Is there an clique on boards.ie who are immune to the rules?

tbh

metrovelvet wrote: »

He asked a question. What is the big deal? Why are people getting so upset?

therefore, the only replies on this thread should be "yes" or "no", correct?
If you think Gandalf is trying to genuinely answer a question that (s)he doesn't already know the answer to, that's fair enough. I think that gandalf is saying that such a clique exists (although not showing any proof or even evidence of this) and is looking for people to agree.

Nevyn

metrovelvet wrote: »

Again, I ask what is the point of feedback when nothing changes?

Things always change and that is the only constant.

This is not a private inquiry it a public one and one that will be read by posters on this site and people who find it via google for years to come due to the archiving which is why well meaning people have taken the time to explain not just for Gandalf23 sake but for anyone who does a search via the work clique to find out what the story it.

If this thread and the information on it about how the site works changes the way even 1 poster things about the site and how it functions due to them understanding it then that is change and it is good change and it makes the thread worth while and I reckon it will be more then just 1 person.

metrovelvet

^ Bah ha ha ha ha ha. So the lectures are for people who google "boards ie cliques?"

Oh come on.

And btw it is poor etiquette to correct another adult on their poor etiquette, do you do this to people who forget to say thank you when you hold the door for them?

Do you do this to people who make mistakes as guests in your home? Are you considerate to the feelings of guests in your home or do you offer excoriating lectures to them when they ask a question or ask you for a towel or to turn up the heat?

tbh

metrovelvet wrote: »

^ Bah ha ha ha ha ha. So the lectures are for people who google "boards ie cliques?"

Oh come on.

And btw it is poor etiquette to correct another adult on their poor etiquette, do you do this to people who forget to say thank you when you hold the door for them?

Do you do this to people who make mistakes as guests in your home? Are you considerate to the feelings of guests in your home or do you offer excoriating lectures to them when they ask a question or ask you for a towel or to turn up the heat?

so I'm guessing this really isn't about Gandalf23's op anymore.

Nevyn

tbh wrote: »

so I'm guessing this really isn't about Gandalf23's op anymore.

well I don't see the point of responding to off topic personal posts, so I won't.

Gandalf23

I've just logged back in to this thread. Thanks for all the excellent replies and opinions. Especially thanks to Seamus, Randy, Muppet, tbh, Sceptre, SteveC, Wibbs, Faceman, and Metro.

I dont have time to reply to everything I'd like to because I'm running for a flightthis evening. Also, in case anyone accuses me of not being around, I'm off to a country with even worse broadband than ours, so I might not be around for the next few days. I'll be back next week if anyone wants me to reply to anything specific.

Just a few things that struck me ...

Going Waterforward wrote: »

Just wanted to quote this bit and reiterate it actually, seeing as I have been one of the other examples of abuse from a "moral authority" as it were. Gandalf23, i'm pretty sure you know i disagree with a lot of your views, and especially the way you go about it, but insulting you as I did previously was wrong. I apologise.

Thanks for this GW. Takes a big man to apologise. I'd like to apologise to you too ... I was a total assh0le to you in both my pm's and replies to you. I'm sorry and I was out of line. Hand of friendship?

Wibbs wrote: »

Do groups of people who share common bonds and interests exist on this site? Yep. Just like anywhere else in life. Do they sometimes give more leeway to some than others, especially new people? Yep again, for reasons given before. Just like life. Does this site seek to and indeed minimise such situations, by a system of rules, checks and balances and common sense evolved over time? Definitely. Indeed I would say considering the size and scope and diversity of this place I have found it actually better and fairer to the large middle ground majority than most real life situations. I've seen more cliquey behavior in one day in an office of 20 people than I've seen here in years. Actually I've seen more cliquey behavior in a small group of friends, so the fact that it is minimised here given it's scope is part of what fascinates me about the place TBH.

Excellent post ... well said.

Best and most accurate summary as I see it, and the best answer to my question.

Gandalf23

Just to clarify my position on this again. My question is in my first post. I have not said cliques exist ... I have asked the question. Lots of people have said they do exist, and I dont think thats a bad thing.

I have also asked if being part of a clique here allows you to be immune from the rules of boards.ie. I think this is a very bad thing, and I have said so many times in this thread. I have given an example of someone, Amp, avoiding a banning/infraction for what I consider to be personal abuse to support my question. He was not punished where others would have been banned. I have not accused Amp of being in a clique ... I put the question out there for discussion.

Many people have expressed opinions on this, and I accept what is being said (especially by Seamus, Gandalf, Wibbs, etc). People can make up their own minds based on the discussion and replies.

Its been a robust discussion that has been heated at times. I dont apologise for that. There have been thanks and support for both views. Its good to provide feedback and shake things up every now and again. I'm just being honest here and saying it as I see it.

Again, people will make up their own minds at the end of the day. My hope is that discusion like this will improve the site and the community.

And I really mean that.






p.s. enjoy the frost till I get back ... I'll be in beautiful heat and jungle for the next few days

Overheal

Gandalf23 wrote: »

\
I have also asked if being part of a clique here allows you to be immune from the rules of boards.ie. I think this is a very bad thing, and I have said so many times in this thread. I have given an example of someone, Amp, avoiding a banning/infraction for what I consider to be personal abuse to support my question. He was not punished where others would have been banned. I have not accused Amp of being in a clique ... I put the question out there for discussion.

Then I'll respond directly to the Amp thing - the poor bastard is trying to get banned (well, de-modded, preferably before Obama becomes King of America, in like, the next 2 hours)

Fact is, he is far too amusing to keep around. Not banning him for personal abuse in his own thread (which is protected by a giant wall of text rife with insanity) is an act of Torture as I see it. Its quite beautiful.

Amp is insane enough - lets label it Tourette's Syndrome and call it a day.

I agree with Seamus's interpretation: there is no pact or agreement that I can go over Personal Issues and rip the piss out of an OP because he thinks 6 inches is inadequate; and expect not to get banned from that forum, regardless of my sometimes-useful contributions in that forum. Nor can I discuss the ins and outs of internet piracy just because I have helped a lot of people fix their computers in the Tech fora.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have good money on Mr. Obama being assassinated today.

sceptre

Gandalf23 wrote: »

Also, in case anyone accuses me of not being around, I'm off to a country with even worse broadband than ours

Pitcairn I assume. Enjoy.

Dudess

Gandalf23 wrote: »

I have given an example of someone, Amp, avoiding a banning/infraction for what I consider to be personal abuse to support my question.

Although that thread is the ultimate example of an esoteric, exclusionary circle-jerk, wasn't he just being tongue-in-cheek with the abuse?

seamus wrote: »

Are there are group of posters on the site who are knowingly and willingly acting like some form of coven and actively undermining and flaunting the rules of the site, based on some formal pre-agreement that they won't take action against eachother?

The answer to this question is a resounding "No". Anything which gives rise to the illusion that such a group or agreement exists, is simply the community acting as communities do, for reasons I outlined early on in this thread.

Yep. There seems to be a view that perceived "cliques" are actually the result of a deliberate policy.
However of course there are people who know each other (even if not in real life), who are friends with each other, who view long-term members differently to newbies (simply because they know them), who treat people differently based on how familiar with them... that's life.

FlutterinBantam

Overheal wrote: »

Then I'll respond directly to the Amp thing - the poor bastard is trying to get banned (well, de-modded, preferably before Obama becomes King of America, in like, the next 2 hours)

Fact is, he is far too amusing to keep around. Not banning him for personal abuse in his own thread (which is protected by a giant wall of text rife with insanity) is an act of Torture as I see it. Its quite beautiful.

Amp is insane enough - lets label it Tourette's Syndrome and call it a day.

I agree with Seamus's interpretation: there is no pact or agreement that I can go over Personal Issues and rip the piss out of an OP because he thinks 6 inches is inadequate; and expect not to get banned from that forum, regardless of my sometimes-useful contributions in that forum. Nor can I discuss the ins and outs of internet piracy just because I have helped a lot of people fix their computers in the Tech fora.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have good money on Mr. Obama being assassinated today.

In bad taste buddy,like your fawning over a mod who allowed certain people to do what he banned others for

Fact.
Don't wish to get personal but you come across as quite immature.

John Mason

Yes of course there cliques

i personally am a member of at least 3.

i will pm you the details of how to apply

Nerin

bah, damn it, serious feedback response, and to gandalf23 too. damn you sir

Long answer:

yes, i'd agree there are cliques.
i'd be suprised if there wasnt. theres nothing wrong with them. some can be a bit more "cliquish" than others.
People accused bgrh of being a clique, and i found them to be quite welcoming to me. For an example of someone that was new and didnt get on well in the beginning with them, look a delija.
when the noc forum was created, he jumped in, and has become a regular. (people often describe us as a clique, and i know a few people hate it. But screw it, as long as we strive to be friendly and welcoming, i see no problem)

No, i wouldnt see a clique getting preferential treatment. Thats not to say it doesnt happen. i just havent seen it. so of course, it very well can, happen, could have happened,or is happening. But from what i can see it isnt.
The automatic mod conspiracy crap is just that. crap.
Its nonsense, its silly, its bloody boring and frustrating.
people may see the mods as "higher ups" or whatever, but i see them as just another bunch of users. some are friends irl, some are friends online. some are rivals, some are down right enemies.
it cant be made any clearer.
As for the older crew, yes, they probably have a clique or two, or three. and some get on, some dont. but on the most part i dont see them as immune to rules.
As for modding and friendships, well, in my experience, its the opposite. ive come down hard(er) on friends ive had to mod. Moreso than normal users.
Ive treated friends as if the thing they did that i reprimanded them on was the first post by someone with a dodgy username.
i know this isnt fair either, and ive learned more since i began modding months ago (or way back in ye old 2008). ive seen it happen to other users, by other mods.
again, going back to the clique thing, regulars have been banned and infracted for being abusive, off putting, whatever, to noobs. all these different points have lead me to believe that no, there isnt preferential treatment.

as for this feedback thread, hey, feedback works. everyones allowed their opinions. i see well known muppets, trolls and all round jerks lurking on this, bringing in other issues and basically riling it up.
They havent been silenced (and oh how tempting i'd say it can be).
so case and point, the naysayers are proving themselves wrong. even if they dont see it. or even if they dont care and are just posing for a reaction or a fight.

short answer:

Yes there are cliques. I'd say a safe guess is there are hundreds.

No, cliques arent immune to the rules, from what ive seen.

FlutterinBantam

Why can jezza post with impunity in the banned thread in TCN


Answer that

Steve

Dudess wrote: »

Although that thread is the ultimate example of an esoteric, exclusionary circle-jerk, wasn't he just being tongue-in-cheek with the abuse?

I made a single post in that thread totally expecting to be completely ignored because it was a circle I was never involved in on this site. I don't believe I've ever had any interaction with the OP in my time here.
To my amazement, the post was acknowledged and that to me is proof that the whole circle-jerk clique thing is nothing more than horseshit.


@ Nerin, excellent post, I know we haven't always seen eye to eye on matters but I commend you on the achievements you've made with the Noc forum..

Talliesin

stovelid wrote: »

You were thinking of cabal perhaps?

Which I always think sounds kinda supernatural as well.

You wouldn't be entirely off the mark in that. Cabal originally meant an occult doctrine and was derived from Cabala (one of the many transliterations of Qabala/Kabbalah/etc.)

The idea that it came from the initials of Charles II's Cabal Ministry (Sir Thomas Clifford, Lord Arlington, the Duke of Buckingham, Lord Ashley, and Lord Lauderdale) reverses the true etymology; rather than being the source of the word, people were pointing to the fact that their names spelt out "cabal" as a satire at the time.

Overheal

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Why can jezza post with impunity in the banned thread in TCN


Answer that

TCN doesnt follow the normal laws of space and time as far as i know.

cHaTbOx

Overheal wrote: »

TCN doesnt follow the normal laws of space and time as far as i know.

thinks he knows it all

Terry

I didn't read the whole thread. Normally when I do, the thread ends up closed by the time I get to the last page.
Anyway, here's my take:

Sabotage wrote: »

I'm thinking of starting my own.

With blackjack and hookers?
Can I join?

SteveC wrote: »

I made a single post in that thread totally expecting to be completely ignored because it was a circle I was never involved in on this site. I don't believe I've ever had any interaction with the OP in my time here.
To my amazement, the post was acknowledged and that to me is proof that the whole circle-jerk clique thing is nothing more than horseshit.


@ Nerin, excellent post, I know we haven't always seen eye to eye on matters but I commend you on the achievements you've made with the Noc forum..

The Amp thread I assume?
I posted in it too and have probably posted only two or three times in tCN, with the exception of the obligatory moved from AH posts. He replied to my post even thopugh we don't know each other. Not that I was looking for validation. I'll get to that in a bit.
Not my cup of tea.

Amp has been here from the beginning
As with any forum, those who arrive first and stick around will evetually become friends.
The others will obviously know amp's personality and know that he was just having a laugh.
There are hundreds of mods here and they all choose different ways of stepping down. Some take the route of sending a PM to an admin, some post in the mod forum and ask to be removed, some scramble their password and just disappear. Amp chose to post here.

Onto the clique thing.
Of course there are cliques.
There are cliques on every forum.
You will always have people who share interests and they will inevitably become friends.
That's not a bad thing.

The bad part of cliques is that some do think they are immune to the rules (except when they cross me. Then I just ban them from AH and tell them to STFU when they start whining. Ooh, there goes Terry on another of his anti-clique rants. Blow me).

OP, you're probably like me. You probably have no interest in joining any cliques here or becoming close friends with anyone on this site.
Nothing wrong with that, but some people do end up striking up friendships even if they don't set out to. That's a good thing rwally and is something that endears people to this site.

Should amp have been banned for his comments here?
If I was a feedback mod, then I would have banned him. That's just me though and not a comment on the mods of this forum. They run this in the way they see fit and it's probably best to take it up, well, here.
I don't know what else to tell you.

randylonghorn

random chatbox wrote: »

thinks he knows it all

thinks he is in the "Post about the poster before" thread.

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Why can jezza post with impunity in the banned thread in TCN


Answer that

She can't, because the banned thread in tCN has been locked for months.

Apart from that, Overheal's answer is probably close to the truth. Anyone who expects tCN to be logical or follow the normal rules of anything has missed the point.

Apart from that, I can give you no better answer than anyone on this site, and I won't pretend I can.

I would just like to gently suggest to you, for your own sake more than anyone else's, that it's time to stop flogging a dead horse. But that's your own decision to make ...


Up to my eyes at the moment, few other things above I might come back to when / if I get time.

Victor

Yes, there are cliques. Would you like to join?

Mahatma coat

wasnt there a private forum called

The Clique

???????????????

what more evidence of a conspiracy do you people need

FlutterinBantam

randylonghorn wrote: »

thinks he is in the "Post about the poster before" thread.

She can't, because the banned thread in tCN has been locked for months.

Apart from that, Overheal's answer is probably close to the truth. Anyone who expects tCN to be logical or follow the normal rules of anything has missed the point.

Apart from that, I can give you no better answer than anyone on this site, and I won't pretend I can.

I would just like to gently suggest to you, for your own sake more than anyone else's, that it's time to stop flogging a dead horse. But that's your own decision to make ...


Up to my eyes at the moment, few other things above I might come back to when / if I get time.

That's the best and only realanswer I ever got to that query.

Which proves that if people pony up at the outset,and be honest,it saves a lot of dead horse flogging from gimps like me.

Carstairs!! take this whip back to the trophy room.

4zn76tysfajdxp

randylonghorn wrote: »

Up to my eyes at the moment, few other things above I might come back to when / if I get time.

Up to your eyes? WTF happened to the top of your head?

Villain

Pear Tree House?

Terry

Villain wrote: »

Pear Tree House?

****ers wouldn't let me in there.

I just wanted a look.


Regarding private forums; There was a bit of trouble a couple of years back with some private forum members taking the piss out of non members.
DeVore stepped in and put a stop to it. (Not pear tree house)
The way it stands now is that if you have a private forum, you are not allowed to take the piss out of other site members.

I am a member of two private forums, but the mods will give access willingly to others.
They're not cliquish in any way and are only private because they contain adult orientated content.

Villain

Well I have learnt to try and keep my head down here but recent events on the weather forum have lead me to think the op has a point.

Terry

Links?

Villain

julep wrote: »

Links?

All deleted we are all in the dark

DeVore

I'm still trying to get to the bottom of the weather thing. In fact I am waiting to give one of the people involved enough time to gather their thoughts, at their request.

I have previously put the boot into a number of private forums, a couple where I would hang out too, for conduct outside their forums. But since this isnt seen, its not considered by the (rather blinkered) usual suspects.



Any mod who can show or even truthfully claim I have ever over turned one of their decisions or told them to do so because the target was a friend of mine can take over my position as Admin and I will resign forthwith. I'm not joking about this.

DeV.