Pulled over on the N7

ottostreet

Right, this has a few replies since I posted it. I've read them all, and just to clear a few things up:

1. I was speeding. I fully admit to that. I'm not ashamed to admit it. People who are familiar with the road will know that it's quite a decent road, and in reference to another posters reply, its the same stretch of road where three weeks ago, I followed a squad car doing the same speed no problems from Naas to Rathcoole. Yes, I know, different circumstances, and I'm not going to get into the whole "But this is the real world, on a road that good, everyone speeds". The reality is, stupid speed limit or not, the limit is there and I broke it.

2. My car. My car is a standard 318, with alloys and a rear spoiler. Not exactly the chavviest motor on the road, despite one posters insinuation.

3. Same poster: "Driving around looking for checkpoints". I have a lot of respect for the guards. I think they do a great job, and I have always enjoyed going through a checkpoint when I know my car and myself are fully legal. When out for a drive with a friend in Dublin city, we will keep driving around for a while, hoping to meet a checkpoint, just to break the mundanity of the routine. How exactly this constitutes delinquent behaviour, since you have insinuated it, I'd like to know please.

4. My lane "swerving". Some posters seem to think I've been swooping across all three lanes in one manoeuvre without checking. Not the case. One lane change at a time. All indicated properly, no swerving, all gentle steering and no hard acceleration or braking. All done just to ensure I didnt undertake anyone in front of the TC.

@ TheNog. Thanks for your reply. I was looking forward to it, since I've read a good few of your posts regarding your policies on driving standards and behaviour, and I think you've got it nailed. I'll certainly take your advice on board.

That's basically it. It's not the speeding that's got my back up, it was the way the guard basically went "own up to this, or I'll tell the judge about all your swerving like a madman" Maybe I'm picking it up wrong, but thats certainly the way it came across. I know some posters are going to go "oh you were speeding that was really DANGEROUS!!" but in reality, I know when I'm doing something dangerous or risky, and the only risk I took last night was going past the traffic corps car when he was so obviously baiting the drivers behind him. I got past him, and stayed ahead for a good four miles before he pulled me over, without me increasing my speed after the initial burst. THAT'S why i'm annoyed.

DannyBuoy

ottostreet wrote: »

...When out for a drive with a friend in Dublin city, we will keep driving around for a while, hoping to meet a checkpoint, just to break the mundanity of the routine...

Berty

Correct me if I am reading this wrong folks and "the Nog" but are we saying that If I am cruising in the left hand most lane at 80kph and the speed limit if 100kph and I come up on the left of a car in the middle lane doing 90kph.

If I move to the third lane and pass the car in the middle lane and then cross back over to the first lane then thats wrong.

So(If I read that right), overtaking is only correct if you overtake one lane at a time occupying lanes you have no reason to occupy.

Stark

You are required to obey the laws of physics which means no catching up on cars doing 90km/hr while you're doing 80

Berty

Stark wrote: »

You are required to obey the laws of physics which means no catching up on cars doing 90km/hr while you're doing 80

Damn you! damn you and your science. :mad:

Ok my theoretical car is doing 90kph and their car is doing 70kph.

Mr. Presentable

The easy way for the OP to get a definitive answer to his question: Ignore the letter and see how it goes in court.

Zube

Berty, It's perfectly legal to overtake by moving from the inside to the outside lane, one lane at a time. If you do it in one wild swerve, it's dangerous.

Somewhere in between the two, there is a threshold where the watching guard will decide to stop you and have a chat.

Wossack

stealthyspeeder wrote: »

If the guards only evidence of the speeding infringment is his word that he saw the car overtake him while he stayed at the limit, and the defendant contests this, says he was at the limit and the guard was below the limit, case dismissed everytime. Approximate speed is not a viable prosecution in the black and white eyes of the law.

this 'approximate speed' as you describe has been used to convict countless motorists I'd imagine - and you dont reckon someones tried contesting this before?

what are your figures on this 100% success rate?

tossy

If the garda was doing 100kmph and you were doing 120kmph it is pretty obvious even to the dimest of souls that you are speeding.My thinking is he might have even decided to cut you a break on the speeding,it seems so as you were well past him,but the fact you couldn't decide which lane you liked best probably swayed it for him.

Fight it in court and let us all know how you get on,i'd love to hear about it

Terra

I personally Blame the Micra for this!!

I wish they could get fined for lane hogging and driving slow in general....

There the real cause of people speeding.

Rowley Birkin QC

ottostreet wrote: »

I have always enjoyed going through a checkpoint when I know my car and myself are fully legal. When out for a drive with a friend in Dublin city, we will keep driving around for a while, hoping to meet a checkpoint, just to break the mundanity of the routine. How exactly this constitutes delinquent behaviour, since you have insinuated it, I'd like to know please.

Incomprehensibly weird, but certainly not delinquent.

You don't really do that though, do you?

Vertakill

ottostreet wrote:

I have always enjoyed going through a checkpoint when I know my car and myself are fully legal. When out for a drive with a friend in Dublin city, we will keep driving around for a while, hoping to meet a checkpoint, just to break the mundanity of the routine. How exactly this constitutes delinquent behaviour, since you have insinuated it, I'd like to know please.

That's easily one of the saddest things I've heard of in a while.
Btw a 318 with a spoiler and custom alloys can very well look quite chavvy and depending on the driver can stand out quite a bit. I'm not saying yours does because I don't know what it looks like, but pikeys have some kind of gift where they're able to make any kind of car look like crap.

I thought (until now) that everybody knows not to overtake Garda/TC, especially when they're matching the speed limit. It's not difficult to spot a speeder when they know themselves they're right on the speed limit and someone parallel to them is travelling faster.

Remember, they don't even need a reason to pull you over anymore so don't give them one. Just bide your time until they turn off your route.

TheNog

stealthyspeeder wrote: »

If the guards only evidence of the speeding infringment is his word that he saw the car overtake him while he stayed at the limit, and the defendant contests this, says he was at the limit and the guard was below the limit, case dismissed everytime. Approximate speed is not a viable prosecution in the black and white eyes of the law.

As I said some judges will run with it and some wont in the case of speeding. It is not an ideal situation for a guard to go to court and give an approximate speed only rather than a true speed. Having said that I have successfully prosecuted people for dangerous driving by giving an appromiate speed ie the speed shown on the speedometer of the patrol car.

stealthyspeeder wrote: »

Here is the quote from the OP which threatens prosecution on the grounds of dangerous driving if he does not admit to speeding by paying the fine.

"heads back to the car and sits there for a while. comes back, says ill get a letter for speeding. pay it and take the two points. if i bring it to court, hell tell the judge i was swerving dangerously all over the road, lane changing like a madman with "flashfloods" all over the place"

Sorry I was wrong there. The lack of quotes threw me.

stealthyspeeder wrote: »

If the lane changes are done individually and correctly with appropriate checks of mirrors and indication, there is nothing illegal happening, and no grounds for the prosecution of dangerous driving. Therefore speeding is the only offence (bear in mind this cannot be proved)

Yes lane changes can be made so long it is coupled with proper indication and a time lapse between lane changes.

stealthyspeeder wrote: »

I would disagree, if somebody was actually driving dangerously, say handbraking round roundabouts, undertaking and tailgaing (all of which I saw on Swords roundabout within 2 minutes last week fom one highly enthusiastic Golf GTI driver) then I think that it would be in the publics interest to prosecute them for dangerous driving as opposed to speeding! Or should we give him a chance to learn from his mistakes?

There is a big difference between being slightly over the limit and doing handbrake turns.

ottostreet wrote: »

- I was speeding. I fully admit to that. I'm not ashamed to admit it.

- The reality is, stupid speed limit or not, the limit is there and I broke it.

In fairness to you, you realise you made a mistake re: speeding and are willing to admit responsiblity. Most people wont admit it or try to blur the facts a little.

That makes you the bigger and better man. Fair play to ye.

MagicMarker

You were actually driving at 120km/hr in a 100km zone, INFRONT of the TC?

Seriously, how did you manage to pass the theory test?

The guards were probably laughing their ass off at your stupidity before they pulled you over.

Buffman

I wouldn't advise going to court on it anyway, if only because of your posts here admitting to it.
Tie this to the pictures of your car on another thread with your reg on it(big no no IMO) and all this could be used against you.
Guards read this stuff too. One for the conspiracies forum I know:D, but stranger things have happened!

TheNog

Buffman wrote: »

Guards read this stuff too.

Nah too busy eating donuts :pac:

Buffman

TheNog wrote: »

Nah too busy eating donuts :pac:

Ye, the local lads here just got their brand new mondeo, massive donut capacity:)

uberwolf

ottostreet wrote: »

All done just to ensure I didnt undertake anyone in front of the TC.

Is this illegal? I thought that if the traffic in an outside lane was going slower than that inside it, there was no problem? So don't swerve in to go inside someone, but if you're there already then no issue?

Anan1

uberwolf wrote: »

Is this illegal? I thought that if the traffic in an outside lane was going slower than that inside it, there was no problem? So don't swerve in to go inside someone, but if you're there already then no issue?

Back to the ROTR for you, i'm afraid.:)

Buffman

uberwolf wrote: »

Is this illegal? I thought that if the traffic in an outside lane was going slower than that inside it, there was no problem? So don't swerve in to go inside someone, but if you're there already then no issue?

Only in 'slow moving' traffic (traffic lights, etc), and 100-120km/h on the 3 lane Naas road certainly isn't slow moving.

TheNog

uberwolf wrote: »

Is this illegal? I thought that if the traffic in an outside lane was going slower than that inside it, there was no problem? So don't swerve in to go inside someone, but if you're there already then no issue?

You can undertake if you are in heavy traffic and movement between lanes is not possible but I think from the OPs account we can assume traffic was light to medium.

Seth Brundle

egan007 wrote: »

My car speedo 80K miles - 10 on the tyres, 7 years old matches my sat nav speed almost perfectly (to within a km or two).
They are not exact but are not inaccurate either.

Yours must be the exception to the rule. In general speedos cannot be presumed to be accurate.

stifz wrote: »

The trouble is the Gardai make it very difficult to answer back in court.. 4 points rather than the original 2.

Firstly, the gardai don't control the court's time - I would presume that its the judge that controls who can speak and when.
Secondly, speeding earns four points. This is reduced to two if you accept the charge and avoid using court time. There is a big difference.

ottostreet wrote: »

3. Same poster: "Driving around looking for checkpoints". I have a lot of respect for the guards. I think they do a great job, and I have always enjoyed going through a checkpoint when I know my car and myself are fully legal. When out for a drive with a friend in Dublin city, we will keep driving around for a while, hoping to meet a checkpoint, just to break the mundanity of the routine. How exactly this constitutes delinquent behaviour, since you have insinuated it, I'd like to know please.

Delinquent? Possibly not!
Normal? Definitely not!

BigCon

ottostreet wrote: »

2. My car. My car is a standard 318, with alloys and a rear spoiler. Not exactly the chavviest motor on the road, despite one posters insinuation.

3. Same poster: "Driving around looking for checkpoints". I have a lot of respect for the guards. I think they do a great job, and I have always enjoyed going through a checkpoint when I know my car and myself are fully legal. When out for a drive with a friend in Dublin city, we will keep driving around for a while, hoping to meet a checkpoint, just to break the mundanity of the routine. How exactly this constitutes delinquent behaviour, since you have insinuated it, I'd like to know please.

I assume you're referring to my earlier post?

1. I didn't insinuate your car was a "chav motor". It does look a bit "boy racer" type though imo.

2. I didn't insinuate driving around looking for checkpoints was "delinquent behaviour". I'd consider it to be stupid though.

In your defence though I think that the 3-lanes on Naas road should have a 120kph limit...

ottostreet

BigCon wrote: »

I assume you're referring to my earlier post?

1. I didn't insinuate your car was a "chav motor". It does look a bit "boy racer" type though imo.

2. I didn't insinuate driving around looking for checkpoints was "delinquent behaviour". I'd consider it to be stupid though.

In your defence though I think that the 3-lanes on Naas road should have a 120kph limit...

thanks for clearing that up. well, yes, im inclined to agree. its pretty obvious that a male is driving it, and more than likely a young lad! as for the stupid behaviour driving around for checkpoints, well, it is stupid. in terms of "why do they get a kick out of it". i cant explain that, all i know is that i enjoy meeting a checkpoint, not to antagonise, not to wind up anyone, just to see the guards in action. as for the 120kph limit, it would be more sensible, based on the standard of the road, but, this is ireland. three lanes? woah...confusing! thanks for posting again and clarifying. your first post was a little attacking, and while i realise that you cant tell what my attitude towards driving or my standards of driving are, id prefer you didnt jump to conclusions, especially based on my car.

you would have had a point if i had been driving one of my old cars though (bright yellow punto sporting with a big rear wing)

_Kaiser_

Interesting thread...

Not that the OP got done. By the sound of it he WAS driving erratically and got off lightly imo.

However.. I do have an issue with a garda's "word" being enough to bring a conviction in court. Even more so with it being enough for his partner to say "yea I saw him too judge".

Given the reports in the media over the past few years of the conduct of certain members of the Gardai, it's a ridiculous situation whereby this is all that's needed. Like you see on those Police Stop shows from the UK, every Traffic Corps car (at a minimum) should be fitted with a camera to PROVE the claim in court - y'know as in "innocent until PROVEN guilty"

But then again, by actively discouraging the public from challenging a prosecution, and punishing them further by way of increased fines and additional points if they lose, it keeps the conviction rates up - allowing the Gardai and RSA to say they're "making a difference" without actually doing anything. Secondly it's a nice revenue stream for our cash-strapped government too of course!

BigCon

ottostreet wrote: »

thanks for clearing that up. well, yes, im inclined to agree. its pretty obvious that a male is driving it, and more than likely a young lad! as for the stupid behaviour driving around for checkpoints, well, it is stupid. in terms of "why do they get a kick out of it". i cant explain that, all i know is that i enjoy meeting a checkpoint, not to antagonise, not to wind up anyone, just to see the guards in action. as for the 120kph limit, it would be more sensible, based on the standard of the road, but, this is ireland. three lanes? woah...confusing! thanks for posting again and clarifying. your first post was a little attacking, and while i realise that you cant tell what my attitude towards driving or my standards of driving are, id prefer you didnt jump to conclusions, especially based on my car.

you would have had a point if i had been driving one of my old cars though (bright yellow punto sporting with a big rear wing)

I know this will make your day:
I got done by the gatso van coming out of Portlaoise tonight.
. Will have to wait for the fine to see what speed I was doing.
Think the limit is 30kmh, I was probably doing 45, big wide open road, no other traffic, no houses.

Andrewf20

Ive gotten this "swerving all over the place" bull from the cops on 1 occasion and it was merely overtaking a few cars on the M50 and moving back in. No points tho as ultimetly he was out of ideas at that stage. Pathetic.

ottostreet

BigCon wrote: »

I know this will make your day:
I got done by the f*cking gatso van coming out of Portlaoise tonight.
W*ankers. Will have to wait for the fine to see what speed I was doing.
Think the limit is 30kmh, I was probably doing 45, big wide open road, no other traffic, no houses.

no. i never like to hear of people being done needlessly. thing is, you were speeding, but not driving dangerously (im assuming anyway). which is exactly what i was doing (in my opinion). i'm sure some people will say "but what if a child ran out in front of you", well, what the hell is a child doing running across a three lane road at 10 at night? all the ifs and buts in the world dont change facts, 120kph is NOT dangerous on that section of road, and i highly doubt 45kph is dangerous along the section you were caught on.

is it that bit after you pass the maxol garage on your right, go through the roundabout, and it straightens up?

bo-bo

BigCon wrote: »

I know this will make your day:
I got done by the f*cking gatso van coming out of Portlaoise tonight.
W*ankers. Will have to wait for the fine to see what speed I was doing.
Think the limit is 30kmh, I was probably doing 45, big wide open road, no other traffic, no houses.

what road were you on?

TheNog

Andrewf20 wrote: »

Ive gotten this "swerving all over the place" bull from the cops on 1 occasion and it was merely overtaking a few cars on the M50 and moving back in. No points tho as ultimetly he was out of ideas at that stage. Pathetic.

I have seen many people swerving on the road and stopped them. Usually to see if they have been drinking and some havent, some have. For those who havent been drinking I tell them what I saw and ask them to pay a little more attention to their driving and thats it. Its all about keeping people out of harms way and not all about prosecuting them.

Maybe in your case you could learn from it rather than taking offence to it and I say maybe cos I wasnt there.

Anan1

TheNog wrote: »

I have seen many people swerving on the road and stopped them. Usually to see if they have been drinking and some havent, some have. For those who havent been drinking I tell them what I saw and ask them to pay a little more attention to their driving and thats it. Its all about keeping people out of harms way and not all about prosecuting them.

Maybe in your case you could learn from it rather than taking offence to it and I say maybe cos I wasnt there.

I have to say that sounds pretty reasonable to me.

KoRn101

BigCon wrote: »

1. Driver acts like a Muppet (speeding, 20% over the limit, and changing multiple lanes in one maneuver, in plain view of the Guards, (I think, hard to read).

2. Guards do their job (after being goaded for quite a distance).

What's there to complain about (except maybe the Guards were too lenient)?
This idiot has done this before (admitting in other threads to driving at 80mph
beside a cop car on the N7, driving around looking for checkpoints for fun.

And to top it all off, he's driving this:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58395985#post58395985

I had a small bit of sympathy for ottostreet at first as when reading it my eyes were straining so i didnt get the full story but i imagined it as something minor, However..

When an absolute fool is driving this http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58395985#post58395985
Well basically your just a dirty chav and well i hope the gards pull you over for everything you do because from prior posts and the 16 year old fantasy "boy racer" you think ya are! You're a terrible driver from the sounds of it and to be honest i think you're just one of these drivers who think they're victimised by the gards.

I reccomend you grow up, and get a half way respectable car. Draws less attention.

Curvy Vixen

ottostreet wrote: »

1. I was speeding. I fully admit to that. I'm not ashamed to admit it. People who are familiar with the road will know that it's quite a decent road

I am fully aware of this road as I've been driving on it in all it's various forms for 6 years now, and being aware of it, whilst it might be a 'decent' road, it's also a road that has massive flood puddles along both the first and third lanes in heavy rain.

For that reason alone, in my opinion, you were driving idiotically even sitting on 100km an hour in those weather conditions let alone 120km and I'm glad you were pulled over.

The speed limit is a limit, not a target or a directive that must be kept to at all times of day and night and in all weathers :mad:

And a good driver would be fully aware of everything going on around him whether it be possible flood issues or cops watching to pull them over!

TheNog

Anan1 wrote: »

I have to say that sounds pretty reasonable to me.

The only problem though is people are always harpering on about better driver education but when it is pointed out to them about their own driving, some people take offence to it.

TheNog

KoRn101 wrote: »

I had a small bit of sympathy for ottostreet at first as when reading it my eyes were straining so i didnt get the full story but i imagined it as something minor, However..

When an absolute fool is driving this http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58395985#post58395985
Well basically your just a dirty chav and well i hope the gards pull you over for everything you do because from prior posts and the 16 year old fantasy "boy racer" you think ya are! You're a terrible driver from the sounds of it and to be honest i think you're just one of these drivers who think they're victimised by the gards.

I reccomend you grow up, and get a half way respectable car. Draws less attention.

The only response this post deserves is: Read the charter buddy

KoRn101

TheNog wrote: »

The only response this post deserves is: Read the charter buddy

i got in trouble..

I just really cant understand how people can complain about getting caught for speeding.

TheNog

KoRn101 wrote: »

i got in trouble..

I just really cant understand how people can complain about getting caught for speeding.

True but there is no need to take personally. The OP has freely admitted to making a mistake which alot of other people wouldnt do.

crocro

TheNog wrote: »

The only problem though is people are always harpering on about better driver education but when it is pointed out to them about their own driving, some people take offence to it.

I think you will agree that many Irish police have room to improve the standard of their own driving and that, if this happened, their advice would be more likely to be heeded.

TheNog

crocro wrote: »

I think you will agree that many Irish police have room to improve the standard of their own driving and that, if this happened, their advice would be more likely to be heeded.

+ 1 but I can only speak for my own driving

Old_-_School

OP deserves 4 penalty points alone for making this passage of text like a sudoko puzzle

not a problem until we hit the part where it becomes three lane and the speed limit drops.car coming up in my lane so i move out behind the traffic corps car in the overtaking lane and pass it. traffic clear again and the TC car moves over. i slowly accelerate past, indicate back across the two lanes into the left lane. i stay there, holding my speed at maybe 120 (100 zone) slowly pulling away. car in my lane, i indicate out to middle lane, then back in. then...my mistake. car in the middle lane. didnt want to undertake in front of the guards so i indicate out behind the upcoming car, then across into overtaking lane, then back across

ottostreet

KoRn101 wrote: »

I had a small bit of sympathy for ottostreet at first as when reading it my eyes were straining so i didnt get the full story but i imagined it as something minor, However..

When an absolute fool is driving this http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58395985#post58395985
Well basically your just a dirty chav and well i hope the gards pull you over for everything you do because from prior posts and the 16 year old fantasy "boy racer" you think ya are! You're a terrible driver from the sounds of it and to be honest i think you're just one of these drivers who think they're victimised by the gards.

I reccomend you grow up, and get a half way respectable car. Draws less attention.

:rolleyes:

you haven't really read this, have you?
I have a heavy right foot, i acknowledge that, and restrain myself most of the time. However, on occasion, i have been caught out.

Now, stop being an idiot, and develop some manners. And also, try to learn what defines a chav, since you clearly don't have a clue.

KoRn101

ottostreet wrote: »

:rolleyes:

you haven't really read this, have you?
I have a heavy right foot, i acknowledge that, and restrain myself most of the time. However, on occasion, i have been caught out.

Now, stop being an idiot, and develop some manners. And also, try to learn what defines a chav, since you clearly don't have a clue.

Ah no i didnt mean ta be so offensive directly! Just i mean, come on, accept it, from what ya have said anyway it sounds a little dodgey to me!

I mean anyone with any sense knows, you dont do sloppy things around TC, and come on, could you HAVE a more conspicuous car ??

Nice as it may look, when you're in a car of such caliber, you should esspecially be on your best behavior !

MagicMarker

KoRn101 wrote: »

Nice as it may look, when you're in a car of such caliber

haha... funny.

KoRn101

MagicMarker wrote: »

haha... funny.

Bear with me magic, im trying to be serious!

Matt Simis

Marjorie Slow Hashish wrote: »

I wont even pass out a mondeo and/or break the speed around one without making sure its not an unmarked car(I find them very easy to spot). What possessed you op, right in front of a marked patrol car.

Me neither. Wonder do civilian Mondeo drivers notice the very cagey and reserved driving that must go on around them. Except the OP of course..

sdanseo

tossy wrote: »

oh no here we go again!

i was speeding
i got caught.
what gives them the right to catch me!

take the points like a man!

Post of the year, so far?

CharlieCroker

Matt Simis wrote: »

Me neither. Wonder do civilian Mondeo drivers notice the very cagey and reserved driving that must go on around them. Except the OP of course..

Used to work for a car rental company. Had to drive a car up to head office in dublin that was going off the fleet. Everyone was getting out of my way, which i thought was great. then i remembered that the car was a navy mondeo with a dublin reg, load of bumps and scrapes from all the yanks driving and with only 2 hubcaps. That, and i was wearing a blue shirt.
Shortest trip I've ever had up to dublin.:)

Honey-ec

KoRn101 wrote: »

I had a small bit of sympathy for ottostreet at first as when reading it my eyes were straining so i didnt get the full story but i imagined it as something minor, However..

When an absolute fool is driving this http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58395985#post58395985
Well basically your just a dirty chav and well i hope the gards pull you over for everything you do because from prior posts and the 16 year old fantasy "boy racer" you think ya are! You're a terrible driver from the sounds of it and to be honest i think you're just one of these drivers who think they're victimised by the gards.

I reccomend you grow up, and get a half way respectable car. Draws less attention.

Is that a spurious M badge I spot in the second pic?*




*My bad if it isn't, but it certainly looks like it with my crappy eyesight

SV

Honey-ec wrote: »

Is that a spurious M badge I spot in the second pic?*




*My bad if it isn't, but it certainly looks like it with my crappy eyesight

M Power badge it is.


in fairness to the OP, he did tell me he was going to remove that ages ago.

Andrewf20

TheNog wrote: »

I have seen many people swerving on the road and stopped them. Usually to see if they have been drinking and some havent, some have. For those who havent been drinking I tell them what I saw and ask them to pay a little more attention to their driving and thats it. Its all about keeping people out of harms way and not all about prosecuting them.

Maybe in your case you could learn from it rather than taking offence to it and I say maybe cos I wasnt there.

Perhaps, but his tone was very condensending at the time. Apart from that Ive had no major issues with the guards.