UFC 94 BJ PENN VS GSP ***Will Contain Spoilers***

Nothingcompares

GSP.

Penn's fitness? He was getting mauled by a guy 20 lbs heavier. I'm not saying Bj's conditioning was at GSP's level nor am I saying it was at Bj's best (which it could have been) but you're going to gas if you're getting beaten up and out wrestled by someone stronger than you.

dunkamania

Agreed, BJ at his best, is a lightweight, dieticians and stength coaches cant change that. The welterweight division doesnt suit him. BJ was giving away alot of weight to an incredible fighter and athlete, and showed tremendous heart.

ginoginelli

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I'll say it again, neither BJ or his corner gave up.

It was a TKO.

The referee came over and said he was stopping it.
He tried to tell BJ, and BJ ignored him.
He then told BJ's corner, and they just shook their heads.

Herb said I'm stopping it, and asked J.D. did he dispute it.
J.D. said no.

It's down in the books as a TKO.

Simple as that.

I know this personally, cause I'd bet that GSP would win by TKO in the 4th round, and the money I'm getting is all the proof that I need.
For the rest, check out the UFC website.

No thats not correct.

its down as a tko (corner stoppage) on the ufc website. Rewatch it, His corner clearly stops the fight. Bj had no objection to the stoppage either..

PeakOutput

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I'll say it again, neither BJ or his corner gave up.
.

you can say it all you want i hope you get your money

but the fact is that his corner signalled throwing in the towel right after the doc looked at his eyes so either the doc called it and the ref listened or the doc didnt call it and the corner threw in the towel

i dont think it really matters accept for gambling technicalities but he was handed his ass by a better fighter

warrenaldo

Anyone have a link to the GSP Penn fight? I missed it, and my usual links are not working

ta2liam

Nothingcompares wrote: »

every mma fan is a bj fan

No thats not true... i for 1 am not a Bj fan and i know a hell of alot of people who agree with me!

Tim_Murphy

Anyone have a link to the GSP Penn fight? I missed it, and my usual links are not working

I watched it at mma-core.com

Disappointing enough fight in the end, GSP looked in a different class.

DeVore

No more request for links please, if you are enough of a fan you'll buy their product. If you have any cop on you can find links for yourself. This isnt a site for links to copyright material. I appreciate everyone wants to see the fight and that if you missed it you want to watch it now. I know you (plural) are just looking to see it, but we cant and wont tolerate links to bit torrents etc.

Back to discussing the fight now, thanks.


DeV.

Colm_OReilly

My 2 cents.

Despite some mod on this forum spoiling the fight by me by changing his Facebook status (Grrrr!) I was still excited to see this fight.

When I saw the condition BJ Penn was in I figured he hadn't cut much (if any to make weight), something which given GSP's attitude/dedication I reckon he has that aspect down as much as the rest of his game. I wasn't dissappointed as the dude was HYOOOGE! He'd an imposing figure, his shoulders noticably broader and stronger than we'd seen him before.

Can't recall the first round too well now, but GSP failed to get two takedowns and I thought "Van Dammit, that's ruining his takedown %", but he won that round. Round two, he came out and was more dominating, scoring the takedown and Penn had no answer. With each round, Penn looked more and more shocked. I don't know if Penn is surrounded by Yes men or not, but it looked as if his mental fortitude wasn't up the possibility of losing two rounds in a row. (His corner said "You've got to turn this around" at one point, without giving any specific or mechanical instructions on how to do so)

Loved GSP's post fight interview, how he broke down his gameplan. I'm thinking at this point in time he'd beat Silva - would Silva cut to welter tho?

On a personal note 2009 is my year for predictions. I got everyone right on the card bar Karo Parysian - which is a controversial decision anyway.

Colm
-I was impressed with GSP's technique.

Dragan

I think GSP has taken it to another level, very legitimately. He looked good in all facets of the fight, didn't let BJ stuffing his takedowns get to him and worked his game plan.

He has all the physical tools in the world and they now seem to be matched with a strong will and great fight intelligence.

Rollo Tamasi

Are there any post fight video interviews with Penn floating around the place? I want to check out what he has to say about trash talking his opponent, quitting and of course the bruising on his face from getting thumped by GSP!

rovert

Rollo Tamasi wrote: »

Are there any post fight video interviews with Penn floating around the place? I want to check out what he has to say about trash talking his opponent, quitting and of course the bruising on his face from getting thumped by GSP!

Good luck getting them as he was rushed to hospital after the fight so he could be administered fluids.

Nothingcompares

Ignoring the obvious size and strength disadvantage the difference between GSP and BJ Penn seems to be that:

GSP has a coaching staff and he is the student.
BJ is the boss of his training.
GSP gets his game plan from JAckson and abides by it.
BJ makes his own game plan.
GSP trains with people who are the best in the world
BJ trains with his friends.

When BJ was getting battered and wasn't in the position to think any way creatively all he had in his corner was people telling him to try harder. So not only was Bj fighting a size disadvantage he was fighting about 5 people combined into one.

I still think Bj can beat anyone at 155 and I was questioning why Florian, Sherk and Sanchez insist on cutting to 155. GSP and to a lesser extent Alves explain why.

After Alves (who I think he will beat but Alves has a punchers chance) the only fights left for GSP are at 185.

Dragan

I agree completely, when BJ was looking a bit lost there was no one there to pull him back and set him on a different track.

As for GSP, he is getting too big to be able to make 170 for much longer i think.

dunkamania

I read the below two comments from GSP and was just blown away. The first one is from the post fight interview, not to sure about the second one. The strategic thinking from Team Jackson is without equal.

I hear there is a petition for a Anderson GSP superfight at UFC 100......

Well, B.J. Penn is a very fast starter and he has very fast hands. He's got small shoulders if you look at him, like boxing shoulders. So, I wanted to make the first couple rounds a wrestling match. A lot of clinching. A lot of moving around for him to carry my weight so the blood goes to his shoulders. His shoulders would have been heavy. His hands would not come out as fast as usual. Then, after that, pick him apart standing later in the fight.

Actually, the thing with B.J. Penn is that I know he's seen a lot of my fights. When you go into war, you don't want to show all of your weapons. [After] all the talking, I wanted to show some different weapons. That's why I didn't really shoot from far [away] because I was expecting him to try knees to my head. I was faking a lot, if you saw, because he has very fast reaction time, but a slow reset time. All that, I've been studying. When I do something, he reacts very fast. Faster than I, faster than most fighters in the UFC. But if I fake something, and he reacts - and the brain is just a muscle - he takes a lot of time to reset and to be able to react as fast for the first shot. He had a very slow reset time, so my strategy was to fake him, make him react, and then attack him.

Colm_OReilly

Genius apparently unparalleled in MMA at this point in time. Pinpoint accuracy on a gameplan. And I'd wager there was more to it.

Question: Does Jackson have other up and comers? So we may separate the system from the fighter.

ta2liam

Dragan wrote: »

I agree completely, when BJ was looking a bit lost there was no one there to pull him back and set him on a different track.

As for GSP, he is getting too big to be able to make 170 for much longer i think.

i disagree GSP weighted in at bang on 170 where as alot of fighters used the 1 pound allowed over rule. as u can see from the weight in results there is only a number of fighters that actually make the weight in bang on the limit

Georges St. Pierre (170) vs. B.J. Penn (168)

Lyoto Machida (206) vs. Thiago Silva (206)
Karo Parisyan (170) vs. Dong Hyun Kim (171)
Nathan Diaz (156) vs. Clay Guida (156) 155
Stephan Bonnar (206) vs. Jon Jones (206)
Jon Fitch (171) vs. Akihiro Gono (171)
Manny Gamburyan (155) vs. Thiago Tavares (155)
Chris Wilson (170) vs. John Howard (171)
Jake O'Brien (205) vs. Christian Wellisch (206)
Matt Arroyo (171) vs. Dan Cramer (171)

there is alot on new talent coming up the ranks of the WW division, i think GSP will be kept busy for a while. but i would like to see him in the MW in the future.

Dragan

ta2liam wrote: »

i disagree GSP weighted in at bang on 170 where as alot of fighters used the 1 pound allowed over rule. as u can see from the weight in results there is only a number of fighters that actually make the weight in bang on the limit

That simply means he can cut weight. I wouldn't take a fighter being 1 pound over to mean anything...as the majority of them cut down.

GSP has said himself in recent interviews that he is getting bigger and heavier and he won't stay at 185 forever.

As for their only being a number of fighters who can make the weight limit bang on, i disagree, the vast majority of fighters will weight exactly the weight limit on fight night.

ta2liam

Dragan wrote: »

That simply means he can cut weight. I wouldn't take a fighter being 1 pound over to mean anything...as the majority of them cut down.

GSP has said himself in recent interviews that he is getting bigger and heavier and he won't stay at 185 forever.

As for their only being a number of fighters who can make the weight limit bang on, i disagree, the vast majority of fighters will weight exactly the weight limit on fight night.

Thats what i'm saying, fighters that cut down are finding it hard to make weight hence the 1 pound over rule. for example john hathaway weighted 188 pounds 4 days before the weight in at UFC 93, made the 170 weight limit (he was actually 171) and on the night of the fight he was back up to 184 pounds. GSP is the same and doesn't have a problem cutting weight so why would he move up a weight class?

Colm_OReilly

Colm_OReilly wrote: »

My 2 cents.

Despite some mod on this forum spoiling the fight by me by changing his Facebook status (Grrrr!) I was still excited to see this fight.

What can I say! It didn't even cross my mind! Sorry bout that!!

ginoginelli

Dragan wrote: »

That simply means he can cut weight. I wouldn't take a fighter being 1 pound over to mean anything...as the majority of them cut down.

GSP has said himself in recent interviews that he is getting bigger and heavier and he won't stay at 185 forever.

As for their only being a number of fighters who can make the weight limit bang on, i disagree, the vast majority of fighters will weight exactly the weight limit on fight night.

That doesnt make sense.

You say most of them are cutting down? yet most of them will weigh the weight limit on fight night?

Most of them will be over the limit once rehydrated..Hence the need for the cut in the first place..

dunkamania

Title fights dont get the 1 pound over the limit allowance, and must weigh-in at the exact weight.

Dragan

ta2liam wrote: »

Thats what i'm saying, fighters that cut down are finding it hard to make weight hence the 1 pound over rule. for example john hathaway weighted 188 pounds 4 days before the weight in at UFC 93, made the 170 weight limit (he was actually 171) and on the night of the fight he was back up to 184 pounds. GSP is the same and doesn't have a problem cutting weight so why would he move up a weight class?

Because as we get older it can be harder and harder to cut, it's about that simple. GSP has always been a decent sized Welterweight, right now he is a very, very big Welterweight. He either needs to reign in the myoplasia or end up struggling to cut to 170.

ginoginelli wrote: »

That doesnt make sense.

You say most of them are cutting down? yet most of them will weigh the weight limit on fight night?

Most of them will be over the limit once rehydrated..Hence the need for the cut in the first place..

Yes, most fighters will "cut weight" through dehydration techniques to make the weight class. They do this to be within their chosen weight limit for fighting, on the day of weigh ins.

There ya go, exactly what i original said, i just reworded it.

ginoginelli

Danas last blog for 94..

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=rd2PmSss_h4&eurl=http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f2/georges-big-trouble-dana-914445/

Utopia Parkway

Pity the fight turned out so one-sided in the end. I think it showed that BJ is relying too much on his natural talent to coast through fights. He can get away with it at lightweight because there is nobody as good as him in that division but facing someone like GSP who is incredibly talented and also 20lbs heavier than him is too big a hurdle to overcome. A good big one will nearly always beat a good little one as the old saying goes.

BJ trains with his buddies down the gym in between bouts of surfing and while I'm sure the training is tough by the average person's standards it doesn't compare to how GSP methodically and scientifically prepares for his fights. Think BJ needs to get away from all the yes men he's surrounded by if he wants to progress even further but that's what he's comfortable with. Even if he stays there he will probably continue to clean out the lightweight division because he's so naturally gifted but to compete against bigger champions like GSP he needs more than rolling around and sparring with his mates in Hilo.

Nothingcompares

ginoginelli wrote: »

Danas last blog for 94..

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=rd2PmSss_h4&eurl=http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f2/georges-big-trouble-dana-914445/

I love dana i have to admit it.

Anyone seen the undercard yet? Is it on the ufc website?

Tim_Murphy

BJ trains with his buddies down the gym in between bouts of surfing and while I'm sure the training is tough by the average person's standards it doesn't compare to how GSP methodically and scientifically prepares for his fights. Think BJ needs to get away from all the yes men he's surrounded by if he wants to progress even further but that's what he's comfortable with. Even if he stays there he will probably continue to clean out the lightweight division because he's so naturally gifted but to compete against bigger champions like GSP he needs more than rolling around and sparring with his mates in Hilo.

How do you guys know so much about how BJ trained for this fight?

Utopia Parkway

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

Pity the fight turned out so one-sided in the end. I think it showed that BJ is relying too much on his natural talent to coast through fights. He can get away with it at lightweight because there is nobody as good as him in that division but facing someone like GSP who is incredibly talented and also 20lbs heavier than him is too big a hurdle to overcome. A good big one will nearly always beat a good little one as the old saying goes.

BJ trains with his buddies down the gym in between bouts of surfing and while I'm sure the training is tough by the average person's standards it doesn't compare to how GSP methodically and scientifically prepares for his fights. Think BJ needs to get away from all the yes men he's surrounded by if he wants to progress even further but that's what he's comfortable with. Even if he stays there he will probably continue to clean out the lightweight division because he's so naturally gifted but to compete against bigger champions like GSP he needs more than rolling around and sparring with his mates in Hilo.

There certainly is an element of truth to what you're saying but BJ is well known for bringing in great fighters to his camps.

For Sherk he had Urijah Faber and Pablo Popovich over to tarin with him.

For Hughes 1 he was training at Team Quest with Randy, Lindland etc

Lindland cornered him when he fought GSP the 1st time.



But, where I do agree with you is that BJ and his brother manage every element of his camp while GSP have others who manage his camps and allow him to take holidays etc.

Tim_Murphy

Tim_Murphy wrote: »

How do you guys know so much about how BJ trained for this fight?

"If you wanna know what Bj Penn is thinkin right now, go to bjpenn.com."

Mossy Monk

Nothingcompares wrote: »

Anyone seen the undercard yet? Is it on the ufc website?

I cannot find it anywhere.