windows vista

iPlop

darealtulip wrote: »

I am surprised, most people I know dont like vista to much and only have it because it came with their comp. I personaly still have one comp on xp and one on vista. Dont really think vista is an improvement except ofcourse that you can upgrade without installing every thing again.

Ok off topic!!!

I found a lot of people with the same problem, and a lot with no problem what so ever and I would like to find out what is different in the once that dont.

Any idea?

I cant wait to get rid of vista 64 it's rubbish I have xp 64 and im gonna install during the week.If you are used to all the other versions of windows back as far as 3.1 ,it's all the same.Vista turns your employees into retards and they have to learn all over again.The company I work for abandoned vista as it was taking employees too long to find stuff on their PC's and office 2007 is a nightmare to navigate through,where is file and print in exel --gone ,it's now alt + f on a sitewide mail to employees.Microsoft know they messed up with the launch of win 7 so quick ,xp was / is around for 9 years

AlmightyCushion

Septic Leper wrote: »

.Microsoft know they messed up with the launch of win 7 so quick ,xp was / is around for 9 years

I'd hardly call 3 years quick. Compared to the release schedule between xp and vista it is but not compared to other releases. And it's still only about 7 years since xp was released.

iPlop

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

I'd hardly call 3 years quick. Compared to the release schedule between xp and vista it is but not compared to other releases. And it's still only about 7 years since xp was released.

Iv' had xp on my old build since 2000

AlmightyCushion

Septic Leper wrote: »

Iv' had xp on my old build since 2000

That must have been a beta you were running in 2000 (if at all) as xp wasn't released until late 2001. This detracts from the point I was trying to make. 3 years isn't quick, especially considering that it was only about 1.5/2 years between xp and 2000/ME.

ttm

Septic Leper wrote: »

Iv' had xp on my old build since 2000

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

That must have been a beta you were running in 2000 (if at all) as xp wasn't released until late 2001. This detracts from the point I was trying to make. 3 years isn't quick, especially considering that it was only about 1.5/2 years between xp and 2000/ME.

The point with XP IMHO is the Microsoft always intended to release another version not long after ME/2000. The plan was that for the millenium they would have a business and home OS that used the same kernel, ME came about when they realised they couldn't develop the products in time.

Whereas there were no immideate plans to follow up Vista so quickly with a new OS untill Vista got a bad reputation.

Bottom line is Vista isn't selling as well as expected so the next product line has been developed early.

Anyway after the usual off topic arguments over black is white I'm looking forward to hearing how darealtulip gets on with his 64 bit XP install or if he finds the fix for his Vista install. ditto Septic Leper

And on darealtulip comment on having both XP and Vista systems, I also have both OS's setup and running my better PC has Vista but I hardly use it and do most of my work on a 5-6yo XP system which does eveything I need.

eoferrall

darealtulip wrote: »

does anyone else here run on x64?

Hi I have Vista x64 Ultimate and it does not freeze up on me. I built the computer myself during the summer (had one or two issues which the good people here helped my quickly remedy!) I can't help you much on the issue you are encountering though as my knowledge is fairly low!

darealtulip

ttm wrote: »

The point with XP IMHO is the Microsoft always intended to release another version not long after ME/2000. The plan was that for the millenium they would have a business and home OS that used the same kernel, ME came about when they realised they couldn't develop the products in time.

Whereas there were no immideate plans to follow up Vista so quickly with a new OS untill Vista got a bad reputation.

Bottom line is Vista isn't selling as well as expected so the next product line has been developed early.

Anyway after the usual off topic arguments over black is white I'm looking forward to hearing how darealtulip gets on with his 64 bit XP install or if he finds the fix for his Vista install. ditto Septic Leper

And on darealtulip comment on having both XP and Vista systems, I also have both OS's setup and running my better PC has Vista but I hardly use it and do most of my work on a 5-6yo XP system which does eveything I need.

I will try this week and let you know how I got on, I left my VOM meter on, so empty battery:mad: I live in a small village so need to go out to get one. Will let you know as soon as I have done it all.

eoferrall wrote: »

Hi I have Vista x64 Ultimate and it does not freeze up on me. I built the computer myself during the summer (had one or two issues which the good people here helped my quickly remedy!) I can't help you much on the issue you are encountering though as my knowledge is fairly low!

Glad to know that there are people out there with a good working one, gives me hope, do you have a AMD or intel?

Auvers

darealtulip wrote: »

Glad to know that there are people out there with a good working one, gives me hope, do you have a AMD or intel?

I have been using Vista 64 since it launched and its perfect bar a few teeding problems which were sorted by MS since SP1, all this about XP being better is bullsh1t.

I think users who say this must need to upgrade there P3 with 512MBs and get with the times

oh Dareal my rig is a Intel Q9550, 4GBs

darealtulip

Auvers wrote: »

I have been using Vista 64 since it launched and its perfect bar a few teeding problems which were sorted by MS since SP1, all this about XP being better is bullsh1t.

I think users who say this must need to upgrade there P3 with 512MBs and get with the times

oh Dareal my rig is a Intel Q9550, 4GBs

i had my ultimate working good for a year, then sp1 came and buggerd everything up. since then I have had lots of problems and now got it down to freezing every 'cold' start. bought home primium because of all this.

Vista has better thing like the search etc. but I found lots of people on the net who just like me still have this problem. Most of them with new builds. now I dont know why alot of people dont have these problem but a lot do.
I dont prefer xp as such but if my comp works better on it I will return and wait till windows 7

Now the question is maybe; does any one has a good working AMD based comp with x64? just try to find out if it is maybe intel or AMD related.

eoferrall

darealtulip wrote: »

Glad to know that there are people out there with a good working one, gives me hope, do you have a AMD or intel?

Have AMD processor ... phenom X3 8650 to be exact, and a gigabyte GA-MA790X-DS4 mobo so nothing too mental or high performance...but runs crysis quite nicely!:D

darealtulip wrote: »

Now the question is maybe; does any one has a good working AMD based comp with x64? just try to find out if it is maybe intel or AMD related.

Well there you go I have a working computer for the last 7 or so months on amd based architecture and X64 Ultimate. Does that help you narrow it down?! probably messes your theory up does it!?

astrofool

ttm wrote: »

Whereas there were no immideate plans to follow up Vista so quickly with a new OS untill Vista got a bad reputation.

Bottom line is Vista isn't selling as well as expected so the next product line has been developed early.

Windows 7 development started before Vista was even released. MS were always going to move back to a 2-3 year OS refresh, like what they had during the 90's (along with a higher stock price). Vista took so long because the XP kernel became too fragile as development continued, there was a further 2 year delay to Vista as they went back to basics (2003 sp1 kernel), and built everything up using components. Behind the scenes, and in the kernel, Vista is a quantum leap over XP, unfortunately the UI lagged behind (you can see it wasn't finished, by some area's having a nice Vista UI, and then defaulting to the XP panel for other area's).

Windows 7 uses the same kernel, tweaked for performance, and with a new UI on top of it. (and a fixed UAC).

AlmightyCushion

astrofool wrote: »

Windows 7 uses the same kernel, tweaked for performance, and with a new UI on top of it. (and a fixed UAC).

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I really hope Microsoft don't screw up 7. The beta is fantastic.

darealtulip

eoferrall wrote: »

Have AMD processor ... phenom X3 8650 to be exact, and a gigabyte GA-MA790X-DS4 mobo so nothing too mental or high performance...but runs crysis quite nicely!:D



Well there you go I have a working computer for the last 7 or so months on amd based architecture and X64 Ultimate. Does that help you narrow it down?! probably messes your theory up does it!?

Yep afraid so!! same processor as me, can we swap comp??:D I am really just quessing. Already found that out yesterday, two friend in holland have same processor aswell. one has no problems with vista and the otherone does. same version of vista aswell. Instead of getting clearrer and norrowing down it gets more muddled up!

TerrorFirmer

ttm wrote: »

Sorry no x64 here, only 64 bit hardware I've used have been servers and 64 bit XP workstations and never had an issue.

The yellow cable is the 12V rail (black is the neutral)

http://pinouts.ru/Power/atx_v2_pinout.shtml

and interstingly the 12 Volt supply dispite all the others (5V,3.3V etc) is the one used via voltage regulators on the motherboard to power all the main components including the PSU. (Note older systems PIII and earlier relied heavily on the 5V supply newer systems suck most of the power via the 12V supply).

Now your 700Watt PSU will be (should be!) delivering in excess of 30amps (I'm guessing) for the 12Volt supply so something is very wrong if taking half an amp for a couple of cold cathode neon lights is causing a problem!

So if you can measuer the voltage between the yellow and black cables with and with out the lights plugged in then it would be intersting to see if there is a big voltage drop with them plugged in - might be a momentary drop while they start up to screw everything up, but if it is that it can happen a little to fast to measure. 12Volt rail should be supplying a minimum of 11.4Volts see http://www.formfactors.org/developer/specs/ATX12V_PSDG_2_2_public_br2.pdf when under load. Note voltages over 12.5volts are also bad news.

Now my point is that if the voltage drops below 11.4Volts even for a couple of milliseconds then there is a good chance that the system will freeze up. Ive tested hundreds of PSU's if not thousands and it is very rare for them to drop below this (old warn out ones do though).

Actually the problem may very well be the PSU, in the first post he mentions that he's using a 700W X-Power Supply. These supplies are notoriously horrendous, with brutal efficiency (last review I checked had them at between 50-60%) and have a pathetically weak 12v rating (think 20a last time I checked). Now, I am assuming that we're speaking about the 700W Generic red boxed X-Power supply, the Gamer edition X-Power PSU's are actually made by HEC and are fine - if its the later supply you have then never mind, but if its the former then yeah it's entirely likely it IS the PSU. A 300w Corsair or PC P&C PSU would be actually better then that POS.

Interestingly and coincidentally enough I built a machine for my girlfriend using older parts and with the sole cathode turned on (its a clear case), XP locks up within about 10 seconds of booting. When turned off the machine boots flawlessly

darealtulip

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

Actually the problem may very well be the PSU, in the first post he mentions that he's using a 700W X-Power Supply. These supplies are notoriously horrendous, with brutal efficiency (last review I checked had them at between 50-60%) and have a pathetically weak 12v rating (think 20a last time I checked). Now, I am assuming that we're speaking about the 700W Generic red boxed X-Power supply, the Gamer edition X-Power PSU's are actually made by HEC and are fine - if its the later supply you have then never mind, but if its the former then yeah it's entirely likely it IS the PSU. A 300w Corsair or PC P&C PSU would be actually better then that POS.

Interestingly and coincidentally enough I built a machine for my girlfriend using older parts and with the sole cathode turned on (its a clear case), XP locks up within about 10 seconds of booting. When turned off the machine boots flawlessly

thanks for that, I have a 400 watt psu laying about so I will put that in aswell in the weekend. Lots to do and try!! keep suggestions coming!!!

AlmightyCushion

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

Actually the problem may very well be the PSU, in the first post he mentions that he's using a 700W X-Power Supply. These supplies are notoriously horrendous, with brutal efficiency (last review I checked had them at between 50-60%) and have a pathetically weak 12v rating (think 20a last time I checked).

Holy crap. 50% efficiency. That's crazy.

iPlop

partioned hard drive today and put windows 7 64 bit on ,This is fantastic back to basics.Easy to use from the start ,i really like it.Anyone could get a 30 min lesson on how to use a PC with this--unlike vista;)

iPlop

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Holy crap. 50% efficiency. That's crazy.

OMG Im' using a 700 watt psu!

eoferrall

Septic Leper wrote: »

OMG Im' using a 700 watt psu!

Trend Perhaps!? both have 700W PSU...mines a 550W corsair...wonder when Darealtulip posts regarding the change of PSU what he will say.

This is good stuff, I always assumed bigger the PSU the better never realised that the quality would be so poor in some!:eek:

iPlop

Mine is a ez-cool 700 watt psu




http://www.amazon.co.uk/EZCool-Tornado-Super-Silent-700W/dp/B0014DHXQ6/ref=sr_1_3/276-2004011-4490840?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1232478410&sr=8-3

TerrorFirmer

Septic Leper wrote: »

Mine is a ez-cool 700 watt psu




http://www.amazon.co.uk/EZCool-Tornado-Super-Silent-700W/dp/B0014DHXQ6/ref=sr_1_3/276-2004011-4490840?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1232478410&sr=8-3

Probably something like 350-400w in reality... That's made by JSP-Tech, remember this?

Just looking at the X-Power PSU's there, the 400, 450 and 500w PSU's claim 75% efficiency but only have 17, 18 and 20a on the 12v respectively. Pretty piss poor. It was, I believe, either the 500 or 550w that had the horrible efficiency in tests, looking at the 700w X-Power PSU it has a combined 32a and also sports a slight-less-nasty-but-still-cheap blue box and I haven't heard anything about it but presumably it comes from the same factory. I think X-Power are all re-brands of cheap supplies anyway, apart from their Gamer line which come from HEC which are OK.

So it might not be the PSU, but just keep it in mind all the same.

darealtulip

i will start swapping and measuring thursday. Will let you all know thursday or friday.

I will try windows 7 aswell. septic leper did you have problems or none??

darealtulip

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

Probably something like 350-400w in reality... That's made by JSP-Tech, remember this?

Just looking at the X-Power PSU's there, the 400, 450 and 500w PSU's claim 75% efficiency but only have 17, 18 and 20a on the 12v respectively. Pretty piss poor. It was, I believe, either the 500 or 550w that had the horrible efficiency in tests, looking at the 700w X-Power PSU it has a combined 32a and also sports a slight-less-nasty-but-still-cheap blue box and I haven't heard anything about it but presumably it comes from the same factory. I think X-Power are all re-brands of cheap supplies anyway, apart from their Gamer line which come from HEC which are OK.

So it might not be the PSU, but just keep it in mind all the same.

Ill try it anyway. Its done in minutes. Its the waiting to freeze that takes 10 minutes orso.:D

I will measure first, then change PSU and measure again. If all is still freezing i start doing software

iPlop

darealtulip wrote: »

i will start swapping and measuring thursday. Will let you all know thursday or friday.

I will try windows 7 aswell. septic leper did you have problems or none??

No problems so far with 64 bit version ,and not 1 frreze yet ,and im' running alot of stuff trying it out.IE 8 is good as well ,and you will get free anti virus for it from microsoft.I recommend you partition your hard drive install windows 7 and duel boot -just in case;)

ttm

eoferrall wrote: »

This is good stuff, I always assumed bigger the PSU the better never realised that the quality would be so poor in some!:eek:

If you ever get the chance when buying a PSU also consider its weight. Would you expect a 700Watt PSU to be lighter in weight than a 550Watt PSU? Its a

darealtulip

I have installed windows 7 aswell now and no problems so far. not one freeze (yet). Like it a lot. I did the upgrade and all my programs and file and documents were in place and working except for skype and easymule. I had to instal the beta version of skype and reinstall easymule. other than that no probs what so ever (yet)

did measure everything but couldnt see anything strange ore anything with light on or off. didn't try them on while starting up yet but will doi that tomorrow and let yoou know.

Ended up not changing my PSU os anything. just works fine as it is!

what do you all think? it should be a software problem then or not? Early dyas though and report back in the morning!

L31mr0d

I had an issue with my PC hanging on startup recently as well. OP, you don't have any ramdisks do you?

My issue was that my ramdisk was mounting my pagefile to ram when it was booting, as the pagefile had gotten pretty large this was taking longer and longer. I just set the ramdisk to not bother keeping an image of it and just let Vista create a new one as and when it needed to.

Aside from this I turned of GUI boot in msconfig and installed this application (startup delayer) for setting the time at which each application starts. Works a treat and my desktop is now usable in about 13 seconds after booting.

ttm

Sorry about dragging up the PSU issue, hope it didn't confuse things too much. Very strange how it froze on a cold boot but was OK on a restart from the reset button, perhaps boot order was different?

Just googling "vista reset cold boot freeze" looks like a few people have exactly the same issue of needing a reset after a cold boot to start things up, unfortunatly no real answers.

darealtulip

ttm wrote: »

Sorry about dragging up the PSU issue, hope it didn't confuse things too much. Very strange how it froze on a cold boot but was OK on a restart from the reset button, perhaps boot order was different?

Just googling "vista reset cold boot freeze" looks like a few people have exactly the same issue of needing a reset after a cold boot to start things up, unfortunatly no real answers.

haha yep I googled it too. It's strange a lot of people have it and a lot dont. very strange.

windows 7 working fine, only disconnects my internet every so often, probaly my modem is to old, they send me a new one

darealtulip

L31mr0d wrote: »

I had an issue with my PC hanging on startup recently as well. OP, you don't have any ramdisks do you?

My issue was that my ramdisk was mounting my pagefile to ram when it was booting, as the pagefile had gotten pretty large this was taking longer and longer. I just set the ramdisk to not bother keeping an image of it and just let Vista create a new one as and when it needed to.

Aside from this I turned of GUI boot in msconfig and installed this application (startup delayer) for setting the time at which each application starts. Works a treat and my desktop is now usable in about 13 seconds after booting.

will try tha aswell, sound really good!