BER Analysis Advice - D1 Rating

friendface

I'm completing a DEAP assessment of old houses as part of a college project so I decided to take my own house as an example. I just completed the survey this evening and came out with a D1 rating. I realize some of my figures may be off but I think it's a reasonable assessment and fit's in with what I was expecting before I began. It is an end-of-terrace house dating from about 1911 though it has a relatively new extension built in 1998.

My question is about analyzing my results. I'm not looking for free assessments here, just maybe a few pointers on how to examine my results. I am attaching a link to a pdf file of the results output if anyone wants to have a look.

Are there any solutions that are generally advised to be the best ways to dramatically improve a houses energy rating? I realize not all cases will be the same but are there tips which would be applicable to the vast majority of cases. I'm trying to look at the effect of different aspects of the building on the final rating and how much impact each element has:

• Walls - Existing walls in my case study are of solid stone construction (approx. 500mm thick - no insulation). I would expect these would have the biggest adverse effect.

• Windows - Windows were replaced about 12 years ago with Double-glazing (I assumed they were 6mm air-filled)

• Floor Construction - I think the existing dwelling (constructed circa 1910) would have solid floors with no insulation though I am not sure of the exact details. The extension would have been completed to modern standards.

They would probably be the main aspects I'll be looking at unless I've missed something. I'm hoping to do a 3D energy software analysis as well to see how it compares to the DEAP results. Should be interesting to see how accurate the DEAP assessment is.

Anyway, all I am looking for here is maybe a few tips from any of you who have experience with BER assessments or retrofitting older houses. I would appreciate any hints or even useful links that you guys could provided. Thanks in advance.

DEAP Results: http://rapidshare.com/files/189007547/DEAP_Report.pdf

aobenergyassess

Hi friendface,

I'm a DEA in England, if you can give me some more details, I will take a look and help where I can.

Heating: what type of heating system do you have?
Hot Water: does your main heating system heat your hot water?
Lighting: how many LELs do you have?
Roof: do you have loft insulation, if so how thick is it?

Ian
I couldn't download your pdf

friendface

aobenergyassess wrote: »

Hi friendface,

I'm a DEA in England, if you can give me some more details, I will take a look and help where I can.

Heating: what type of heating system do you have?
Hot Water: does your main heating system heat your hot water?
Lighting: how many LELs do you have?
Roof: do you have loft insulation, if so how thick is it?

Ian
I couldn't download your pdf

Hi Ian. Thank you for the reply. I'll check my pdf file and try uploading it again. In relation to you questions:

Heating: I'm using a Roomsealed Firebird 50/90 Super-Q Oil Heating System (http://www.firebird.ie/roomsealed-super-q.htm). The boiler was just recently service and TRV's were installed on most of the radiators.

Hot Water: Yes, the main heating system is used to heat the water. There is also an electrical immersion switch which is used rarely.

LELS: I take it LEL's are Low-energy lightbulbs. At present, none of the light fittings have LEL's. That is one of the areas I would also like to look at in my analysis. I would like to see the effect of replacing the current bulbs with low-energy bulbs and by what percentage this would reduce the current energy requirements of the house.

Roof: There is attic insulation. I don't have access to the attic right now to measure it but, from the construction drawings prepared for the extension, there is 150mm quilt insulation specified. The existing house and extension have all been insulated to the same standard.


I suppose one of the main areas I want to look at is the heat loss induced by the solid stone walls in the pre-existing part of the house. I would like to also look at what options are available for retrofitting these walls and how cost-effective these solutions would be.

I would appreciate any help you can provide. Thanks again.

sinnerboy

Welcome aobenergyassess .

This is the methodology used in Ireland

http://www.sei.ie/Your_Building/BER/BER_Assessors/Technical/DEAP/DEAP_2008/

EPC's are called BER's . They indicate rating , A B C etc and expressly indicate energy demand in kwhr/m2/year and Co2/m2/year No SAP rating per se

DEAP Dwelling Energy Assessment Procedure . Unlike in the you UK can download the software ( as well as the excell worksheet ) for free . You can download the manual too .



Now , if it looks a lot like SAP .... that's because it basically is SAP with tweeks . We generate and distribute electricity here in a more carbon intensive way than in UK . Solar intensity is better here and avg temp is 15 degrees here - i think avg temp is a little less ? in the UK . Or maybe that's regionalised within UK ( I am not so familiar with SAP )

Now ..... if you had some spare time .... I would really appreciate if you could run a UK SAP assessment through DEAP to compare results

( If that's not a lot to request )

aobenergyassess

friendface wrote: »

Heating: I'm using a Roomsealed Firebird 50/90 Super-Q Oil Heating System (http://www.firebird.ie/roomsealed-super-q.htm). The boiler was just recently service and TRV's were installed on most of the radiators.

Gas is considered better because it is not delivered by road (using fuel etc. to deliver it) and electric is very wasteful due to losses because of the the distance it travels (I hope that makes sense). But oil is good and much better than electric.

If the boiler is condensing, then that is even better.TRVs are also good, however it is considered better to have a room thermostat because it is kept away from the radiator. You can get TRVs with a remote thermostat, they are good but don't count for our surveys.

Hot Water:Yes, the main heating system is used to heat the water. There is also an electrical immersion switch which is used rarely.

Also good.

LELS: I take it LEL's are Low-energy lightbulbs. At present, none of the light fittings have LEL's. That is one of the areas I would also like to look at in my analysis. I would like to see the effect of replacing the current bulbs with low-energy bulbs and by what percentage this would reduce the current energy requirements of the house.

A 100 watt bulb uses 100 watts of power, a 10 watt bulb uses 10 watts. so if you have 10 X 100 watt bulbs on for one hour, you will use 1Kwh (one kilo watt hour) of electric, so for the same price you can have 100 x 10 watt bulbs on for the same length of time. The amount of light and quality of it is another story, but low energy bulbs (LELs sorry ) are getting better. In terms of SAP points, you would get an increase of around 2 going from none to 100%.

Roof: There is attic insulation. I don't have access to the attic right now to measure it but, from the construction drawings prepared for the extension, there is 150mm quilt insulation specified. The existing house and extension have all been insulated to the same standard.

The thicker the better, but it may be worth thinking about insulating the rafters, this will leave the floor area for storage if you want. At about this level, the cost to savings ratio drops and it becomes more a question of personal comfort.

I suppose one of the main areas I want to look at is the heat loss induced by the solid stone walls in the pre-existing part of the house. I would like to also look at what options are available for retrofitting these walls and how cost-effective these solutions would be.

There are lots of ways of insulating walls, internally and externally, both have good and bad points to them. There are renders available, or layers of insulation followed by renders, so it depends on how much you like the look of the outside, or the room you have inside.

Replacing the windows would help, but again the saving to cost ratio is not good. It may be worth looking to fit some secondary glazing units giving you triple glazing, another alternative is to use a heat shrink film in the winter, but you will have trouble opening the windows!

To get a real cost of installation and saving would be expensive and time consuming. The best thing to do is get as much information as you can about the construction thermal values.

With the reduced SAP that we use, we are tied with what we can look at, technology is changing rapidly and there isn't enough testing carried out or comparisons made; I have my own opinions.

And in my own personal opinion the biggest problem is not the products per se, but the installers and manufacturers who are looking to make a fast buck.

I hope this helps!:)

aobenergyassess

Hi Sinnerboy,

I would enjoy having a dabble, it would be good to compare notes and see what is different; I can't look too deep at the moment, I'm doing the commercial training.

I thought you took the chill out of the Atlantic winds for us

I take it that you are or are training to be an energy assessor?

friendface

Hi Ian,

Thanks for the info. In relation to insulating the exterior walls, I don't think any of the solutions out there at present would be suitable for this case. It is a protected structure in a terrace so any external solutions are out of the question. As regard internal insulation, this would require extensive renovation and relocation of doors so I would guess the cost would heavily outweigh the savings. However, I will analyze the solution and find out an approximate cost/savings ratio.

I will replace all the bulbs with LELs, although according to the DEAP analysis system, this would only have a minimal effect on the overall building energy rating - Remains a D1.

I am also going to estimate a cost/savings ratio for replacing the windows, although again I feel this would not be economical. The double-glazed windows in place at present have a U-Value of around 3 afaik. Changing to triple glazing would probably bring the house down to a C rating but would be far too costly.

Anyway, I hope to do a more detailed energy analysis using energy modeling software over the next few weeks and will report back with the results.

As sinnerboy says, it would be interesting to do a comparison between the DEAP results and SAP results for the same structure.

I am attaching another copy of my DEAP results which contains all relevant information if anyone has time to take a look at it. I don't have a copy of the SAP software but I assume the results would be virtually the same.

http://www.mediafire.com/?tyzyyjmmrmm

Thanks again guys for the info and i'll keep ye posted on progress.

aobenergyassess

Hi Friendface,

It is difficult to justify having the walls done I agree.

When you say protected, does that mean it is a listed building where you cannot modify the main structure or appearance?

Changing to LELs can be done when the bulb blows otherwise you will waste the money you spent on the standard bulbs.

If you were to get new windows, the u-value would not be a significant change; the big thing is how they are installed, I've seen some shocking installations of windows. What I was referring to was secondary glazing, these are basically a single glazed window that can be installed on the inside of the existing windows. They were designed for conservation areas and cheap double glazing but do a good job in real terms.

The problem with EPCs or BERs is that they can only look at the outside of an item, if it's badly installed or installed really well it doesn't make any difference to the result you get. For instance if you have a boiler that was made on a bad day, it will not perform in the same way as a well made one will, if there is a cm gap around a triple glazed window that is sealed around the edges with mastic, they will not perform properly.

Also the BERs do not take into account how you live, it just basis a standard occupancy. For instance, I've got 2 kids who insisit on leaving all the lights on and standing in front of an open door talking to their mates. If you want to be able to wander around your house in a t-shirt in the depths of winter, then you will have higher fuel costs. This is obviously not good, so actual energy savings is down to how we live.

aobenergyassess

Sorry if I'm rambling, but as you are finding out it is quite an extensive subject :eek:

sinnerboy

Ramble on Ian you are making perfect sense

Protected Structure = Listed Building alight - so even replacing glazing / windows would require permission

( Protected structures are actually exempt from BER's )

aobenergyassess

You haven't confessed yet sinnerboy :P

are an energy assessor or a Trainee?

sinnerboy

SEI registered Assessor - domestic ( new and existing )








............... amongst other things :cool:

aobenergyassess

Does the

............... amongst other things

mean things are a bit slow on the BER front?

brianmacl

sinnerboy wrote: »

( Protected structures are actually exempt from BER's )

only one problem SEI haven't clarrified what level of listing is exempt?

Exterior only?

how about a really nice workers cottage that is listed. it is about 50 sq m but has a 200 sq m extention does in need a BER?

SEI have reffered this on for clarification. I asked this question over two months ago, they are still waiting for the Department to clariffy.

aobenergyassess

Hi Brianmacl,

We have the same problems over here, no matter how many rules are laid down, there are exceptions; especially where money is concerned with who gets to gain or lose.

The EU directives seem fairly straight forward to me, all properties should be looked at and have an energy survey conducted on them; and in my opinion, a much deeper look than we are doing at the moment.

Listed buildings can still have improvements made, but obviously they would have to be sympathetic to the surrounding area.

:pac:I can't help but think that if the world fries, would the listed buildings be all that remains of our existence?!!

sydthebeat

aobenergyassess wrote: »

:pac:I can't help but think that if the world fries, would the listed buildings be all that remains of our existence?!!

what a sad reflection that would be.....

sinnerboy

aobenergyassess wrote: »

:pac:I can't help but think that if the world fries, would the listed buildings be all that remains of our existence?!!

Absolutely . There are few as tenacious as conservation officers