Waterford Wedgwood suspends trading

shanemul

Waterford Wedgwood has asked that its shares be suspended from trading on the Irish stock exchange. It says certain of the group's UK and Irish subsidiaries have had to go into administration and receivership.
In Ireland the company employs 800 staff. About 1,900 people are employed in the UK.
In Ireland, the ultimate holding company Waterford Wedgwood PLC is in recievership, and joint administrators are to be appointed to the approximately 10 UK companies.
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The receiver of the Irish company says he is seeking a buyer for the company, and wishes to sell it as a going concern.
No other companies other than those in Ireland and the UK have had receivers or administrators appointed. So they trade on, even though they are all subsidiaries of the ultimate holding company.
The company last month reported pre-tax losses of €63.2m for the six months to 4 October. There was a loss of almost €50m a year earlier.


from http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/0105/wedgwood.html

mike65

No one coud be too surprised by this - O'Reilly and the Greek fella were only going to keep injecting thier money for so long.

I really dunno who would take WW on to be honest, a particuarly indulgent muilt-billionaire? Somone in China or the Gulf? They'll need deep pockets cos I don't see any bank on the planet lending.

trishw78

tis a sad day for Waterford

Cabaal

Hardly shocking alright as sad as it is to say,

gscully

If I've been hearing correctly, Waterford Crystal itself is making a profit, but Wedgwood is the drain on the whole company.

If the receivers come in, can someone take Crystal as a seperate entity and continue business?

BlaasForRafa

gscully wrote: »

If I've been hearing correctly, Waterford Crystal itself is making a profit, but Wedgwood is the drain on the whole company.

If the receivers come in, can someone take Crystal as a seperate entity and continue business?

It seems like everything started going wrong when they took over Wedgewood back in the late 80's alright.

Still the Crystal has been reduced from around 3000 workers in 3 sites in 1990 to about 500 at kilbarry now.

Kilbarry could probably make a profit but why would they want to make a small profit when they can make larger profits by outsourcing to china.

Its quite possible that the brand could be sold as intellectual property as it is the brand thats most valuable rather than the workers or machinery.

Its certainly a sad day for sure, hopefully someone might come along and be a white knight, that looks unlikely though

ziedth

Very Sad but I agree with Mike, Its been on the cards for sometime now.

Cabaal

There best hope in Waterford is to retain some of the site as a tourist attraction,

Sully

News today suggest two american companys are in talks with Waterford Wedgwood.

fly_agaric

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

Kilbarry could probably make a profit but why would they want to make a small profit when they can make larger profits by outsourcing to china.

Its quite possible that the brand could be sold as intellectual property as it is the brand thats most valuable rather than the workers or machinery.

In the case of "Waterford Crystal" are the workers and their machinery "working" & "machining" away in Waterford not a key part of the brand?

Manufacturing all the crystal more cheaply in another country with either low cost labour or using a more automated process would seem to damage that aspect of the brand.

BlaasForRafa

fly_agaric wrote: »

In the case of "Waterford Crystal" are the workers and their machinery "working" & "machining" away in Waterford not a key part of the brand?

Manufacturing all the crystal more cheaply in another country with either low cost labour or using a more automated process would seem to damage that aspect of the brand.

Personally I would agree with the workers being an integral part of the brand, that Waterford Crystal without significant manufacturing input in Waterford just isn't right.

I'm not a chairman of a potential multinational buyer and they might have a different view.

And also when people buy Waterford Crystal...do they know where Waterford is? Do they even know that Waterford Crystal comes from Ireland?

Trotter

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

And also when people buy Waterford Crystal...do they know where Waterford is? Do they even know that Waterford Crystal comes from Ireland?

I know of one American who was surprised to know that Waterford was actually a place. He thought that it was just the name of crystal. Thats a strong brand right there

Sully

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

And also when people buy Waterford Crystal...do they know where Waterford is? Do they even know that Waterford Crystal comes from Ireland?

The amount of tourists coming to the South East in general just for the Crystal Factory is pretty big. Its one of our big tourism sellers which is why everyone including the Hotel Federation are trying to stop the company moving from Waterford as it will have consequences for tourism. They usually stay in Tramore/Waterford for a day just to visit the factory and move onto Cork the next day

honeybadger

i was reading the above and was tinking did any of ye read about bono of u2 buying into palm pc handheld ****e for wel we all need jobs to own 1 haha ,but was tinking aswell can the irish bale out the out the irish in d curent cimate wot ye tink

gscully

honeybadger wrote: »

i was reading the above and was tinking did any of ye read about bono of u2 buying into palm pc handheld ****e for wel we all need jobs to own 1 haha ,but was tinking aswell can the irish bale out the out the irish in d curent cimate wot ye tink

Any chance you could edit that just one more time so the rest of us can understand it?

Seriously, the annoying text format should be banned on discussion forums!

gscully

Sully wrote: »

The amount of tourists coming to the South East in general just for the Crystal Factory is pretty big. Its one of our big tourism sellers which is why everyone including the Hotel Federation are trying to stop the company moving from Waterford as it will have consequences for tourism. They usually stay in Tramore/Waterford for a day just to visit the factory and move onto Cork the next day

Exactly. If Waterford Crystal does go completely, then there will be no cruise ships sailing up the Suir anymore and local trade will suffer even more. The loss of Waterford Crystal will have a more widespread effect on the local community than the higher-profile Dell in Limerick in my opinion.

ziedth

I was talking to chap in the gym the other day someone he know's was offerd the bones of 150k and his full pension at 65 in november to leave the company but he said no.

Now he'll be lucky to get his pension from what I hear the money from the fund was used elsewhere.

Would you not just beyond sickened?

mike65

Offered 150k and didn't take it? Boy a sickener - the sort of money you could pay your mortage off with.

ziedth

mike65 wrote: »

Offered 150k and didn't take it? Boy a sickener - the sort of money you could pay your mortage off with.

Since when did you stop signing your name Mike?

longshanks

150k?? i thought they put a cap of 17 years on the redundancy payments. thats nearly 9k for each of those 17 years. jesus, who'd turn that down in a factory that was dying a slow death?

Sully

gscully wrote: »

Seriously, the annoying text format should be banned on discussion forums!

It kinda is.. but depends on the forum. I dont like instant bans for text speech - im sure the poster will post normally from now on tho.

mike65

ziedth wrote: »

Since when did you stop signing your name Mike?

Since about a month ago. I ran a programme that showed I was wasted
10.55 hours over 7 years & 7 months, signing my name!

gotcha09

ziedth wrote: »

I was talking to chap in the gym the other day someone he know's was offerd the bones of 150k and his full pension at 65 in november to leave the company but he said no.

Now he'll be lucky to get his pension from what I hear the money from the fund was used elsewhere.

Would you not just beyond sickened?

i know people who retired from the factory who have now lost their pensions.. these people retired maybe a year ago or more.. so he probably would have lost his pension if he did take it then...

Sully

Ya I heard about the early retirement offers but didnt think they were was good as previous offers put on the table a few years back!

wellbutty

The deal in 2005 was 6 weeks pay per year service capped at 2 years salary, hence the 17 year optimum.

The deal in 2007/2008 was 5 weeks pay per year service capped at 3 years salary. Some turned this down, losing at least 150 grand now.

This deal was then changed to statutory up front and then weekly payments for 12 months. These payments have also been cut off.

Anyone that left last year and was of "pensionable age" are ok now, they're drawing down their full entitlement. Anyone that left last year to fill in a few years before reaching "pensionable age" are now in the same position as employees.

Imagine putting 60-80 euro week into a mandatory pension fund for all that time and then find you've been left with nothing. An absolute disgrace, considering the chauffer-driven CEO was pulling a million a year out of the place

south

John Foley has stepped down from the company..

wellbutty

John Foley has stepped down from the company..

John Foley was stepped down from the company..

robtri

wellbutty wrote: »

Imagine putting 60-80 euro week into a mandatory pension fund for all that time and then find you've been left with nothing. An absolute disgrace, considering the chauffer-driven CEO was pulling a million a year out of the place

That is a bloody disgrace, whoever is responsible for the overseeing of that fund shoud be held accountable.
Mind you I do think is is a bit much that the unions want the government to bail out the pension fund to the tune of €100million.....
don't get me wrong I have every sympathy for all the employees of the company but come on asking the rest of the country to pay for it.....

gscully

robtri wrote: »

That is a bloody disgrace, whoever is responsible for the overseeing of that fund shoud be held accountable.
Mind you I do think is is a bit much that the unions want the government to bail out the pension fund to the tune of €100million.....
don't get me wrong I have every sympathy for all the employees of the company but come on asking the rest of the country to pay for it.....

I understand what you're saying, but the government are bailing out banks that I do no business with, yet I'm paying towards that through my tax.

The banks are culpable for their own downfall. The employees of WC never had a chance!

ziedth

gscully wrote: »

I understand what you're saying, but the government are bailing out banks that I do no business with, yet I'm paying towards that through my tax.

The banks are culpable for their own downfall. The employees of WC never had a chance!

TBF its not exactly as black and white as that, though i'd love to see the banks go under as at the end of the day they are business who are failing and no different then any other business we work for, the economic implications of the banks going under is much much worse then a few hundred people not getting their pensions in the grand scheme of things.

I have complete and utter sympathy for anyone in waterford crystal stung by this but if joe tax payer bails them out where does it end?

gscully

ziedth wrote: »

TBF its not exactly as black and white as that, though i'd love to see the banks go under as at the end of the day they are business who are failing and no different then any other business we work for, the economic implications of the banks going under is much much worse then a few hundred people not getting their pensions in the grand scheme of things.

I have complete and utter sympathy for anyone in waterford crystal stung by this but if joe tax payer bails them out where does it end?

I agree, but my point is purely that we, the taxpayer, are bailing out something or someone we've no interest in whatsoever because the government choose to use our money that way.