from a defunct machine you need to add the ol' Microsoft Tax to the cost of the machine! :rolleyes: )

Assuming "no" to all the above, your little list is missing: A power supply (PSU), a hard drive (HDD) and a DVD burner. I will assume you need all of these (I seriously doubt you'll be able to salvage a modern PSU from another machine) If you want odds and ends like a sound card (not even an issue with Vista) card reader, etc. tell me - otherwise I'll assume you don't want them.

The last big question: Do you intend to learn the arcane black arts of overclocking, or would you want something a bit more plug-n-play? The former is better value for money, the latter a lot less stressful Either path will change the build order a bit...

Assuming the latter I'll ignore the OC side of things and go for immediate power. I notice you've budgeted a lot toward the CPU. Do you want a quad-core? If you really intend to focus on gaming performance with this machine an "ordinary" dual-core CPU is better, simply because most games can't tap the considerable potential of a quad so the extra money is wasted. I'll assume you want a decent dual-core for this build.

Given all those assumptions, a quick guesstimate from hardwareversand.de:



The E8400 is plenty if you don't want to OC - and its great if you do anyway! (so long as your mobo can handle a high FSB...) The Foxconn is excellent value for the price (good OC, FSB1600 and Crossfire potential), the RAM is good (lower stock voltage than most PC8500 which it could OC well beyond anyway if you were bothered) and the case and PSU are excellent considering the price. The only thing I wish was cheaper is the graphics card - €145 is good for a HD4850, but there is better out there. Oh well, at least its a slightly OCd version...

RichTea

Cheers for the help lads

Solitaire wrote: »

Back later, just one observation: PCWorld is pure fail 90% of the time. Get the graphics card online. What was it anyway? We'll tell you if its a good deal or not

It was an Nvidia one mentioned in the Bargain Alerts thread. Think it was a 9800GT. I've heard a lot of negative things about PC World alright, but sure if the price is right here I might as well.

Solitaire wrote: »

RichTea: Guessing from your post you have something around €600-700 for a budget.

First big question: Do you need anything from the following: monitor, keyboard, mouse, OS license (in other words, a Windows installation. If you haven't got a spare one to transfer from a defunct machine you need to add the ol' Microsoft Tax to the cost of the machine! :rolleyes: )

Assuming "no" to all the above, your little list is missing: A power supply (PSU), a hard drive (HDD) and a DVD burner. I will assume you need all of these (I seriously doubt you'll be able to salvage a modern PSU from another machine) If you want odds and ends like a sound card (not even an issue with Vista) card reader, etc. tell me - otherwise I'll assume you don't want them.

Ah forgot about the disc drive. That'd come in handy :pac:. Didn't put in the HDD because I have an external one at home. Didn't think I'd need one but if they're not that expensive a good internal one should be alright then. Sound card and all that shouldn't be an issue either.

Solitaire wrote: »

The last big question: Do you intend to learn the arcane black arts of overclocking, or would you want something a bit more plug-n-play? The former is better value for money, the latter a lot less stressful Either path will change the build order a bit...

Assuming the latter I'll ignore the OC side of things and go for immediate power. I notice you've budgeted a lot toward the CPU. Do you want a quad-core? If you really intend to focus on gaming performance with this machine an "ordinary" dual-core CPU is better, simply because most games can't tap the considerable potential of a quad so the extra money is wasted. I'll assume you want a decent dual-core for this build.

Didn't intend on going down the overclocking route tbh. I could only predict that it would end badly for me. If it meant saving a good deal and bit of a performance boost then I'd say I should really consider it a bit more. It does look plenty complicated.
Didn't realise that about the CPUs either. I presumed they would be expensive and from looking at komplett and elsewhere thats the sort of price I thought I'd be looking at. As you said a good dual core would be perfect though.

Solitaire wrote: »

Given all those assumptions, a quick guesstimate from hardwareversand.de:



The E8400 is plenty if you don't want to OC - and its great if you do anyway! (so long as your mobo can handle a high FSB...) The Foxconn is excellent value for the price (good OC, FSB1600 and Crossfire potential), the RAM is good (lower stock voltage than most PC8500 which it could OC well beyond anyway if you were bothered) and the case and PSU are excellent considering the price. The only thing I wish was cheaper is the graphics card - €145 is good for a HD4850, but there is better out there. Oh well, at least its a slightly OCd version...

Sweet, that looks great. I take it you've used the site? Is it good for support etc?
Many thanks for the help Solitaire, quick question. How easy is it to put together a PC. I have this nightmare scenario of putting it all together, going to turn it on and *nothing*.

VinLieger

Since Hardwareversand are based in germany getting product supports from them isnt very easy but you will get warrantys for every peiece of hardware you buy. They do however generall have the best prices around and delivery is only 30 euro with another 30 for them to put it together for you if you want.
Id deffinitely advise getting an internal HD and as stated above you can get a decent one pretty cheap.
As for putting it all together i built my first one 3 months ago with pieces from HWV and its very easy with the amount of guides available.
The only problem with ordering off HWV is that the only way to do it from Ireland is by money order and some people find it to be too much of a hassle and prefer credit cards. Mine went very smoothly though and there was only a slight problem of a piece not being in stock but it was sorted out very quickly

RichTea

VinLieger wrote: »

Since Hardwareversand are based in germany getting product supports from them isnt very easy but you will get warrantys for every peiece of hardware you buy. They do however generall have the best prices around and delivery is only 30 euro with another 30 for them to put it together for you if you want.
Id deffinitely advise getting an internal HD and as stated above you can get a decent one pretty cheap.
As for putting it all together i built my first one 3 months ago with pieces from HWV and its very easy with the amount of guides available.
The only problem with ordering off HWV is that the only way to do it from Ireland is by money order and some people find it to be too much of a hassle and prefer credit cards. Mine went very smoothly though and there was only a slight problem of a piece not being in stock but it was sorted out very quickly

Excellent, cheers for that. That actually suits my situation quite well too as my good old student credit card is a fierce one for interest and limits. Sounds like it'll be HWV for me. What sort of tools if any do you need if you're putting one of these things together.

VinLieger

Just need a philips head screwdriver, the ones with the magnetic heads are really handy so you arent dropping tiny screws into the case

daveharnett

RichTea wrote: »

How easy is it to put together a PC. I have this nightmare scenario of putting it all together, going to turn it on and *nothing*.

Physically, it is very easy. Everything is modular and designed so that it's impossible to plug anything in incorrectly.

The 'nightmare' scenario which you describe is possible though. Make sure that wherever you are building it has internet access and another computer - for diagnosing problems, downloading up-to-date drivers, firmware etc..

Also, I'd recommend getting to know somebody in a compsys/comp eng/it course who's handy with this stuff, in the unlikely event that you get really stuck.

All that said, don't be put off. It might mean a few days of frustration, but it is very rewarding in the long run - you'll never look back.

Solitaire

Ever played with Lego as a kid? If you did, putting together a PC is almost natural

Sticking points I can think of:

Get whatever 120mm fan you want for the front of the case (that fan on the list might not be to your taste if you dislike LED bling), just bear in mind that those self-tapping screws ("Frankensteins") included with most fans can be a pain unless you have a perfectly fitting philips-head to drive them home. You might want to use these lads instead.

You might need to fiddle with a jumper setting on the motherboard to run the processor at full speed - the E8400 is designed for a 333MHz FSB but most mobos are set to 200MHz at default. Read the manual and it'll tell you where to put the little plastic thingies to run it at 333MHz

I'm almost certain the memory will run without issue as that mobo should run EPPs no problem. If something goes wrong the motherboard might play it safe and drop the RAM down to CL6, reducing speed... ohh about 1%. The very worst that could happen is that the EPP fails for some extraordinary reason and the motherboard decides to run it at 800MHz CL4 instead, but its very unlikely. Hopefully you'll get away with not having to fiddle with the BIOS settings (and if you do... that's what we're for )

And for maximum performance you should ignore the driver disk that comes with the HD4850 and install the latest drivers straight after its installed. Download them from the interwebs the night before on another PC

Bear in mind that the suggested etailer and parts list is just that - a suggestion. You're free to ignore some or all of it, especially if someone else here has a stroke of genius And does anyone know how good the stock 120mm fan on the Coolermaster is? If its as bad as the stock fan that came with my Vento then the OP might need this and a second set of fixings added to the order... :rolleyes:

RichTea

Solitaire wrote: »

Get whatever 120mm fan you want for the front of the case (that fan on the list might not be to your taste if you dislike LED bling), just bear in mind that those self-tapping screws ("Frankensteins") included with most fans can be a pain unless you have a perfectly fitting philips-head to drive them home. You might want to use these lads instead.

You might need to fiddle with a jumper setting on the motherboard to run the processor at full speed - the E8400 is designed for a 333MHz FSB but most mobos are set to 200MHz at default. Read the manual and it'll tell you where to put the little plastic thingies to run it at 333MHz

I'm almost certain the memory will run without issue as that mobo should run EPPs no problem. If something goes wrong the motherboard might play it safe and drop the RAM down to CL6, reducing speed... ohh about 1%. The very worst that could happen is that the EPP fails for some extraordinary reason and the motherboard decides to run it at 800MHz CL4 instead, but its very unlikely. Hopefully you'll get away with not having to fiddle with the BIOS settings (and if you do... that's what we're for )

And for maximum performance you should ignore the driver disk that comes with the HD4850 and install the latest drivers straight after its installed. Download them from the interwebs the night before on another PC

Bear in mind that the suggested etailer and parts list is just that - a suggestion. You're free to ignore some or all of it, especially if someone else here has a stroke of genius And does anyone know how good the stock 120mm fan on the Coolermaster is? If its as bad as the stock fan that came with my Vento then the OP might need this and a second set of fixings added to the order... :rolleyes:

Fantastic advice Solitaire. You've put me on my way anyway. Thanks for that, must have taken some effort. It'll be a few months before any major developments as I recover some funds from Christmas etc. You'll hear from me again I'm sure.

daveharnett wrote: »

Physically, it is very easy. Everything is modular and designed so that it's impossible to plug anything in incorrectly.

The 'nightmare' scenario which you describe is possible though. Make sure that wherever you are building it has internet access and another computer - for diagnosing problems, downloading up-to-date drivers, firmware etc..

Also, I'd recommend getting to know somebody in a compsys/comp eng/it course who's handy with this stuff, in the unlikely event that you get really stuck.

All that said, don't be put off. It might mean a few days of frustration, but it is very rewarding in the long run - you'll never look back.

Sounds pretty encouragin that. I have a mate whos doing Computer Science in DIT, he knows his stuff and his mates there have built a fair few computers in their time I reckon. The long road begins.