Irish Squad/Ireland XV for Six Nations?

Twin-go

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Your idea of fair share is definitly completely different to mine. Magners league stats and GPL for murphy.

Ian dowling - Apps: 46 Tries 6
Luke fitzgerald - Apps: 31 Tries 11
Rob Kearney - Apps: 45 Tries 10
Shane horgan - Apps 59 Tries 25
Tommy Bowe - Apps: 72 Tries 30
Johne Murphy - Apps 38: Tires 12

I think I said Socres AND CREATES. Good in defence also.

But thanks for the stats looking all over the place for them.

Twin-go

Goose81 wrote: »

The Sexton decision is so puzzling theres definitely more to it.

Maybe Kidney just wants to talk to the lad,obviously his contract is up at the end of the season and maybe Kidney is desperate for him to stay in ireland and to try to find out what has gone wrong.

I mean if you were looking for a player in the mould of ROG,then Sexton would be the closest in the type of game he plays.

He has obviously seen something in the lad he likes.

+1

I do think thats what Kidney's thinking is.

RugbyFanatic

Goose81 wrote: »

The Sexton decision is so puzzling theres definitely more to it.

Maybe Kidney just wants to talk to the lad,obviously his contract is up at the end of the season and maybe Kidney is desperate for him to stay in ireland and to try to find out what has gone wrong.

I mean if you were looking for a player in the mould of ROG,then Sexton would be the closest in the type of game he plays.

He has obviously seen something in the lad he likes.

Probably still remembers a 20year old Sexton stepping up in Thomond Park and putting Munster to the sword. If he can get him back to that form then great but I can't see it happening especially within the time period left until the 6nations if Kidney is thinking more long term however then thats a great sign.

Chucky the tree

Twin-go wrote: »

I think I said Socres AND CREATES. Good in defence also.

But thanks for the stats looking all over the place for them.

I know you said creates, but since your pretty far of on your idea that he scores alot. What you should of said is "He scores very little, but creates alot". I dont really agree that he creates alot either, not for a winger. I'd agree that Fitz,kearney bowe, murphysx2 can create more because they are much better attacking players.

His defence is great and his position is great. He's a very solid player, but he's not good enough to be an international wing.

premierstone

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

the difference being when has Sexton proven himself internationally? If Sexton churned out top class performances for Ireland like Horgan has done then yes he should be at least up for consideration for the international squad but the fact has he hasn't.

If Horgan plays as poor as he has been and still makes the 22 believe me I will be the first to be complaining.

Point taken I was just very suprised and annoyed (still am ) at people berating Dowling and Horgans inclusion being just taken for granted, I like most people would have like to see Johne Murphy included but I think its incredibally unfair that Dowling be the scapegoat in all of this

Chucky the tree

Goose81 wrote: »

The Sexton decision is so puzzling theres definitely more to it.

Maybe Kidney just wants to talk to the lad,obviously his contract is up at the end of the season and maybe Kidney is desperate for him to stay in ireland and to try to find out what has gone wrong.

I mean if you were looking for a player in the mould of ROG,then Sexton would be the closest in the type of game he plays.

He has obviously seen something in the lad he likes.

Why though? So he can sit on the bench and pick splinters out of his ass? No one can argue that Cullen and Jennings moving to Lecister was the best decision they could of made. If the IRFU/EOS/Kidney didnt have such a stupid policy of avoiding selecting foregin based players we would be in much better shape I think.

I dont know why he didnt put humphries in the squad. He could of had humphries and sexton in the team then have humphries in the Ireland 22 for France and let Sexton get some game time in the A match. Sexton is the player that needs so playing time and not humphries.

Goose81

Because Leinsters a big club.If he got a move to the premiership it would prob be to division 2 or very low prem level,where he would probably sit on the bench even more.

At least Kidney could try to influence Leinster to play him,whereas he cant do that if he moves.

RugbyFanatic

Goose81 wrote: »

At least Kidney could try to influence Leinster to play him,whereas he cant do that if he moves.

With the way Nacewa is playing at 10 and the rumours of Contepomi leaving Leinster might not have much choice anyway.

premierstone

Its a pity Cheika didnt show the same faith when he went and signed Howell back, that cant have done Sextons confidence much good

Chucky the tree

Goose81 wrote: »

Because Leinsters a big club.If he got a move to the premiership it would prob be to division 2 or very low prem level,where he would probably sit on the bench even more.

At least Kidney could try to influence Leinster to play him,whereas he cant do that if he moves.

I dont really see the point staying somewhere you arent getting your game just because it's a big club. Although with the way Kidney selected this team it seems that being at a big club is alot more important then playing regular rugby.

Noopti

Some strange decisions alright. Hopefully we will have a more clued in picture when the squad is trimmed down a bit.

I have no problem with Dowling being in the squad though. He is a very useful and committed player who would be beneficial to many a team.

il gatto

Sexton in ahead of Humphries? Wha? I see we're back to ignoring form again. That's b@llocks. Humphries has been playing excellent rugby consistantly this season for Ulster. Sexton has been making an ass groove on the bench after a shaky start to the season. Even Keatley should've been ahead if form is taken into account in any way. There's some politiking going on somewhere. I'm p1ssed off with that.

thehighground

il gatto wrote: »

Sexton in ahead of Humphries? Wha? I see we're back to ignoring form again. That's b@llocks. Humphries has been playing excellent rugby consistantly this season for Ulster. Sexton has been making an ass groove on the bench after a shaky start to the season. Even Keatley should've been ahead if form is taken into account in any way. There's some politiking going on somewhere. I'm p1ssed off with that.

Sexton isn't necessarily ahead of Humphreys. It looks to me as if Humphreys will start in the 'As' against the Saxons and the 'A's will need a back-up fly-half which will probably be Sexton (well, its unlikely to be ROG as he will have France the next day ).

And do you really think its wise that Humphreys or Keatley's first cap could be against France in a full-blown international in front of 82K people? Their confidence could be shattered and it could take years to come back from it (think Tommy Bowe against France). In fairness as well, you are exagerating about Humphreys' season - he only started about the last 5 games and up to that Niall O'Connor was first choice. :rolleyes:

Chucky the tree

thehighground wrote: »

Sexton isn't necessarily ahead of Humphreys. It looks to me as if Humphreys will start in the 'As' against the Saxons and the 'A's will need a back-up fly-half which will probably be Sexton (well, its unlikely to be ROG as he will have France the next day ).

And do you really think its wise that Humphreys or Keatley's first cap could be against France in a full-blown international in front of 82K people? Their confidence could be shattered and it could take years to come back from it (think Tommy Bowe against France). In fairness as well, you are exagerating about Humphreys' season - he only started about the last 5 games and up to that Niall O'Connor was first choice. :rolleyes:

I'd rather humphries come off the bench then someone who doesnt take the kicking duties regularly.

thehighground

Chucky the tree wrote: »

I'd rather humphries come off the bench then someone who doesnt take the kicking duties regularly.

I'd rather we scored trys (5 pointers) than depend on winning by kicking penalties/conversions.

Edit: and would you be happy that he wouldn't freak out for his first international kick in front of 82k people?
What if he missed? Ian Humphreys has spont most his career (up to about a month ago) as 2/3rd choice at Leicester.

anonymous_joe

thehighground wrote: »

I'd rather we scored trys (5 pointers) than depend on winning by kicking penalties/conversions.

Edit: and would you be happy that he wouldn't freak out for his first international kick in front of 82k people?
What if he missed? Ian Humphreys has spont most his career (up to about a month ago) as 2/3rd choice at Leicester.

I'd have thought, might be wrong, but I'd have assumed Humphreys'd be better able to cope with the pressure better than Sexton.

This year Humphreys was forced to improve a weak facet of his game (his defence) or fail to earn a place in his team - he's met that challenge and played superbly. Sexton, who clearly has some talent, though how much has sadly been put up for debate, has failed on several occasions to meet the challenges he's facing.

Not only is he unprepared in terms of form and game time, what kind of signals does it send out whereby an off form player is given a place at the expense of two better performing out-halves in Humphreys and Keatley. (How are Staunton and Hickey doing in England atm btw, in terms of the 10 jersey does anyone know?)

Serenity Now!

thehighground wrote: »

I'd rather we scored trys (5 pointers) than depend on winning by kicking penalties/conversions

I would say that if Ireland won a Slam or the 6N tournament overall, afterwards you wouldn't give a stuff how they did it.

Serenity Now!

Goose81 wrote: »

Because Leinsters a big club.If he got a move to the premiership it would prob be to division 2 or very low prem level,where he would probably sit on the bench even more

Leinster is not a "club". None of the provinces are.

Micky Dolenz

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Leinster is not a "club". None of the provinces are.

thehighground

anonymous_joe wrote: »

I'd have thought, might be wrong, but I'd have assumed Humphreys'd be better able to cope with the pressure better than Sexton.

This year Humphreys was forced to improve a weak facet of his game (his defence) or fail to earn a place in his team - he's met that challenge and played superbly. Sexton, who clearly has some talent, though how much has sadly been put up for debate, has failed on several occasions to meet the challenges he's facing.

Not only is he unprepared in terms of form and game time, what kind of signals does it send out whereby an off form player is given a place at the expense of two better performing out-halves in Humphreys and Keatley. (How are Staunton and Hickey doing in England atm btw, in terms of the 10 jersey does anyone know?)

Humprheys has started about 5 games (I think) in front of crowds that would have no more than 10K at them - most of them with nothing to lose. Big difference to facing France with a team he has spent one week training with in a pivotal position like OH. (The fact that at the age of 27 he had to return to Ulster to be told to improve his defense before he would be picked doesn't say a lot about the coaching in Leicester, does it?)? :rolleyes:

As for what message does it send out with regard to form - that it will take an exceptional player to make their international debut in a pivotal position such as OH against a team such as France. (Yes, Tomas O'Leary did it against the ABs, but he has captained Cork Minors to an All Ireland final, and has played in a H Cup final with Kelleher his opposite SH in front of 80k people).

Anyway, Sexton will be on the bench for the A game against the Sexton! Wallace (or Tomas O'Leary) can split the OH's duties between them. O'Leary had no problem knocking one over agaiinst the Ospreys

RuggieBear

thehighground wrote: »

Anyway, Sexton will be on the bench for the A game against the Sexton! Wallace (or Tomas O'Leary) can split the OH's duties between them. O'Leary had no problem knocking one over agaiinst the Ospreys

Are you saying it is all a battle of wills within his own head!? Coz that's probably true!:D

thehighground

RuggieBear wrote: »

Are you saying it is all a battle of wills within his own head!? Coz that's probably true!:D

lol. by gawd you're right. I think I might have (inadvertently) hit the nail on the head there

Goose81

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Leinster is not a "club". None of the provinces are.

Well im calling leinster a club,if you dont like it hit the ignore button.

If you want to be specific they are a team and not a province.

They represent a province which is defined as
"a territorial unit, almost always an administrative division, within a country or state."
Not a rugby team
Mr smarty pants.

anonymous_joe

thehighground wrote: »

Humprheys has started about 5 games (I think) in front of crowds that would have no more than 10K at them - most of them with nothing to lose. Big difference to facing France with a team he has spent one week training with in a pivotal position like OH. (The fact that at the age of 27 he had to return to Ulster to be told to improve his defense before he would be picked doesn't say a lot about the coaching in Leicester, does it?)? :rolleyes:

As for what message does it send out with regard to form - that it will take an exceptional player to make their international debut in a pivotal position such as OH against a team such as France. (Yes, Tomas O'Leary did it against the ABs, but he has captained Cork Minors to an All Ireland final, and has played in a H Cup final with Kelleher his opposite SH in front of 80k people).

Anyway, Sexton will be on the bench for the A game against the Sexton! Wallace (or Tomas O'Leary) can split the OH's duties between them. O'Leary had no problem knocking one over agaiinst the Ospreys

Leicester's coaching has been quite poor for a number of seasons. ^^

I've seen Sexton do well under pressure, and bottle completely, I quite like the guy's style of play, but I wouldn't dare rely on him given the season that's in it.

In fairness to Humphreys, he's played with and against some of the world's best players (admittedly only at club level) so he's got to be doing something right.

I hate seeing Paddy Wallace at 10 anyway, he always looks out of place, because at teh end of the day, he's a 12 and not a 10.

Chucky the tree

thehighground wrote: »

I'd rather we scored trys (5 pointers) than depend on winning by kicking penalties/conversions.

Edit: and would you be happy that he wouldn't freak out for his first international kick in front of 82k people?
What if he missed? Ian Humphreys has spont most his career (up to about a month ago) as 2/3rd choice at Leicester.

I'd be happier with him taking the kicks then Paddy Wallace anyway. The chaps 26/27 it's time to take off the kid gloves.

RONOC08

[7. Openside
Shane Jennings (St. Mary's College - Leinster)
David Wallace (Garryowen - Munster)
Sean O’Brien (Clontarf - Leinster)

8. Number Eight
Jamie Heaslip (Naas - Leinster)
Denis Leamy (Cork Constitution - Munster)
David Wallace (Garryowen - Munster)

Wallace shpould be eight no question heaslip has been very average latley and leamy is more of a 6 in my opinion + wallace's running game is best used from 8

Goose81

Leamy shouldnt play.

An Ideal backrow imo would be
6-Ferris
7-wallace
8-heaslip

we have to make do with the best we have and although wallace is better at 8,Heaslip has upped his game since the last internationals and deserves spot and Leamy doesnt.

Or you could do

6-Ferris
7-jennings
8-Wallace

Benefit of having an actual 7

thehighground

Chucky the tree wrote: »

I'd be happier with him taking the kicks then Paddy Wallace anyway. The chaps 26/27 it's time to take off the kid gloves.

I'd prefer (more for the supporters sake) if the kid gloves were taken off of against England or Scotland. Definately not France.

thehighground

anonymous_joe wrote: »

Leicester's coaching has been quite poor for a number of seasons. ^^

I've seen Sexton do well under pressure, and bottle completely, I quite like the guy's style of play, but I wouldn't dare rely on him given the season that's in it.

In fairness to Humphreys, he's played with and against some of the world's best players (admittedly only at club level) so he's got to be doing something right.

I hate seeing Paddy Wallace at 10 anyway, he always looks out of place, because at teh end of the day, he's a 12 and not a 10.

I've seen Sexton do very well (despite Felipe giving him a hard time on the pitch!). This may help his confidence being selected.

TBH, I find it a bit strange that at the age of 27 someone has to tell Humphreys that his tackling is weak and he better do something about it!

Stev_o

This is going to be a depressing 6N.

Kidneys selections dont make sense at all and i fail how they will spark a revolution come the opening with France. Oh well come on Wales yeah...woo....defence....*sigh*