Calling Dubliners west Brits

arybvtcw0eolkf · 20-12-2008 1:16pm

Actually the name 'West Brits' referred to people from Dun Laoghaire (Kingstown).

Queen Vic landed there and was paraded through the streets of Dublin (at the turn of the last century) were she was greeted by crowds of cheering Dub's waving the union jack - Jackeens!.

There, I know everything.

CDfm · 20-12-2008 5:38pm

Mairt wrote: »

Queen Vic landed there and was paraded through the streets of Dublin (at the turn of the last century) were she was greeted by crowds of cheering Dub's waving the union jack - Jackeens!.

Oh knowegeable one is the West Brit catching.

A Queen Vic statue was buried in UCC after independence (her that was our Queen during the famine) and there was a movement to dig it up.

Could Dudess in Cork have caught the West Brit.

jill_valentine · 20-12-2008 5:44pm

I agree with making West Brit a Godwin thing. Even for the internet, it's just too stupid.

Dudess · 20-12-2008 5:46pm

CDfm, you sure talk a lot of idiotic shyte.

Iang87 wrote: »

ha west brits and jackeens, ha funny cos its true

What's true?

People like the two of you are such an embarrassment to intelligent republicanism.

SV · 20-12-2008 5:49pm

ntlbell wrote: »

I'm sure the whole two of them would be very upset...

Well I'm one of them and it's all good

jill_valentine · 20-12-2008 5:50pm

Poster 1: "Gerry Adams could heal lepers. Gerry Adams could undo the recession. Gerry Adams could even kick Chuck Norris's ass!

He wouldn't though, because Gerry Adams is a man of peace."

Poster 2: "... What?"

Poster 1: "WEST BRIT!"

Etc.

CDfm · 20-12-2008 10:07pm

Dudess wrote: »

CDfm, you sure talk a lot of idiotic shyte.

What's true?

People like the two of you are such an embarrassment to intelligent republicanism.

Boohoo.

So Im just pointing out that the correct usage of the term West Brit is not meant as a compliment.

That it has a deeper and darker social ,poilitical and cultural meaning seems to be lost on most posters.

Our civil service model was inherited from the British and has not served us well- based as it was on an occupation model and we didnt change it. Our Industrial Relations model is based on 1960s/70s Britain and is Socialist despite not having a mandate from the people in parliment nonetheless hugely controls economic and social policy.Our health and social welfare policy was copied from the British.Jeez we even have a State Run TV service we cant let go of -even though it doesnt do public service broadcasting by any accepted definition.

Our laws are copied from the British as a benchmark.Our courts use British caselaw as persuasive precedent in deciding court cases.

The outpouring of grief at Princess Dianas death - the persistant calls for calls for an honours system even to calls for reviving the Knights of St Patrick -never a public honour as such.

I cant pick up a newspaper without reading some Irish politician paraphrase a British politicians ramblings as their own.We may have gotten independence but that didnt extend to political thought or goverance.

So its a generic term for adopting stuff the Brits do.

Lets see what the Brits do and copy it.If the Brits do it it must be right.

West Brit says it all. What would you call it?

Terry · 20-12-2008 10:17pm

CDfm wrote: »

Boohoo.

So Im just pointing out that the correct usage of the term West Brit is not meant as a compliment.

That it has a deeper and darker social ,poilitical and cultural meaning seems to be lost on most posters.

Our civil service model was inherited from the British and has not served us well- based as it was on an occupation model and we didnt change it. Our Industrial Relations model is based on 1960s/70s Britain and is Socialist despite not having a mandate from the people in parliment nonetheless hugely controls economic and social policy.Our health and social welfare policy was copied from the British.Jeez we even have a State Run TV service we cant let go of -even though it doesnt do public service broadcasting by any accepted definition.

Our laws are copied from the British as a benchmark.Our courts use British caselaw as persuasive precedent in deciding court cases.

The outpouring of grief at Princess Dianas death - the persistant calls for calls for an honours system even to calls for reviving the Knights of St Patrick -never a public honour as such.

I cant pick up a newspaper without reading some Irish politician paraphrase a British politicians ramblings as their own.We may have gotten independence but that didnt extend to political thought or goverance.

So its a generic term for adopting stuff the Brits do.

Lets see what the Brits do and copy it.If the Brits do it it must be right.

West Brit says it all. What would you call it?

I'd call it following a model that partly works.
Their health service is better than ours though.

Focusing your energies on wastes of space is a waste of time really.

CDfm · 20-12-2008 10:30pm

<3BeingIN6th wrote: »

I'd call it following a model that partly works.
Their health service is better than ours though.

Focusing your energies on wastes of space is a waste of time really.

West Brit is still a cool phrase?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 20-12-2008 10:41pm

So has anyone actually managed to define the term yet? Is it someone who lives in Dublin? Someone who doesn't activally support the IRA? Someone who has a mortgage and likes coffee? Aomeone with a bit of intelligence who can think for themsleves without being told what to think by someone else...?

Is it too late to add a poll?

The Mighty Ken · 20-12-2008 10:45pm

Why aren't the people who accuse Dubliners of being 'West Brits' all speaking Irish to each other as their first language? In fact, I would suggest anyone that uses the term 'West Brit' and isn't a fluent Irish speaker is a complete hypocrite.

Four-Percent · 20-12-2008 11:08pm

Don't know if i'd go that far , but certainly the people who say "Irish is my first language" while speaking in english are hypocrites.

CDfm · 20-12-2008 11:33pm

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

So has anyone actually managed to define the term yet? Is it someone who lives in Dublin? Someone who doesn't activally support the IRA? Someone who has a mortgage and likes coffee? Aomeone with a bit of intelligence who can think for themsleves without being told what to think by someone else...?

Is it too late to add a poll?

Look - I wikied it for you. It has nothing to do with mortgages and coffee or whether you live in Dublin.

The phrase has been around for over a century and a half - just so happens people who its applied to dont like it.

And yup - its too late to add a poll cos that wont change its meaning.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Briton

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 21-12-2008 12:28am

CDfm wrote: »

Look - I wikied it for you. It has nothing to do with mortgages and coffee or whether you live in Dublin.

The phrase has been around for over a century and a half - just so happens people who its applied to dont like it.

And yup - its too late to add a poll cos that wont change its meaning.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Briton

Didn't thing it'd make wiki!

I think the reasons why people who it's applioed to don't like it seems to be because it's applied wildly inaccurately.

jill_valentine · 21-12-2008 12:31am

It's Boards usage is slightly more select, and can be defined thus:

West Brit (n): A person who disagrees with the policies or actions of any element of the Republican movement. Or, more likely, disagrees with - or dares to question - any given statement of an especially Republican poster. It is an entirely adequate substitute for a reasoned or well considered argument, regardless of the actual allegiances or opinions of the poster to which it is directed.

Eg.

"I was banned from the Computers & Technology forum for spamming it with violent porn by those damn West Brits."

nkay1985 · 21-12-2008 1:58am

I would only think West Brit applies to someone that is anti-Irish even though they were born in Ireland. Someone who is, by all measure, a British Conservative.

I think Dudess may have referred to Conor Cruise O'Brien and Kevin Myers. If she didn't, they're who I'd call west Brits.

jill_valentine · 21-12-2008 2:10am

Kevin Myers always gets wheeled out for the West Brit parade, but he's anti-Everything, surely?

nkay1985 · 21-12-2008 2:21am

jill_valentine wrote: »

Kevin Myers always gets wheeled out for the West Brit parade, but he's anti-Everything, surely?

Yep but that doesn't mean he's not a West Brit

OPENROAD · 21-12-2008 2:21am

jill_valentine wrote: »

Kevin Myers always gets wheeled out for the West Brit parade, but he's anti-Everything, surely?

Is he not English?

domkk · 21-12-2008 2:25am

So then, a posh d4 person is related to a West brit, cos of so called poshness.BULL?!! What happens when the brit happens to come from Glasgow or Cardiff?, Wheres the comparison?
No one ever seems to have a bad word against the WELSH,SCOTISH, always comparing to the ENGLISH. Afterall we are all BRITS.
Basically you can be Welsh, Scottish, Manx(UK), BUT not ENGLISH(your british).
.........eeeerrrrrr I havent noticed a single country called britain

RandolphEsq · 21-12-2008 4:17am

The definition I would recite most often is that 'West Brit' must be taken in context, the context being the general 'War of Independence' era. Usually the upper middle class Irishmen who did not want change, i.e. independence from Britain, were what I have learned the term 'West Brit' to refer to.
I would agree with that though; if I was prosperous and living a materially comfortable, and thus intelligible, life I would not have wanted a band of romantics to plot an uncertain path for my future. I have a family business to maintain, and land to convert to fee tail!

stepbar · 21-12-2008 4:41am

Jeasus holy christ. 20 pages. Who the fcuk gives a sh1te? Calling someone a Jackeen or a Culchie is a fairly lame slag to be fair.

CDfm · 21-12-2008 2:51pm

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Didn't thing it'd make wiki!

I think the reasons why people who it's applioed to don't like it seems to be because it's applied wildly inaccurately.

Me too- like I say its insulting - so i dont expect people who its applied to to be wildly enthused about it.

As to its being applied inaccurately -I dunno - I think its being contemparised a wee bit that to copy the British isnt always that sophisticated. Especially in polictical economic and social stuff -which are inappropriate for a nation of our side.

As to West Brit being a D4 thing - getouttahere- its certainly does not have any snob value.

CDfm · 21-12-2008 2:57pm

jill_valentine wrote: »

It's Boards usage is slightly more select, and can be defined thus:

but Jill its boards usage is very selective - you could say the Government regulation of the Banks was very West Brit ie a copy the British regulation of their Banks which caused the crisis at Northern rock.

That would be a contempary usage.

CDfm · 21-12-2008 3:00pm

stepbar wrote: »

Jeasus holy christ. 20 pages. Who the fcuk gives a sh1te? Calling someone a Jackeen or a Culchie is a fairly lame slag to be fair.

calling someone a culchie isnt particularily insulting - however calling somone a jackeen is because people dont understand its origans.maybe if they did they would dislike it.

viva ignorance.

CDfm · 21-12-2008 3:09pm

nkay1985 wrote: »

I would only think West Brit applies to someone that is anti-Irish even though they were born in Ireland. Someone who is, by all measure, a British Conservative.

I think Dudess may have referred to Conor Cruise O'Brien and Kevin Myers. If she didn't, they're who I'd call west Brits.

i think that is a selective use of the term.

its when you use it in its wider context that you get a reaction. to refer to the Irish labour party and unions as west brit as they follow a British model sends them digging out their Connolly credentials.

Its too close to the truth for the loony left or the public service to see how much they rely on Britain for their ideoligy.

I would agree that Conor Cruise O'Brien was - however I am not sure about Kevin Myers as he is far too straight talking for that.

Ed Walsh,Eddie Hobbs, George Hook and John Waters all would be examples of people who are not west brits

Balmed Out · 21-12-2008 3:12pm

I would consider a west brit to be someone who prefers to embrace British rather then Irish culture when they themselves are Irish. They dont like GAA, Irish music, dance, language etc. Wouldnt think its a term used just for dubliners or just for people from wicklow or wherever else.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 21-12-2008 3:39pm

Balmed Out wrote: »

I would consider a west brit to be someone who prefers to embrace British rather then Irish culture when they themselves are Irish. They dont like GAA, Irish music, dance, language etc. Wouldnt think its a term used just for dubliners or just for people from wicklow or wherever else.

Hmm..... never identified with any of the Irish culture you mention above, but beyond supporting Liverpool, never identified with UK culture either. Must be a West European.

CDfm wrote:

As to West Brit being a D4 thing - getouttahere- its certainly does not have any snob value.

+1 - look at the emount if inner city teenages who live their life according to the 'culture' on TV3. If that doesn't define "West Brit", I don't know what does.

JimmyCrackCorn! · 21-12-2008 4:36pm

Hub wrote: »

I read in the accent thread

"Ooooh ye jackeens, you're nothin but a bunch of west brits"

"Dubliners are closet English people"

Seriously...what does that even mean? Is it supposed to be an insult or something. Probably the lamest slag ever

I'm too lazy to read the whole thread to see if anyone actually gave an answer to this.

It goes back to the war of independence and probably pre-war. It was a commonly used in propaganda at the time.

Does Ireland want to be independent or become west Britten. The notion of a second class state or Provence. There are posters with this kind of wording on them if you fancy digging through the archives.

At the time the majority of the resistance/IRA flying columns were active in the countryside so in comparison Dublin would have been considered to be "less concerned" with the war and have closer ties to England.

Lets just say at the time you wouldn't be starting a rugby club in Kerry. Where it wouldn't have been an issue in the wealthier areas of Dublin.

Today iv only seen it used as a slur similar to free stater by the few die hard republicans and some drunken arm chair hero types(also some who are just ignorant to its meaning).

Im kind of surprised to see this asked. Or has the micahel collins hollywood movie become the perception of irish history?

CDfm · 21-12-2008 4:48pm

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

Hmm..... never identified with any of the Irish culture you mention above, but beyond supporting Liverpool, never identified with UK culture either. Must be a West European.

+1 - look at the emount if inner city teenages who live their life according to the 'culture' on TV3. If that doesn't define "West Brit", I don't know what does.

Yup -the term should be revived. There are plenty of public figures, polictians and public servants who would wear it well.

Mary McAlleeese -she is definately a west brit.

Calling Dubliners west Brits

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