TII Motorway Service Areas (MSA) Progress Thread

Amtmann

Bluetonic wrote: »

The southbound one opens next Wednesday with a big official opening with circa 400 guests.

That soon? Brilliant stuff. This will be a media affair (you'd imagine) and will surely be the time for any new announcements on other MSA progressions to be made. I'm really hoping for an announcement on the M8 Cashel MSA... but I won't hold my breath.

Each building, southbound and northbound have seating for 300 and are exactly the same size and layout. There is more parking on the northbound site.

The buildings further north at Dundalk are slightly smaller than the Lusk buildings.

Interesting. According to the EIS plans for the MSAs at Kilcullen and Cashel, the buildings are to be of the same design as the M1/M4 service areas. However, there will only be one building at Cashel and Kilcullen, serving both the north- and southbound carriageways. The one at Cashel will have 103 carparking spaces, 10 coach spaces, 10 motorcycle spaces and 35 HCV spaces. I can't help but feel that 103 spaces (22 of which are for staff/the mobility impaired) is on the mean side.

cargo

Furet wrote: »

The one at Cashel will have 103 carparking spaces, 10 coach spaces, 10 motorcycle spaces and 35 HCV spaces. I can't help but feel that 103 spaces (22 of which are for staff/the mobility impaired) is on the mean side.

Yeah but dont forget Furet that you can always get a few more cars up on the footpath around the door and in the way of the pumps etc as I saw at Lusk the other day and funnily enough it was a family who could have done with the walk!!

DWCommuter

Purely observational lads..... but....

Does anyone think that the MSAs at Enfield and lusk/Balbriggan are a waste of time in terms of where we could have developed them first?

Both of them are either at your journey start (if travelling from Dublin) or at your journey end (if travelling to Dublin)

I appreciate that if you are travelling Belfast - Kilkenny/Thurles for example etc. then the M1 MSA is a good facility and like wise if you travel up the M11 and head for the M4, a similar situation could exist at Enfield.

But considering the traditions of our driving habits and that the motorway network expands out from and to Dublin, Im at a loss as to why these two sites got done first. Please enlighten me.

cargo

Absurdum wrote: »

I was wondering about this - what's the payment procedure? Were there any delays caused by motorists filling up then going inside to do a load of shopping/browsing before paying and returning to their car?

I was filling up before I even noticed them and anyway I wanted to go in for a nose around but before you lift the nozzel you put in a card (I think it takes laser and credit), put in pin, fill-up and take a receipt if you want. Then you can just hit the road or park up out of the way and go in to use the facilities at you lesuire without having to come back out and move your car (not that anyone ever does anyway).

I was wondering if it'd encourage drive-offs with people saying something mustn't have worked on the card but I noticed signs on the way in for number plate recognition camera on the slip road so all cars are probably logged to help identify plates on cars from the main cctv.

Amtmann

There have been no updates so far in this thread on the Castlebellingham M1 service area near Dundalk. This must be close to completion too, I presume.

L1011

DWCommuter wrote: »

Purely observational lads..... but....

Does anyone think that the MSAs at Enfield and lusk/Balbriggan are a waste of time in terms of where we could have developed them first?

Both of them are either at your journey start (if travelling from Dublin) or at your journey end (if travelling to Dublin)

I appreciate that if you are travelling Belfast - Kilkenny/Thurles for example etc. then the M1 MSA is a good facility and like wise if you travel up the M11 and head for the M4, a similar situation could exist at Enfield.

But considering the traditions of our driving habits and that the motorway network expands out from and to Dublin, Im at a loss as to why these two sites got done first. Please enlighten me.

Going on the UK, the MSAs that shouldn't be popular due to being close to the ends of journeys do surprisingly well. The lack of any other MSAs on the M4 and any prior ones on the M1 may help also - but Ireland could be an entirely different prospect to the UK.

L1011

cargo wrote: »

I was wondering if it'd encourage drive-offs with people saying something mustn't have worked on the card but I noticed signs on the way in for number plate recognition camera on the slip road so all cars are probably logged to help identify plates on cars from the main cctv.

Do you not have to positively select to pay by card first of all? Thats how Tesco did it pre chip and pin (their HW doesn't have pin readers). If you did't hit card it went to control by the kiosk and you'd have no excuse; if you did it didn't allow you to start pumping until it had pre-auth'ed 80 euros on to the card.

MYOB

MYOB wrote: »

Going on the UK, the MSAs that shouldn't be popular due to being close to the ends of journeys do surprisingly well. The lack of any other MSAs on the M4 and any prior ones on the M1 may help also - but Ireland could be an entirely different prospect to the UK.

I expect they'll do well, mainly visitors from the UK as they are the first "pit stops" seen after leaving the ferry/airport. Most UK drivers would be expecting to see one earlier!

Bluetonic

Furet wrote: »

There have been no updates so far in this thread on the Castlebellingham M1 service area near Dundalk. This must be close to completion too, I presume.

Drove by them during the week when up in Dundalk and the signs say opening the last week of September.

nordydan

Bluetonic wrote: »

Drove by them during the week when up in Dundalk and the signs say opening the last week of September.

Indeed, I posted the same thing a few days ago. Temporary orange signs are up stating end of september, for the southbound at least

ardmacha

People leaving back rental cars to the airport would want to fill up close to the airport.

Bluetonic

The two service station on the M1 at Lusk will be very busy when the new landfill opens at Tooman. There'll be a few hundred truck movements in the area per day.

Absurdum

As per Bluetonic's review, excellent facilities on the M1 Lusk Service Area. There are two large baby changing rooms as well as a baby food preparation area (microwave and bottle warmer) which are always very handy to have. Good selection of food and drinks, magazines, books, etc. too.

mackerski

The service area is now mapped on OpenStreetMap.

Chris_5339762

Good ole OSM Who was the person sheepishly driving around every single road of the MSA?

mackerski

Chris_5339762 wrote: »

Good ole OSM Who was the person sheepishly driving around every single road of the MSA?

I hope I wasn't sheepish about it. I also didn't get it all. The lorry and coach parks will still need surveying.

spacetweek

I'm very impressed by the pictures, guys, thanks for those. I'm gonna echo everyone here and say that it's a lot bigger and better than I thought it would be. Also I'm glad they've paved at least some of the car parking areas with blocks instead of dull tarmac. The blocks are what they use in places like Germany and they enhance the appearance significantly.

I'm sure the opening of the first three areas will surely spur the development of more. Sometimes in life you can get things moving if you give people a taste - then they want more!

But is there really a market for 2 MSAs on the M1? It's a bit mad that the M1 gets two but the rest of the mótorbhealachaí get none.

MYOB wrote: »

Going on the UK, the MSAs that shouldn't be popular due to being close to the ends of journeys do surprisingly well. The lack of any other MSAs on the M4 and any prior ones on the M1 may help also - but Ireland could be an entirely different prospect to the UK.

I always assumed the M1 and M4 were targeted first as they've the highest traffic levels, plus the M1 in particular has a lot of local traffic movement, meaning that you can't anticipate where the start and end of people's journeys are so easily.

Rovi

It's a pity there's no link between the M1 South (Lusk) Northbound and Southbound service areas.

Myself and a group of fellow travellers head up to N.I. pretty frequently, and we were just saying last Saturday that this would be a lovely convenient spot for everyone to assemble and car-pool.

On the return journey, getting off at J4 and going back up to the Northbound Services and then on up to J5 and back down again is going to add 24-25km to the trip, which isn't entirely optimal.

Ah well, we'll give it a go next time and see how it feels in action; it mightn't be all that arduous.

mackerski

Rovi wrote: »

It's a pity there's no link between the M1 South (Lusk) Northbound and Southbound service areas.

You could always be bold and try to abuse the staff entrance to the back roads behind the service area (not yet mapped as they are still under construction).

Rovi

mackerski wrote: »

You could always be bold and try to abuse the staff entrance to the back roads behind the service area (not yet mapped as they are still under construction).

Hmmm...
Get off at J5 and hit the back roads?

It'd be great if it was feasible; how well policed are these 'staff entrances' likely to be, I wonder?

mackerski

Rovi wrote: »

Hmmm...
Get off at J5 and hit the back roads?

It'd be great if it was feasible; how well policed are these 'staff entrances' likely to be, I wonder?

I couldn't tell from what I saw, but it wouldn't surprise me if they had raising bollards or lifting gates. This being Ireland and everything...

Rovi

mackerski wrote: »

I couldn't tell from what I saw, but it wouldn't surprise me if they had raising bollards or lifting gates. This being Ireland and everything...

It'll have to be investigated, at the very least.

As I said, perhaps the 25km round trip mightn't be all that bad, it'd just be sooo much more convenient to be able to access it from both sides of the motorway. Some of us will have done the guts of 500km that day (starting at 5am), so every extra un-necessary kilometre is begrudged.
Even a pedestrian bridge would be useful.

Sully

Was in the M1 service station the other day on way to N.IRL. Excellent place to stop along the way, traveled from Waterford on the M9 without stopping so was good to get a break. The A cafe place was closed, but everywhere else was open. Plenty of space to get around outside and in. I wonder what the opening hours for the individual stores are?

On the Galway to Dublin motorway, thats still closed but nearing completion it would seem.

AOwannabe

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0914/1224278831321.html

THE NATIONAL Roads Authority is to erect signs on motorways where planned service stations have been put on hold.
The signs will direct traffic off the motorway network to nearby villages and towns for fuel, food and toilets.
An Bord Pleanála had approved the development of seven service areas on Irish motorways, but four will not be built due to a lack of funding.
A spokesman for the NRA said that there was no plan to build services areas on the M6 (Dublin to Galway), M7 (Dublin to Limerick), M8 (Dublin to Cork) and M9 (Kilcullen to Waterford) because “the money wasn’t made available”.
He said the authority was, however, implementing a national signage programme so that when members of the public were driving on a new motorway, they would know exactly where to go for petrol, food etc.
The 130 signs, due to be in place by the end of next month, are being implemented at a cost of some €200,000, according to the authority.
AA Ireland’s director of policy Conor Faughnan said the absence of service stations on four Irish motorways was “not just an inconvenience, but a safety hazard”.
Mr Faughnan said a key cause of collisions on motorways was driver fatigue.
“This can lead not just to people falling asleep but also a loss of concentration among drivers,” he said, adding that “a key countermeasure is the provision of proper service areas”.
Service stations are to open on two of the State’s busiest motorways over the next few weeks at a cost of €79 million to the taxpayer.
The lack of service stations so far has meant that drivers can drive from south of Gorey, Co Wexford, to the Border without finding a place to stop for fuel, food or toilets.
The green light has been given to the Superstop consortium – comprising Tedcastle Oil, which operates the Top brand, Petrogas, which runs the Applegreen chain of petrol stations, and Pierse Contracting – as the preferred bidder for the service stations, two of which will be on the M1 (Dublin to Belfast).
The first service area, to be located at Lusk between junctions 4 and 5, is set to open tomorrow, while the second will be located at Castlebellingham, north of junction 15.
A third is due to open on the M4 (Dublin to Sligo) on October 6th, west of junction 9 at Enfield.

mackerski

mackerski wrote: »

I couldn't tell from what I saw, but it wouldn't surprise me if they had raising bollards or lifting gates. This being Ireland and everything...

I bet the staff exit on the M4 eastbound service area will be very secure.

Jayuu

I'm a bit confused now. The article states that there are no plans to build on the M8 but was there not a CPO put out for a proposed M8 site.

Are they just buying the land for the M8 area now because it's potentially a lot cheaper? And if that is the case why not CPO the land for all the service areas now and then at least it would be purchased and owned by the time we do get around to building them.

Finally can somebody explain to me the contact under which the service areas are actually run? Is it a PPP in which case why has it cost nearly €80 million for the three current ones? Surely the private party takes the cost of building and then recoups that costs over the term of their contract?

Pete_Cavan

Rovi wrote: »

it'd just be sooo much more convenient to be able to access it from both sides of the motorway.

Are all the MSAs planned to be accessed from one side of the road only? It would make a lot more sense to have them accessed from both sides, I'm sure it wouldnt be too difficult to build a bridge over the motorway as most of the bridge is precast concrete and using an imaginative traffic management plan temporarily diverting the traffic along the slip road up to the MSA while the precast elements are installed.

Jayuu wrote: »

Finally can somebody explain to me the contact under which the service areas are actually run? Is it a PPP in which case why has it cost nearly €80 million for the three current ones? Surely the private party takes the cost of building and then recoups that costs over the term of their contract?

Under a PPP the private company does provide the finance and recoups the costs over the term of the contract, at the end of the contract the NRA will still own the MSAs and make a big profit from renewing the contracts as the capital costs will have been covered.

L1011

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

Are all the MSAs planned to be accessed from one side of the road only? It would make a lot more sense to have them accessed from both sides, I'm sure it wouldnt be too difficult to build a bridge over the motorway as most of the bridge is precast concrete and using an imaginative traffic management plan temporarily diverting the traffic along the slip road up to the MSA while the precast elements are installed.

All future ones are planned to be single sided with bridge, I believe.

Jayuu

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

Under a PPP the private company does provide the finance and recoups the costs over the term of the contract, at the end of the contract the NRA will still own the MSAs and make a big profit from renewing the contracts as the capital costs will have been covered.

Thanks for this! But if this is the case why has it cost €79 million to the taxpayer. Is this for the land and the access roads? If so it seems like an excessive amount.

Amtmann

RTÉ have a tiny story about this (and a picture of a non-Republic section of the Dublin-Belfast route): http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/0915/roads.html

Hopefully some of the other media will ask the Minister and the NRA why, on the Ms 6, 7, 8 and 9, we see women, children and men scrambling up embankments everyday to find a place to pee.

Something in the IT today:

REARVIEW: LAST FRIDAY, Minister for Transport Noel Dempsey opened the brand new M9 motorway, which links Dublin and Waterford.

Drivers can now get to and from the capital, Cork, Galway, Belfast and Waterford in a reasonable time without major bottlenecks and on a road that is statistically many times safer than the old national routes.

Mr Dempsey was asked why no service station had been built on these roads and he replied there were facilities available off all of them.

The NRA said service station signs would be put up to direct people to petrol, food and toilet facilities off the motorway. So the plan would seem to be if you are using the multi-million euro road and need to go to the toilet, eat or fuel up, you will need to leave the road, clog up the nearest town and add unnecessary time to your journey. It’s a bit like building a bus with no seats.

I travelled from Drogheda to West Cork, last Thursday, with two children and was forced to pull off the M8 twice (once at night, in the rain) to allow the little ones to answer the call of nature. Starved on the way down, it was Innishannon before we could stop for food.

The first service areas, located on the M1 at Lusk and Castlebellingham, Co Louth and on the M4 at Enfield, are ready to open – indeed the one in Lusk is up and running – and will provide welcome relief to motorists, who have been forced to leave the roads.

The new stations should also be welcomed by local towns that will be spared unnecessary traffic travelling through their areas. However, service stations in nine other areas have been put on hold because there is no State money to help build them.

It is a pity that such crucial facilities were not planned decades ago when we first set about building a motorway network and when money would not have been a problem.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/motors/2010/0915/1224278883849.html