my bargain order cancelled!!! not fair!!!

Gillo

Just thinking was the contract ever completed as the goods were never delivered? If they weren't surely Argos could pull out just as the OP could change his or her mind too.

Anyone with a legal knowledge care to give a definite answer as opposed to the general read it on the internet / this guy in the pub opinion.

Gyalist

IANAL but I'm a retailer. I had a quick look at Argos' Terms & conditions on their website:

2. Order process

2.1 Please see the Home delivery information and How to use this website section for information on how to place an order. All orders that you place on this website will be subject to acceptance in accordance with these terms and conditions.

2.2 The 'confirmation' stage sets out the final details of your order. Following this, we will send to you an order acknowledgement email detailing the products you have ordered. Please note that this email is not an order confirmation or order acceptance from Argos.

2.3 Acceptance of your order and the completion of the contract between you and us will take place on despatch to you of the products ordered unless we have notified you that we do not accept your order or you have cancelled it (please refer to Returns and refunds).

2.4 We do not file details of your order for you to subsequently access direct on this website, and therefore, please print out these terms and conditions and the order acknowledgement for your own records. If you wish to obtain specific details of your previous orders please Contact us.

I can't see how in the light of 2.3 that you think you have a worthwhile case.

junior_apollo

Gyalist wrote: »

IANAL but I'm a retailer. I had a quick look at Argos' Terms & conditions on their website:

2. Order process

2.1 Please see the Home delivery information and How to use this website section for information on how to place an order. All orders that you place on this website will be subject to acceptance in accordance with these terms and conditions.

2.2 The 'confirmation' stage sets out the final details of your order. Following this, we will send to you an order acknowledgement email detailing the products you have ordered. Please note that this email is not an order confirmation or order acceptance from Argos.

2.3 Acceptance of your order and the completion of the contract between you and us will take place on despatch to you of the products ordered unless we have notified you that we do not accept your order or you have cancelled it (please refer to Returns and refunds).

2.4 We do not file details of your order for you to subsequently access direct on this website, and therefore, please print out these terms and conditions and the order acknowledgement for your own records. If you wish to obtain specific details of your previous orders please Contact us.

I can't see how in the light of 2.3 that you think you have a worthwhile case.

But surely from your own above quote .. these terms and conditions are for orders made VIA THE WEBSITE see bold in part 2.1
Also: in part 2.3 they state that

2.3 Acceptance of your order and the completion of the contract between you and us will take place on despatch to you of the products ordered unless we have notified you that we do not accept your order or you have cancelled it (please refer to Returns and refunds).

Again this is website ordering specific but they did accept his order... IN PERSON... and completed the transaction in person by taking payment and issuing a receipt.

The website ordering terms and conditions are pretty much irrelevant here as the OP completed the transaction in the shop and so we'd need to see the terms and conditions for this type of transaction.

anna77

Did you get a reply yet?? is there any movement?

aoshea wrote: »

Hi,I am the person who bought the 2 Corner Groups. I have received a refund cheque,(which I advised them on the phone I didn't want and the calls are recorded) which I copied and Returned with a strongly worded Letter to the MD of Argos Direct in Stafford England.
I have been ringing nearly everyday and it appears there is that many "Executive Teams" working on this that its getting to be a joke. I cannot get to speak to anyone of any importance on this matter,I have apperantly being dealing with the Managers Dept who keep telling me a different team will ring me back before 5pm, and They dont.

I have copies of the advertised Sofa's and a copy of the Listing which actually states in Red "Less than half price"

I also sent them this, straight off the Argos Direct Site:-:confused:

How can I check latest prices?

We're always lowering our catalogue prices and running special offers. With so many great deals, you might find that many items are cheaper than you thought! Luckily, Argos.co.uk always has the latest prices. Wherever you see a price advertised on this website, you can be sure it is the latest price available. Alternatively, there's now a fast and easy way to check product prices using our Price & stock checker located at the top of your screen. Simply enter the catalogue number you're looking for and we'll provide you with the latest price available.
Please note that prices can change on a daily basis. If you reserve an item for store pick up using our Check & Reserve service, the price you pay is the price in-store on the day you collect & pay for the item.
Back to top
I have a Solicitor on board now and meeting with him on Monday morn.The Small Claims Court can't take this on because they said its a "breach of contract " and they don't handle that, they advised me to get a solicitor,as did consumer affairs. I am peed of with them as well as I rang and rang them to see what they were doing about this collective complaint and I just keep getting fobbed off,but I'm not letting it go,I will fight them all the way.I received no Voucher! (not that I want one)Every legal person I spoke to says they have to give the sofa's as My receipt is my contract,It is not unreasonabe to think it would be so cheap as it was after xmas and everywhere has sales,If You were in A budget Travel Queue you may get a family holiday for a euro or go to clearys and queue and may get a Dyson for a euro. Its not my fault I got a sofa for less than half price!

Blarney92

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consideration_under_English_law#Consideration_need_not_be_adequate

Consideration must be real but it need not be adequate.

In this case €119 was paid to argos and it was accepted.

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/business/contract_law.html

A contract needs only 3 elements to be considered valid and therefore legally enforceable- offer, acceptance and intention to create legal relations.

In this case we have
Offer: the OP offering €119 to buy the couch.

Acceptance: The argos worker accepting this €119 euro and completing the transaction

Intention to Create Legal Relations: In a commercial context the courts will always assume that there is a contract to create legal relations.


As this case contains all three elements its a valid contract.

In this case I would advise the OP, to seek Specific performance from Argos ie to get them to deliver couch as per contract.

I'm not sure though will this work as even if they don't you can only sue for damages which will probably be only €119. I would pursue it however. Also since courts will mostly side with consumers as liability has been identified in this case its definitely worth a shot.

aoshea

Well I went to see the Barristor that onsumer Affairs gave the contact through Citizens Advise,He says and I quote,..." Everything I have on Paper is true and I am within my rights and Argos Should Preform on the Contract,however unless I'm a millionair:( He wouldn't advise persuing this as they will fight it tooth and nail". I have since wriien to Consumer Affairs through their site and the Director of Consumer Affairs,here is their reply,...

Dear Ms. O'Shea,
Thank you for contacting the National Consumer Agency (NCA) with your query regarding Argos.

The store may be able to argue that the incorrect price displayed was due to genuine human error, and there are legal provisions to state that no one can benefit from a genuine human error. As such, when a company outlines there was an error and advises you of the correct price, its then up to the consumers choice as to whether they wish to go ahead with the transaction or not.

However, as you have have paid in full, you may be able argue that a contract has been formed, and seek fulfilment of that contract. However, this would be a civil matter to be resolved between the parties involved, and you would require legal counsel for further advice and assistance.

Under the provisions of the Consumer Protection Act 2007 misleading advertising is regarded as a misleading commercial practice. Providing false, misleading or deceptive information that would likely cause the average consumer to commit to purchasing a product or service is regarded as a misleading commercial practice.

As such, the matter will be referred to our Commercial Practices Division for examination and whatever follow up action deemed necessary and appropriate against Argos. However, due to the limited resources of our agency and the volume of complaints we receive, we are unable to assist in resolving individual disputes.

We trust you have found this information useful and if you have any further consumer related queries please do not hesitate to contact us on 1890 432 432.

And the Reply from the Director of Consumer Affairs,....

Consumer Complaint 102162
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nca to me
show details Feb 18 (1 day ago) Reply

Dear Ms O'Shea,
Thank you for contacting the National Consumer Agency (NCA).

The Consumer Protection Act 2007 came into force on 1st May 2007. The Act formally set up the National Consumer Agency as an independent statutory body. It abolished the Office of the Director of Consumer Affairs and transferred the powers and functions of the Director of Consumer Affairs to the new Agency.

The matter has been referred to our Commercial Practices Division for examination and whatever follow up action deemed necessary and appropriate against Argos. However, due to the limited resources of our agency and the volume of complaints we receive, we are unable to assist in resolving individual disputes.

We can only suggest what options a consumer would have in certain situations; however it is up to the consumer on how they wish to pursue the company thereafter.

Should you have any further consumer related queries please do not hesitate to contact us on 1890 432 432.......

Argos Are still insisting I'm not getting what I paid for,I E-mailed the G Ryan Show and J duffy also,...got no reply.

Cheers

aoshea

Hi,..I have posted a reply as to what happened recently,...I will keep updating,...still fighting.

derry

With the Guada going for a demo about the cut in pay and the banks scams robbing us blind getting joe dufffy to get keen about a sofa price scam from Argos with that much stuff to choose from is not so good.


Derry

aoshea

This is Website ordering,I did order in the store and payed with cash. Argos are trying that on though,saying that the fact it wasn't delivered means they have no contract with me,...that doesn't even make sense,...If I picked it up in the store after paying it would be in my home now!

aoshea

Your right,...there is a lot of stuff happening at the min,..I have no chance,

Welease

And do you really honestly believe that you should have a chance? (and i don't mean this in an offensive way but...)

You know it was a mistake.. an honest mistake, and the sofa was not meant to be available at that price... you have admitted as much.

If you made a mistake in any avenue of life, would you honestly fully support someone pushing through every legal avenue to get a resolution against you? somehow i doubt it...

aoshea

No Offence taken,..but yes I do think I should get it,and I didn't know it was a mistake untill they rang me,...In fact if you look again at the listing for "Fabric Corner Groups" you will see another Corner group which is very misleading,A brown one pictured in its entirity for 299.00,that was brought to my attention in the shop when they advised me this was just for ONE PIECE of the corner group. So are they delibreratly trying to mislead? The Girl at the till that day thought it was very misleading.

antoinolachtnai

Why can you not go the Small Claims route? This would seem to be a good way of resolving this.

Welease

aoshea wrote: »

No Offence taken,..but yes I do think I should get it,and I didn't know it was a mistake untill they rang me.

Oh come on... You knew it was in the book for 10 times the price.. What shop sells items for 1/10 of the price? (without it being some massive clearance sale which would be well advertised in store)... You knew that it was a mistake, and hoped to get lucky. Nothing wrong with that.. but as your consumer affairs guy said there is provision in law for human error.

Basically unless you are planning to lie in a law court, i honestly don't see how you could win. You knew the real price, you knew there was no sale on.. logic dictates you could work out it was a mistake given the vast difference in price.

idunnoutellme

ye i've found out you only have a contract when cash+delivery have taken place. if you dont have delivery you dont have any contract. if you collected couch in store on the day you would have had a contract and noone can say anything to you...but seein as they didnt deliver then there's no contract and all you can do is take your money back.


so take the cash back and get on with it...i did anyway

antoinolachtnai

Where did you find that out? This is generally not the case.

idunnoutellme

my two work colleagues have solicitor girlfriends who confirmed that consumer has no rights in this case...sadly

L1011

Welease wrote: »

Oh come on... You knew it was in the book for 10 times the price.. What shop sells items for 1/10 of the price? (without it being some massive clearance sale which would be well advertised in store)... You knew that it was a mistake, and hoped to get lucky. Nothing wrong with that.. but as your consumer affairs guy said there is provision in law for human error.

Basically unless you are planning to lie in a law court, i honestly don't see how you could win. You knew the real price, you knew there was no sale on.. logic dictates you could work out it was a mistake given the vast difference in price.

I don't see where "knowing the real price" comes in to this. She made an offer to purchase at €119 WHICH WAS ACCEPTED.

I knew full well 'the real price' on my car, I offered quite a bit less than this and got accepted. I knew 'the real price' on a TV in Power City and offered a wee bit less and got accepted. That the retailer accepted the offer and took payment is what matters; not that the purchaser knew 'the real price'.

L1011

idunnoutellme wrote: »

my two work colleagues have solicitor girlfriends who confirmed that consumer has no rights in this case...sadly

You'll note that the state seems not to agree (Consumer Affairs). Having dealt with a solicitor here who appeared to think that the UK Data Protection Act was our own one, I generally wouldn't necessarily trust first-hand info let alone third-hard.

Kenno90

i think even though she knew the price was wrong , isn't it in her rights to get the couch at the avertisted price , a few years ago i got a jumper for half price , because some1 put a half price tag on it by mistake ,shouldn't the same rules apply

Gauge

Kenno90 wrote: »

i think even though she knew the price was wrong , isn't it in her rights to get the couch at the avertisted price , a few years ago i got a jumper for half price , because some1 put a half price tag on it by mistake ,shouldn't the same rules apply

No. The shop is not obliged to sell you the item at a lower price if it was mispriced. This is a very different case anyway because the item had been paid for.

Welease

MYOB wrote: »

I don't see where "knowing the real price" comes in to this. She made an offer to purchase at €119 WHICH WAS ACCEPTED.

I knew full well 'the real price' on my car, I offered quite a bit less than this and got accepted. I knew 'the real price' on a TV in Power City and offered a wee bit less and got accepted. That the retailer accepted the offer and took payment is what matters; not that the purchaser knew 'the real price'.

The point was.. and as his consumer affairs expert said.. there is provision in law to invalidate the contract because of human error.. It was an error, he/she knows it, unless he lies in court then he will admit it.. and most likely the case would be thrown out because everyone will agree he was trying to benefit from human error and therefore contract is invalid. The 119 was accepted IN ERROR.

If it was an open and shut case he would have been told to take it to SCC by consumer affairs, but from my reading they didn't to think it was worth the effort, becuase he probably wouldnt win.

L1011

The clause to cover errors doesn't count if they accepted payment - only if they correct it prior to completing the deal.

Welease

MYOB wrote: »

The clause to cover errors doesn't count if they accepted payment - only if they correct it prior to completing the deal.

Do you have a reference for that in law?

I would have assumed if they corrected the mistake before accepting payment then this issue would never arise (as it would not be possible to create the contract in error) and therefore there would be no need for such a provision.. But seeing as such a provision exists, and his advice from Consumer affairs said that would be the basis of a defence arguement by Argos in court....

L1011

The reason its covered in law is so that people cannot insist on getting a product for a mistaken price if it is corrected at point of sale. This wasn't corrected at point of sale and a sale contract was entered in to.

Welease

MYOB wrote: »

The reason its covered in law is so that people cannot insist on getting a product for a mistaken price if it is corrected at point of sale. This wasn't corrected at point of sale and a sale contract was entered in to.

No, you misunderstand me.. you are describing invitation to treat as covered by the Sales of Good and Services act of 1980.. and you are correct in your point..

However I am talking about laws covering unfair/invalid contracts.. which covers contracts that may illegal, created in error, unfair to consumers etc.. all of these types of contracts do not have to be fulfilled as they are essentially invalid.

For example under Article 4:103 of European law it states..

Article 4:103: Fundamental Mistake as to Facts or Law
(1) A party may avoid a contract for mistake of fact or law existing when the contract was concluded if:
(a) (i) the mistake was caused by information given by the other party; or
(ii) the other party knew or ought to have known of the mistake and it was contrary to good faith and fair dealing to leave the mistaken party in error; or
(iii) the other party made the same mistake,
and
(b) the other party knew or ought to have known that the mistaken party, had it known the truth, would not have entered the contract or would have done so only on fundamentally different terms.
(2) However a party may not avoid the contract if:
(a) in the circumstances its mistake was inexcusable, or
(b) the risk of the mistake was assumed, or in the circumstances should be borne, by it.

In this case it would seem to me that

1.ii the original poster knew it was a mistake (as i stated they knew the original price of the sofa)
b) the other party would not have entered into the contract or would have entered under fundamentally different circumstances (i.e. price)

In my view.. Argos would argue successfully that contract is infact invalid.

antoinolachtnai

Where is the mistake as to fact? Mistakes as to fact are usually things like the type of ground for a construction project, or the safety standards in a particular industry, or the design or size or suitability of a product. The OP went to some trouble to check that the price offered was in fact the correct price - she checked it twice - once at the electronic price checking unit and once more at the till.

If there was a mistake, it is pure carelessness, and the fault and responsibility lies with Argos, not the punter.

Argos knew what price they were selling the product at. The agent checked the product description and knew what he/she was selling. The agent was a sentient human being entering into the contract on behalf of the company, not an automaton. There was no mix-up between products. There was no incorrect transcription of a price. The total price and the bill of goods would have been mentioned explicitly on the printed receipt at the point of sale when the money was handed over. Argos made the offer to sell the product to the customer at that price, and the consumer accepted it. The consumer never offered the lower price or even asked Argos to supply at that price. This was not like the famous case where there was a mixup between 'per pound' and 'per piece' after a prolonged negotiation.

The possibility for arguing 'mistake' is very limited for a good reason. If it is accepted that a retailer can welsh on a contract for such an inexcusable error, then what is to stop a consumer welshing on a contract and seeking a refund if he finds the same or a similar product for sale at a lower price elsewhere? He can assert that he simply made a mistake when he paid the higher price, and the store failed to apprise him of the fact that the people down the road were selling it cheaper.

In order for our system of commerce to work, contracts have to be, generally speaking irrevocable. You cannot have a situation where companies can freely, knowingly and carelessly enter into contracts on a Monday and then decide that for a fairly arbitrary reason they will not be bound by them on a Wednesday. This is one of the foundations of our way of life.

I really do think this is worth a trip to the small claims registrar. There is very little to lose, if the OP thinks it is worth the trouble. There is room for argument though,and it's all in the presentation.

It is worth looking at http://books.google.ie/books?id=hAA8dgieR3IC&pg=PA248&lpg=PA248&dq=Article+4:103&source=bl&ots=4S01zh6wlP&sig=nYstqA4z4rZj-ip2LTGO5cGAD30&hl=en&ei=H0ygSYy9ENm0jAe75sTGCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=10&ct=result#PPA243,M1

aoshea

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Why can you not go the Small Claims route? This would seem to be a good way of resolving this.

Small Claims Wont take "Breach of Contract"

aoshea

antoinolachtnai wrote: »

Where did you find that out? This is generally not the case.

"Argos" are stating that its not a contract unless its delivered,.....But as far as I've been told the contract was made when payment was accepted

antoinolachtnai

Did you actually submit the forms to them and did they write back to you returning your money?

I just can't see that exclusion anywhere in the rules for the Small Claims procedure.