Will/Has the recession make people more racist?

The_Minister

It's already starting

I've certainly noticed that people are beginning to become resentful of foreigners in recent weeks, and many people seem to feel that they should "all go home". I was actually treated to a conversation where the other party was complaining about "the blacks", and how "none of them work".

Have you noticed that people are becoming more resentful of migrant workers (or non-workers now I suppose), and specifically, have you noticed a rise in racism?

javaboy

It won't make them more racist. It will just expose what's already there.

bizmark

wont get the financial backing to start a cotton farm anyway so what does it matter

Iang87

i'm not racist but i blame the polish and other immigrants, not the irish its them

Nehaxak

Would prefer to see all the culchies go back home and get out of Dublin so we can get on with improving our gene pool here with more beautiful "foreign" wimmins. More Africans and Asians to Dublin please, breed the ugly out that's been imposed on us for centuries from everywhere else outside the pale...

SilkySmooth

Nehaxak wrote: »

Would prefer to see all the culchies go back home and get out of Dublin so we can get on with improving our gene pool here with more beautiful "foreign" wimmins. More Africans and Asians to Dublin please, breed the ugly out that's been imposed on us for centuries from everywhere else outside the pale...

Irish women are beautiful too, ya know. Even in bogger-land.

CreepingDeath

The_Minister wrote: »

Will/Has the recession make people more racist?

There's a difference between racism and territoriality.
Ireland belongs to the Irish... once there's enough resources to go around and support us all, everyone is happy.

Once resources ( jobs, houses, money etc ) becomes limited, then tension arises. It's a completely natural reaction / evolved behaviour to try to defend the resources available to you.

You can't bury and repress millions of years of evolved behaviour just cos a few politically correct laws have been passed.

Saint_Mel

Definately ... even lunch time today I was in a cafe and overheard a lot of talk about "the blacks" getting medical cards and utility bills paid for etc., and the feckin Poles taking all our jobs and feckin off home when it suited them.

Degsy

I dont know about racism but if the goverment want to save a few hundred million a year they should refuse to process anymore asylum cases,refute the right to appeal for those not sucsessfull and stop paying solicitors out of state funds to deal with asylum cases.
Onec they realise the party is over,they'll soon stop coming here.

The_Minister

CreepingDeath wrote: »

There's a difference between racism and territoriality.
Ireland belongs to the Irish... once there's enough resources to go around and support us all, everyone is happy.

Once resources ( jobs, houses, money etc ) becomes limited, then tension arises. It's a completely natural reaction / evolved behaviour to try to defend the resources available to you.

You can't bury and repress millions of years of evolved behaviour just cos a few politically correct laws have been passed.

Leaving aside your last two sentences, I have to say I never thought of it like that, and you have given me reason to mull.

ronnie3585

Dey tuk err jerrbs! (and swans).

ScumLord

Of course it will, stupid paddys. :rolleyes:

TheZohanS

ronnie3585 wrote: »

Dey tuk err jerrbs! (and swans).

But it's a fair swap fer der wimmins(who have jobs).

vt3

Degsy wrote: »

I dont know about racism but if the goverment want to save a few hundred million a year they should refuse to process anymore asylum cases,refute the right to appeal for those not sucsessfull and stop paying solicitors out of state funds to deal with asylum cases.
Onec they realise the party is over,they'll soon stop coming here.

You are a horrible horrible person. Any chance you'll move somewhere else?

BTW when does somebody become Irish?

pipsqueak

can worms open every where, little feckers

The_Minister

vt3 wrote: »

You are a horrible horrible person. Any chance you'll move somewhere else?

BTW when does somebody become Irish?

Irish citizen or Irish ethnicity?



Ooooooh there's a good thread.

Berty

Will it make people more racist of just plain racist.

We are all racist so more racist possibly OR we will be able to empathise with other nations now that we are on the slide.

The_Minister

Degsy wrote: »

I dont know about racism but if the goverment want to save a few hundred million a year they should refuse to process anymore asylum cases,refute the right to appeal for those not sucsessfull and stop paying solicitors out of state funds to deal with asylum cases.
Onec they realise the party is over,they'll soon stop coming here.

And women who might get circumcised, they just need to go back home and face the cigar-cutter?

Not all migrants are looking for money, some of them actually do face danger if they go home.

CreepingDeath

The_Minister wrote: »

Leaving aside your last two sentences, I have to say I never thought of it like that, and you have given me reason to mull.

In my opinion, you're racist if you hate the non-nationals even if there's plenty of houses/jobs/resources available.

But it's natural to feel more entitled to Irelands resources if you and your parents, and your parents parents etc had contributed to the country all their lives. There would be a legacy of thousands/millions of punts/euros contributed to the country.

ronnie3585 wrote:

Dey tuk err jerrbs!

I hope that's not an attempt to introduce the gay gang-bang solution they resorted to in that SouthPark episode "Goobacks".

The_Minister

CreepingDeath wrote: »

I hope that's not an attempt to introduce the gay gang-bang solution they resorted to in that SouthPark episode "Goobacks".

Goobags surely?
I think saying Goobacks while talking about a big gay orgy was a Freudian slip.

Fozzie Bear

Don't know if its racism but I have heard some people at work asking why the Irish state is paying out millions to house foreigners in places like Mosney or the countless hotels, hostels, HSE houses and apartments etc up and down the country. I can sort of see their point, why is this going on? Why not send them back home or simply refuse them entry to the country at the airport/ports etc. It's not doing them any good being abandoned in some minging old hotel for years on end living off state handouts.

vt3

The_Minister wrote: »

Irish citizen or Irish ethnicity?



Ooooooh there's a good thread.

would be.

but what i was getting at what 'ireland is for the irish', so is someone like paul mcgrath irish or not? is that baz guy on rte irish? laura izibor? stephen kelly? the much bigger than ever irish born of non-european population?

PrivateEye

I blame Brussels for starting the 'race to the bottom' (1 market with how many workers scrambling for jobs?), the bosses who were more than willing to create a two-tier working class- with well documented examples of immigrants being paid less, and lastly the government for very obvious reasons.

Whoever made the recession it wasn't the foreign workers, you've far more in common with them than the Irish bosses.

Run_to_da_hills

The media can often be blamed for encouraging racism by publishing articles like this.

http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/Majority-of-Dell39s-Polish-workers.4865682.jp

Degsy

vt3 wrote: »

You are a horrible horrible person. Any chance you'll move somewhere else?

BTW when does somebody become Irish?

I'm horrible because i dont want more of my tax money wasted on chancers??

CreepingDeath

The_Minister wrote: »

Goobags surely?
I think saying Goobacks while talking about a big gay orgy was a Freudian slip.

Nope, "Goobacks"... as in "go back".
They were time refugees from the future.

SouthPark episode WIKI Link

Iang87

vt3 wrote: »

You are a horrible horrible person. Any chance you'll move somewhere else?

BTW when does somebody become Irish?

how is he a horrible person in fairness. he's looking out for his own which is his right. there isn't enough money now to look after everyone so why should the cutbacks be for the irish.

In my opinion thats whats bothering the irish, cos we dont get **** if you have had the economically crippling burden that is a job cos it seems to a lot of us that you get nowhere working and you'd get more benefits etc not working.

I'm not sayin that its about the foreigners not working it happens across the board but what i am saying is that the irish government should look after the irish first. If that makes me racist get ma a triangular hood and an all white suit,

foxshooter243

One of my neighbours is definitley a racist, then again after losing 5 k worth of gear to Roma gypsies doesnt help does it?:rolleyes:

The_Minister

CreepingDeath wrote: »

Nope, "Goobacks"... as in "go back".
They were time refugees from the future.

SouthPark episode WIKI Link

I stand corrected.

consultech

SilkySmooth wrote: »

Irish women are beautiful too, ya know. Even in bogger-land.

...as well as being notoriously bad liars, and/or dillusional - especially in bogger land.

vt3

i dont get 'look after'...its not like we're in famine times here. one thing we can't complain about polish anyway. they are just fellow europeans. we are in eu and ireland wouldnt have had any good times without it.

Terry

vt3 wrote: »

You are a horrible horrible person. Any chance you'll move somewhere else?

BTW when does somebody become Irish?

You were banned yesterday.
You don't get to create another account to circumvent that ban.

Goodbye.

Biggins

Sadly, those that are racist by underlying nature, will use the recession to legitimise their ideology and evoke it onto other trains of thought to justify their continuing bigotry.

Neamhshuntasach

vt3 wrote: »

i dont get 'look after'...its not like we're in famine times here. one thing we can't complain about polish anyway. they are just fellow europeans. we are in eu and ireland wouldnt have had any good times without it.

I had better craic poor than i did when everyone became a prick with a bit of money in their pocket. Well borrowed money. So fúck the EU.

Degsy

The_Minister wrote: »

And women who might get circumcised, they just need to go back home and face the cigar-cutter?

Not all migrants are looking for money, some of them actually do face danger if they go home.

Its not done against thier will(or certainly not against the mother's will)..anybody who says otherwise is a liar.
The fact is that most migrants ARE here for economic reasons.
They will and do invent reasons for claiming asylum,some are legitimate,the vast majority(according to the Dept of Justice) are not.
Remember the woman who said she faced death by stoning if she returned to her country?
Half the do-goooders in this country united to champion her cause.It later transpired that she didnt even live in an area where sharia law was practised.Everybody was left with egg on thier faces and she quietly slipped awy into the country.
Solicitors and appeals that are state sponsored are costing millions upon millions of euro and this is a gravy train for certain people in the legal profession...its no wonder that they'll try any avenue to stop illegal migrants being deported.

marzic

its simple economics! the foreign workers who did the same jobs as us were no threat until these jobs become scarce, and because they worked for less in many cases and will settle for worse conditions/wont complain so much, may be preferential to employers! this understandably(whether right or wrong) causes a change in attitude towards them, it may be racism or it may be fear of loosing ones job. there should be an attempt at monitoring this to find whats really going on. a racist will use this arguement if there is no counter info, cos it can be justified by the perception out there.

Those whose jobs are not threatened see foreign migrants as contributing to multi*insert whatever blah blah*, which may be true, but were they might feel different if their job was at risk.

the other issue of refugees/asylum seekers is different and shouldnt be mixed in with migrant workers. I dont know what the difference is, and most people dont, so there is alot of mis-info out there which leads to some terrible perceptions, which we dont know how true they are.

0ubliette

CreepingDeath wrote: »

Nope, "Goobacks"... as in "go back".
They were time refugees from the future.

SouthPark episode WIKI Link

I think youll find gooback is a reference to 'wetback', racist slang for illegal mexican immigrants in the US. Called wetback due to the assumption that they had to swim across a river (cant remember where it was) to cross the border, coming out of the river with a 'wet back', much like the aliens come through the portal with goo on their backs in the episode

The_Minister

You forgot to add: The more you know.

consultech

TBH I think anything OP has noticed is product of a mix of:

a) Some Latent racism,
b) but moreover a diminishing of tolerance for the "Leech-culture" that Ireland has attracted/tolerated in the last ten years.

The age-old "Ah sure most Irish people are racist by nature" is all well n'good n'all; but I think the PC-brigade need to occasionally turn the sirens off for a minute and get their arses on the side of the fence that can actually identify the obvious epidemics of mass-immigration for the sole purpose of screwing the Irish state that this nation has fostered and encouraged.

It's only now that the same more-tolerant-than-can-be-practical people are slowly starting to change their tune from "Ah sure we're all loaded, we can absorb the leeching" to the same "Our people, first" protective approach that has seen every great indiginously-prosperous nation enjoy economic growth without backlash (i.e. Our recession).

Oh, and eh, dey tik arr jibbbssss etc...

0ubliette

The_Minister wrote: »

You forgot to add: The more you know.

well i usually just post the picture, but ah doesnt allow images :rolleyes:

(which btw, is retarded, what is this, 56k dial up in 1998???)

The_Minister

0ubliette wrote: »

well i usually just post the picture, but ah doesnt allow images :rolleyes:

(which btw, is retarded, what is this, 56k dial up in 1998???)

There was a feedback thread that dealt with it a few months ago.

javaboy

Degsy wrote: »

Its not done against thier will(or certainly not against the mother's will)..anybody who says otherwise is a liar.

And how do you know this?

iPlop

vt3 wrote: »

You are a horrible horrible person. Any chance you'll move somewhere else?

BTW when does somebody become Irish?

When they contribute to society

consultech

A pretty salient point on this is probably that while we, a predominantly Irish group of posters at 5:10pm who are either posting on company time or are on the dole, a number of immigrants in this country are out there working hard.

The_Minister

consultech wrote: »

A pretty salient point on this is probably that while we, a predominantly Irish group of posters at 5:10pm who are either posting on company time or are on the dole, a number of immigrants in this country are out there working hard.

The funny thing is that while I've been replying to this thread, I've also been reading a recent case on extraditing a Polish man.

asdasd

The term racism here is loaded, of course. in the 19th century the racists were opposed to the idea that people owned land because they were there for centuries.


Against the racists, were territorialists and ethnic nationalists: for instance the Irish, native americans, aborigines etc. All of these people believed that the fact they were there first entitled them to the land. Most still do ( reservations in the US, and Australia).

what happened was the needs of the ruling classes moved on. The early part of the industrial revolution saw the European population break free of the malthusian trap .An ideology was needed to justify the "surplus" population going to where it wanted. This was an actual racist ideology ( as opposed to the people who defended their ancient territory).

Fast forward a century or more. The ruling classes have different interests. They need population transfers in reverse. So their ruling ideology is anti-"racism". And they redefine racism as the belief that you have a right to a place because your ethnic group was there for centuries ( meaning that the native americans, and aborigines would be the racists in the 18th-19th centuries).

Of course, it is nonsense. The British empire was horrible but responsibility for it does not lie with the working classes in Tower Hamlets, and the actual ruling classes are immured themselves to the effects of multiculturalism and immigration- their jobs are protected etc.

Further, as in the 19th century, the natives are described as shiftless, nasty, ugly, genetically deficient ( we have seen this on this thread with regard to "culchies"), not willing to do jobs the outsiders will do willingly. Exactly the same as the racists of the 19th century. And their culture pathologised they respond by wallowing in alcoholism and abuse, and idleness.

Or to put it plainly 19th century ruling class racism is a response to a demographic increase in Europe, 19th century ruling class "anti-racism" is a response to the demographic collapse. Both ideologies are, bereft of cant, are the same.

Regardless of long term history( both ideologies claim) people can go anywhere. Nobody has a historical right to land. Incomers are better than natives.

Same old.

Degsy

javaboy wrote: »

And how do you know this?

You know the ceremony is performed by village elders,right?
They are usually old women held in very high regard in the area,they dont come stealing up to the girl in the night to cut her bits off while the mother cowers in the corner.The mother brings the child to be circumcised as it is considered a tribal rite of passage and a great honour.
Do irish people who pierce childrens' ears,do it against the familys' will?

markesmith

I have no problem whatsoever with other races, nationalities, creeds, etc. But of course the preceeding statement acts as qualifier to the subsequent one. Not in this case.

I do have a problem with parasitism, either from within or without. If someone can not work, or can not get a job, I'll happily help out tax-wise; that's our obligation as members of society.

But if someone doesn't want to work, that I have a problem with. And if people come to this country on the back of advice that Ireland gives a good handout, that's a problem.

I consider myself a liberal, but the default liberal position on this matter is either to ignore, or to claim it to be "much less of a problem than you think".

Right wing loons like Enoch Powell, the BNP etc have meant that any debate on this type of topic will get you branded a racist pretty damn quick.

Shame, because it means that there's no opportunity for a frank and honest discussion about it.

consultech

asdasd wrote: »

The term racism here is loaded, of course. in the 19th century the racists were opposed to the idea that people owned land because they were there for centuries.


Against the racists, were territorialists and ethnic nationalists: for instance the Irish, native americans, aborigines etc. All of these people believed that the fact they were there first entitled them to the land. Most still do ( reservations in the US, and Australia).

what happened was the needs of the ruling classes moved on. The early part of the industrial revolution saw the European population break free of the malthusian trap .An ideology was needed to justify the "surplus" population going to where it wanted. This was an actual racist ideology ( as opposed to the people who defended their ancient territory).

Fast forward a century or more. The ruling classes have different interests. They need population transfers in reverse. So their ruling ideology is anti-"racism". And they redefine racism as the belief that you have a right to a place because your ethnic group was there for centuries ( meaning that the native americans, and aborigines would be the racists in the 18th-19th centuries).

Of course, it is nonsense. The British empire was horrible but responsibility for it does not lie with the working classes in Tower Hamlets, and the actual ruling classes are immured themselves to the effects of multiculturalism and immigration- their jobs are protected etc.

Further, as in the 19th century, the natives are described as shiftless, nasty, ugly, genetically deficient ( we have seen this on this thread with regard to "culchies"), not willing to do jobs the outsiders will do willingly. Exactly the same as the racists of the 19th century. And their culture pathologised they respond by wallowing in alcoholism and abuse, and idleness.

Or to put it plainly 19th century ruling class racism is a response to a demographic increase in Europe, 19th century ruling class "anti-racism" is a response to the demographic collapse. Both ideologies are, bereft of cant, are the same.

Regardless of long term history( both ideologies claim) people can go anywhere. Nobody has a historical right to land. Incomers are better than natives.

Same old.

I bet you're left-handed.

Iang87

Is it just me or is racism the word just thrown around simply because we dont agree with certain things that directly involve foreign people.

Also its also kind of known people dont want to be referred to as racists so it shuts them up pretty damn quick, so what was goin on can continue without these "racists" speaking their bit trying to change this course of action.

Thats just what i can establish out of the amount of times racism is used in general media and general conversation

Degsy

Iang87 wrote: »

Is it just me or is racism the word just thrown around simply because we dont agree with certain things that directly involve foreign people.

Also its also kind of known people dont want to be referred to as racists so it shuts them up pretty damn quick, so what was goin on can continue without these "racists" speaking their bit trying to change this course of action.

Thats just what i can establish out of the amount of times racism is used in general media and general conversation

And then you have the likes of "anti racist week" and i've seen signs up saying "racist free workplace".
What an utter,utter load of tripe.
If someboduy is genuinly,completely racist,you'll never change thier minds..maybe they have thier reasons,maybe its just bigotry on thier part but the fact is that being "racist" is a normal human condition.
Everybody has prejudices against other types of people,some admit it some dont but those that say otherwise are deluded.