The ProEvo v Fifa Debate continues

Private Dancer

I prefer FIFA online but i prefer PRO EVO offline.

Although saying that, Konami need to do something special for 2010 otherwise its game over for them and Pro Evo!

all is violent

Fifa 2009 is way better than PES 2009. I had PES first, got extremely bored and frustrated with it so i traded it in and got Fifa. I think the new fifa is much more realistic and of course the structure to the career mode is way better in fifa.

Bren1609

Bren1609 wrote: »

Keith, what did you make of FIFA 09? Im thinking of picking it up today, same as you in that Im browned off with PES for the following reasons.

1. Licencing: In previous versions it was tolerated due to gameplay. But now its tiresome having to rename all the premiership teams and International teams, update option files etc etc.

2. Online lag is disgraceful.

3. Gameplay is not as good as previous versions and the way a player can dribble and wiggle from one end of the pitch to the other is ridiculous and totally unrealistic. Looks like a game of pac man watching Messi run around in circles.

4. Player condition and fatigue: Again, totally unrealistic, lucky to get one full game out of your players without them getting injured, tired or poor condition.

5. Player ratings: Cannot judge how well a player is rated? is it based on goals passes, distanec covered and its totally inconsistent.

6. Master League: More to do with licencing but they could at least sort out the leagues instead of manually having to put teams in the correct league so that Man U are not in the same division are Werder Bremer.

7. Complacency: Ultimately this will be PES downfall. Konami and PES had a huge and loyal cult following for years, I personally have been playing the game since the ISS series and for years customers have been telling Konami to sort out the licencing and lag. Konami didnt listen and now customers are leaving PES in droves to jump ship to FIFA.

I'm going to buy FIFA 09 today and I'll repost my verdict later in the week.

Following up on my previous post, I’m not overly enamoured with FIFA 09 for the following reasons:

1. No master league mode. I know they have that new mode which is supposed to be similar but I started to play it and it looked so long winded to set up and with trading cards and contract etc I didn’t even get past the first game.
2. No World Cup!!! WTF!!
3. No European Cup!
4. No Champions League!
5. No International tournaments at all
6. The writing on the menu screens is small and with the background being black it’s very difficult to read.
7. Sorry but gameplay is not all that great. Similar situation to PES 2009 in that there are a few great players in the game that you cant get the ball off i.e Torres & Ronaldo.
8. No online lag which is one up on PES however I’ve gotten to the stage where I’ve given up on online because so many people quit the game and everyone only plays with Man U, Barca or Liverpool. That’s why I found the computer game modes so disappointing.

In summary, two disappointing football games. PES has failed to capitalise on previous versions and FIFA is still that bit off par.

miralize

I had PES09 in november and i was happy at the start, the online play was barely tolerable.. Got fifa in December.. so much better. Fifa has regained the lead.

It just offers so much more than Pro, and its looking like Konami is doing nothing innovative.. I had to trade in my PES because I never play it anymore...

Keith186

Bren1609 wrote: »

Keith, what did you make of FIFA 09? Im thinking of picking it up today, same as you in that Im browned off with PES for the following reasons.

1. Licencing: In previous versions it was tolerated due to gameplay. But now its tiresome having to rename all the premiership teams and International teams, update option files etc etc.

2. Online lag is disgraceful.

3. Gameplay is not as good as previous versions and the way a player can dribble and wiggle from one end of the pitch to the other is ridiculous and totally unrealistic. Looks like a game of pac man watching Messi run around in circles.

4. Player condition and fatigue: Again, totally unrealistic, lucky to get one full game out of your players without them getting injured, tired or poor condition.

5. Player ratings: Cannot judge how well a player is rated? is it based on goals passes, distanec covered and its totally inconsistent.

6. Master League: More to do with licencing but they could at least sort out the leagues instead of manually having to put teams in the correct league so that Man U are not in the same division are Werder Bremer.

7. Complacency: Ultimately this will be PES downfall. Konami and PES had a huge and loyal cult following for years, I personally have been playing the game since the ISS series and for years customers have been telling Konami to sort out the licencing and lag. Konami didnt listen and now customers are leaving PES in droves to jump ship to FIFA.

I'm going to buy FIFA 09 today and I'll repost my verdict later in the week.

Sorry for the delay in replying man.

It's too late now to stop you unfortunately.
FIFA is absolute muck as far as I'm concerned. I gave it a good chance and it's still as crap as it ever was, especially in gameplay terms in my opinion.

A god awful horrible game, do not buy.

I'm actually only getting round to trading it back in right now. Gotta go, will post back how much I got for it in xtra vision, give me about half hour!

PS: Sorry Pro Evo, I never should have doubted you even though you gave me enough reasons too.


EDIT: Ha ha, just seen you post now Bren as I searched my own name to update thread and seen your first post.

Ye know what they say - 'Great minds think alike'.

Glad you think its crap too.

noodler

Keith186 wrote: »

Sorry for the delay in replying man.

It's too late now to stop you unfortunately.
FIFA is absolute muck as far as I'm concerned. I gave it a good chance and it's still as crap as it ever was, especially in gameplay terms in my opinion.

A god awful horrible game, do not buy.

I'm actually only getting round to trading it back in right now. Gotta go, will post back how much I got for it in xtra vision, give me about half hour!

PS: Sorry Pro Evo, I never should have doubted you even though you gave me enough reasons too.


EDIT: Ha ha, just seen you post now Bren as I searched my own name to update thread and seen your first post.

Ye know what they say - 'Great minds think alike'.

Glad you think its crap too.

Still persevering with Pro Evo but I fear that my sentiments on trying Fifa will exactly mirror your own.

It is still excellent in offline 2 player.

Grey Fox

-Kaka is untackleable
-the through ball button is in fact the "pass directly to a member of the other team" button
-your players go nuts and jog off in the opposite direction to the ball for some reason
-the passing is really bad

Definitely gettin Fifa next year

Keith186

Got €16 for Fifa in xtra vision.

-Kaka is untackleable
-the through ball button is in fact the "pass directly to a member of the other team" button
-your players go nuts and jog off in the opposite direction to the ball for some reason
-the passing is really bad

Definitely gettin Fifa next year

Yeah it has it's bad points but it's the best both games. Go and buy Fifa next year but be warned it's not half as much fun as pro evo.

BeeSee

Keith186 wrote: »

Go and buy Fifa next year but be warned it's not half as much fun as pro evo.

friend of mine raised an interesting point with me before, said how pes 6 (which i think most agree was the best game for its time) was very arcadey, BUT a very enjoyable fun game, the most i ever enjoyed anyways. but that how pes now are trying to go into a more simulation style game.

which game would people say is more simulation more arcade now out of curiosity? FIFA or PES? i'm guessing FIFA is seen as the simulation and PES the less so, leaning towards arcade.

so in my complete roundabout way what i'm basically tryin to say is:

should PES go back to/become a true arcade game?

ok so there might be funny score lines but isn't it more fun? i taught pes6 was brilliant for its time, just long as ya decreased adriano's shooting stats.

noodler

BeeSee wrote: »

friend of mine raised an interesting point with me before, said how pes 6 (which i think most agree was the best game for its time) was very arcadey, BUT a very enjoyable fun game, the most i ever enjoyed anyways. but that how pes now are trying to go into a more simulation style game.

which game would people say is more simulation more arcade now out of curiosity? FIFA or PES? i'm guessing FIFA is seen as the simulation and PES the less so, leaning towards arcade.

so in my complete roundabout way what i'm basically tryin to say is:

should PES go back to/become a true arcade game?

ok so there might be funny score lines but isn't it more fun? i taught pes6 was brilliant for its time, just long as ya decreased adriano's shooting stats.

I couldn't disagree more. PES has always (until recently) been the sim for me and FIFA the arcade version.

BeeSee

noodler wrote: »

I couldn't disagree more. PES has always (until recently) been the sim for me and FIFA the arcade version.

what time scale you mean when talking about recently, as in PES09 and FIFA09?

if pes has until recently been the sim do you mean that currently fifa is more of a sim?

i'm not sayin that pes 6 at the time was the arcade game of the two. cant remember if i played fifa06 but i'd imagine it was more arcadey than pes6. i think fifa changed their strategy a couple years ago, was complete arcade rubbish for years and years.

what i'm tryin to say that if you now compared pes09 and pes6, pes6 is more arcadey.

what i'm also tryin to say that currently, fifa seems more of a sim than pes.

i'm not sayin a prefer fifa, i have pes, cant see myself buying fifa09 now, but when i played fifa i think there was more build up play and then look for the killer pass, where as pes seems more like end to end stuff.

crisco10

Okay. Have bought every Pro Ev since PES. Went out this year and got Fifa 09. Also felt like a traitor.

It took me awhile to get into Fifa and how it works if you know what I mean and I do play with the controller configured to Pro Ev controls. But once I got it, how to appreciate the space in Fifa etc, it was stunning. And so varied. There are very few moves that you find yourself repeating in games.

I temporarily lost Fifa so took the opportunity to go and get PES 2009. And what can I say. Pro Ev is sooo far behind now.

I agree with previous posters that the writing in Fifa is myopia inducing.

The lack of Master League is annoying. But starting with Accrington Stanley in Fifa and taking them to the champions league final is a pretty good replacement.

Be a Pro is so much more playable than Become a legend. That close in camera that shakes etc in Fifa adds a whole dimension to the game.

The licences. This has never bothered me before but when I played Fifa, it was a lot nicer to play Arsenal v Bolton instead of North London v Middlebrook.

TBH, I don't find myself sitting in front of Pro Ev for hours on end like I used to. Where as Fifa has wasted many nights for me.

I hope Konami get their act together because I think they are more talented programmers than EA, but FIFA 09 >> PES 2009 for me.

curry-muff

Fifa is improving but itll be another 2/3 years before it reaches pro evos standard

Fingleberries

curry-muff wrote: »

Fifa is improving but itll be another 2/3 years before it reaches pro evos standard

... Unless PES keeps regressing as it has over the last couple of years

Kirby

Base games on their merits, not on fanboyism. Pro evo is nowhere near as good as it once was. This years fifa is leaps and bounds ahead of it. There shouldn't even be a debate this year..... its obvious to everyone.

Buy the best game, not the brand. Go where the best game is and it shouldnt matter whether the name is pro evo or fifa. People are too quick to hitch their flags to a brand. Last years star was fifa.....by several lengths. Konami may make the better game this year. We shall wait an see.

Fingleberries

Kirby wrote: »

Base games on their merits, not on fanboyism. Pro evo is nowhere near as good as it once was. This years fifa is leaps and bounds ahead of it. There shouldn't even be a debate this year..... its obvious to everyone.

Buy the best game, not the brand. Go where the best game is and it shouldnt matter whether the name is pro evo or fifa. People are too quick to hitch their flags to a brand. Last years star was fifa.....by several lengths. Konami may make the better game this year. We shall wait an see.

Very good point ... Well said, that man...

NeoKubrick

Kirby wrote: »

Base games on their merits, not on fanboyism. Pro evo is nowhere near as good as it once was. This years fifa is leaps and bounds ahead of it. There shouldn't even be a debate this year..... its obvious to everyone.

Buy the best game, not the brand. Go where the best game is and it shouldnt matter whether the name is pro evo or fifa. People are too quick to hitch their flags to a brand. Last years star was fifa.....by several lengths. Konami may make the better game this year. We shall wait an see.

Frankly, going to magazines and online reviews for your opinion is just as worse. Read:

I think that a few puppets here really need to cut off the strings attached to their bodies. First of all, primarily you all read reviews and copy what they tell you, and I hate to break it to you but magazines, rags and online sites are courted by both EA and Konami (Konami paid for a press junket in Rome for a ****-load of journalists), and while it's not explicitly stated, it's implicit that if you are courted by a developer or publisher as a journalist, they expect repayment (no such thing as a free lunch - sit back in ****ing wonderment).

It doesn't really matter that most of the review scores are biased, because anyone who understands competitive gaming knows that you won't find out how good a game is competitively (which is the most important part of most sports games) until months after it's released. Thus, the process of reviewing a football game a month before release or after release is a null and void process in determining how deep the gameplay is (and don't forget that reviewers have very little time with review codes: they have a deadline to meet), and it makes any statement along the lines of 'FIFA 09 is better than PES 2008' not worth the bandwidth or paper it's hosted/published on.

EA Sports' aim has been to copy Pro Evolution Soccer's gameplay; if you read between the lines, that's an admittance on Electronic Arts' part that Konami's version of football is superior. PES's gameplay has been fine-tuned over seven iterations (soon to be eight), which is roughly eight or nine years of development (not to mention the years of development on the ISS series). So, the statement that FIFA caught up with PES last year is illogical based upon the simplest factor: time. How can the imitation surpass the original? How can a developer improve gameplay it copied off of another developer more than the actual developer who created the gameplay? It simply doesn't make sense.

The range of modes offered by the FIFA series has always been far superior than the PES series' (exception being the Master League up until the point FIFA copied it). So, nothing has really changed there and I don't think **** about that fact proves the superiority of the gameplay (a separate element) in FIFA 09.


I will buy PES 2009, because it will be same as PES 2008 with a year of tweaks and fine-tuning the gameplay et cetera. Hopefully, the tweaks make it a better game, and they usually do. I may buy FIFA 09 if the online team games prove attractive enough, but that will be probably the only reason to buy it this year. Last year, If you wanted a watered-down and ungraceful version of PES, you bought the FIFA series and I don't foresee that changing this year.


Journalists' and publishing companies' opinions are bought and paid for; your opinion isn't. You're in a position to post the truth; they aren't. But it's the same with Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo online lackeys (read: fanboys): defending the respective company without even being on their payroll.

Vic Vinegar

curry-muff wrote: »

Fifa is improving but itll be another 2/3 years before it reaches pro evos standard

Ha ha!

That's funny.

Kirby

curry-muff wrote: »

Fifa is improving but itll be another 2/3 years before it reaches pro evos standard

koHd

Kirby wrote: »

Base games on their merits, not on fanboyism. Pro evo is nowhere near as good as it once was. This years fifa is leaps and bounds ahead of it. There shouldn't even be a debate this year..... its obvious to everyone.

Buy the best game, not the brand. Go where the best game is and it shouldnt matter whether the name is pro evo or fifa. People are too quick to hitch their flags to a brand. Last years star was fifa.....by several lengths. Konami may make the better game this year. We shall wait an see.

This.

givyjoe81

Iv been a pro evo for years since ISS on the megadrive in fact, for the simple reason it was the best footie game around simple as...

However now, its simply the WORST footie game around... AFAIK though there is only two! FIFA and the trype that is pro evolution 'cutback pinball' 2009. Even if there were fifty to choose from i think this muck would be bottom of the pile.

They have consistently made the game worse since pro evo 6 and this load of baloobas is the pre cursor the final nail in the coffin next year, although how they can make this any worse is just a mystery.

Another mystery is how on earth they havent fixed the lad issue? One one pro evo game I have ever played online hasnt been totally ruined by lag is pro evo six on the 360... wtf??? Crazy goings on with the goalkeepers, lunatic passing by the best players in the game and 'the untouchables' of kaka, messi and ronaldo make this game a complete nonsense...The very fact that this forum has been taken over by Fifa, by many people who used to love pro evo says it all. Game over.:mad:

devereaux17

look i just dont find fifa very interesting, the players are too heavy(i admit pes players seem a bit light as well) and fifa 09 doesnt even come close to pes6.

i hate the dribbling in fifa, but i do love the penalties.

in previous pro evos it actually felt like your team played like their real life counterparts, in fifa they never had this.

Kirby

You are entitled to your opinion mate, nobody is trying to tell you otherwise. If you prefer pro evo, thats cool. But you must recognise that 90% of the people on here will disagree with you and that sweeping statement such as "fifa siux and pro evo is betta!" will be met with ridicule and scorn rightfully or wrongly.

devereaux17

but does nobody notice how in pro evo passing is a real joy, while in fifa its so slow, you can't knock the ball around in fifa like u can in pes.

miralize

devereaux17 wrote: »

but does nobody notice how in pro evo passing is a real joy, while in fifa its so slow, you can't knock the ball around in fifa like u can in pes.

its called realism.. people dont automatically sprint to full pace in a second. it takes time to do things in real life, as it does in Fifa. I kind had this problem when I switched. Its just a bit of getting used to

devereaux17

did i mention sprinting, i'm talking about passing, in fifa it seems like their passing a lead football or something?

Nugget89

I can't stand playing Fifa, not really sure what it is about the game I just hate it. Maybe I've just overplayed Pro Evo and can't change back now.

SDTimeout

devereaux17 wrote: »

did i mention sprinting, i'm talking about passing, in fifa it seems like their passing a lead football or something?

I replayed pes the other day with my bro . Passing is nothing comared to fifa. The passed in PES seems 2D. Where in Fifa it seems like you have complete control over where the ball is going.

Didn't notice it but i admit the old fifa passing was bad.

miralize

devereaux17 wrote: »

did i mention sprinting, i'm talking about passing, in fifa it seems like their passing a lead football or something?

No but in general the ball physics is superb..

Eire-Dearg

Before you could argue FIFA in game quality was at a low standard, but since the 2007 edition it's being improved greatly. Maybe the transition to two new consoles took their toll on EA, I don't know, but there's no argument in my opinion that FIFA is the better game for
- realism on the pitch
- depht of players and teams
- license to use crests, jerseys, etc. (huge cosmetic bonus to the game)

Plus many more.