Why are single 30+ women portrayed as 'desperate'?

seahorse · 29-12-2008 3:07pm #1

Desperate to involve themselves with a man, or so we’re told; and is there any substance to the accusation, really, is what I’m asking?

I’m a thirties woman myself and I have to say I find it a bit insulting, even though my being in a long-term relationship would preclude the label from applying to me. I guess I feel if I were to find myself single in the morning I’d suddenly be slapped with the maniac label or something.. The way that single thirties woman are portrayed you’d think they all obsessed day and night about involving themselves with a man and very little else, when the reality as far as I have seen (among the single thirties women I know personally) is that they have more on their plates to be concerning themselves with.

Having said that, this attitude must be coming from somewhere: so where? Have a handful of bunny-boiling mid-thirties women behaved in such an extreme fashion as to turn hysterical thirties-related relationship-hunting into an urban myth? Or is there any truth in the accusation that ticking biological clocks induce some sort of psychological metamorphosis around this age? Or, have the likes of 'Bridget Jones diary' done more harm in the attitudes they generate than any good from the entertainment they provide?

For me personally, I was far more in need of the security of a relationship in my early twenties. Now that I’ve grown up a bit and left a lot of mental baggage behind, my relationship is a welcome addition to my life; it complements rather than defines it. As for my biological clock, at nearly thirty-three I’m sure it is ticking loud and clear, not that I would know as I couldn’t be arsed listening to it.

So for the women reading this who’ve ever found themselves single in their thirties: did anything change at this age for you or have single thirties women been unjustifiably labeled? And for the men who’ve dated women of all ages: did you enjoy those relationships or was there any discernable difference in dating thirties+ women that would lead you to believe there’s any substance to the ‘desperate’ perception?

ntlbell · 29-12-2008 3:10pm

Who is portraying them as desperate?

seahorse · 29-12-2008 3:13pm

ntlbell wrote: »

Who is portraying them as desperate?

Funny you ask ntlbell because I've read more comments on the internet along those lines than I've ever heard people say, but then the internet can be a real eye-opener in that way; people tend to type the words they'd never allow escape from their mouths!

ntlbell · 29-12-2008 3:14pm

seahorse wrote: »

Funny you ask ntlbell because I've read more comments on the internet along those lines than I've ever heard people say, but then the internet can be a real eye-opener in that way; people tend to type the words they'd never allow escape from their mouths!

People on the internet are stupid.

If you're happy been single comfortable in your own skin what other people think is pretty irrelevant.

IvaBigWun · 29-12-2008 3:19pm

ntlbell wrote: »

Who is portraying them as desperate?

ABC?

/gets coat

JC 2K3 · 29-12-2008 3:19pm

seahorse wrote: »

biological clock

This is why.

seahorse wrote: »

at nearly thirty-three I’m sure it is ticking loud and clear, not that I would know as I couldn’t be arsed listening to it.

And this is why you are different.

Now I don't know stats, or even if you are in fact different, perhaps it's just a minority that gives single women your age this reputation, but I do know that it's very much related to some women wanting to settle down before it's too late to have kids.

seahorse · 29-12-2008 3:20pm

ntlbell wrote: »

People on the internet are stupid.

Oh come on now, that's you and me you're talking about too!

Seriously though, people have a tendency to speak their minds when they're sitting in the privacy of their own homes. Could you imagine someone maintaining most single thirties women are desperate for a man around a table of single thirties women?! I've come across that so many times now I'd imagine it has to be a more prevailing attitude than I ever thought, or ever would have thought, if there weren't so many keyboard warriors out there!

Wibbs · 29-12-2008 3:21pm

I would say in general as a bloke, women in their 30's were more serious for want of a better word about a relationship. Doubly so for the ones who wanted kids. Funny they were more casual about a friends with benefits thing, but if it was a boyfriend/girlfriend thing they were more prone to thinking about the "future". When compared to 25 year olds anyway. Understandable. If I was gonna marry/have kids with someone, I would want to be with them for about 3 odd years before I would be as sure as I could be about going down that road. So I meet a 34 year old say, on that timeline, she's knocking on the door of 37 before marriage kids is on the cards. Lets say at that stage we both reckon its a bad plan or its run it's course, then she's not in a great position to start again, by comparison to a bloke at that age anyway.

As for bunny boilers? I would say I know more of that type after 30 than before tbh. More baggage and more bad relationships/knob end blokes behind them. That said the most balanced women I've known were over 30, so it really is down to the individual.

One thing I have seen though, is women who had played the field when younger(and more power to them) and barely had a pregnancy scare between them magically fell pregnant in their early 30's. Now some was pure bad luck, but I am convinced with 4 of them it was subconsciously planned. Not to "trap" a guy either as only one of them seemed to have an interest in keeping the father around.

Women's declining fertility is a real pain and a disadvantage for them. Pity it can't be put on hold more easily.

ntlbell · 29-12-2008 3:26pm

seahorse wrote: »

Oh come on now, that's you and me you're talking about too! Seriously though, people have a tendency to speak their minds when they're sitting in the privacy of their own homes. Could you imagine someone maintaining most single thirties women are desperate for a man around a table of single thirties women?! I've come across that so many times now I'd imagine it has to be a more prevailing attitude than I ever thought, or ever would have thought, if there weren't so many keyboard warriors out there!

Well I don't know about desperation.

Some women in their 30's are depserate to have kids.

Some are not.

Some idiots will make sweeping genearlisations about women (or anything)

Some will not...

There's no big secret...

herya · 29-12-2008 3:30pm

seahorse wrote: »

Or, have the likes of 'Bridget Jones diary' done more harm in the attitudes they generate than any good from the entertainment they provide?

To a degree, yes they have. If you can put a name and a funny face on a certain attitude makes it easier to remember and to stereotype about. Nothing sticks like a good joke

And pressing for commitment is likely to scare commitment phobes.

Wibbs has summed up the rest pretty nicely.

Karen_* · 29-12-2008 3:31pm

I'm single and 34 but I have a child and realise I'm not maternal and don't want anymore. I'd like to meet someone but they'd have to have loads of space for all my baggage!!!:D They'd have to like psychos too.:D

ntlbell · 29-12-2008 3:32pm

Karen_* wrote: »

I'm single and 34 but I have a child and realise I'm not maternal and don't want anymore. I'd like to meet someone but they'd have to have loads of space for all my baggage!!!:D They'd have to like psychos too.:D

and all you would have to do is let them watch footy...

see, it's not as hard as people make out give and take

Karen_* · 29-12-2008 3:38pm

seahorse wrote: »

Oh come on now, that's you and me you're talking about too! Seriously though, people have a tendency to speak their minds when they're sitting in the privacy of their own homes. Could you imagine someone maintaining most single thirties women are desperate for a man around a table of single thirties women?! I've come across that so many times now I'd imagine it has to be a more prevailing attitude than I ever thought, or ever would have thought, if there weren't so many keyboard warriors out there!

I didn't realise women in their thirties were perceived as desperate until I read boards. Its a very sweeping generalisation and to be honest I could generalise and say that women in their twenties would go out with almost anyone just for the sake of having a bloke. I say that from years of watching friends and aquaintances behaviour but it Is a generalistion and doesn't apply obviously to all women in their twenties. When reading posts and opinions on the internet I just take the attitude that the person doesn't really mean what they say, its just how their feeling that day and they can vent their spleen safely behind their monitors.

Karen_* · 29-12-2008 3:41pm

ntlbell wrote: »

and all you would have to do is let them watch footy...

see, it's not as hard as people make out give and take

No they couldn't watch footy. I went out with a right bastard once and he liked footy so my head swivels now if it comes on the telly. It brings back the pain of how badly I was treated and then he ran off with someone else. I actually can't beleive you even mentioned footy ntlbell! :tears: :tears:

IvaBigWun · 29-12-2008 3:43pm

2 of the best relationships I had were with single Mams in their 30s. Generally they can hold a conversation, their drink and their dignity a lot better than a girl who is 24 and watches The Hills. They are also, usually, unfooking real in bed. Which is always a bonus.

Yummy Mummies ftw.

Wibbs · 29-12-2008 3:51pm

Karen_* wrote: »

I didn't realise women in their thirties were perceived as desperate until I read boards.

I've heard it said by quite a few blokes in the real world, though it's much more obvious here.

Its a very sweeping generalisation

True.

and to be honest I could generalise and say that women in their twenties would go out with almost anyone just for the sake of having a bloke.

I would agree actually. I know and have known too many women in that age group who go out with someone that's horribly wrong for them just to say they have a boyfriend. More than once I've heard a woman describe a bloke she brought to a party or whatever as her boyfriend, only to discover she knows him a week or two.

When reading posts and opinions on the internet I just take the attitude that the person doesn't really mean what they say, its just how their feeling that day and they can vent their spleen safely behind their monitors.

There's a lot of that, though I do reckon a lot of how they honestly feel comes out too.

IvaBigWun wrote:

They are also, usually, unfooking real in bed. Which is always a bonus.

There is that, but IMHO that stereotype is massively over blown. Naturally they may have more experience and they're more comfortable in their own skin in general, but I would say the good in bed bit is not so much to do with age. Looking back the women who were best in bed(which tbh is rare anyway) in my life were all under 30. Damn near the best had little enough experience and one of the worst had had loads and was 35. So again it's down to the individual.

Karen_* · 29-12-2008 3:57pm

Ho do women in their twenties who are great in bed get crap in bed when they hit their thirties Wibbs?:D

Wibbs · 29-12-2008 3:59pm

Karen_* wrote: »

Ho do women in their twenties who are great in bed get crap in bed when they hit their thirties Wibbs?:D

I dunno, but I haven't slept with the good ones now they're in their 30's.....

Joking aside, people, men and women, can become worse in the sack with age. They get stuck in their ways, they're not up for new stuff, they just do what they've always done with people before, they get less fit and flexible, they don't look as good, etc. Kinda like life really.

seahorse · 29-12-2008 4:01pm

Karen_* wrote: »

I didn't realise women in their thirties were perceived as desperate until I read boards.

Nor did I. Well, I'm not only talking about boards. I've come across the attitude often on a couple of different American sites I used to visit.

Karen_* wrote: »

Its a very sweeping generalisation and to be honest I could generalise and say that women in their twenties would go out with almost anyone just for the sake of having a bloke. I say that from years of watching friends and aquaintances behaviour but it Is a generalistion and doesn't apply obviously to all women in their twenties.

Ah you could generalise about anything I suppose, but what I was wondering about here was the roots of that particular perception and while I accept that women wanting to have children before their thirties are out probably significantly contributes to it I don't believe that covers it, because the attitude seems to be more often about women being incomplete without a man as opposed to the child he could provide her with.

Karen_* wrote: »

When reading posts and opinions on the internet I just take the attitude that the person doesn't really mean what they say, its just how their feeling that day and they can vent their spleen safely behind their monitors.

I'd actually love to think that Karen; maybe I'm just more sensitive then you but I just assume people are saying what they truly think but wouldn't have the guts to say in a situation where they might possibly be running the risk of a dig in the face. In fairness it's probably a bit of both and many other things besides depending on the individual; we don't want to be getting into any negative generalisations here!

ntlbell · 29-12-2008 4:06pm

seahorse wrote: »

N
I'd actually love to think that Karen; maybe I'm just more sensitive then you but I just assume people are saying what they truly think but wouldn't have the guts to say in a situation where they might possibly be running the risk of a dig in the face. In fairness it's probably a bit of both and many other things besides depending on the individual; we don't want to be getting into any negative generalisations here!

The big problem with the "internet" is you often don't know who you're listening to.

Is it a 21yr old hard man that thinks he looks cool by saying something like that?

Is it a 30+ man that's just had a run of bad luck with bunny boiling 30+'s?

Is it just a complete moron?

in the majority of cases you just don't know.

So you have to take these things with a pinch of salt..

For the majority of your "real" life you tend to choose who you listen to and be around most of the time.

On the internet you don't get that luxury so you're more inclined to be listening to some complete and utter socially/emotional retard.

herya · 29-12-2008 4:06pm

seahorse wrote: »

Ah you could generalise about anything I suppose, but what I was wondering about here was the roots of that particular perception and while I accept that women wanting to have children before their thirties are out probably significantly contributes to it I don't believe that covers it, because the attitude seems to be more often about women being incomplete without a man as opposed to the child he could provide her with.

I believe that the root is the belief that a woman needs to be validated by having a family (a man as well as children) and as the clock starts ticking she is running out of time to get it.

metrovelvet · 29-12-2008 4:09pm

From Andy Rooney-

A woman over 30 will never wake you in the middle of the night to ask, "What are you thinking?" She doesn't care what you think.

If a woman over 30 doesn't want to watch the game, she doesn't sit around whining about it! . She does something she wants to do. And, it's usually something more interesting.

A woman over 30 knows herself well enough to be assured in who she is, what she is, what she wants and from whom. Few women past the age of 30 give a damn what you might think about her or what she's doing.

Women over 30 are dignified. They seldom have a screaming match with you at the opera or in the middle of an expensive restaurant. Of course, if you deserve it, they won't hesitate to shoot you, if they think they can get away with it.

Older women are generous with praise, often undeserved. They know what it's like to be unappreciated.

A woman over 30 has the self-assurance to introduce you to her women friends. A younger woman with a man will often ignore even her best friend because she doesn't trust the guy with other women. Women over 30 couldn't care less if you're attracted to her friends because she knows her friends won't betray her.

Women get psychic as they age. You never have to confess your sins to a woman over 30. They always know.

A woman over 30 looks good wearing bright red lipstick. This is not true of younger women.

Once you get past a wrinkle or two, a woman over 30 is far sexier than her younger counterpart.

Older women are forthright and honest. They'll tell you right off if you are a jerk if you are acting like one! You don't ever have to wonder where you stand with her.

Yes, we praise women over 30 for a multitude of reasons. Unfortunately, it's not reciprocal. For every stunning, smart, well-coiffed hot woman of 30+, there is a bald, paunchy relic in yellow pants making a fool of himself with some 22-year-old waitress.

Karen_* · 29-12-2008 4:14pm

seahorse wrote: »

I'd actually love to think that Karen; maybe I'm just more sensitive then you but I just assume people are saying what they truly think but wouldn't have the guts to say in a situation where they might possibly be running the risk of a dig in the face. In fairness it's probably a bit of both and many other things besides depending on the individual; we don't want to be getting into any negative generalisations here!

I think its a bit of both. People say things they wouldn't dare say to your face and also its a bit of how people feel on the day.

I'm very sensitive. I let opinions really bother me at times but at the end of the day who the hell cares what unreggedgob****e thinks? If people think that single women in their thirties are desperate then let them. I'm certainly not desperate but even if I was then I'm entitled to be. Sod everyone else. You'd swear it was a crime to want kids or to get married. Well its not and its very ok to want good things to happen in your life.

CDfm · 29-12-2008 4:16pm

It could be thats how women view themselves or are viewed by other women.

Dudess · 29-12-2008 4:19pm

Probably the biological clock, but I also think it's because there's a view prevalent that women older than 29 are old and past it and unattractive and unlovable and undesirable - I've seen this view expressed on Boards a fair bit (by both genders). And unfortunately, some 30-something women cave in to it and thus view themselves in the same terms, making them panic about finding a man because they "don't deserve" one as much as they did a few years ago. It's a shame they help perpetuate such a view instead of dismissing it. And it's a shame they take so seriously the views of obviously stupid people. Whenever there are "what age are you?" threads, the women over 30 (and sometimes even younger) practically apologise for being so old...

seahorse · 29-12-2008 4:24pm

Karen_* wrote: »

.. If people think that single women in their thirties are desperate then let them. I'm certainly not desperate but even if I was then I'm entitled to be. Sod everyone else. You'd swear it was a crime to want kids or to get married. Well its not and its very ok to want good things to happen in your life.

You have a very refreshing attitude Karen I have to say; those comments really put a smile on my face. "I'm certainly not desperate but even if I was then I'm entitled to be." ha ha

CDfm · 29-12-2008 4:27pm

Dudess wrote: »

Probably the biological clock, but I also think it's because there's a view prevalent that women older than 29 are old and past it and unattractive and unlovable and undesirable - I've seen this view expressed on Boards a fair bit (by both genders). And unfortunately, some 30-something women cave in to it and thus view themselves in the same terms, making them panic about finding a man because they "don't deserve" one as much as they did a few years ago. It's a shame they help perpetuate such a view instead of dismissing it. And it's a shame they take so seriously the views of obviously stupid people. Whenever there are "what age are you?" threads, the women over 30 (and sometimes even younger) practically apologise for being so old...

Sweeping generalisations are my department.

I honestly cant see why women of thirty think they are unattractive. Its a social construct maybe to do with childbirth deaths and risks years ago.

Many girls in their 20s are little more than children themselves and many behave that way.

Viva la 30 plus

Wibbs · 29-12-2008 4:29pm

ntlbell wrote: »

For the majority of your "real" life you tend to choose who you listen to and be around most of the time.

On the internet you don't get that luxury so you're more inclined to be listening to some complete and utter socially/emotional retard.

Good points all. I think the first part of that is very true. Most people especially as they age get into a habit of surrounding themselves with like minded people. Which is cool, but they get locked into that too, which is not so cool. better to be constantly challenged intellectually and by contrary opinions as much as possible. I make a point to seek out people who disagree with me, even the muppets. The more they challenge my deeply held beliefs the better. For me anyway.

The second part is very true, especially on the web for obvious reasons. There are more and more people getting to adulthood who haven't had the edges knocked off them by the rough and the smooth of adult interaction.

metrovelvet wrote:

From Andy Rooney......

Yea ok, but a tad overdone and too much of a feel good oprahism for me I must admit. I can think of a fair few 25 year old women who would tick a lot of those boxes and a fair few 35 year old women who wouldn't. I will admit I would have less patience with a 35 year old(man or woman) consistently acting like a muppet. By that stage all bets are off. Inexperience is no longer an excuse.

A lot of it is down to fertility biology though. All things being equal, most of the triggers for reproductive fitness in women are based on youth signals. Most of the triggers for reproductive fitness in men aren't. That's in general of course. A good looking woman of 35 is still going to be more attractive than a not so good looking woman of 25. On purely the looks side anyway. I do think that a lot of it comes from the idea that a lot of women(and men too) let themselves go when they hit their 30's(and earlier) and that's never attractive.

The male side is different for the most part. I know that at 25 I had far less success with women than at 35. No doubt about it. If my 25 year old self was chatting up a woman of 25 and then my 35 year old self walked in, it would be game over for my 25 year old persona. I mean I looked the same. A few extra grey hairs and that's it. So the deciding factor would be my age/maturity/whatever. I really don't think the reverse would hold true if I was a woman.

Karen_* · 29-12-2008 4:32pm

seahorse wrote: »

You have a very refreshing attitude Karen I have to say; those comments really put a smile on my face. "I'm certainly not desperate but even if I was then I'm entitled to be." ha ha

Well Seahorse I don't see any law saying I can't be desperate, a psycho, a slapper, insecure, needy and the list goes on. I've had it very tough an that gives me the right to have been affected by it. So what if someone on a message board doesn't like it or thinks I'm wrong? I think I'm great! And I'm right, I AM great. Go live my life and then come back and tell me how I should be is what I say. And If I want to be man mad and crave kids well then thats fine too. I'll just suit myself and sod everyone else:D;)

seahorse · 29-12-2008 4:33pm

Dudess wrote: »

Probably the biological clock, but I also think it's because there's a view prevalent that women older than 29 are old and past it and unattractive and unlovable and undesirable - I've seen this view expressed on Boards a fair bit (by both genders). And unfortunately, some 30-something women cave in to it and thus view themselves in the same terms, making them panic about finding a man because they "don't deserve" one as much as they did a few years ago. It's a shame they help perpetuate such a view instead of dismissing it. And it's a shame they take so seriously the views of obviously stupid people. Whenever there are "what age are you?" threads, the women over 30 (and sometimes even younger) practically apologise for being so old...

Well Jesus, I've certainly no apologies to make for being 'so old' lol. To be honest I wouldn't go back to my early twenties for anything or anyone. My life is a million miles happier now than it was at that age. I also know for a fact I'm a far better person to be involved with and be around than I was then, and I mean in every way; mentally, emotionally, physically, the whole lot.

I think if a thirty-something woman is buying into the idea that she's less worthy now than she was ten years ago then she cant have done the emotional maturing you'd expect over that span of time.

ntlbell · 29-12-2008 4:35pm

Dudess wrote: »

Probably the biological clock, but I also think it's because there's a view prevalent that women older than 29 are old and past it and unattractive and unlovable and undesirable - I've seen this view expressed on Boards a fair bit (by both genders). And unfortunately, some 30-something women cave in to it and thus view themselves in the same terms, making them panic about finding a man because they "don't deserve" one as much as they did a few years ago. It's a shame they help perpetuate such a view instead of dismissing it. And it's a shame they take so seriously the views of obviously stupid people. Whenever there are "what age are you?" threads, the women over 30 (and sometimes even younger) practically apologise for being so old...

It's not exclusive to women tho....

Men can feel the same...

The body is changing and unless you're working very hard at it from a physical point of view things aren't getting any better.

Men start to spread, they might be finding grey hair's or the baldness is kicking in or a bit of a turkey neck etc and if you were very attractive in your twenties this can be a huge bashing to your self confidence and self esteem but if you were always fairly average or a bit of a minger then this won't affect you as much as it would if you were a bit of a stunner..

If you have counted previously on your good looks and physical attractivness to "catch" men and they're starting to vanish rightly or wrongly it will cause a bit of anxiety i'm sure

I don't think women are stupid for thinking the above in a lot of cases it will be the reality of the situation...

it would be nice to think the match making of the world boils down to one having a great personality but even in your 30's it's just not the case...

Why are single 30+ women portrayed as 'desperate'?

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