Cancelling an o2 contract

Sam Vimes

Talk2O2: Daryll wrote: »

Just to add my 2 cents guys,

We will require that you return the handset. The 14 Days(7 Days for iPhone) is like a cooling off period. if you don't like the handset or service you can port back to your network but you have to return everything that came with the phone before it is cancelled. If by some chance you handset is not returned we will black list it and you won't be able to use it on any network.

that's the policy i always followed but that's not what item 13 says. it clearly states you won't get any refund for the phone

justsomebloke

iphone 3GT&C wrote:

For a period of 14 days from when you Port your number (the “Porting Period”), you may port your number back to your original operator without incurring contract termination charges with O2. You will, however, be responsible for all Charges and other liabilities incurred by you during this Porting Period.

This is from the iphone's T&Cs, the fact that they mention other liabilities would probably leave the door open for them to request the phone back

Sam Vimes

Joe the Santa wrote: »

This is from the iphone's T&Cs, the fact that they mention other liabilities would probably leave the door open for them to request the phone back

i was thinking that but it does say you won't get any money back for the phone. demanding the phone back with no refund makes no more sense than allowing someone to keep it

justsomebloke

Sam Vimes wrote: »

i was thinking that but it does say you won't get any money back for the phone. demanding the phone back with no refund makes no more sense than allowing someone to keep it

As some phones they probably couldn't care less about having returned to them they have probably put that in to confirm that they won't unlock any phone that you may have kept however still having the liabilities section included leaves them open to request any number of varying charges that they may have incurred doing the porting including the cost of the phone so yes they might let you keep it but they then may charge you the price of an unlocked phone instead

Sam Vimes

Joe the Santa wrote: »

As some phones they probably couldn't care less about having returned to them they have probably put that in to confirm that they won't unlock any phone that you may have kept however still having the liabilities section included leaves them open to request any number of varying charges that they may have incurred doing the porting including the cost of the phone so yes they might let you keep it but they then may charge you the price of an unlocked phone instead

so the term is that you can cancel the contract without termination charges but they won't refund you for the phone so you can either let them blacklist it, leaving you out the money you paid for it or pay probably €500 to get up to the sim free price?

that just sounds ridiclous tbh

justsomebloke

Sam Vimes wrote: »

so the term is that you can cancel the contract without termination charges but they won't refund you for the phone so you can either let them blacklist it, leaving you out the money you paid for it or pay probably €500 to get up to the sim free price?

that just sounds ridiclous tbh

I know I was exaggerating the point but without knowing exactly what they deem to be "other liabilities" we don't know what they may try and charge you when porting back but it does leave the door open for them to in some way charge you for a phone

Sully

Hanley wrote: »

As others have said, it was not intentional.

I didn’t really think it thru, and with economic downturn I’m not sure if I can afford to keep on the bill. Especially after losing my fcuking iphone on the way to work today. I am NOT impressed. Makes a balls of everything tbh. Now I’ve a big contract, and no phone. And even if I do get out of it, I’ll be none the better off.

Karma, eh?

What’s blacklisting anyway? Sounds like a pretty cynical and illegal move.

Good timing for the phone to go "missing" eh? :P

drunkmonkey

Sully wrote: »

Good timing for the phone to go "missing" eh? :P

lol, that's what I thought as well:D

Hanley

drunkmonkey wrote: »

lol, that's what I thought as well:D

It's ok.. I found it again

Gillo

Hanley wrote: »

What’s blacklisting anyway? Sounds like a pretty cynical and illegal move.

Basically its a way of disabling a phone so it won't work, in Ireland if a phone gets blacklisted on one network it'll be also be blacklisted on the other networks (if I recall correctly it'll also be blacklisted on UK networks). It's generally done if a phone is reported lost or stolen, and if a phone has been purchased in fraudulent circumstances.

Mimikyu

This post has been deleted.

Hanley

Gillo wrote: »

Basically its a way of disabling a phone so it won't work, in Ireland if a phone gets blacklisted on one network it'll be also be blacklisted on the other networks (if I recall correctly it'll also be blacklisted on UK networks). It's generally done if a phone is reported lost or stolen, and if a phone has been purchased in fraudulent circumstances.

How do you know if it's happened?

What are the grounds that it can be done on?

And if it is done, is it reversable?

drunkmonkey

Hanley wrote: »

What are the grounds that it can be done on?

the only time i've requested phones to be blacklisted is if they are stolen from customers, i've never been scammed thankfully....you cancelling your contract wouldn't really be grounds to blacklist unless you were after scamming, false id's etc when buying the phone....

Sully

Well the chap from o2 support earlier says that it would be blacklisted. Assume he was obviously refering to the OP trying to pull a fast one and challenge o2s T&Cs.

If o2 were wrong but did it anyway OP, would you waste the cash challenging them in court? If they breached their T&Cs in your opinion?

billbond4

Gillo wrote: »

Basically its a way of disabling a phone so it won't work, in Ireland if a phone gets blacklisted on one network it'll be also be blacklisted on the other networks (if I recall correctly it'll also be blacklisted on UK networks). It's generally done if a phone is reported lost or stolen, and if a phone has been purchased in fraudulent circumstances.

Yeah when you power up your mobile and register with the network you send the IMEI of the phone to an Equipment Identity Register which checks it against blacklisted IMEI, if your IMEI is blacklisted the EIR will respond back and you wont be able to get on the network.
I think there is only one EIR for all the mobile operators in Ireland, and they have access to the international EIR as well.

Gillo

drunkmonkey wrote: »

the only time i've requested phones to be blacklisted is if they are stolen from customers, i've never been scammed thankfully....you cancelling your contract wouldn't really be grounds to blacklist unless you were after scamming, false id's etc when buying the phone....

But if the phone is bought at a subsidised price, on the basis the customer is going to stay with the network for a set period of time (in this case eighteen months) a decision may be made to blacklist the handset if the customer cancels the contract and leaves the network within a few weeks of signing up. I'm speculating at this stage though.

Hanley

Gillo wrote: »

But if the phone is bought at a subsidised price, on the basis the customer is going to stay with the network for a set period of time (in this case eighteen months) a decision may be made to blacklist the handset if the customer cancels the contract and leaves the network within a few weeks of signing up. I'm speculating at this stage though.

It says in the T&C's that they can't guarantee that the phone will work on any other networks, but it doesn't go so far as to say they'll take steps to actively ensure it doesn't.

I think that's a dubious line to cross? Especially since the phone was bought in good faith.(I can't emphasise that point enough - I did not buy the phone in an attempt to screw over o2.)

If it was bought in bad faith as a con job I would have signed up to the most expensive contract to ensure I got the phone at the most highly subsidised price. As it is, I joined the least expensive contract and paid the most possible for my phone, other than joining speakeasy).

Is there any way to reverse a black listing if it does happen? Any way of flashing the IMEI number?

O2_Daryll

The Blacklisting is set by the network so cannot be reversed by the handset or software that I am aware of.

pyramuid man

Changing the IMEI is highly illegal and is counted as fraud afaik.
Not possible to change it afaik

Hanley

pyramuid man wrote: »

Changing the IMEI is highly illegal and is counted as fraud afaik.
Not possible to change it afaik

Cool... thanks guys.

Can the network legally block a phone if you're not longer a customer of theirs? And if their grounds for doing so are nothing more than spite?

MunsterCycling

Can I ask how apple and O2 are getting around the European Directive that prohibits contract phones from being locked to the network that provides them?

You are legally entitled to the unlock code for your handset if you are on a contract as the contract pays not only for the calls etc but the phone as well, this has been the case for years, the day I got my N95 8GB I rang and requested my unlock code and received it in the post about 5 days later as it had to be requested from Nokia, just an aside from the current debate.

MC

Sam Vimes

pyramuid man wrote: »

Changing the IMEI is highly illegal and is counted as fraud afaik.
Not possible to change it afaik

If it was impossible the law would be unnecessary

Hanley wrote: »

Cool... thanks guys.

Can the network legally block a phone if you're not longer a customer of theirs? And if their grounds for doing so are nothing more than spite?

I think it'd be dodgy and a misuse of the blacklisting system

ardmacha

The subsidy on the phone is not explicit. You buy the phone cheaply and you also agree to a contract. You are liable for the contract, not the unsubsidised price of the phone, a figure that is carefully not listed anywhere. So you can't be asked to pay the full price of the phone other than as required in the contract.

You are legally entitled to the unlock code for your handset if you are on a contract as the contract pays not only for the calls etc but the phone as well,

good to get it unlocked within the 14 days then!

resistor

You will, however, be responsible for all Charges and other liabilities incurred by you during this Porting Period'

Don't you think that this is the 'catch all' section of the contract. By not specifically stating what the 'charges and liabilities' are, they could bill you 500 euro for the phone and tell you that the cost is part of the 'charges and liabilities' that you incurred during the porting period???

Let me know how you get on... ps. i got one free month 1-phone rental (45 euro) due to phone being out of service for one week (needed to be sent for repairs after just 10 days).

Carol_1985

I personally think that it is reasonable for the network to blacklist the handset. You got the phone for the price you got it with an agreement to stay with o2 for 18 months. When you were signing up you knew you were committing for 18 months but now you're backing out. Although technically it may not be illegal, I do think it would be dishonest of the OP! Just my opinion

Our man in Havana

Has anyone ever tested these terms and conditions in a court of law? Just because a term is in there does not make it legal at all.

Gillo

Hanley wrote: »

It says in the T&C's that they can't guarantee that the phone will work on any other networks, but it doesn't go so far as to say they'll take steps to actively ensure it doesn't.

I think that's a dubious line to cross? Especially since the phone was bought in good faith.(I can't emphasise that point enough - I did not buy the phone in an attempt to screw over o2.)

I think that may be two different things, networks do realise that people will over time chop and change between different networks, most will only look at changing after twelve or eighteen months (after the contract has expired) and some of these people will want to keep the phone they already have. In your case and I'm not implying that you have done anything wrong you bought a phone and now a few days later want to move networks but keep the phone so I can see where a network is coming from in blacklisting a handset, it's be the same if someone ported to Vodafone to buy the blackberry store and then decided to more back to O2, I'd expect Vodafone to blacklist the handset.

Just for the record, I'm only posting my own opinions and nothing more.

Do you mid me asking Hanley, why you want to port back to Meteor? (without

Our man in Havana

Now, if the OP went beyond the 14 days and attemted to cancel O2 would invoke the contract and hit the OP for 18 months worth of line rental. I would think that the network would not be able to blacklist in that situation.

Davy

Any update OP?