if this gets any worse

pepsicokeacola

whose with me in taking to the streets like what happened in riga.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7827708.stm

seriously what else can we do? the ****ing goverment is still on holiday:eek:

ionix5891

off ya go

Bob Z

i dont know.....its a bit cold outside

the_syco

So you want to loot the shops, cause mayhem, and throw stuff at the Gardai?

Sounds like a parade not so long ago :mad:

Riddle101

Wow Latvian people are pretty stupid, they don't realise that the economical problems they're having are the same as the economical problems The REST OF THE World are having.

But then again i can understand why this is happening. With the economic downfall everyone is getting worried, and worry leads to anger and blame, and who's gonna be the first to be blamed when something of this calibre happens, the Government as usual. not that i'm advocating that i support their government or anything but i'm just saying they need to realise that this was out of the government's hand

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

ionix5891

daveirl wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

how about the real root cause?

some of us got greedy

no wait thats to simple of an answer

SkepticOne

I also disagree that every country suffering equally from the worldwide situation. Most countries will have a full a recession of some sort due to it but others will have a full blown crisis. Some governments will use the period up to the crisis to make sure their friends are sorted out at the expense of the country.

I think rioting like this is counter-productive although I can understand the emotion that leads to it. It strengthens the governments hand and ordinary people seeking security will back the ensuing crackdown.

Better a sustained but peaceful protest if you want to shift the government and bring about elections.

pepsicokeacola

in riga they have been having peaceful protests before this, where have been the irish protests? has there been any?

uaobrien

Riddle101 wrote: »

not that i'm advocating that i support their government or anything but i'm just saying they need to realise that this was out of the government's hand

Unless I'm very much mistaken, governments are put in place to be the caretakers of their respective countries. If they let companies run amok and their countrymen have to pay the penalties, who else are you going to blame? The companies are headquartered thousands of miles away from your country.

I think that in part is the point. The governments of the world are scrambling to shore up a disaster they may not have directly caused, but sure as hell did nothing to stop when they could do something, like enact laws or bills to restrain free market greed.

mike65

If you are advocating a Statist economy then we would never have had a boom to bust.

oscarBravo

pepsicokeacola wrote: »

whose with me in taking to the streets like what happened in riga.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7827708.stm

seriously what else can we do? the ****ing goverment is still on holiday:eek:

I know it's a crazy, radical thought, but: maybe we should vote for someone else?

Sure, the next scheduled election isn't for a few years, but if our memories are that short then we don't deserve decent government.

SkepticOne

I've advocated recently the current government serving out their term. If they got the country into the current mess through bad policies over the last several years, then they should be around for the damage over the next few years, plus we as a people need to learn from our mistakes. Recent events, particularly the Anglo debacle have changed my views. From a purely self-interested point of view, I would support efforts to shift the current government. Rioting of the sort seen in Riga won't achieve this however.

meglome

I'm up for a protest and some **** throwing, and I mean literally.

meglome

SkepticOne wrote: »

I've advocated recently the current government serving out their term. If they got the country into the current mess through bad policies over the last several years, then they should be around for the damage over the next few years, plus we as a people need to learn from our mistakes. Recent events, particularly the Anglo debacle have changed my views. From a purely self-interested point of view, I would support efforts to shift the current government. Rioting of the sort seen in Riga won't achieve this however.

I agree with you 100% there.

DublinWriter

First we take Finglas,
Then we take Berlin.

gurramok

Nah, we take Foxrock first

Rioting has implications, it will show how bad the anger is out there of the general populace and usually results in urgency been made by govts to correct any issues of anger.

Secondly, it can be bad not just from sticks and stones but from the international reputation of the country. Investors would be scared away with political instability aka Greece.

ionix5891

gurramok wrote: »

Nah, we take Foxrock first

Rioting has implications, it will show how bad the anger is out there of the general populace and usually results in urgency been made by govts to correct any issues of anger.

Secondly, it can be bad not just from sticks and stones but from the international reputation of the country. Investors would be scared away with political instability aka Greece.

investors are already scared due to our economic position and our political stance (no to lisbon)

gurramok

ionix5891 wrote: »

investors are already scared due to our economic position and our political stance (no to lisbon)

Ok, we know that. Scared even further is what i meant.

the_syco

oscarBravo wrote: »

I know it's a crazy, radical thought, but: maybe we should vote for someone else?

Vote for who else? The opposition tells us how bad the government is, but doesn't really say how it'd fix it, other than "we'll do better"...

Nodin

DublinWriter wrote: »

First we take Finglas,
Then we take Berlin.

I'd feel a bit better about it if we could have a crack at Berlin first...Get a bit of practice in.

jmayo

uaobrien wrote: »

Unless I'm very much mistaken, governments are put in place to be the caretakers of their respective countries. If they let companies run amok and their countrymen have to pay the penalties, who else are you going to blame? The companies are headquartered thousands of miles away from your country.

I think that in part is the point. The governments of the world are scrambling to shore up a disaster they may not have directly caused, but sure as hell did nothing to stop when they could do something, like enact laws or bills to restrain free market greed.

Riddle101 wrote: »

Wow Latvian people are pretty stupid, they don't realise that the economical problems they're having are the same as the economical problems The REST OF THE World are having.

But then again i can understand why this is happening. With the economic downfall everyone is getting worried, and worry leads to anger and blame, and who's gonna be the first to be blamed when something of this calibre happens, the Government as usual. not that i'm advocating that i support their government or anything but i'm just saying they need to realise that this was out of the government's hand

Except in our case one of the companies that has created a whole lot of the mess is HQ in Stephens Green and AFAIK it's former chairman/CEO is playing golf in South Africa while the mess he left behind is screwing the taxpayer.

In a lot of countries the problems they are experiencing were created by smart greedy American bankers passing off toxic debts and the fallout from decreased consumer spending world wide.
In ours it is due to home grown chancers who saw a chance to screw as much money as possible out of dumb smucks that were clammering over each other to get on the path to easy riches property ladder.
Some of those chancers are very embedded within our main government party over last 12 years, so yes I do wholly blame them for the depth of our mess :mad:
Passing it off as the fault of American subprime market and credit crunch is disengeneous and horribly bending the truth of our situation.

If the Irish people fall for this sh***, then we do really deserve to be screwed over by the Molloys, Fitzpatricks, Nearys, Drumms, Lawlors, Dunne, Flynns, Berties of this world.

the_syco wrote: »

Vote for who else? The opposition tells us how bad the government is, but doesn't really say how it'd fix it, other than "we'll do better"...

Ah yes I see you are quoting the FF press office "sure they would be as bad as us" chant.
The government have the full resources of all the government departments, have better contacts and should have more up to date information from Central Bank, the gobs**** financial regulator, ECB, etc.
Yet they are wandering around like gormless eejits,stumbling fromone disaster to another, hoping Obama maybe does something that saves their ars**.
AFAIK the reason for an opposition is not to run the country for the ones that are in government. Their job is to comment on what the government is doing and back or oppose their policies.
Usuually they oppose or try and get their adjustments/ammendments added into government policy.

PS I think the scary thing is that I don't think the opposition or any of us, really know how bad things are and what toxic debts are lying out there.
It would be interesting to see Kenny, Gilmore & Bruton's faces when they do find out how bad things really are.

Myabe this government of ours really do need mass protest to realise that they can't continue giving out golden handshakes to ex public employees that shafted taxpayers by wasting their money e.g. Molloy and Neary.

Darragh29

Riddle101 wrote: »

Wow Latvian people are pretty stupid, they don't realise that the economical problems they're having are the same as the economical problems The REST OF THE World are having.

But then again i can understand why this is happening. With the economic downfall everyone is getting worried, and worry leads to anger and blame, and who's gonna be the first to be blamed when something of this calibre happens, the Government as usual. not that i'm advocating that i support their government or anything but i'm just saying they need to realise that this was out of the government's hand

That old chestnut... :rolleyes:

Darragh29

I think what is happening in Riga will also happen here, within the next few months, there will be a huge peaceful protest organised in Dublin and the same day it is organised, some more terrible news will emerge about the economy or some other bank being bailed out with billions and people will snap and it will turn nasty. The only thing missing for civil unrest now in Ireland is a focal point or a conduit for people to express their anger through...

oscarBravo

the_syco wrote: »

Vote for who else? The opposition tells us how bad the government is, but doesn't really say how it'd fix it, other than "we'll do better"...

Which leaves you with a number of choices:

You can choose to believe that no matter how catastrophically, unbelievably dreadful the current government is, the alternative must somehow be worse.

You can choose to take a chance on a change in government, if for no other reason than to shake the sense of God-given entitlement to rule that is one of the core reasons for how bad the current government is.

You can get involved in politics, and help to change whatever it is you don't like about Irish politics from within whatever political party you feel deserves your support.

Or you can take the quintessentially Irish approach, and bitch about the situation without doing anything about it.

Spoilt for choice, really.

Erin Go Brath

Darragh29 wrote: »

I think what is happening in Riga will also happen here, within the next few months, there will be a huge peaceful protest organised in Dublin and the same day it is organised, some more terrible news will emerge about the economy or some other bank being bailed out with billions and people will snap and it will turn nasty. The only thing missing for civil unrest now in Ireland is a focal point or a conduit for people to express their anger through...

Its just a matter of time. People have had it so good in this country over the past decade and now thinks are falling apart and rapidly. Companies pulling out of the country, banks going to the wall, people will start defaulting on their mortgage payments in increasing numbers. On top of this Government incompetence, wastage, and general mismanagement are angering the nation. All the ingredients for anarchy are there, things aren't bad enough just yet, but in 6-12 months time they may well be.

BroomBurner

Darragh29 wrote: »

I think what is happening in Riga will also happen here, within the next few months, there will be a huge peaceful protest organised in Dublin and the same day it is organised, some more terrible news will emerge about the economy or some other bank being bailed out with billions and people will snap and it will turn nasty. The only thing missing for civil unrest now in Ireland is a focal point or a conduit for people to express their anger through...

They already have a conduit, sure everyone is jumping on the "let's all hate and blame the public servants" bandwagon that has been growing in the media. Sure you can tell by just reading the amount of threads of hatred on boards.

OP, seriously, think for a minute about what you're advocating. Do you really think we need to riot? We're not exactly under a military dictatorship or anything, at least not yet!

Fratton Fred

Latvia probably don't have as many immigrants as we do. once we have stopped blaming all the asylum seekers and Poles, once they have all left then we can start rioting in the streets as there will be no one else to blame.

Rebeller

the_syco wrote: »

Vote for who else? The opposition tells us how bad the government is, but doesn't really say how it'd fix it, other than "we'll do better"...

Are you really serious? Do you really mean that you would prefer to continue with the most inept corrupt administration in the history of the Irish Republic because the opposition "doesn't really say how it'd fix it"?

Brian "hic" Cowen, is that you?

BroomBurner wrote:

OP, seriously, think for a minute about what you're advocating. Do you really think we need to riot? We're not exactly under a military dictatorship or anything, at least not yet!

Righteous anger is a good thing. It is good that a government fears the people it rules. A government that does not fear the wrath of the general populace is a government that has been in power for too long.

Rioting will not of course solve our economic woes.

Rioting will not of course create new jobs for the soon to be masses of unemployed.

Rioting will not of course protect the 100s of thousands of people from negative equity.

However, smashing some government (numb)skulls would feel damn good:D

Frankie Lee

I say get the guillotine out.

The Corinthian

oscarBravo wrote: »

Spoilt for choice, really.

You missed one. Emigration.

The collapse of the property market was coming. Even the most optimistic of commentators were talking about 'soft landings'.

Lisbon had a very minor negative effect on investor confidence. Nonetheless, if did have an effect. It was a safe bet by the last week or two of campaigning that it would be defeated. I was packing my bags by this stage.

The credit crunch that followed caught most of us by surprise though; I'll admit that. However even without it Ireland was due a minor recession, on the scale of the one in 2001-2002. If one couldn't see that much coming, I strongly advise them never to breed.

Anyhow, the grass is greener in faraway fields, but you'll either have to go to Oz or learn another language. I say this because the downturn has effected the 'Anglo-Saxon' economies a lot more than everywhere else, where they may still be in a slowdown or recession at the moment, but it's all relative. Purgatory is better than Hell, in the grand scheme of things...

Just please remember that the last one leaving Ireland should remember to switch off the lights.