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Sup hunters
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10-12-2008 10:49am#1
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Ivan I don't know where you're getting "pvp dps is awful" Im critting for about 5k odd for rune/scourge coupled with bloood, frost and plague for dots, chains for kiting, pet dishes out insane dps.
As for pve well it's just lolable the dps im putting out is INSANE.
We will be nerfed, sadly
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I wish I could summarise an aspect of the game mostly meant for end game whilst being 1/3rd the way through.
Was that pointed at me? I'm not supposed to pvp till I reach lvl80 is it? Ah right. Stupid of me to not have realised that.
EDIT: It'll still suck
I hear Darkfall is coming out in Jan. Been reading up on it. Sounds cool. WoW but with real PvP or something like that.0 -
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DPS implies damage per second. 5k crits != dps. The problem with DK pvp dps is that if you fail to take advantage of your diseases being up; by being kited, or they drop off; because they were dispelled, then you can either waste more runes on reapplying them and wait for next rotation for big damage or you can do significantly lower damage.
Then you need to choose between a snare that is vital to you limiting your kiteability or Icy Touch, which unless talented, is totally ineffective if you cant hit the target.
Deathgrip is great, but it's untalented cooldown means you will like be kited to death before it comes back up again.
All of these things mean DKs need a good class partnership, from a very limited choice, to really shine.
Naturally, all of this is from an Arenas perspective, since BGs are lame.
Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong though, these are just the observations I've made from doing Arenas with a friend and from talking with another DK friend. I havent played the class past 63 and that was in beta...
I find i can only be kited to death by skilled frost mages, yes we have a long CD on death grip but we also have chains of ice which we can spam as long as we have a frost or death rune active. Chains of ice reduces movement speed by 100% and then every second after casting it movement speed is returned in increments of 10%.
Plus depending on the specc we can continue consistently dpsing at range, ice touch, chains of ice (glyphed can grant it damage also) howling blast, blood boil, pestilence and of course death coil if we have the runic power
And Canis mate i think what people mean when refering to your level, is that your level range isnt as populated as the max level. So you will always be bored pvp wise while leveling thus warranting your opinion on wow pvp void, the pvp will pick up alot once you wade into the level 70-80 zones. And if yer talking BG's its the same, unless you fancy joining BG's at low levels and getting owned my the talentless twinks.0 -
And Canis mate i think what people mean when refering to your level, is that your level range isnt as populated as the max level. So you will always be bored pvp wise while leveling thus warranting your opinion on wow pvp void, the pvp will pick up alot once you wade into the level 70-80 zones. And if yer talking BG's its the same, unless you fancy joining BG's at low levels and getting owned my the talentless twinks.
I've had a couple of fights. Some lost, most won. For the most part no one seems to look around them and I've snuck up on most people despite a big red nametag over my head.
I then sic the pet on them and rotate my shots. I die, I resurrect. There's no sense of achievement, no sense of loss.
I've seen raids on SW involving large battles. Jeez what a mess. How do you call and select a primary in a group battle? Trying to locate and click on someone is impossible.
I suppose I'll just wait and see if things pick up once I get to higher levels but without risk I don't see the point of it? Oh and I did an arena battle last night and took out two dudes my level without blinking. I assume once I get higher mana and health management become more critical over time.
On other news dinged 30 and got me a sexy rideable kitty kat last night. Very pleased my self 0 -
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Icy Touch loses to Death coil in terms of damage, unless Icy Touch is heavily talented. Icy Touch loses to Chains of Ice unless heavily talented.I find i can only be kited to death by skilled frost mages, yes we have a long CD on death grip but we also have chains of ice which we can spam as long as we have a frost or death rune active. Chains of ice reduces movement speed by 100% and then every second after casting it movement speed is returned in increments of 10%.
Plus depending on the specc we can continue consistently dpsing at range, ice touch, chains of ice (glyphed can grant it damage also) howling blast, blood boil, pestilence and of course death coil if we have the runic power
And Canis mate i think what people mean when refering to your level, is that your level range isnt as populated as the max level. So you will always be bored pvp wise while leveling thus warranting your opinion on wow pvp void, the pvp will pick up alot once you wade into the level 70-80 zones. And if yer talking BG's its the same, unless you fancy joining BG's at low levels and getting owned my the talentless twinks.
I should probably have clarified my comments but I was more talking about damage than actual DK usefulness in arenas. I think frost dk's will be pretty powerful in arenas but their damage is alot lower than other builds. Other builds will suffer alot to being kited and/or dispels.
It's a trade-off and in anything less than 5 mans, Frost is all I believe to be viable and even then a Prot Warrior replaces you quite easily...
Dont get me wrong, even my dk friends from whom I base most of these opinions on, are still learning the class and things will be mixed up quite abit with the next content patch alone. So things are subject to change.Canis Lupus wrote: »I've had a couple of fights. Some lost, most won. For the most part no one seems to look around them and I've snuck up on most people despite a big red nametag over my head.
I then sic the pet on them and rotate my shots. I die, I resurrect. There's no sense of achievement, no sense of loss.
I've seen raids on SW involving large battles. Jeez what a mess. How do you call and select a primary in a group battle? Trying to locate and click on someone is impossible.
I suppose I'll just wait and see if things pick up once I get to higher levels but without risk I don't see the point of it? Oh and I did an arena battle last night and took out two dudes my level without blinking. I assume once I get higher mana and health management become more critical over time.
On other news dinged 30 and got me a sexy rideable kitty kat last night. Very pleased my self
Calling targets is done by having a main assist. It is the same, essentially, as EvE do it. It's pretty tough to all target the same ship in large scale EvE PvP too without the use of main assists
But yes, a good open PvP fight in EvE, is generally many times better than a similar open PvP fight in EvE.0 -
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Icy Touch loses to Death coil in terms of damage, unless Icy Touch is heavily talented. Icy Touch loses to Chains of Ice unless heavily talented.
I should probably have clarified my comments but I was more talking about damage than actual DK usefulness in arenas. I think frost dk's will be pretty powerful in arenas but their damage is alot lower than other builds. Other builds will suffer alot to being kited and/or dispels.
It's a trade-off and in anything less than 5 mans, Frost is all I believe to be viable and even then a Prot Warrior replaces you quite easily...
Dont get me wrong, even my dk friends from whom I base most of these opinions on, are still learning the class and things will be mixed up quite abit with the next content patch alone. So things are subject to change.
Calling targets is done by having a main assist. It is the same, essentially, as EvE do it. It's pretty tough to all target the same ship in large scale EvE PvP too without the use of main assists
But yes, a good open PvP fight in EvE, is generally many times better than a similar open PvP fight in EvE.
Yes Death coil does better damage than icy touch, but death coil costs 40 runic power whereas icy touch gives a disease and damage and also grants you runic power, i think it gives like 10 or 15 runic power. So no reason not to cast it
But yes of course the next patch is going to require me to change my spell rotations and general pve tanking tactics which i only kinda got used to over the last 2 days 0 -
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I hope you're talking about only tanking here, and not for plain dps output in heroics and raids. I'll have you know with the right class mechanic knowledge and a good rune rotation we easily top the dps scale regarding melee, the only thing that comes close are ret pallys, and BM hunters as we all know do insane amounts of damage.
I have been, and always will be talking about PvP. 5v5s, 3v3s and 2v2s.
Yes, PvE DK dps is very competitive. I've already stated I believe that to be the case.Yes Death coil does better damage than icy touch, but death coil costs 40 runic power whereas icy touch gives a disease and damage and also grants you runic power, i think it gives like 10 or 15 runic power. So no reason not to cast it
But yes of course the next patch is going to require me to change my spell rotations and general pve tanking tactics which i only kinda got used to over the last 2 days
Depending on spec, Runes are generally vastly more important than Runic power.0
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