Is it time the irish went home

thebman

I think we don't deserve special treatment but if we can pull the strings to get, why the fook wouldn't we? Its worth a shot is it not?

We should be looking out for our own people and lets face it, there is nothing much waiting here for them if they do come home now.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

thebman

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Well we'd just ignore them. They are welcome to try though. The American's can ignore our government too without fear of consequences.

Looking out for your own people doesn't mean condoning—and therefore encouraging—lawbreaking in other nations.

Now hang on! How many times have people that committed crimes come back home only to be protected by their governments?

It happens all the time. Every country seems to do it.

Serenity Now!

brim4brim wrote: »

Well we'd just ignore them. They are welcome to try though. The Americans can ignore our government too without fear of consequences

No they can't and they won't. Every two years there are mid-term elections then every four a national election. The Irish-American lobby represents quite a sizeable chunk of the electorate on the Eastern Sea Board. This is when (ridiculous) negotiations with the US govt are carried out to legitamise those living there illegally from Ireland. Expulsion costs money and votes while also having to meet an equivocal policy with other demographics among the illegal immigrant population. Hence the US govt will do nothing about these people unless on an individual case-by-case policy.
The illegals are lucky to be still there. If caught, they should be sent out of the country, without fail. They broke immigration laws.

thebman

Serenity Now! wrote: »

No they can't and they won't. Every two years there are mid-term elections then every four a national election. The Irish-American lobby represents quite a sizeable chunk of the electorate on the Eastern Sea Board. This is when (ridiculous) negotiations with the US govt are carried out to legitamise those living there illegally from Ireland. Expulsion costs money and votes while also having to meet an equivocal policy with other demographics among the illegal immigrant population. Hence the US govt will do nothing about these people unless on an individual case-by-case policy.
The illegals are lucky to be still there. If caught, they should be sent out of the country, without fail. They broke immigration laws.

I don't disagree but at the end of the day they haven't got their way yet.

The American's are just letting them push and giving the illusion that they are giving in. They have never got what they wanted and I doubt they ever will.

Irish American's don't deserve special treatment but the lobby group has the right to ask. Its up to them whether they are stupid enough to give in.

Liam Byrne

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

:eek: Ahem....."standardised" [cough!]

The double-standards are nuts, but it's typical of an Irish politician who wants to be "seen" to be "supporting the Irish"......forget the fact that it's irrelevant - and unwelcome - to the people who pay his wages, or the fact that it won't make a blind bit of a difference, it'll guarantee that Ms O'Biddy, whose son can't come home for Christmas - will vote for him next time.

If politicians put as much effort into improving the lives of those who DO live here and DON'T break the laws of the countries they're living in, we'd all be better off, and maybe those working abroad COULD come home to jobs, houses and a decent life.

But top marks to the OP for counterbalancing the racist threads about sending LEGAL Polish home......

We've also had examples of foreign scum - those who rob or assault people (a definite minority, before anyone reads that the wrong way) NOT being sent home, which they should be.

Basically, anyone breaking the law in the country in which they live should be sent home. Anyone's perfectly entitled to argue otherwise, but if they do they should do so consistently and not have one rule for Irish people and one for everyone else.

asdasd

Basically, anyone breaking the law in the country in which they live should be sent home. Anyone's perfectly entitled to argue otherwise, but if they do they should do so consistently and not have one rule for Irish people and one for everyone else.

This is a argument to legalisms so tell me what you really feel about countries controlling their borders using their legal system.... Good for them, and bad for us?

the illegal Irish are illegal because the US has a very harsh immigration policy these days, despite it being historically an immigrant country. Polish immigration should never had been made legal - we should have followed the Germans. Our population is 4 million, the Polish population is 40 million. Thats ten times our population ( Poland, alone): this is as if the US had legal immigration from Mexico, andif Mexico had a population of 3 billion. Mexico and Poland have about the same GDP per capita.

Of course, we opened up to more than Poland.

Most of the "send the Irish home" brigade are resorting to legalistic arguments: it is right because it is legal ( arguments they dont apply to failed ayslum seekers here so readily).

You inconstantly believe the Irish should be turfed out of America, but Ireland cant make laws to fufil the same criteria of making immigration difficult for the accession States, and impossible for non-EU. That's racist, but only when we do it. The US turfing the Irish out is to be expected, encouraged and applauded.

As I said I beleve that all countries should control their borders, thats the definition of soverneighty. So lets kick the Irish out of America: and I assume all illegals including Mexicans (Anyone's perfectly entitled to argue otherwise, but if they do they should do so consistently and not have one rule for Irish people and one for everyone else.)

We should follow Americas lead in a very strict immigration policy from now, in respect to countreis where wages are much lower than here.

asdasd

The illegals are lucky to be still there. If caught, they should be sent out of the country, without fail. They broke immigration laws.

All illegals in the US, or just the Micks?

wylo

How annoying would it be to have a bunch of "Irish-American-Irish" in this country, the accents would be worse than they already are, totally omg like...

Sand

This was a great opening post, but sadly some terrible replies and derails have messed it up.

Anyone who reckons their questionable belief "shure didnt some people who werent me built the place!!!" gives you the right to flout the laws of the US should be all means feel welcome to test that assertion in a US court.

There is a certain arrogance/delusion in the lobbying for Irish illegals - the last big push for legalisation was ****ing disastrous. Massive crowds of illegal immigrants waving Irish and Mexican flags :rolleyes: . Idiots should have been waving US flags if they wanted to get on the good side of the US government.

K-9

asdasd wrote: »

We should follow Americas lead in a very strict immigration policy from now, in respect to countreis where wages are much lower than here.

It must not be that strict though, 10 million illegals you said earlier?

asdasd wrote: »

All illegals in the US, or just the Micks?

You keep asking this despite nobody saying otherwise, so I think your assumption in the previous post is correct.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

The Raven.

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Liam Byrne wrote: »

:eek: Ahem....."standardised" [cough!]

I think you will find that both spellings are correct.

Wikipedia gives both spellings: ‘Standardization (or standardisation)’.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standardization

The Oxford English dictionary also gives both spellings.
The Chamber’s Twentieth Century Dictionary only gives ‘standardisation’.

It's unlikely that you will catch Donegalfella out on spelling or grammar.

GuanYin

So we're all in agreement. The illegal Irish in the US should get the same treatment as illegal immigrants in any country and be sent home.

They're breaking the law, technically criminals and have no claim to any special treatment.

I would add that anyone suggesting otherwise yet feels Ireland should deport illegal immigrants would be quite hypocritical.

Now, unless someone has something wonderful to add, this thread has a finite lifespan.

K-9

GuanYin wrote: »

So we're all in agreement. The illegal Irish in the US should get the same treatment as illegal immigrants in any country and be sent home.

They're breaking the law, technically criminals and have no claim to any special treatment.

I would add that anyone suggesting otherwise yet feels Ireland should deport illegal immigrants would be quite hypocritical.

Now, unless someone has something wonderful to add, this thread has a finite lifespan.

I wonder were they get the support from though? I suppose nobody will admit on a public forum they support this campaign and yet support kicking out illegals here too!

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

thielfer

asdasd wrote: »

building a few shoddy shoebox appartments for themselves to live in, and then ****ing off home is not the same as building the railroads.

did you ever read something else that stupid, manipulating worthless "newspapers" that shows other nations in bad view?
have you ever realize how far your country jumped forward cause of people who worked hard for less money so you could use it in other sectors
do you realize that most of them still live in apartments they built like you said and pay a big money for that, do you know that there's not only a fckn construction sector in a bleedn' job market (where that people work)

try to find a statistics and records about how many of them live here and work
compare it to few other nations that you'll find placed lower on the list
the difference may shock you out and maybe will erase a bit of your racism

more than 94% of Polish, Latvian, Czech, Slovak and others live here and work and barely use social help
less than 50% of western and far southern ones do not work (sometimes they have no permit but a lot of them don't even try to get it), live here and use mostly social welfare support

don't be racist or one-side directed - use your eyes, your brain...

mountainyman

The Corinthian wrote: »

Actually, that's a complete myth. If any immigrant group has been overwhelmingly influential in the rise of the USA, it's probably the Germans.

The two aren't mutually exclusive.

sovtek

brim4brim wrote: »

We should be looking out for our own people and lets face it, there is nothing much waiting here for them if they do come home now.

I've said this before and I'll say it again...this is a poster boy for the Irish mammy syndrome writ large.

thebman

sovtek wrote: »

I've said this before and I'll say it again...this is a poster boy for the Irish mammy syndrome writ large.

Nonsense, every other nation is doing the same thing.

sovtek

brim4brim wrote: »

Nonsense, every other nation is doing the same thing.

When has the United States government EVER lectured the Irish government about their hypocritical and sanctimonous treatment of illegal immigrants in Ireland?

Benedict XVI

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Expulsion costs money and votes while also having to meet an equivocal policy with other demographics among the illegal immigrant population. Hence the US govt will do nothing about these people unless on an individual case-by-case policy.
The illegals are lucky to be still there. If caught, they should be sent out of the country, without fail. They broke immigration laws.

If the US authorities wanted to deport illegal Irish they could go into any bar in any city and have deport thousands.

But they won't beause illegals add to the local economy, the same girls and guys in the pub mind the kids and work with the construction firms all over that city, many might have even worked for the police that are there to arrest them.

Anyone I know who has been deported has been on a case by case basis, traffic violations mainly, or in some cases where immigration have received confidential information that so and so living on such and such a street is an illegal

thebman

sovtek wrote: »

When has the United States government EVER lectured the Irish government about their hypocritical and sanctimonous treatment of illegal immigrants in Ireland?

That's completely different to the Irish lobbying for illegal Irish immigrants. They aren't saying treat all immigrants differently, just the Irish.

I'm sure if there were many American's living illegally in Ireland, they'd try to pressure us into letting up on it.

GuanYin

Benedict XVI wrote: »

But they won't beause illegals add to the local economy, the same girls and guys in the pub mind the kids and work with the construction firms all over that city, many might have even worked for the police that are there to arrest them.

That is the crux of it. Illegals do jobs that nobody else wants to do. That is why they are largely tolerated in the US and I imagine the view is similar in other countries.

It *still* doesn't make them right and I'm happy to see anyone illegally working in a country deported.

GuanYin

brim4brim wrote: »

That's completely different to the Irish lobbying for illegal Irish immigrants. They aren't saying treat all immigrants differently, just the Irish.

I'm sure if there were many American's living illegally in Ireland, they'd try to pressure us into letting up on it.

Ok, without rehashing two pages of debate (I'm guessing you didn't bother to read it all), the Irish don't deserve any special treatment.

An illegal immigrant is an illegal immigrant. You can't make a case for the Irish and then suggest that the Irish government should be tough on illegal immigrants in Ireland. At least not an intelligent case.

sovtek

brim4brim wrote: »

That's completely different to the Irish lobbying for illegal Irish immigrants. They aren't saying treat all immigrants differently, just the Irish.

Ah well that's ok then. My comment still stands.

I'm sure if there were many American's living illegally in Ireland, they'd try to pressure us into letting up on it.

When have the American government done that anywhere else in the world? In fact what other government lobbies a foreign state to treat it's illegal citizens in said state to treat them better than everyone else.

sovtek

GuanYin wrote: »

An illegal immigrant is an illegal immigrant. You can't make a case for the Irish and then suggest that the Irish government should be tough on illegal immigrants in Ireland. At least not an intelligent case.

And even less for the Irish government to be tough on legal immigrants in their country...the purposeful slowdown of LTR and citizenship processing...charging €150 every year to register with the INIS...harrasing non-eu/eu couples for years by not giving the non-eu residency (until recently when the EU court stated the obvious).

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

the_syco

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I thought the illegal and undocumented irish could come home any time they like, in fact surely all they have to do is walk into the nearest police station and tell them they are an illegal immigrant and they would be home quick as a flash, for free.

IIRC, they get jailed for a while, then deported, and banned from entering the USA for a while.

I know people who picked up people in the airport, only to be stopped, and deported. But they're back again. The US border is large, and if it borders a "nice" contry, not all of the border is fully guarded.

=-=

Obama ticks a few boxes, being black, American, and Irish. I'd say he automatically got a large portion of the black and Irish voters who vote on whim.

Liam Byrne

The Raven. wrote: »

I think you will find that both spellings are correct.

OT, but that's what was funny [ ironic ? ] about donegalfella using that spelling when talking about spellings being standardised.....similar to "colour" vs "color", one is English and the other is American English - the yanks use a "zee" (as they call it) for "organise", "specialise", etc......