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Littering fine

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13

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    #62
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,804 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    gnxx wrote: »
    You don't seem to get it. Either directly or indirectly we are paying for the Repak service via taxes, bin fees, Repak is a joint venture between the Dept. Of Environment and the various industry bodies that sell packaged goods.
    Absolutely: criticism of overflowing bottle banks is entirely valid.
    We should not be prosecuting the individuals that attempt to use these services. Instead we should be chasing private companies that don't deliver services to tax payers.
    Can't we do both?
    How about arresting people for loitering in accident and emergency wards?
    Sure, if they break the law while they're there.
    How about parking fines for those stuck in traffic in the city centre?
    Sure, if they break the law while they're there.


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    #63
    OhNoYouDidn't
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭OhNoYouDidn't


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    Leaving bottles on the side of the road isn't "making an effort to recycle", it's littering.

    But they didn't leave them "by the side of the road". They left them in designated recycling areas, that are usually in shopping centre carparks, that are not being attended to correctly. Actually one of the posters was prosecuted for the box they left the bottles in. Its jobsworthism of the highest order and if the council spent a fraction of the effort ensuring that the areas were maintained properly, this would not be an issue.


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    #64
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,804 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »
    They left them in designated recycling areas...
    The only place you're allowed to leave bottles for recycling is in the bottle banks. Leaving them near the banks is littering.

    Yes, the banks should be emptied regularly. No, that isn't an excuse for littering.

    Is it so very hard to grasp that two different parties are at fault here, for two completely different things? Do you believe that a full rubbish bin means it's acceptable to throw waste on the street beside it?


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    #65
    OhNoYouDidn't
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭OhNoYouDidn't


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    The only place you're allowed to leave bottles for recycling is in the bottle banks. Leaving them near the banks is littering.

    Not in Galway where the prosecution was for the container the bottles were in, not the bottles themselves

    Either way, a far cry from "leaving bottles on the side of the road".

    oscarBravo wrote: »
    Is it so very hard to grasp that two different parties are at fault here, for two completely different things? Do you believe that a full rubbish bin means it's acceptable to throw waste on the street beside it?

    "Throw waste"? Why the hysterionics?

    If there is only one bin in the area, I've made a special trip and my other option is taking the rubbish home, I would consider leaving the rubbish beside the bin, in a secure container, yes.


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    #66
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,804 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »
    Not in Galway where the prosecution was for the container the bottles were in, not the bottles themselves
    I don't believe that for a second.
    Either way, a far cry from "leaving bottles on the side of the road".
    No, it's not. The bottle banks I use most often are in public car parks, and one in a tourist amenity area. Leaving bottles outside the banks is unsightly and dangerous. But the point you're determined to ignore is that it's illegal.
    "Throw waste"? Why the hysterionics?

    If there is only one bin in the area, I've made a special trip and my other option is taking the rubbish home, I would consider leaving the rubbish beside the bin, in a secure container, yes.
    Once again, I'm drawing a parallel. Suppose I'm halfway through a sandwich that I've bought, and I decide I don't want the rest. I decide to throw the remainder with its wrapping into a rubbish bin on the street. If the bin is full, is it OK for me to neatly wrap the half-sandwich in the wrapper and drop it on the ground beside the bin?


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    #67
    gnxx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 228 ✭✭gnxx


    I'm in total agreement with this statement. It is littering to place bottles near the recycling facility.

    I think that Repak should pay the fines. They are not delivering the service that the consumer has paid for.


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    The only place you're allowed to leave bottles for recycling is in the bottle banks. Leaving them near the banks is littering.

    Yes, the banks should be emptied regularly. No, that isn't an excuse for littering.

    Is it so very hard to grasp that two different parties are at fault here, for two completely different things? Do you believe that a full rubbish bin means it's acceptable to throw waste on the street beside it?


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    #68
    lostexpectation
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    i wonder if you could their records and see how ften the bins are full, turning people away.


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    #69
    OhNoYouDidn't
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,934 ✭✭✭OhNoYouDidn't


    I'm not denying that its littering which is an offence in the strict sense of the word, nor did I.

    I'm saying its petty to prosecute, a waste of resources and lets the actual villans of the piece, the large waste management companies, off the hook and discourages people to go to the hassle of recycling.


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    #70
    gnxx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 228 ✭✭gnxx


    Obviously the bins are frequently overflowing -- the council have installed CCTV to cash in on the problem :-)

    I would wonder if they have any interest in resolving the problem or is it more profitable to allow the problem to continue.
    lostexpectation wrote: »
    i wonder if you could their records and see how ften the bins are full, turning people away.


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    #71
    RichMc70
    Registered Users Posts: 858 ✭✭✭RichMc70


    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    C) No. It has been the policy and practice for several years now to fine people, who leave items beside bins, for littering.

    So it is common practice for councils to try and con someone into paying a second fine when no offence has been committed.


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    #72
    time lord
    Registered Users Posts: 606 ✭✭✭time lord


    Leaving any bags or boxes at bring banks is wrong. Lots of people are too lazy to put the items into the banks. Local residents or shops shouldn't have to look at crap about the place, go council go. Ps as far as I know the only litter fine out there is for 150 euro not 160.


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    #73
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    RichMc70 wrote: »
    So it is common practice for councils to try and con someone into paying a second fine when no offence has been committed.

    What the heck are you on about? :confused:
    What con? what second fine? and how is there no offence?

    Leaving any items about a bottle bank as oppoosed to putting then in the banks is a littering offence and always has been. A litter fine (one fine). No con in enforcing the law for the good of the rest of us. :rolleyes:


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    #74
    Fighting Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 7,065 ✭✭✭Fighting Irish


    alannologo wrote: »
    I recently brought 2 big bags of bottles down to my local bottle bank thinking I was doing my bit and when I arrived the bottle bank was full and loads off bottles were left to the side so I thought right I will leave mine here too and they will be picked up when the bin is being emptied, but I was wrong I then got home about 3 days later and there was a fine of €160 for littering which I think is way out of order and from now on im gonna put my bottles in my regular bin.

    :rolleyes:

    What if hundreds of people did it?


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    #75
    Fighting Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 7,065 ✭✭✭Fighting Irish


    alannologo wrote: »
    They took my car reg and i heard it has happened to alot of people its a scam

    wtf is wrong with some people

    its not a scam


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    #76
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    This is just another blatant case of "Big Brother" watching you with ANPR surveillance cameras at the dump.


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    #77
    Fighting Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 7,065 ✭✭✭Fighting Irish


    Run_to_da_hills wrote: »
    This is just another blatant case of "Big Brother" watching you with ANPR surveillance cameras at the dump.

    OK lets take away the cameras and let people litter, then we can bitch about the litter


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    #78
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Fighting Irish wrote: »
    OK lets take away the cameras and let people litter, then we can bitch about the litter
    The County Council workers should have examined what the OP's dropped off against the CCTV footage to see if the contents were legit before issuing the fine.

    Those cams are there to stop dumping offenders not for the purpose of picking on people trying to do their bit of good. If they were that accurate to single out the numbers of his registration plate they should be accurate enough to spot him disposing of his recycled bottles.

    So what if it was after hours, I know plenty of self service bottle banks that are open 24/7. Next time I would suggest the OP take his bottles down the country and use them for pot shots.


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    #79
    Fighting Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 7,065 ✭✭✭Fighting Irish


    Run_to_da_hills wrote: »
    Those cams are there to stop dumping offenders not for the purpose of picking on people trying to do their bit of good. If they were that accurate to single out the numbers of his registration plate they should be accurate enough to spot him disposing of his recycled bottles.

    So what if it was after hours, I know plenty of self service bottle banks that are open 24/7. Next time I would suggest the OP take his bottles down the country and use them for pot shots.

    throwing the bags of bottles on the ground beside the bottle banks is dumping


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    #80
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Fighting Irish wrote: »
    throwing the bags of bottles on the ground beside the bottle banks is dumping
    Considered dumping because the Council workers are to lazy to get their hands dirty to separate the bottles instead they would prefere to spend all day sitting in their warm offices drinking tea and reading the tabloids. :rolleyes:


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    #81
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Run_to_da_hills wrote: »
    Considered dumping because the Council workers are to lazy to get their hands dirty to separate the bottles . :rolleyes:

    What absolute twaddle! It's considered dumping because it is littering. You'd have to be an idiot not to see something wrong with leaving what is after all rubbish lying beside a Bottle Bank. Can I throw rubbish on the street beside my wheelie bin and wait for the bin man to pick it up?
    It's not the Councils job to empty Bottle Banks or seperate out rubbish you may leave scattered around.
    The cameras are there to prevent this type of abuse.

    As for your sarcastic comment about bringing cans & bottles down the country for pot shots - you may think that funny but as someone involved in the preservation of our natural heritage I find the suggestion (no matter how humourous you find it) to be as nonsensical as the notion that leaving items beside a bottle bank is not dumping and not worthy of a fine.


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    #82
    lostexpectation
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,082 ✭✭✭lostexpectation


    which council was this?


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    #83
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    What absolute twaddle! It's considered dumping because it is littering. You'd have to be an idiot not to see something wrong with leaving what is after all rubbish lying beside a Bottle Bank. .
    Dumping at this recycling facility would be the indiscriminate discarding of unassociated rubbish, household wastage and land fill contents that is totally useless for recycling. I can see no problem with the CC applying the full force of the law for such.

    But for having zero tolerance and fining someone like the OP for mistakingly depositing bottles at the wrong time is down to the increasing trend of "ECO Fascism" that we are witnessing in this state.

    e160 may not be a lot to you but it is 2/3'rds of a weekly dole payment to some. This type of nonsense will only lead to a back lash of unofficial fly tipping and disgarding of bottles in regular land fill wheely bins.
    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    Can I throw rubbish on the street beside my wheelie bin and wait for the bin man to pick it up?.
    Big difference, a recycle center is an enclosed area designated for recycling. A wheely bin is left out on a public walkway.:rolleyes:
    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    It's not the Councils job to empty Bottle Banks or separate out rubbish you may leave scattered around. .
    It is their job to look after the recycle center and differentiate between what is rubbish and is a genuine bottle drop off and issue fines that abuse the system.
    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »


    The cameras are there to prevent this type of abuse.
    .
    Like mistakingly dropping off bottles for recycle after hours.:rolleyes:


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    #84
    Fighting Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 7,065 ✭✭✭Fighting Irish


    Run_to_da_hills wrote: »
    Considered dumping because the Council workers are to lazy to get their hands dirty to separate the bottles instead they would prefere to spend all day sitting in their warm offices drinking tea and reading the tabloids. :rolleyes:

    :rolleyes:


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    #85
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    You seem to be missing the entire point here.

    Leaving Plastic Bottles, Glass, Cans etc on the round beside a Bring Bank is certainly littering. Littering laws do not discriminate on the type of materials involved. Legally leaving my rubbish on the street beside the wheelie bin is exactly the same thing.

    A Bring Centre is not an enclosed area. Some may be but most are located in car parks, beside shopping centres, beside Community Centres and indeed beside schools in rural areas.

    It is not the Councils job to look after the Bring Centre (time you learned about Repak and it's role in the whole thing!) Indeed many Councils have brought Repak to task for their management of these centres. What is a genuine bottle drop off is what is placed in the bins. What is left beside the bins is rubbish/littering/dumping. The only true staement you made was that the Council is responisble for fining any offenders and that is exactly what they did.

    There is no such thing as "mistakenly dropping off bottles after hours" just dumping if you leave them there illegally.

    Start by learning the facts on this subject!


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    #86
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    You seem to be missing the entire point here.

    Leaving Plastic Bottles, Glass, Cans etc on the round beside a Bring Bank is certainly littering. Littering laws do not discriminate on the type of materials involved. Legally leaving my rubbish on the street beside the wheelie bin is exactly the same thing.!
    Again you are putting words into my mouth. I would agreee with you, that would be litter, however I or the OP never mentioned discarding "Plastic Bottles, Glass, Cans etc on the round beside a Bring Bank"
    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    A Bring Center is not an enclosed area. Some may be but most are located in car parks, beside shopping centers, beside Community Centers and indeed beside schools in rural areas. !
    Some are also unmanned 24/7. They should either have them one way or another, Its this type of confusion that causes human error.
    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »

    It is not the Councils job to look after the Bring Center (time you learned about Repak and it's role in the whole thing!) Indeed many Councils have brought Repak to task for their management of these centers. What is a genuine bottle drop off is what is placed in the bins. What is left beside the bins is rubbish/littering/dumping. The only true statement you made was that the Council is responsible for fining any offenders and that is exactly what they did.!
    They indiscriminately spat out another one of their automated revenue making bills just like the Westlink.
    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    There is no such thing as "mistakenly dropping off bottles after hours" just dumping if you leave them there illegally.
    Fined for leaving bottles off at the incorrect time at a bottle ctr. What about those that work irregular hours and can't make it during CC times?

    This is just as petty as the UK fining OAPs for leaving their wheely bins out on the wrong day.


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    #87
    LightningBolt
    Registered Users Posts: 1,639 ✭✭✭LightningBolt


    I got hit with one of those fines in 2007. I'd had friends over the night before and brought the bottles to the bank the following day. I dumped off the green and brown bottles but the clear glass bank was overfull (people had tried to force them in already resulting in bottles falling out and smashing) so I put the clear bottles in a box and placed it beside the clear glass bin.

    Two months later I received a fine in the post and I immediately got in touch with the County Council. They said I had a right to appeal so I challenged it by appealing to the litter warden offering to pay the amount to charity instead as I'd made an honest mistake in believing that leaving the bottles in a secure box neatly beside the bin was okay.

    Two months after this had passed and I got a notice saying I had yet to appeal. Sent off another appeal to a diff person coupled with the original. A couple of weeks after I received a court summons. I rang up enraged at this as I was given the right to appeal and I'd received no correspondance from them. I eventually managed to receive a reply 5 weeks after the court summons even though the person in the County Council I spoke claimed he'd yet to receive any appeal.

    Went to court in October just passed and I told the judge the story, he struck it out immediately upon seeing the evidence of attempted appeals I had. Happy days:D

    To the OP, if you made an honest mistake appeal it and offer to donate the money to charity. There's no way I'd give them money for something that was partly their fault.


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    #88
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    I would also suggest that the OP not to bottle up his anger against the county council and suggest him to make an appeal. :pac:


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    #89
    RichMc70
    Registered Users Posts: 858 ✭✭✭RichMc70


    Ira Greasy Fawn wrote: »
    What the heck are you on about? :confused:
    What con? what second fine? and how is there no offence?

    Leaving any items about a bottle bank as oppoosed to putting then in the banks is a littering offence and always has been. A litter fine (one fine). No con in enforcing the law for the good of the rest of us. :rolleyes:

    I didnt commit a second offence but the council were trying to stitch me up using the cctv footage from the first and only incident.

    To me that is a scam or fraud or whatever you want to call it.

    I'd suggest you read the post's in full before jumping on your ultra-green bandwagon.


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    #90
    BroomBurner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,737 ✭✭✭BroomBurner


    RichMc70 wrote: »
    I didnt commit a second offence but the council were trying to stitch me up using the cctv footage from the first and only incident.

    To me that is a scam or fraud or whatever you want to call it.

    I'd suggest you read the post's in full before jumping on your ultra-green bandwagon.

    So you dumped some bottles next to a bring bank, they caught you and now you're bulling. Next time, don't dump them there. Simple as. Most people are able to understand that concept.


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    #91
    mickoneill30
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,073 ✭✭✭mickoneill30


    RichMc70 wrote: »
    I didnt commit a second offence but the council were trying to stitch me up using the cctv footage from the first and only incident.

    To me that is a scam or fraud or whatever you want to call it.

    Or mistake. It's not really the greatest thought out fraud is it? Catch you once and fine you and you pay the fine. Then send out a fine later on for the same offence. I can't see many people falling for that scam.


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