so how important is the leaving?

Jam-Fly

look, if you get higher points in the leaving cert than someone else, that doesn't mean you're better than them.

If you get 550 in the LC, and someone else gets 500, but in the year that you spent your time only studying to get 550 points, they spent their time studying to get 500 points, winning the cup, having a great time every weekend, scoring loads of girls, learning how to drive a car, learning how to play the piano, getting a golf handicap of 3, curing world hunger, ending cancer....etc. would you consider yourself more successful than that person?
Also, if someone gets 500 putting in 100 hrs of study (arbritary number), and you get 510 putting in 1500hrs of study, who is more successful then?

It's the person as a whole that makes up 'how successful you are'.

Gavin "shels"

Mario007 wrote: »

look i dont mean to sound like a bastard or anything, but for me leaving cert is what separates the smart people from those messers in class with no aim in their lives whatsoever.

Not sure if anyone picked you up on this as I just flicked through the thread, but this has sums you up in one mate. The Leaving Cert doesn't determine anyone smart in my opinion, the Leaving Cert is about memory and how much information you can remember from the course.

My definition of smart who be people/teams who win the likes of TCH Quiz, etc...

Gavin "shels"

Jam-Fly wrote: »

look, if you get higher points in the leaving cert than someone else, that doesn't mean you're better than them.

If you get 550 in the LC, and someone else gets 500, but in the year that you spent your time only studying to get 550 points, they spent their time studying to get 500 points, winning the cup, having a great time every weekend, scoring loads of girls, learning how to drive a car, learning how to play the piano, getting a golf handicap of 3, curing world hunger, ending cancer....etc. would you consider yourself more successful than that person?
Also, if someone gets 500 putting in 100 hrs of study (arbritary number), and you get 510 putting in 1500hrs of study, who is more successful then?

It's the person as a whole that makes up 'how successful you are'.

Great post mate.;)

Mario007

Jam-Fly wrote: »

look, if you get higher points in the leaving cert than someone else, that doesn't mean you're better than them.

If you get 550 in the LC, and someone else gets 500, but in the year that you spent your time only studying to get 550 points, they spent their time studying to get 500 points, winning the cup, having a great time every weekend, scoring loads of girls, learning how to drive a car, learning how to play the piano, getting a golf handicap of 3, curing world hunger, ending cancer....etc. would you consider yourself more successful than that person?
Also, if someone gets 500 putting in 100 hrs of study (arbritary number), and you get 510 putting in 1500hrs of study, who is more successful then?

It's the person as a whole that makes up 'how successful you are'.

wow getting 500 points and doing all that would be quite an achievment:D

i think we actually went off the topic here, its not about how succcessful you are but how important is the lc, and the answer is pretty important especially with the economic climate, no matter what your counterarguements can be

postalservice

Gavin shels wrote: »

The Leaving Cert doesn't determine anyone smart in my opinion, the Leaving Cert is about memory and how much information you can remember from the course.

My definition of smart who be people/teams who win the likes of TCH Quiz, etc...

You serious??
I bet that if you check the winners of that quiz from the last couple years.......they all probably got 570+ points in the LC.

It's not impossible to do well in the leaving using intelligence and a small bit of study.

Don't tar everyone with same (SWAAAAAAAT) brush:P:P

Sorry....but i get passionate about this sometimes:o:o

Mario007

postalservice wrote: »

You serious??
I bet that if you check the winners of that quiz from the last couple years.......they all probably got 570+ points in the LC.

It's not impossible to do well in the leaving using intelligence and a small bit of study.

Don't tar everyone with same (SWAAAAAAAT) brush:P:P

Sorry....but i get passionate about this sometimes:o:o

i agree, i mean i dont study and i do well in school...course you have people who just swat for the lc, but then college comes and they don't know what they do. lc is about how you can meet a chalange and now complain about it and wonder if its fair or imporant

Mario007

Mario007 wrote: »

i agree, i mean i dont study and i do well in school...course you have people who just swat for the lc, but then college comes and they don't know what they do.

That's good for you. But, have you ever considered that if these people - which you so kindly tar with the one brush - didn't "swat", they mightn't get into college? Not everyone is so naturally gifted; perhaps some have to swat to achieve what they would like to achieve. In my opinion, anyway, there is nothing wrong with swatting: if it gets you to where you want to be.

Mario007

-JammyDodger- wrote: »

That's good for you. But, have you ever considered that if these people - which you so kindly tar with the one brush - didn't "swat", they mightn't get into college? Not everyone is so naturally gifted; perhaps some have to swat to achieve what they would like to achieve. In my opinion, anyway, there is nothing wrong with swatting: if it gets you to where you want to be.

you didn't actually quote my whole post, see i actually contradicted myself in the second half where i said its about meeting a chalange and preparing for it, so sorry if my half a post caused any offence

Mario007

Mario007 wrote: »

you didn't actually quote my whole post, see i actually contradicted myself in the second half where i said its about meeting a chalange and preparing for it, so sorry if my half a post caused any offence

Because, the second half of your post isn't relevant to the first. The second half applies to all: obviously the LC's challenge, and obviously it's about learning to prepare for it:- this applies to all LC participants; not just those who have to, as you say, "swat" to achieve results.

I, personally, wouldn't consider you to have contradicted yourself. You tarred all LC students who find the need to "swat" with the one and same brush: You said, in a sweeping generalization, that when they go to college they don't know what to do: as they're not as naturally intelligent as you imply yourself to be: "i agree, i mean i dont study and i do well in school".

Anyway, I apologise for derailing this thread. Broad and sweeping generalizations just, and always have, annoyed me.

PurpleFistMixer

Also amusingly enough, if ever there's a place where it's harder to get by on natural talent alone, it's college. You can be "smart" and sleep through secondary school, but unless you're actually a genius, you must work in college. So having a good work ethic is of vital importance. : )

Mario007

-JammyDodger- wrote: »

Because, the second half of your post isn't relevant to the first. The second half applies to all: obviously the LC's challenge, and obviously it's about learning to prepare for it:- this applies to all LC participants; not just those who have to, as you say, "swat" to achieve results.

I, personally, wouldn't consider you to have contradicted yourself. You tarred all LC students who find the need to "swat" with the one and same brush: You said, in a sweeping generalization, that when they go to college they don't know what to do: as they're not as naturally intelligent as you imply yourself to be: "i agree, i mean i dont study and i do well in school".

Anyway, I apologise for derailing this thread. Broad and sweeping generalizations just, and always have, annoyed me.

i didn't mean to tar all students that dp their utmost best to get good results in the lc. maybe i might have actually said something in that way, but that was not meant at all. all i want to get across is that lc is important for people who want to go to college or as your first test whether you can actually go to extreme lengths to actually do finish off the assigment(ie the leaving cert)

Twinkle-star15

The Leaving Cert isn't a measure of how smart you are- it measures how well you can memorise a bunch of random topics and regurgitate them in two and a half hours.
Yes, you can get through the LC, get a fair few points whatever, with very little work if you're smart- but that doesn't mean you couldn't have done even better if you'd worked at it!
Different people are good at different things- I have a good memory and tend not to blank in exams (touch wood :P) so I usually do quite well.
On the other hand, I will never be excellent at sports, or physics.
Would you call me stupid because I can't do honours maths?
Or call me smart because I can ace French?

I don't think the LC is that important- there are always other ways to get the course you want, and hardly anyone knows at 18 where they want to be in 10 years time.
But if someone else thinks it's worth crucifying themselves over, I'm not going to argue with them.

dfx-

sock puppet wrote: »

But a job is just a way to earn money

I'd strongly disagree with this. If you like doing what you're doing, then a job doesn't have to be just a way to earn money. If you've an interest in archaeology, you can get a job out of that by qualifying..same goes for Maths/Chemistry/Physics etc. certainly. It's only a way to earn money if you're not happy in it and logically you can add that the Leaving Cert is the most direct way of getting a job you have an interest in and making it your job, so is very important in one respect.

The Leaving Certificate may look daunting and important (I didn't notice until I went to get my points), but can be really simplified - in the case of Chemistry anyway, from personal experience supervising labs where honours level students have to be taught the fundamental practical techniques in third level. It's nowhere near the defining moment that it is made out to be. No point in getting into Chemistry or Medicine or Maths or Arts with your points and not being able to cope afterwards.

Davidius

Jam-Fly wrote: »

It's the person as a whole that makes up 'how successful you are'.

Do you have any idea what you're talking about?
Everybody knows that points = personality. Fact.

:pac: