Lisbon II: the real issue

Cantab.

It's not:
- abortion
- neutrality and defence
- taxation
- the EU commissioner

(all perfectly valid reasons to vote 'No')

But what really troubles the Irish people is the undermining of national sovereignty. Nowhere is this being discussed, yet this is the very reason we need to have a referendum in the first place: it's precisely because the Lisbon Treaty supersedes Bunreacht na hEireann.

I'll be voting 'No' until I get assurances on sovereignty. We're getting assurances on everything else, so they can tack that one on to the list.

Or, is the Lisbon Treaty really about the Zionist Elites' plan to take over Europe and force us to participate in a re-invented globalist economy that will undoubtedly emerge from the forthcoming financial chaos? (A crisis that's purposely engineered for the very purpose of bringing about the the Zionist agenda).

Darragh29

I'm voting no because it is clear that these people can't be trusted. This treaty is so convoluted that you wouldn't know what it could be used to put in place a few years down the road.

Give me a short, understandable and objective treaty, along the lines of our own constitution and I'll vote yes. Give me something that appears to be so utterly complicated for only one purpose, so that no person can actually understand it, and I'll vote no...

Moriarty

Cantab. wrote: »

It's not:
- abortion
- neutrality and defence
- taxation
- the EU commissioner

(all perfectly valid reasons to vote 'No')

LOL

You're an idiot. Pure and simple.

Tabloid rabblerabble reply to a tabloid rabblerabble thread. If you don't like it, post something that's based on fact. Idiot.

Nodin

Cantab. wrote: »

Or, is the Lisbon Treaty really about the Zionist Elites' plan to take over Europe and force us to participate in a re-invented globalist economy that will undoubtedly emerge from the forthcoming financial chaos? (A crisis that's purposely engineered for the very purpose of bringing about the the Zionist agenda).

I'm relatively new here, and havent the time at the moment to go through your posting history. Therefore I must ask - are you taking the piss?

irish_bob

there were very few true believers on the NO side last time out , most people who voted no did so either because they couldnt understand it or because they were pissed off at the recession and wanted to lash out at something , as ive said before , had the referendum been held in 2006 , it would have sailed through
whether it will pass the next time , i dont know , thier are a significant number of rebels without a cause in this country and with the economy even worse now , thier will be a sizeable number who will go nuts and shoot themselves in thier other foot

seamus

Cantab. wrote: »

It's not:
- abortion
- neutrality and defence
- taxation
- the EU commissioner

(all perfectly valid reasons to vote 'No')

None of these issues are even mentioned in Lisbon. Lisbon has no power to make any changes to our current position on these issues. Therefore they are not valid reasons to vote "No" at all.

it's precisely because the Lisbon Treaty supersedes Bunreacht na hEireann.

It "supersedes" it no more than the Nice treaty does right now, and no more than every other EU treaty has superseded our constitution since the late 1970's. Again, Lisbon says nothing about removing sovereignity (?) from nations, it has no remit in that regard. In fact, it provides for a Union where the autonomy of the member states is even more solidified than it is now. It even provides a mechanism for *leaving* the union?
Surely if the aim was to take control from member states, it would contain a clause forbidding anyone from leaving?

Please provide evidence that the big, bad EU is planning to control us from Brussels.

Oh, and within this evidence, the following phrases (and all derivatives and synonyms) are disallowed: "Zionists", "Socialists", "New world order", "Political Elite", "1984", "Mind control", "globalism".

cavedave

irish_bob

there were very few true believers on the NO side last time out ,

Same can be said about the YES side.

Oh, and within this evidence, the following phrases (and all derivatives and synonyms) are disallowed: "Zionists", "Socialists", "New world order", "Political Elite", "1984", "Mind control", "globalism".

In fairness until the Zionist rant is explained as trying to get a reasonable explanation of anything else said is like pushing on a string.

oscarBravo

Thread closed. There's a forum for this kind of nonsense, and it isn't this or any of its subfora.

OP, if you want to discuss the Lisbon treaty, go to the EU forum and join in one of the conversations there. If you post any more of that Zionist agenda crap, it will be deleted and you will be banned.

Moriarty banned for a week for personal abuse.