Dundalk Leader article about shopping up North

amacachi

You've never read economics have you?

bigneacy

amacachi wrote: »

You've never read economics have you?

Don't be so rude. Don't you know a free-market economy is where we have to shop where we are told?

ssmith6287

I know what you mean more demand the higher the price but how can you expect retailers and shops to actually pay more for their products, pay staff more, pay higher rates, pay higher VAT, basically pay as much as double the northern equivelant and then have people expect to completely cut the margin and sell stuff for nothing.

The company im working for now has quite a strong presence in the uk and is branching into ireland and the cost is just so big, paying the same in rates on west street in drogheda as you would in Limerick or Cork city.

And before you say if the company can sell it for x amount in the north they can sell it for the same in the south. It's just not true. And unfortunately suppliers see an Irish and Uk company even though its the 1 company. Ireland has a population of what 4 million, Im not even gonna hazard a guess at the uk.

Don't blame retailers and shops as much as blaming greedy suppliers.

positron

ssmith6287 wrote: »

I know what you mean more demand the higher the price but how can you expect retailers and shops to actually pay more for their products, pay staff more, pay higher rates, pay higher VAT, basically pay as much as double the northern equivelant and then have people expect to completely cut the margin and sell stuff for nothing.

I am not taking sides, but in an ideal market-economics scenario, the shops will have to understand the situation on the ground, and push their suppliers to reduce their prices, or stop buying from them. Its that or they should probably just stop trading as business. I know that's not great news from anyone, but that's the harsh reality, really.

ssmith6287

Oh I agree but unfortunately that rarely happens. My point is you cant have your cake and eat it.

Shop up the north and have no complaints about your taxes etc getting higher.

Or shop down here and try help stabilise our shamble of an economy.

hellboy99

ssmith6287 wrote: »

I know what you mean more demand the higher the price but how can you expect retailers and shops to actually pay more for their products, pay staff more, pay higher rates, pay higher VAT, basically pay as much as double the northern equivelant and then have people expect to completely cut the margin and sell stuff for nothing.

The company im working for now has quite a strong presence in the uk and is branching into ireland and the cost is just so big, paying the same in rates on west street in drogheda as you would in Limerick or Cork city.

And before you say if the company can sell it for x amount in the north they can sell it for the same in the south. It's just not true. And unfortunately suppliers see an Irish and Uk company even though its the 1 company. Ireland has a population of what 4 million, Im not even gonna hazard a guess at the uk.

Don't blame retailers and shops as much as blaming greedy suppliers.

According to our lovely FF government the cost of living and rates have come down :rolleyes:

ssmith6287

Thrust me I don't condone FF and I know my price of living hasnt come down, if anything its gone up. But I don't do my shopping in a foreign country, I keep pretty much all my money in this country so I have right to say what I feel should be done with it.

If i was funding the british govnt then I'd be a hypocrite. When evryone here starts working for €5 an hour, the dole is cut to €120 a week and child benefit becomes little or nothing then I'm sure the savings could be passed on to retailers who in turn can lower their prices.

hellboy99

ssmith6287 wrote: »

I'm sure the savings could be passed on to retailers who in turn can lower their prices.

As if that will ever happen. I've worked in retail in the past and one place I worked there was big profits being made. Over a period of time there was a fall in customers and management wondered why and what was done to bring custom back, absolutely nothing.

ssmith6287

I also worked in retail for a long time and if we got an incentive e.g cheaper products because of a bulk buy then the price would certainly come down, much to my annoyance when I was a salesman.

Problem is, retailers cant buy in bulk because they know theyll struggle to shift it, so they cant push suppliers for better deals. Cruel circle

It annoys me that people thnk that retailers here are just saying phook it well charge what we want. There is a lot of competition in this country without competing with a foreign country. Market share is a big deal, if retailers could take a massive hit in order to gain business in the long run then I'm sure they would.

But back on topic, I for one won't shop in the north. and I'd love to see something like butter vouchers come back so my tax money couldnt b spent up there either

positron

ssmith6287 wrote: »

I also worked in retail for a long time and if we got an incentive e.g cheaper products because of a bulk buy then the price would certainly come down, much to my annoyance when I was a salesman.

IMHO, a large number of retailers in the south, even in the border towns like Drogheda and Dundalk are still seems to retain the "couldn't care less" attitude to clients. This is based on my personal experience on shopping on both sides of the border and I can point out a large number of shop management & staff from Drogheda who could benefit from a weeks' training to North to learn how to treat your customers and how to behave professionally. Newry / North not only offers better value, they are also much more pleasant and professional to deal with. IThere's a lot unlearning of bad habits here in South before they can really compete with North.

ssmith6287

Oh I whole heartedly agree, likewise managers in the north do. Ive worked for some great people who would bend over backwards for the customer and some bad guys who would basically tell em to phook off. But you get that everywhere. Sure look at hospitality in Ireland, here in the east esp the pale there is no such thing. Go to Kerry, Cork, Galway and they are so polite and friendly. Customer service needs to be improved all over here, but not everybody can be painted with 1 brush.

E.g of good manager in my opinion. 1 that trusts the staff to make their own decisions, who realises that loosing today could gain over time, and that will welcome and greet a man in a tracksuit the same as a guy in an armani suit.

I go up the north in my adidas track bottoms, rugby jersey and runners with my euros and I'll get plenty of tuts. Certainly in Newry they aint that friendly and they actually come across as quite aggressive. Try challenging a currys staff member, great craic

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Bottom line with me (and I have no retail involvement) is if you shop in the North then don't complain about job losses, budget cuts or any other aspect of the economy here.
Before the recent Donegal By Election a punter on radio said the main issue for him was Jobs, Jobs, and Jobs for the area. Asked about the recession he said they weren't as badly hit as other areas as they could shop over the border. FFS catch yourselves on.

It's shortsighted to spend your money outside our own economy. I know people have to get value, service etc but there is a cost to it all.

ssmith6287

+1

positron

Maison Worried Storage wrote: »

Bottom line with me (and I have no retail involvement) is if you shop in the North then don't complain about job losses, budget cuts or any other aspect of the economy here.

I beg to disagree. I am already paying 50+% of whatever I get to the economy, and then another 20-30% on bills and other various bits and pieces. My shopping north is probably 5% of my total spending! Are you saying spending 5% in North takes away my right to complain for jobs, infrastructure etc, despite I spending 80% of my income here?

To me, the substandard service you get when you shop locally (that I do most of the time actually - I haven't been to North in 6 months) makes me really wonder if the businesses are really suffering as much pain as they claim they are suffering down here? I am sure some have. But there's plenty more out there who don't seem have realized there's a recession on, and that their customers are struggling too. While I feel sorry for the businesses that are suffering, may be there are opportunities out there (to bring some competition to the businesses that are still f*ckless). I could be wrong, but this is how I feel at the moment.


PS: Now that I think about it, I am probably spending 1-2% in north.

bigneacy

positron wrote: »

I beg to disagree. I am already paying 50+% of whatever I get to the economy, and then another 20-30% on bills and other various bits and pieces. My shopping north is probably 5% of my total spending! Are you saying spending 5% in North takes away my right to complain for jobs, infrastructure etc, despite I spending 80% of my income here?

To me, the substandard service you get when you shop locally (that I do most of the time actually - I haven't been to North in 6 months) makes me really wonder if the businesses are really suffering as much pain as they claim they are suffering down here? I am sure some have. But there's plenty more out there who don't seem have realized there's a recession on, and that their customers are struggling too. While I feel sorry for the businesses that are suffering, may be there are opportunities out there (to bring some competition to the businesses that are still f*ckless). I could be wrong, but this is how I feel at the moment.


PS: Now that I think about it, I am probably spending 1-2% in north.

imo that's your argument blown to smithereens, Srameen. Positron isn't special - thats a sensible breakdown of his spending which would be similar to anyone elses who shops up north.

hellboy99

Maison Worried Storage wrote: »

Bottom line with me (and I have no retail involvement) is if you shop in the North then don't complain about job losses, budget cuts or any other aspect of the economy here.

So if you've lost your job, took the hit with welfare etc..., struggling to pay your mortgage or rent, pay your bills and feed your family. What are you going to say to those that are going up north to get their weekly shop to feed their family and the savings they make pay the bills. Would you rather they shop down here and not pay their bills.

What do you want people struggling to make ends meet to do ? It's not their fault our economy is in a mess, it's not their fault there is now less income coming into the household and the cost of living is still going up, what is the government doing for them ? We heard the finance minister not so long ago crying out to the Irish people to be patriotic and to shop in the south and what did he do, raise VAT. What has FF done with this budget to help things, cuts in welfare, drop the minimum wage, poll tax, raise petrol and diesel, water rates to be introduced etc... Hows lowering the amount of money people have to spend, driving people up north and decreasing revenue here going to help matters ?

positron

hellboy99 wrote: »

.. and what did he do, raise VAT.

One of the dumbest things from the continuous stream of hot thick lava like horse manure that's been flowing out of our Government's finance department! One would have thought they have learned a lesson from their own hugely successful strategy of low corporate taxes, that reducing taxes boosts business? IMHO (and an uneducated one at that), they should have reduced the VAT to 15%, which would have boosted overall volume of transactions in the state, and the increase in trade *might* have brought more tax over all, when taking into consideration facts like increased trade means higher employment, which again brings in more tax, and less welfare payouts..! Sigh..!! (I could be wrong - I have no facts or figures on this... just ranting really).

opticalens

I would just like to point out the fact that last year dundalk business community got together to produce a leaflet/advertisement encouraging people to shop local. This leaflet/ad was printed in the north, their reasoning was that it was cheaper...........

hellboy99

opticalens wrote: »

I would just like to point out the fact that last year dundalk business community got together to produce a leaflet/advertisement encouraging people to shop local. This leaflet/ad was printed in the north, their reasoning was that it was cheaper...........

And the council have done it too.

positron

opticalens wrote: »

I would just like to point out the fact that last year dundalk business community got together to produce a leaflet/advertisement encouraging people to shop local. This leaflet/ad was printed in the north, their reasoning was that it was cheaper...........

Did this really happen? Stand up comedians couldn't come up with stuff this good!!

hellboy99

positron wrote: »

Did this really happen? Stand up comedians couldn't come up with stuff this good!!

It is true. It's laughable, the very people complaining and telling you to shop local and they themselves go up north, even recent road works done in the town were done by a northern crowd. Bunch of hypocrites.

ssmith6287

VAT increases : Complete joke, altough not for couple of years. The UK is raising theres, we should try be on a near enough par.

What the government does for the people : €200 a week, free healthcare, free landline, discounted heating, discounted elect, rent allowance mmmm yeah thats not enough !!! I work full time and do about 10 hours unpaid overtime, takes an hour and a half too and from work, what do I get?? I get taxed higher to pay this high rate of "free money"

Leaflet: I must say im disgusted

Minimum wage: This does not effect anybody on min wage, This is seriously annoying listening to do gooders prob making massive money saying god help the poor min wage people. The only people this effects is people coming into min wage jobs, It's a job at the end of the day. If it means a company will come in and create 200 jobs then its a good thing.

Finally this its not my fault crap.... I went to college for 4 years, studied hospitality management. ar5e fell outta that market, I retrained. It's called initiative. If people would stop feeling sorry for themselves and get up and do something then it'd make the world better.

And before you start giving out, I was working, lost my job. Signed on, got €150 a week, went to college and retrained, took a min wage job, worked very hard and got promoted to a diff company. Im on an ok wage now, not great but im not complaining. Took 4 years since I got the min wage job to get my current job. people expect evrything to be handed to em nowadays, DO SOMETHING

Sorry got a bit off topic but this doom and gloom craic is really annoying

amacachi

ssmith6287 wrote: »

VAT increases : Complete joke, altough not for couple of years. The UK is raising theres, we should try be on a near enough par.

What the government does for the people : €200 a week, free healthcare, free landline, discounted heating, discounted elect, rent allowance mmmm yeah thats not enough !!! I work full time and do about 10 hours unpaid overtime, takes an hour and a half too and from work, what do I get?? I get taxed higher to pay this high rate of "free money"

Leaflet: I must say im disgusted

Minimum wage: This does not effect anybody on min wage, This is seriously annoying listening to do gooders prob making massive money saying god help the poor min wage people. The only people this effects is people coming into min wage jobs, It's a job at the end of the day. If it means a company will come in and create 200 jobs then its a good thing.

Finally this its not my fault crap.... I went to college for 4 years, studied hospitality management. ar5e fell outta that market, I retrained. It's called initiative. If people would stop feeling sorry for themselves and get up and do something then it'd make the world better.

And before you start giving out, I was working, lost my job. Signed on, got €150 a week, went to college and retrained, took a min wage job, worked very hard and got promoted to a diff company. Im on an ok wage now, not great but im not complaining. Took 4 years since I got the min wage job to get my current job. people expect evrything to be handed to em nowadays, DO SOMETHING

Sorry got a bit off topic but this doom and gloom craic is really annoying

Really don't know where to start with that.
Most obvious thing to point out is that there are very few people under pension age who get that much from the state and a mate of mine was sent to hospital from college a few weeks ago (for stomach pains, the health service in his college is well worth its funding eh? :rolleyes: ) and has a 100 quid bill over his head, possibly more to come because they seem to flip a coin to decide whether to charge people for x-rays etc. He has a medical card. Free healthcare yeah?
Also "the government" does nothing for people, the state does, and it's currently doing it with money that isn't its own.

While I'd love to see the state butt the hell out it undermines an argument when things like "free healthcare" are thrown around, there's a lot of other things they should butt out of before healthcare.


My favorite thing about the leaflets though was when (I think it was the Chamber of Commerce did it first) they were challenged they said something along the lines of "Well all the leaflets say is to shop wherever's cheapest, which is what we did." Did they think that people were going over the border because it was more expensive? When one sees the kind of idiocy and money wasted across all sectors of this country it's no wonder we got to where we are now. Also my dad mentioned that either RTE or TV3 compared a basket of goods between different places in the North and the South and the south was cheaper, I wonder how long it took them to find enough such items to fill a "basket". :pac:

I'll always shop wherever suits me best, and barring the EU changing their minds about freedom of movement of people and goods and services I intend to do selected shopping over the border.

ssmith6287

Like I said in a previous post if you EARN money you have the right to do as you wish, altough my preferance would be to keep it in the south. I just don't like people on the scratch who give out about lack of jobs, no money in the country and their dole being cut when theyre taking our money and spending it in another country. Don't get me wrong I appreciate people have families but as someone said before why not shop in aldi or lidl. If I can't afford a pair of levis I buy in Dunnes. I started my full time working career just as the sh1t was hitting the fan, before that I worked in a pub with a big trade mainly of builders. These guys would cash their thousand euro a week cheques and start drinking and gambling it. Now theyre giving out they have no money. I know not everybody is the same but thats my experience. I have family and friends from the building trade who saved a bit, now theyre just getting on with it. I've never been a high earner so i feel I appreciate my money.

I know I come across as cold but I just say as I see, I don't like the PC world we're forced to live in.

jezko

35Euro for a pre ordered fresh 3.6 kilo Turkey that was due to be 18 euro but due to supply issues had to sourced else where.... take it or leave it ... With this attitude are you surprised people shop else where... It's difficult to travel ... but not impossible... The tiger days are over and I will be a scrouge if I want to be!!! Bah humbug ...Rant over ... I Wonder Why don't I feel festive today?