Bulbs - What is going on!

CutzEr

*I spent 20 minutes looking for the right section to post this in, But it is probably still the wrong one so move it please if I have posted it in the wrong section

The goverment said last year, That they were banning regular bulbs. In place of this is 'CFL bulbs'.

There was to be a ban of regular bans taken into place on January 1st 2009.

WHAT HAPPENED!!

Regular bulbs are still on sale, I have seen no word AT ALL that they are banned.. Newspapers.. Tv's.. Online.. NOWHERE!

I would just like to point this out.. As it is a mockery of what the goverment stands for. :pac: yes I know it is a mockery already haha joke over

CJhaughey

The Green Party wanted to be the first in EU to BAN incandescent bulbs.
Sooo they made a big hoo-haa about banning them, but as they got into power and actually were confronted with the uncomfortable truth that actually banning incandescents was nearly impossible for various reasons.
Number 1 being that there is no CFL replacements for many bulbs.
How then do you actually ban something which there is no replacement for?
Do people simply rip out all the light fittings in their houses and plaster over the holes?
The whole thing was simply an election stunt that has left a bad taste in peoples mouths.
And we have minister Ryan on today telling us to expect a Carbon tax by the end of the year?
Has he not noticed that we are already being taxed out of existence and we have nothing to show for the taxes that we pay already?
All I can say is that I rue the day I ever thought the greens might help us.
I am looking forward to the day that the local green candidate shows up at my doorstep.

wazzoraybelle

Although incandescents are inefficient at doing their job,i.e producing light,they don't waste energy as the heat they produce is lost into the room they are in. Also at present there are many situations where alternatives won't work effectively such as p.i.r. fittings where instant light is required.
I use quite a few cfl's at home and have to say I'm disappointed in them in terms of quality of light and lifespan.
That said I look forward to using low energy bulbs when the technology is there.

Cabaal

CutzEr,
Your ranting and ravying and yet you asre not aware it was actually March 2009 is the cut off date, nothing to do with 1st January 2009

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/1010/energy.html

Traditional light bulbs are to be phased out, with half of the range being banned from shops by March of next year.

The policy is being introduced by Minister for the Environment John Gormley in order to reduce the greenhouse gases which contribute to climate change, but also as a way consumers can make significant savings on their energy costs.

According to Sustainable Energy Ireland, energy efficient light bulbs use 20% of the energy compared to traditional bulbs and last up to 10 times longer - making real savings for consumers, while lowering Ireland's carbon emissions.
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Mr Gormley's bright idea is to phase out the sale of energy inefficient bulbs in a four-stage process; the first to go, from March, will be traditional bulbs with an electrical power consumption rating of 75 watts or more.

The plan is contained in a 14-page consultation paper which contains some highly technical detail over what bulbs will be discontinued, and when, up to the year 2012.

Minister Gormley maintains that the Irish light bulb industry, which had been hostile to his plans, is now onboard following lengthy negotiations.

Not the gov's fault really, its been delayed due to EU laws and we're now looking at 2015 - http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0104/energy.html The delay is nothing to do with the bulbs perhaps being unsuitable for some uses and is instead to do with selling laws in the EU....take the red bull example.

A European Commission spokesman has confirmed that the Government would have a problem if it wanted to ban incandescent light bulbs by the end of the year.

Environment Minister John Gormley has insisted that there is no disagreement between his department and the EU Commission.

The problem would emerge because under EU mutual recognition rules that govern the internal market, member states must allow the sale any product that is legally for sale in another member state.
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That would make a ban in Ireland impossible since there would be nothing to stop a retailer sourcing incandescent light bulbs in another member state.

Speaking this evening, the Minister said that the rules of the EU's Internal Market could make exceptions in the case of environmentally progressive measures.

A comparison would be the energy drink Red Bull, which the French government wanted to ban on health grounds. But on legal advice it was found that since other member states sold the drink legally then the French could not apply a ban and the move was withdrawn.

A ban could only come into place if all other member states agreed and the restriction was agreed through the Council of Ministers.

Austria and Germany both wanted to bring in a ban after Australia announced a ban and the advice to those two countries was the same.

The European Commission has a policy of supporting energy saving light bulbs but it is not yet law.

The draft EU directive on the eco design of energy products is currently under discussion. It is aimed at increasing energy efficiency by adapting a range of electrical appliances, particularly those that have stand-by modes.

The directive has drawn together interested parties, from industry, member states, small and medium sized businesses and NGOs to find a way to ensure that electrical goods might in future be more energy efficient.

One option is phasing out incandescent light bulbs in 2009, but the industry, under the European Lamp Companies Federation, wants the phase out to be delayed until 2015.

CutzEr

^^ That is VERY strange, As I am sure I was browsering wiki and saw it was January 1..

*looks*

It's gone

testicle

"The problem would emerge because under EU mutual recognition rules that govern the internal market, member states must allow the sale any product that is legally for sale in another member state."

This can't be true... In that case, we should all be able to buy cannabis, and prostitutes a-la the Netherlands.

Húrin

ffs. How are we going to peak emissions in 2015 if they're delaying something as basic as a tungsten lightbulb ban until then??

Macha

Húrin wrote: »

ffs. How are we going to peak emissions in 2015 if they're delaying something as basic as a tungsten lightbulb ban until then??

Although you could say that light bulbs are small fry compared to things like proper planning, etc in terms of reducing carbon emissions.

EcoBrats

wazzoraybelle wrote: »

I use quite a few cfl's at home and have to say I'm disappointed in them in terms of quality of light and lifespan.
That said I look forward to using low energy bulbs when the technology is there.

You should check out BioBulbs, which you can buy online from ecoshop.ie

These are the only energy saving bulbs I use in my house. They produce such good quality light that I have read they are recommended for those suffering from Seasonal Affected Disorder (SAD).

The_Minister

testicle wrote: »

This can't be true... In that case, we should all be able to buy cannabis, and prostitutes a-la the Netherlands.

Cannabis is not legal in the Netherlands, there is just an official policy of ignoring amounts under a certain size
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_the_Netherlands#Non-enforcement

Cabaal

taconnol wrote: »

Although you could say that light bulbs are small fry compared to things like proper planning, etc in terms of reducing carbon emissions.

Maybe so but its still a good idea to push ahead with them as they'll reduce people';s energy bills, I know they have with mine!

CJhaughey

Maybe they are good, I am yet to be convinced that they last as long as they claim for CFLs and LED's are not great either.
I have been testing them in my own house since 05 and have large range of alternatives in place that still do not fully replace normal incandescents.
But why oh why does it have to be a BAN?
Could you not simply do as they did for carrier bags and levy normal bulbs?
That would make more sense and still allow people to be treated with a degree of civility.
Last time I checked the Scandinavian countries which are a lot more energy concious than here all still sold incandescents.
It seems we need/expect to be treated like kids.
Don't ban them just offer alternatives that are better priced.

Cabaal

If they levyed the old style bulbs they'd have to add about 6e on them to stop people buying them

Keeks

Does anybody know how this ban is working in Australia - or has it even been implemented their yet?

Capt'n Midnight

Cabaal wrote: »

If they levyed the old style bulbs they'd have to add about 6e on them to stop people buying them

Be easier to take the levy of the CFL's then they would be the same price.

McSandwich

Outright banning of incandescent bulbs is ridiculous, offer a better alternative which saves money and people will buy them. Otherwise it just adding to the growing shopping list for Newry.

Even worse is that the 'Green' party want to fast track a ban with no apparent plan. I know in most cases a CFL replacement can be used but CFLs cannot be used with electronic timers, dusk to dawn sensors, etc. due to risk of overheating and fire. The (expensive) 'dimmable' ones don't dim smoothly and often buzz or flicker. I don't use dimmer switches at home but many do and may have to buy more than a new light bulb to continue lighting their living rooms after the ban.

My own experience of CFL bulbs is that their working life is way over rated. The longest one has lasted in my house (under normal conditions) without failure or other problems is about 2 years. Some blow outright while others get dimmer over time, with blackening of the tubes. In all cases the manufacturers replaced them without a problem - I didn't get the impression that they were surprised by the short life of their bulbs.

Part of the problem is low quality bulbs which rubbish electronics made cheaply - as they are effectively disposable. Aside from a shorter life, cheap electronics also lead to a poor power factor which effectively means that 40 watts of power must be generated to power a 20 watt bulb. After the ban the market will be flooded with even more cheap sh*te (I am not aware of any minimum standards for CFL bulbs).

Fluorescent light fittings with a built in (high quality) ballast and electronics are available to replace standard fittings. These are used with lower cost ballast free CFL bulbs (e.g. G24D). It might have been a good idea to require that these be used in all new buildings and renovations - similar to fitting of mains smoke alarms.