Banned from Soccer forum for "thanks"

Mitch Connor

GuanYin wrote: »

No actually, I didn't. I was just the one left to deal with the situations that followed.

I do push some rules through as do we all but if a soccer mod disagrees, the rules don't get applied.

Just on a point of note, for those saying I like banning people. one of the rules I pushed through was the points system, which actually makes it twice as hard to get banned from soccer and then for only 6 - 9 months (as opposed to a 5 strikes you're out no matter how trivial the offence). Of course, the more desperate might argue that this just gives me more opportunities to ban people

Well, imo, this incident is simple proof that it is still way to easy to ban people.

I can understand the ban for Pighead.

I can also understand the reasons for banning/revoking the second lot of 'thankers'.

However, I think it is a very poor application of the rules to have banned the first few thankers based on the fact it had already been discussed people were thanking it becuase it was funny, and got the Roy Keane reference, not because they agree with any intended insult.

So as to back up my point, and try to continue this in the correct way. the charter does indeed state the following:

Minor Offences (including but not limited to):
Abusing through the thanks system (thanking posts that break the rules)

However, and importantly, it also state this:

Minor offence (See list) will result in a yellow card infraction and may incur a ban.

The important part of that is this: MAY.

You could have applied the rules perfectly fairly, and in keeping with the charter by issuing a yellow card for each 'thanks'. But you didn't. You DECIDED to ban people. It was a CHOICE you made, and imo, it lacked any application of common sense.

I would also argue the posters were not abusing through the thanking system - the two halves of that rule are not one and the same.

Again, I can understand the revoking of the rights of the second lot, don't agree with it, but can understand it, but the first lot of bannings (not including pigheads) is a joke, and completely unfair.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Xavi6

Chucky the tree wrote: »

The rule is directly related to the bans though.

But they've been done and won't be changed so let it go.

Also, what are the chances of having the rule removed?

We're always open to feedback from users, provided it's done in the correct way. Do you think a mass martyring and talk of a 'revolution' as displayed in this thread is the correct way?

Why not put a poll in the soccer forum and take the results from that?

With the amount of negativity towards the mods (GY in particular) in this thread I can't see such a poll being very beneficial as it will only swing one way.

Red Sleeping Beauty

Is GuayYin male or female ?

roryc

Lol I seem to have missed most of this... Open question to Dev... I presume you still read the poker forum a lot?

Its fairly clear that the forum is modded much, much better than the soccer forum in so many ways. As you probably know there are numerous posters over there that would have a strong interest in soccer but don't post in the soccer forum due to the absolutely abysmal modding which it is well known for. This is down to one person and one person only... GY. Whereas the other mods may agree with her decision in this, the fact of the matter is the rule shouldn't have been there in the first place

You only have to look in the BBV thread on matchdays to see how the conversation swings to the current matches. So you have people discussing soccer outside of the designated forum because a huge number of people just don't want to go near it. That is simply ridiculous... I'd say this is also apparent in other forums, the soccer forum doesn't exactly have a great reputation lately...

I've been posting in the soccer forum for the last few months but have started to cut back (again) because of the ridiculous rules put in place by GY. Its only a matter of time before something like this happens again.

Xavi6

alan dunne 27 wrote: »

Is GuayYin male or female ?

Does it matter?

GuanYin

Deleted User wrote: »

Can I have permission to post that PM you sent me which directly contradicts this?

You mean this?

Guanyin wrote:

Well actually, it has nothing to do with dragging things up. I believe there should be equal punishment for those who thank abuse as those who give it.

Too many cowards use the thanks function to abuse other posters rather than make a post themselves because they know they won't get banned.

I said I "believe" I never said I created.

Can I ask why do you wantto thank abusive posts anyway?

RoundTower

Xavi6 wrote: »

With the amount of negativity towards the mods (GY in particular) in this thread I can't see such a poll being very beneficial as it will only swing one way.

so you know the soccer forum users don't like the rule?

telemachus

Whoops haha, I was plodding along through that thread, got to Pigheads post after skimming a good half a dozen pages found it hilarious and thanked it and having found one diamond in the rough sea of largely inane "HE WILL NO HE WONT SIGN" left it at that and closed boards. I only found this thread and worked out what exactly had happened when I got the pm tonight. Now I am both banned and revoked, my life is grey and empty(er) .

Mitch Connor

roryc wrote: »

Lol I seem to have missed most of this... Open question to Dev... I presume you still read the poker forum a lot?

Its fairly clear that the forum is modded much, much better than the soccer forum in so many ways. As you probably know there are numerous posters over there that would have a strong interest in soccer but don't post in the soccer forum due to the absolutely abysmal modding which it is well known for. This is down to one person and one person only... GY. Whereas the other mods may agree with her decision in this, the fact of the matter is the rule shouldn't have been there in the first place

You only have to look in the BBV thread on matchdays to see how the conversation swings to the current matches. So you have people discussing soccer outside of the designated forum because a huge number of people just don't want to go near it. That is simply ridiculous... I'd say this is also apparent in other forums, the soccer forum doesn't exactly have a great reputation lately...

I've been posting in the soccer forum for the last few months but have started to cut back (again) because of the ridiculous rules put in place by GY. Its only a matter of time before something like this happens again.

In fairness to GY, she (i think she, this thread has me wondering) has been fairly quiet on the modding front of late, and most of the fun has been taken out of the forum lately through users getting all pissy when they don't like a joke as opposed to action from the mods (though Xavi did close the Ronaldo farting thread.... BBBBBOOOOOOOO)

Xavi6

RoundTower wrote: »

so you know the soccer forum users don't like the rule?

Did I say that?

AlmightyCushion

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

It's not simple for a mod to remove the ability to thank a certain post, in fact it's impossible.

I'm not really a fan of reprimanding posters who thank a post. In most cases the thanks system is far too ambiguous to ascertain the thankers motives. They may agree with the post and the abuse or maybe it just made them laugh. Stupidity makes me laugh and on occasion I have thanked stupid posts simply because they made me laugh.

With regards to pighead's post, the sheer over the topness of it had me in tears so I can see why people thanked it with out meaning any malicious intent towards the poster pighead was referring to.

Mitch Connor

GuanYin wrote: »

You mean this?


I said I "believe" I never said I created.

Can I ask why do you wantto thank abusive posts anyway?

Because they could have found it FUNNY and wanted to thank the poster for making them laugh, laughing is great after all, as opposed to agreeing with the intended abuse (as had already been said in the thread), as mentioned in my slightly earlier post which also detailed some pieces of the charter which back up claims the original thanks bannings were a poor show of modding (would love a response to that)

RoundTower

Xavi6 wrote: »

Did I say that?

you said a poll of soccer users about the rule could "only swing one way".

I guess you could have meant that they all love it and would vote in favour of such a rule in a landslide. Can you clarify if this is what you meant?

GuanYin

Actually, we could just remove the thanks system from soccer.

If the other soccer mods agree we can do that.

Red Sleeping Beauty

Xavi6 wrote: »

Does it matter?

Nope, just read one post that seemed to hint they're male then another then hinted they're female.

Xavi6

roryc wrote: »

Lol I seem to have missed most of this... Open question to Dev... I presume you still read the poker forum a lot?

Its fairly clear that the forum is modded much, much better than the soccer forum in so many ways. As you probably know there are numerous posters over there that would have a strong interest in soccer but don't post in the soccer forum due to the absolutely abysmal modding which it is well known for. This is down to one person and one person only... GY. Whereas the other mods may agree with her decision in this, the fact of the matter is the rule shouldn't have been there in the first place

You only have to look in the BBV thread on matchdays to see how the conversation swings to the current matches. So you have people discussing soccer outside of the designated forum because a huge number of people just don't want to go near it. That is simply ridiculous... I'd say this is also apparent in other forums, the soccer forum doesn't exactly have a great reputation lately...

I've been posting in the soccer forum for the last few months but have started to cut back (again) because of the ridiculous rules put in place by GY. Its only a matter of time before something like this happens again.

I completely disagree that GY is responsible for the way the forum is.

Were you around for the recent Stoke/Liverpool thread?

If not then I would suggest that you (and everyone else) has a read of it to see exactly the sort of crap that makes it paramount to have so many rules in the forum.

Link

Xavi6

RoundTower wrote: »

you said a poll of soccer users about the rule could "only swing one way".

I guess you could have meant that they all love it and would vote in favour of such a rule in a landslide. Can you clarify if this is what you meant?

Nope I meant that the obvious animosity towards GY in this thread would see the vote swing one way. Part of the 'revolution'.

redout

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

It's not simple for a mod to remove the ability to thank a certain post, in fact it's impossible.

I'm not really a fan of reprimanding posters who thank a post. In most cases the thanks system is far too ambiguous to ascertain the thankers motives. They may agree with the post and the abuse or maybe it just made them laugh. Stupidity makes me laugh and on occasion I have thanked stupid posts simply because they made me laugh.

With regards to pighead's post, the sheer over the topness of it had me in tears so I can see why people thanked it with out meaning any malicious intent towards the poster pighead was referring to.

Go raibh mile maith agat. A mod who see's sense.

GuanYin

GuanYin wrote: »

You mean this?

No the one before that.

GuanYin wrote: »

I said I "believe" I never said I created.

Can I ask why do you wantto thank abusive posts anyway?

I don't. But I don't want to wonder if I'm gonna get banned for being ironic. Like I've said over and over (and Almighty Cushion above says) I will thank a stupid post that makes me laugh as often as I will an intelligent one.

I wonder how many of the original banned members today thought they were gonna get banned for thanking Piggys post I wouldn't have thought it reading it before he got the red card. If you know anything about football you would have assumed (as I did) that it was a paraphrase of Keanos rant towards a poster with "keano" in the name. Post of the day IMO. Whether or not his intents were comical or abusive is only known to him. Most would have seen it as a witty reply based on the Saipan incident.


hypothetical situation. Say I posted something like this as a reply to something you said that made me dislike you as a poster:


":rolleyes: I really like you."



And loads of people see the irony and thank it, and then I later admit that it was a sneaky way of me calling you a twat, and I get banned, should the posters who thanked the original post which is harmless be banned, because I intended it differently? We don't know how posts are intended, you thank as you take it. i took Pigheads as a clever reply to a username. He meant it as an insult. How the hell was I meant to know that? Do you want to employ mind readers for boardsies? Would u like to get a bar added underneath posts where you state outright if you had malicious intent?Ii mean serious "He meant it as a personal insult" is a weak argument to be honest with you.

GuanYin

redout wrote: »

Go raibh mile maith agat. A mod who see's sense.

He's right about motives, this all started because months ago someone complained that another poster thanked abusive posts about him without posting as part of an ongoing vendetta. We're all about keeping peace inside soccer (while keeping the feedback mods in coke and hookers) so we discussed it and one of the soccer mods proposed the solution we now have.

The reason we have a catch all solution is because so many posts get thanked it is very hard to figure out who is being malicious and who isn't and some posters have even claimed a poster was thanking out of spite while the thanker claimed it was humor. We don't have lie detector tests.

The safest option is to just ban thanking abusive posts so noone can abuse the system.

Its not a great solution but its the best that was put forward.

As for my not replying. sorry, I was in work and 4.30 am was my sleepy time. I'd worked the previous 18 hours so I took a long, long sleep today. In fairness 24 hours is the polite response time for a mod reply.

Frisbee

GuanYin wrote: »

Actually, we could just remove the thanks system from soccer.

If the other soccer mods agree we can do that.

Ah don't do that.
I quite like the 'Thanks' system as it let's me pop into a thread and let my opinion known when I don't have time to post a reply.
Or I just don't want to be quoted in a debate.... :pac:

redout

GuanYin wrote: »

He's right about motives, this all started because months ago someone complained that another poster thanked abusive posts about him without posting as part of an ongoing vendetta. We're all about keeping peace inside soccer (while keeping the feedback mods in coke and hookers) so we discussed it and one of the soccer mods proposed the solution we now have.

The reason we have a catch all solution is because so many posts get thanked it is very hard to figure out who is being malicious and who isn't and some posters have even claimed a oster was thanking out of spite while the tanker claimed it was humor. We don't have lie detector tests.

The safest option is to just ban thanking abusive posts so noone can abuse the system.

Its not a great solution but its the best that was put forward.

.

So the innocent getting banned on occasion like myself is the best you lot could come up with ? I cant believe that you lot came up with that, voted on it and deemed it acceptable in all fairness.

*shakes head*

The Recliner

Based on this thread and the bannings etc personally I think removing the Thanks system for the soccer forum is the sensible thing to do

There are too many ambiguities and potential for misunderstandings and misuse

GuanYin

Frisbee wrote: »

Ah don't do that.
I quite like the 'Thanks' system as it let's me pop into a thread and let my opinion known when I don't have time to post a reply.
Or I just don't want to be quoted in a debate.... :pac:

It isn't an ideal solution either but we're running out of them. It is all very well to say trust the posters and then have some (a small minority I will admit) abuse the thanks, thread tagging, quote and even signature options to try and upset other posters.

We're really damned if we do and damned if we don't because if we don't try and combat these things we have another set of posters complain about people getting away with upsetting them.

I mean not so long ago someone wanted us to stop Man United fans posting in the liverpool thread!

We're really tring to keep the peace and I assure you I don't have the ability or the authority to do something maverick without the other mods hauling me in.

redout wrote:

So the innocent getting banned on occasion like myself is the best you lot could come up with ? I cant believe that you lot came up with that, voted on it and deemed it acceptable in all fairness.

Erm its in the forum rules so you knew that thanking abusive posts was not allowed or at least should have to be allowed post in soccer.

As I said, just because it is funny, doesn't mean it isn't abusive.

Chucky the tree

Xavi6 wrote: »

We're always open to feedback from users, provided it's done in the correct way. Do you think a mass martyring and talk of a 'revolution' as displayed in this thread is the correct way?



With the amount of negativity towards the mods (GY in particular) in this thread I can't see such a poll being very beneficial as it will only swing one way.

:pac:


Your always open to feedback but you have no intention in acting on because you think people will just vote to piss off the mods/GY? Jesus you dont think much of the soccer forum users do you? And I thought you were such a fan of respect.

Xavi6

Chucky the tree wrote: »

:pac:


Your always open to feedback but you have no intention in acting on because you think people will just vote to piss off the mods/GY? Jesus you dont think much of the soccer forum users do you? And I thought you were such a fan of respect.

Thank you for taking the time to answer the question in my post.

I'm only going on what has been posted in this thread.

Frisbee

GuanYin wrote: »

It isn't an ideal solution either but we're running out of them. It is all very well to say trust the posters and then have some (a small minority I will admit) abuse the thanks, thread tagging, quote and even signature options to try and upset other posters.

We're really damned if we do and damned if we don't because if we don't try and combat these things we have another set of posters complain about people getting away with upsetting them.

Yeah that's fair enough I suppose.
I guess I can just expect my post count to shoot up rapidly...

Frisbee

Chucky the tree wrote: »

:pac:


Your always open to feedback but you have no intention in acting on because you think people will just vote to piss off the mods/GY? Jesus you dont think much of the soccer forum users do you? And I thought you were such a fan of respect.

Tbh aside from a small core of decent posters in the soccer forum I wouldn't think much of a lot of the soccer forum users anyway.
Most seem to not have a fulfilling day without starting off some row.
While some do it jokingly, there's far too many who troll.
If it didn't make threads hard to read I'd have a lot of posters on Ignore...

redout

GuanYin wrote: »

Erm its in the forum rules so you knew that thanking abusive posts was not allowed or at least should have to be allowed post in soccer.

As I said, just because it is funny, doesn't mean it isn't abusive.

Yes but I and everyone else did not know how you came to that until you just posted it above and in all fairness the best that you and the other mods could come up with is just not good enough. I see that you yourself even said that its not perfect. So I think I am well within my rights to post what I just did above.