Irish Squad/Ireland XV for Six Nations?

twinytwo

Twin-go wrote: »

My Irish XV would be.

15. Murphy/Earls
14. Bowe/Horgan
13. BOD/Trimble
12. Fitzgeald/P. Wallace (Too soon for Darcy)
11. Kearney/Dowling
10. O'Gara/Sexton
9. O'Leary/Reddan
8. Wallace/Heaslip
7. Leamy/Ferris
6. Ferris/Quinlan
5. O'Callaghan/O'Driscoll
4. O'Connell/Ryan
3. Hayes/Ross
2. Flannery/Best
1. Horan/Buckley

And you would not put our most talented FB at FB why??... and if timble every sees a green jesery again let alone the 13 one ill cry. And i think we all know at this stage that fitz is better on the wing than at 12

Noopti

Captain is to be announced next week according to:

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/irish-news/oconnell-the-peoples-pick-for-captain-1609743.html

If it isn't O'Connell I will eat my hat, if I had one.

RugbyFanatic

Noopti wrote: »

Captain is to be announced next week according to:

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/irish-news/oconnell-the-peoples-pick-for-captain-1609743.html

If it isn't O'Connell I will eat my hat, if I had one.

I think after his recent performances that it is definitely going to O'Connell in fact I would put my house on it.

Amazotheamazing

twinytwo wrote: »

And you would not put our most talented FB at FB why??... and if timble every sees a green jesery again let alone the 13 one ill cry. And i think we all know at this stage that fitz is better on the wing than at 12

It might be true that Fitz is better on the wing, but does that mean he's any good on the wing? Does he have the pace for it?

He should probably move to a club where he would get games at fullback. He's not going to get ahead of Kearney at Leinster and runs the risk of becoming a jack of all trades and master of none player if he keeps being swapped around the positions.

Twin-go

rugbymat21 wrote: »

What about this for a starting XV:

15. Rob Kearney
14. Tommy Bowe
13. Darren Cave
12. Luke Fitzgerald
11. Andrew Trimble
10. Ronan O'Gara

9. Redden/Boss

1. Marcus Horan
2. Rory Best
3. John Hayes
4. Ryan Caldwell
5. Paul O'Connell (Captain)
6. Stephen Ferris
7. Shane Jennings
8. Jamie Heaslip

Replacements:

16. Tom Court
17. Jerry Flannery
18. Bob Casey
19. David Wallace
20. Brian O'Driscoll
21. Ian Humphreys
22. Geordan Murphy

This would make a very interesting selection of which i cant see happening in a million years...............

For once we would have a very good attacking backline which we have lacked in recent matches

The in form back row forward at 8 or 7 in eorope right and one of the best ball carriers in the world on the bench. Really!!!!

RuggieBear

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

It might be true that Fitz is better on the wing, but does that mean he's any good on the wing? Does he have the pace for it?

He should probably move to a club where he would get games at fullback. He's not going to get ahead of Kearney at Leinster and runs the risk of becoming a jack of all trades and master of none player if he keeps being swapped around the positions.

a jeremy staunton mark II?:(

Amazotheamazing

RuggieBear wrote: »

a jeremy staunton mark II?:(

I think there's definately a risk of it, though I think Fitz isn't playing in such a high pressure position and his errors aren't either as costly or as noticeable.

I just don't see in what ways his game is progressing since he first broke into the Leinster and Irish squads. He's still great ball in hand, but he's not linking up with other players which prevents him being utilised as a creative centre, he's not very fast, which probably means he'll never be a top level wing, I think he's more suited to fullback at the minute.

But will he ever get games at fullback for Leinster?

Maybe I'm being overly harsh on a very young guy, I just see clear progress in guys like Kearney, Cave and Earls, whereas Fitz, who could be the most talented of them, isn't progressing as much. For example, Earls last year wasn't much of a kicker (in that he didn't do it much), and was very poor defensively, this year his kicking and tackling have been immense. Cave was drifting around in the AIL, and not even doing much there. Kearney has a great chance at starting for the Lions. What's Fitz up to?

RugbyFanatic

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I think there's definately a risk of it, though I think Fitz isn't playing in such a high pressure position and his errors aren't either as costly or as noticeable.

I just don't see in what ways his game is progressing since he first broke into the Leinster and Irish squads. He's still great ball in hand, but he's not linking up with other players which prevents him being utilised as a creative centre, he's not very fast, which probably means he'll never be a top level wing, I think he's more suited to fullback at the minute.

But will he ever get games at fullback for Leinster?

Maybe I'm being overly harsh on a very young guy, I just see clear progress in guys like Kearney, Cave and Earls, whereas Fitz, who could be the most talented of them, isn't progressing as much. For example, Earls last year wasn't much of a kicker (in that he didn't do it much), and was very poor defensively, this year his kicking and tackling have been immense. Cave was drifting around in the AIL, and not even doing much there. Kearney has a great chance at starting for the Lions. What's Fitz up to?

The man is playing out of position. Cheika gave him a chance at wing recently and we all saw the player we all know he can be.

Hes a winger or full back. This nonesense of playing him center is impeeding him. Fitzgerald in most pundits eyes will travel with the lions the question of whether he starts or not will be decided by whether Cheika will play him in his preferred positions.

You don't see progress? He has gone in a very short time from breaking into the Leinster squad to being a regularl starter to Ireland and is currently one of the Leinster's top try scorers. If thats not progress at such a young age I don't know what is.

Amazotheamazing

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

The man is playing out of position. Cheika gave him a chance at wing recently and we all saw the player we all know he can be.

Hes a winger or full back. This nonesense of playing him center is impeeding him. Fitzgerald in most pundits eyes will travel with the lions the question of whether he starts or not will be decided by whether Cheika will play him in his preferred positions.

You don't see progress? He has gone in a very short time from breaking into the Leinster squad to being a regularl starter to Ireland and is currently one of the Leinster's top try scorers. If thats not progress at such a young age I don't know what is.

Like i said, I don't think he has the pace to be a top level wing.

If he's a fullback, will he ever get games there for Leinster?

I don't see a huge improvement in him as a player from when he first arrived on the scene.

RugbyFanatic

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Like i said, I don't think he has the pace to be a top level wing.

If he's a fullback, will he ever get games there for Leinster?

I don't see a huge improvement in him as a player from when he first arrived on the scene.

As far as current Irish wingers go he is faster than almost all of them.

No I can't see him getting Full back with Kearney playing so well but Fitzgerald is excellent on the wing and as stated earlier we would of seen a marked improvement had he been played there

Blured

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I don't see a huge improvement in him as a player from when he first arrived on the scene.

Cant really agree with that - when he arrived he came with all the hype - and showed glimpses of brilliance. He was, however, not really ready for full matches.

Towards the end of last season and the start of this, I think he has progressed immensely. He has bulked up and shored up his defence. I think, like others have said, that playing in the centre hasnt suited him - but I think he will make a world class winger - and is currently the most clinical finisher Leinster (and Ireland?) have.

Podge_irl

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

Fitzgerald in most pundits eyes will travel with the lions the question of whether he starts or not will be decided by whether Cheika will play him in his preferred positions.

Really? I imagine he might travel (though I wouldn't be shocked if he didn't), but I don't think there is any chance of him starting.

Fitzgerald has done well on the wing and is scoring tries. However, he rarely seems to back himself for pace, more often then not he will beat defenders and then look to pass rather then attempting to run it in. He managed to pull of a great bit of skill against Wasps where he beat 3/4 defenders with bugger all room, but then passed straight away rather then making a run for the open line. It was odd.

Amazotheamazing

Podge_irl wrote: »

Really? I imagine he might travel (though I wouldn't be shocked if he didn't), but I don't think there is any chance of him starting.

Fitzgerald has done well on the wing and is scoring tries. However, he rarely seems to back himself for pace, more often then not he will beat defenders and then look to pass rather then attempting to run it in. He managed to pull of a great bit of skill against Wasps where he beat 3/4 defenders with bugger all room, but then passed straight away rather then making a run for the open line. It was odd.

It's only odd if you think he has real pace.

Mind you, even Shane Williams isn't extraordinarily fast, but he's able to change direction suddenly without changing pace, perhaps Fitz will be the same sort of winger.

Maybe I'm being hard on the guy, I'd like to see him do well, but he has to nail down a spot, and imo, that spot should be fullback, and it will have to be with a different team.

bamboozle

Podge_irl wrote: »

Really? I imagine he might travel (though I wouldn't be shocked if he didn't), but I don't think there is any chance of him starting.

Fitzgerald has done well on the wing and is scoring tries. However, he rarely seems to back himself for pace, more often then not he will beat defenders and then look to pass rather then attempting to run it in. He managed to pull of a great bit of skill against Wasps where he beat 3/4 defenders with bugger all room, but then passed straight away rather then making a run for the open line. It was odd.

His quality is not in his speed which is average for a winger but in his side step which is the best i've ever seen, that alone gets him past men, its at this point if their was a runner on his shoulder for the offload we'd see trys aplenty

Serenity Now!

RuggieBear wrote: »

a jeremy staunton mark II?:(

Well, there's a plus side to that: A decent Irish rugby commentator for a change.

RuggieBear

jaysus that's some very thin silver lining you are finding there!

Goose81

If hes used properly then he can be a winger/fullback.
He may be not as secure under the high ball as Kearney,although he is bloody good at it but he is a much more devastating broken field runner.

If the management had any sense,they would get Kearney to catch the ball and give it to fitzgerald if there is any decent space.

Thats why I think hes kind of like murphy whereas Earls and Cave really look like 13's cause they hit specific lines at huge speed and carve defences up that way.
Maybe he might end up at 12 in the future cause imo Earls and Cave are both 13's.

As for does he have the pace,does any Irish player have pace?
No

All of our players are mediocre in the speed department,so there is no reason he couldnt be an international winger for years to come.
Do Ireland or leinster have a sprinting trainer like Margot Wells does at Wasps with Cipriani etc?


As for O'Connell being the people captain?
Which people?
Munster fans.

Everyone I know thinks neither Bod or Poc or Rog are up to to it.

Peter B

RugbyFanatic wrote: »

Fitzgerald in most pundits eyes will travel with the lions the question of whether he starts or not will be decided by whether Cheika will play him in his preferred positions.

I think thats a very premature comment. I do not think he will make the Lions squad unless he improves hugely over the 6 nations. That is if he gets much game time!

Goose81

I would bet he will start every important match at either 12 or 11.

Noopti

Goose81 wrote: »

Everyone I know thinks neither Bod or Poc or Rog are up to to it.

And most people I know think the opposite (well sort of, they think BOD isn't up to it anymore, but that POC most certainly is). At the end of the day everyone is basing their opinions on conjecture, we won't know if POC can do it until he is given the opportunity to consistently do it (not as a replacement when BOD isn't available).

And he is doing it very well with Munster right now, so he at least deserves a shot at it.

Goose81

Noopti wrote: »

And most people I know think the opposite (well sort of, they think BOD isn't up to it anymore, but that POC most certainly is). At the end of the day everyone is basing their opinions on conjecture, we won't know if POC can do it until he is given the opportunity to consistently do it (not as a replacement when BOD isn't available).

And he is doing it very well with Munster right now, so he at least deserves a shot at it.

Poc will always be one of my favourite players.
All im saying as that the media are saying its the peoples choice,what people?.
Maybe the people of Munster but most people I know (Dublin) dont agree,most dont agree with Bod either.

You cant say in the media hes the "peoples choice" .
what interpritation is the journalist taking with "the people"?

The people of Ulster would want Rory best,alot of people in Leinster dont want any of either BOD,Poc or Rog.So the people the journalist is talking about is clearly "the people" of Munster.

It more the heading of this article
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/irish-news/oconnell-the-peoples-pick-for-captain-1609743.html

That I take umbradge to.Why is hugh Farrelly generalising without any facts.

Twin-go

Goose81 wrote: »

If hes used properly then he can be a winger/fullback.
He may be not as secure under the high ball as Kearney,although he is bloody good at it but he is a much more devastating broken field runner.

If the management had any sense,they would get Kearney to catch the ball and give it to fitzgerald if there is any decent space.

Thats why I think hes kind of like murphy whereas Earls and Cave really look like 13's cause they hit specific lines at huge speed and carve defences up that way.
Maybe he might end up at 12 in the future cause imo Earls and Cave are both 13's.

As for does he have the pace,does any Irish player have pace?
No

All of our players are mediocre in the speed department,so there is no reason he couldnt be an international winger for years to come.
Do Ireland or leinster have a sprinting trainer like Margot Wells does at Wasps with Cipriani etc?


As for O'Connell being the people captain?
Which people?
Munster fans.

Everyone I know thinks neither Bod or Poc or Rog are up to to it.

Who do you know?

POC would make a great captain. Passion, Commitment, Respect, Experience, I have never seen him stop to scream at a player for a bad pass while the other team stroll in for another try like other captains may do or have done.

Goose81

Twin-go wrote: »

Who do you know?

POC would make a great captain. Passion, Commitment, Respect, Experience, I have never seen him stop to scream at a player for a bad pass while the other team stroll in for another try like other captains may do or have done.

What a stupid question.
Fellow fans

Stringer cost us a try with a **** pass,I would have eaten the head off a player aswell.Dont turn this into another Bod Bashing,also Bod also has "passion,Commitment,experience,respect" so what new does that bring to the table?
Troll


Poc has never produced the goods the same for Ireland as he has for Munster.
He looses the head to easily imo.
He was a sham on the last Lions tour,yet some are calling for him to be captain on the next.
Can McGeechan take that risk?
Hes undropable if he makes him captain.
Same with Kidney.

Hes too important a player to risk damaging his performances by giving him the captancy.Its already ruined one player.
As I said hes one of my favourite player but I would be weary of him being captain of either.My choice is Rory best and I have made that clear.

Noopti

Goose81 wrote: »

Poc will always be one of my favourite players.
All im saying as that the media are saying its the peoples choice,what people?.
Maybe the people of Munster but most people I know (Dublin) dont agree,most dont agree with Bod either.

You cant say in the media hes the "peoples choice" .
what interpritation is the journalist taking with "the people"?

The people of Ulster would want Rory best,alot of people in Leinster dont want any of either BOD,Poc or Rog.So the people the journalist is talking about is clearly "the people" of Munster.

It more the heading of this article
http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/six-nations/irish-news/oconnell-the-peoples-pick-for-captain-1609743.html

That I take umbradge to.Why is hugh Farrelly generalising without any facts.

Fair enough, the journo could be just pulling "facts" from his arse to make a good headline.

But in all honesty, I think if a poll was conducted as to who should be captain I would be very surprised if O'Connell wasn't at the top. At the end of the day he is the captain of Ireland most successful province and they invariably play a better, more controlled game when he is playing/leading. So if that doesn't indicate a good captain, I don't know what does.

Goose81 wrote: »

Poc has never produced the goods the same for Ireland as he has for Munster.
He looses the head to easily imo.
He was a sham on the last Lions tour,yet some are calling for him to be captain on the next.
Can McGeechan take that risk?
Hes undropable if he makes him captain.
Same with Kidney.

Point 1. Yes he has. I don't know where you are getting that idea from. If you really believe this than you can apply the same logic to Best.
Point 2. He doesn't lose the head at all these days. He is one of the coolest customers on the pitch. The Cudmore incident is strangely enough a great example of that.
Point 3. The last Lions tour was FOUR years ago. He was younger, less experienced and was under a lot of pressure as the "next Martin Johnson"
Point 4: What risk exactly?
Point 5. Undroppable? Yes he is undroppably on current form. And as has happened a lot previously Best and Flannery are constantly interchangeable. So using your logic why would Best be a good captain as he immenently more droppable then POC at the moment.

Goose81

If you think he is as good for Ireland and he is for Munster your deluded.

The risk of making him captain and them him not performing.
Bod probably will get relieved of the captaincy but I still dont think Poc is the man.

Anyway I was more pissed off at the heading of that article,its a disgracefull pirece of journalism.Very disrespectful.

Noopti

Goose81 wrote: »

If you think he is as good for Ireland and he is for Munster your deluded.

Call me deluded then. But he has put in great performances for Ireland, he does it more consistently for Munster but the same could be said for a LOT of Irish players with regards their provinces.

Best right now is playing better for Ulster than he ever has for Ireland. But you still want him as captain. Would you mind explaining that one?

RuggieBear

Goose81 banned.

i've asked you again and again to stop abusing other posters. if you have a problem with a post report it.

Twin-go

Please Vote in the poll I set up. Settle the argument on who the peoples choice is for captain.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055468854

Noopti

Twin-go wrote: »

Please Vote in the poll I set up. Settle the argument on who the peoples choice is for captain.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055468854

Nice one!

twinytwo

Goose81 wrote: »

If hes used properly then he can be a winger/fullback.
He may be not as secure under the high ball as Kearney,although he is bloody good at it but he is a much more devastating broken field runner.

If the management had any sense,they would get Kearney to catch the ball and give it to fitzgerald if there is any decent space.

Thats why I think hes kind of like murphy whereas Earls and Cave really look like 13's cause they hit specific lines at huge speed and carve defences up that way.
Maybe he might end up at 12 in the future cause imo Earls and Cave are both 13's.

As for does he have the pace,does any Irish player have pace?
No

All of our players are mediocre in the speed department,so there is no reason he couldnt be an international winger for years to come.
Do Ireland or leinster have a sprinting trainer like Margot Wells does at Wasps with Cipriani etc?


As for O'Connell being the people captain?
Which people?
Munster fans.

Everyone I know thinks neither Bod or Poc or Rog are up to to it.

then everyone your know is wrong