How do I help save my friends?

robindch

Fanny Cradock wrote: »

A friend got his day in court for doing the same; he's now 50 EUR poorer for his transgression.

Ah, but he got caught, didn't he? Owing to leaving my fore'n'aft lights behind, I was camouflaged from any itinerant cops.

Anyhow, a beer-fuelled baptism rite is an integral part of my pastafarianism (maybe it's a bit like those catholic priests last year who were worried about going over the limit, or the Sikhs who can don't have to wear motorcycle helmets)

Are you trying to limit the freedom to practice my religion? I'm going to start feeling really persecuted or something!

studiorat

and yeh, didith the dodder flow red with the ragu of the spaggetti'd one and the metabolized beer of his minion

Fanny Cradock

robindch wrote: »

Ah, but he got caught, didn't he? Owing to leaving my fore'n'aft lights behind, I was camouflaged from any itinerant cops.

Are you trying to limit the freedom to practice my religion? I'm going to start feeling really persecuted or something!

Not at all! I defend your unconstitutional right to cycle home drunk without lights and to plunge your hands in to the filth of the Dodder. I just hope you gave them a good wash afterwards.

getz

Glenman wrote: »

The devil is hard at work in the world today, that is plain for all to see. he is the god of this world. Most of us are obsessed with the material things of this world. It is very difficult to resist sin (material things of this world) but if we do not believe in Jesus Christ then we have no hope. I am a sinner, I find it very difficult to resist temptation. Approximately 233 thousand people die every day on average and approximately 99% of those go to hell, that is around 230 thousand people entering hell every day.
I am worried about my friends, especially two of them. They say they are agnostic.
I don't want to force religion down their throat but what can I do do help save them?

this sounds like some thing out of the 19th century, in haworth in yorkshire about 1820 a parson from haworth, every sunday morning would go around the pubs with a whip to drive all the villagers to church- then one day they got a good irishman rev patrick bronte then the church was full amen

Zombrex

considering we are all on a forum about a religion who's central belief is that a man "died" for us I don't think we need to get too worked up about someone baptising (Firefox says that is right) us by proxy.

Is anyone "deeply offended" that Jesus died for your sins? Personally I would have preferred a gift voucher from HMV, but I'm certainly not offended by this rather pointless (in my view) act, nor would I be offended by the rather pointless (in my view) act of someone baptising me by-proxy.

They aren't making you do anything, and if you don't believe any of it has any effect on anything I don't see the big deal. It shows a some what low level of respect for the other persons ability to judge a religion themselves, but then my idea that the OP should try and reason with his friends at an intellectual level seems to have been largely ignored, so that isn't exactly surprising.

... and by the way you are all now Scientologists

Run_to_da_hills

Glenman wrote: »

The devil is hard at work in the world today, that is plain for all to see. he is the god of this world. Most of us are obsessed with the material things of this world. It is very difficult to resist sin (material things of this world) but if we do not believe in Jesus Christ then we have no hope. I am a sinner, I find it very difficult to resist temptation. Approximately 233 thousand people die every day on average and approximately 99% of those go to hell, that is around 230 thousand people entering hell every day.
I am worried about my friends, especially two of them. They say they are agnostic.
I don't want to force religion down their throat but what can I do do help save them?

Have you been reading this?


http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/billions_of_people_going_to_hell.htm

Húrin

Glenman wrote: »

The devil is hard at work in the world today, that is plain for all to see. he is the god of this world. Most of us are obsessed with the material things of this world. It is very difficult to resist sin (material things of this world) but if we do not believe in Jesus Christ then we have no hope. I am a sinner, I find it very difficult to resist temptation.

I am worried about my friends, especially two of them. They say they are agnostic.
I don't want to force religion down their throat but what can I do do help save them?

I know how you feel. I have a particular friend who is certain that there is a God and calls herself a Catholic, but does not think that the Bible is divinely inspired, that the universe has a meaning, or that God is a person (that is, more like a person than like anything else we know). AFAIK, I would describe her beliefs as Deist.

I feel the sadness of watching someone snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Recently I have caught myself debating the ontology of God overzealously with her, and not being able to let go of this. I can shut up about nearly everything else but this topic, it just feels so important.

But I remember that Jesus asked us to proclaim and explain our beliefs. Not to convert people. I am realising that this entails accepting sadness when said beliefs are not agreed upon.

However it is worth continuing to talk about. The meaning of the Gospels rarely becomes clear in a sudden flash; rather it is a gradual process.

Do your agnostic friends close up with any mention of God, or are they open to discussing the issue?

I also recommend that you pray particularly for guidance from Jesus, though I imagine you are already doing this.

As PDN said, listening to Jesus so that we ourselves might live by example to demonstrate the reality behind our words. In particular it breaks my heart to see so many people worrying about things that don't really matter.

So I find that freedom from worry is a good base from which to begin the dialogue about Jesus. It's not showy but it is noticeable. It is also a challenge that I find difficult to rise to when it comes to my friends who I love, who will not embrace Jesus.

Húrin

robindch wrote: »

I believe that the Vatican allows a kind of baptism by proxy where the baptizee (?) is said to receive the same theological protection as one gets from a regular baptism. The people concerned don't have to be there, and I believe they don't even need to know that it has happened.

The idea of applying that to someone who does not accept is repugnant to me, as it denies the free will that God seems to see as so important.

I doubt it is much (ab)used for that purpose.

marco_polo

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

Have you been reading this?


http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/billions_of_people_going_to_hell.htm

Is it just me of does heaven look a bit like an heavy industrial factory?