Are we really being ripped off?

Blue_Wolf

Just thought I would throw this out there to get a few different opinions.

Are we really being ripped off or does it appear that way?

We earn more money in comparisant to other EU countries and our cost of living is high but reflects our earnings.

Polands cost of living is reasonably high and their wages are 4 times less than ours.

What are the wages like in the Uk compared to their cost of living?

Please discuss.

Bluetonic

Why not ask it here?

Monkey61

After spending the last year and a half in London, I'm very happy with the cost of living in Ireland.

Part time London wages - £91 per week
Rent, of half a 1 bed apartment - £100 per week

Part time Dublin wages (exact same job)- 200 euro per week
Rent, half a 1 bed apartment - 100 euro per week.

I know London has higher rents than the rest of the UK, but I was earning proportionally more to make up for it and was still on rubbish money. Even though a lot of products are cheaper in the UK the difference in wages and rents makes them waaaay more expensive.

I can happily support myself on part time wages in Dublin and have a pretty good standard of living. That is impossible in the UK. The majority of people I met at work also worked a second evening job in order to have any kind of social life because rent was so expensive. I was lucky because I was living with my partner, so rent was actually much cheaper than it would be on my own.

jdivision

The USA average income is quite high and the cost of living quite low. One doesn't have to follow the other.

311

People in the uk pay far more service charges than we do. Almost certain the water alone costs over a grand a year over there.

They have a larger workforce aswell ,so probably will always be ahead in value for money.
All we can do is provide a better service:)

Blue_Wolf

So Monkey do you think people are blindly shouting out rip off ireland when
looking at the cost of a magazine in the Uk or a pint of lager compared to Ireland and they dont compare earnings?

Laphroaig52

jdivision wrote: »

The USA average income is quite high and the cost of living quite low. One doesn't have to follow the other.

The cost of living is low in some ways in the US. For example, the cost car ownership and driving in general is a lot less. Socialising (eating/drinking) is cheaper as well.

But, they pay a lot more for things like education and health insurance...
Also income tax might be a bit lower but they pay a lot of other local taxes that we don't.

They earn more of course and on the whole, I'd say they are probably a little better off than we are but there mightn't be much in it...

Blue_Wolf

jdivision wrote: »

The USA average income is quite high and the cost of living quite low. One doesn't have to follow the other.

My comment did not suggest that one has to follow the other
My comment is that people complain about being ripped off, however, our earnings go hand in hand with our cost of living. People are comparing our wages with the cost of living in the Uk instead of comparing Uk's wages with Uk's cost of living which was just pointed out by Monkey.

Why not compare Ireland cost of living with Uk's wages? No? because these people wouldn't have an arguement.

If we compare our cost of living with our earnings, we are happy!
If we compare our cost of living with Uk's and not take earnings into consideration, we are pissed off!

shellyboo

Apparently we are...

IRISH CONSUMERS are paying a mark-up of 51 per cent on goods such as clothing, houseware and electrical goods compared to UK prices, according to a new survey by the National Consumer Agency (NCA).

The margin on a basket of 45 non-grocery items purchased in 11 stores is even greater than the 30 per cent price difference for grocery prices on both sides of the Border recorded in an NCA survey published last year. The euro is currently worth about 7 per cent less than sterling.

Oh, and I found this site, too.. www.dualpricing.ie

Might be of vague use before we all go waving the rip-off flag!!

Monkey61

Blue_Wolf wrote: »

So Monkey do you think people are blindly shouting out rip off ireland when
looking at the cost of a magazine in the Uk or a pint of lager compared to Ireland and they dont compare earnings?

Ah yeah all the time! And it really bugs me. I'm forever trying to explain that on the numerous "well it's cheaper in the UK" threads. No it's not.

Blue_Wolf

shellyboo wrote: »

Apparently we are...



Oh, and I found this site, too.. www.dualpricing.ie

Might be of vague use before we all go waving the rip-off flag!!

Shellyboo you have clearly missed the point as has the person you have quoted. You're quoting a markup of 30% on good and 50% on clothing etc.
The point that I made which was proven by Monkey is that we earn more in Ireland so when you put everything on the scale it all balances out.

Climate Expert

The USA has a much higher standard of living if you are into the consumer lifestyle.
It helps that a large amount of people live and work in poverty but if you are college educated over there then you will be living like a king.

shellyboo

Blue_Wolf wrote: »

Shellyboo you have clearly missed the point as has the person you have quoted. You're quoting a markup of 30% on good and 50% on clothing etc.
The point that I made which was proven by Monkey is that we earn more in Ireland so when you put everything on the scale it all balances out.

The 'person' I have quoted (Irish Times, NCA) may have missed the point, but I haven't... was just sticking in news story that's relevant to the point. You asked are we being ripped off as regards euro/sterling... the NCA say we are... end of.

leeroybrown

Just because someone in Ireland earns more money than someone elsewhere doesn't mean that an Irish retail outlet can rip them off by taking a higher profit margin on goods. Obviously living in a relatively small market with higher VAT, higher wages, higher costs, etc will result in a price differential but it doesn't excuse profiteering. While they chose to do so I'll chose to spend my money elsewhere.

Blue_Wolf

You quoted them therefore it's your point. Which you said aparently we are being ripped off. Your point about the cost of living in comparisant is true, there is quite a substancial difference in what we are being charged. However, the chore question is Are we being ripped off? Taking into consideration that we earn more does it not balance out to be on level pegging. Or do you think that the vast difference in the cost of living weighs out the difference that we earn?

leeroybrown

In what is supposed to be an open competitive market place (the EU) there is no excuse for profiteering in one region other than gullibility of it's inhabitants. I think that the current economic nosedive will remind a lot of people that they're in a position to chose to buy at a reasonable price and will leave a lot of retailers in a position where they have to respond.

Blue_Wolf

leeroybrown wrote: »

Just because someone in Ireland earns more money than someone elsewhere doesn't mean that an Irish retail outlet can rip them off by taking a higher profit margin on goods. Obviously living in a relatively small market with higher VAT, higher wages, higher costs, etc will result in a price differential but it doesn't excuse profiteering. While they chose to do so I'll chose to spend my money elsewhere.

I agree and disagree.

Firstly you admitted that we do earn more but we are being over charged in comparisant. I agree with that. However would you rather us earn less money and in turn the cost of living reduce. Or would you rather earn more and cost of living be high. Whats the difference? We have a choice what we want to buy and not buy. The market in the Uk is far bigger and thus they can charge less as buying in bigger bulk. Ireland is a small market and we get charged more as they are not buying in the same quantity. The Vat being higher on goods frees our wages being taxed more which I think is better as we than have the decision to buy what we want. If you think something is too expensive dont buy it. We have that luxury.

A tesco represantitive was quoted saying we charge more in the south than in the North because the irish are willing to spend more. Why is that?its because we earn more. The less you earn, the less your willing to spend on an item.

leeroybrown

Likewise, I agree and disagree.

Obviously there will always be a strong link between the cost of living and wages but prices only remain high if people are willing to pay them. Retailers will of course try to earn more money from consumers if they think they'll pay it and it's the consumer's fault for putting up with it. I earn a decent salary and am certainly willing to spend my money on high quality food, goods, etc and to a certain degree am willing to put up with the local price differential but I'm not willing to put up with paying a 25% plus price premium. Ultimately though we have the right to complain about the price differential and we have the right to try to get our politicians to do something about it. We'll certainly start to see something happening about it now as Dunnes, Tesco, etc try to keep their customers spending money there and not in Aldi/Lidl.

For example, I'm sure that plenty of Irish people would have boasting about spending €1000 on a new TV over the last few years when they could have had it for €950 by shopping around, €800 by going online and €700 by really shopping around online. I think that every year there will be more and more people who will be looking to find that €700 option or at least the €800 one.

EDIT: I'll add that ideally I'd like to have seen the price of goods having been brought into check here five years ago rather than continuing to drive silly inflation resulting in un-competitive wage bills and costs.

Blue_Wolf

leeroybrown wrote: »

Retailers will of course try to earn more money from consumers if they think they'll pay it and it's the consumer's fault for putting up with it.
.

Bang on, that is very true!

leeroybrown wrote: »

something about it. We'll certainly start to see something happening about it now as Dunnes, Tesco, etc try to keep their customers spending money there and not in Aldi/Lidl.

For example, I'm sure that plenty of Irish people would have boasting about spending €1000 on a new TV over the last few years when they could have had if for €950 by shopping around, €800 by going online and €700 by really shopping around online. I think that every year there will be more and more people who will be looking to find that €700 option or at least the €800 one.

Online will always be cheaper due to lower overheads. Don't have customer service or great after sales. When it comes to clothes, you want to be able to try it on etc. I find that alot of people go into retail units to play around with a gadget with the intentions of buying it online but they merely wanted to test out the product. Kinda crap really especially for a sales man to spend 30min explaining what it can do etc.

shellyboo

Blue_Wolf wrote: »

You quoted them therefore it's your point. Which you said aparently we are being ripped off. Your point about the cost of living in comparisant is true, there is quite a substancial difference in what we are being charged. However, the chore question is Are we being ripped off? Taking into consideration that we earn more does it not balance out to be on level pegging. Or do you think that the vast difference in the cost of living weighs out the difference that we earn?

Yes, apparently, according to the NCA, the government body set up to deal with these things, we ARE being ripped off.

They conducted a survey which (I believe) takes into account differences in tax, wages etc, and they still say that the margin is inflated (up to 51%)... the conclusion I would draw from that is that we are being ripped off.

I have absolutely no clue about the differences in cost of living between here and the UK, all I'm doing is presenting a piece of information that's relevant. If I had an opinion, I'd offer it.

Blue_Wolf

right fair enough. I think we are over inflated due to our size, we dont have as much buying or selling power as the uk hense the huge difference.

shellyboo

Blue_Wolf wrote: »

right fair enough. I think we are over inflated due to our size, we dont have as much buying or selling power as the uk hense the huge difference.

You'd be exactly right. It's about economies of scale. I know we're talking about supermarkets which are the same size, but the scale of say, the Tesco operation in Ireland is a fraction of what it is in the UK. So if Tesco Ireland has 10,000 SKUs on their shelves; they're still buying them in smaller quantities than Tesco UK's 10,000 SKUs. Of course, there's some overlap, and a lot of what's in Tesco is sourced in the UK anyway... but there really are a huge host of factors beyond tax, retail rents, wages, suppliers that the public aren't aware of.

The sector is being called on to publish its margins (because really that's what we're talking about, do Irish shops have a bigger profit margin than UK ones) but I don't think that's going to happen.

Blue_Wolf

Would be very interesting to read that

ejmaztec

shellyboo wrote: »

You'd be exactly right. It's about economies of scale. I know we're talking about supermarkets which are the same size, but the scale of say, the Tesco operation in Ireland is a fraction of what it is in the UK. So if Tesco Ireland has 10,000 SKUs on their shelves; they're still buying them in smaller quantities than Tesco UK's 10,000 SKUs. Of course, there's some overlap, and a lot of what's in Tesco is sourced in the UK anyway... but there really are a huge host of factors beyond tax, retail rents, wages, suppliers that the public aren't aware of.

The sector is being called on to publish its margins (because really that's what we're talking about, do Irish shops have a bigger profit margin than UK ones) but I don't think that's going to happen.

I admit that I supported Tesco coming here and creating a bit of competition, but I believe that recently they've been taking the piss as regards prices.

Take for example those 6 pot Benecol low cholesterol drinks. All of the supermarkets seemed to be selling these for 4.99, which was bad enough, but Tesco are now selling them for 5.49. Even our local robbers in SuperValu are still selling them at 4.99.

No doubt there are other examples, like various deoderant sprays being 50 cent more than anywhere else.

shellyboo

ejmaztec wrote: »

I admit that I supported Tesco coming here and creating a bit of competition, but I believe that recently they've been taking the piss as regards prices.

Take for example those 6 pot Benecol low cholesterol drinks. All of the supermarkets seemed to be selling these for 4.99, which was bad enough, but Tesco are now selling them for 5.49. Even our local robbers in SuperValu are still selling them at 4.99.

No doubt there are other examples, like various deoderant sprays being 50 cent more than anywhere else.

Well, I chose Tesco, but it's really a bad example as they've been stealthily increasing their prices since Sept of last year for no reason that anyone can see. The suppliers are up in arms about it. Tesco's denying it though.

ejmaztec

shellyboo wrote: »

Well, I chose Tesco, but it's really a bad example as they've been stealthily increasing their prices since Sept of last year for no reason that anyone can see. The suppliers are up in arms about it. Tesco's denying it though.

They can deny it - but customers aren't stupid, which is why their sales have taken a bit of a dive.

Blue_Wolf

I do and I dont want to see Dunnes been bought over by Asda.

I dont because I'm quite a patriotic guy

I do because they have nearly as big buying power as them so we they will have a duel. Asda always on about their rolls backs etc. But if Asda does come than you will see Tesco and them 2 battling out while Superquinn and supervalu are just crushed and swept to the side

That's my main fear. Charge very little, get all the customers, force your competitors into bankruptcy, and than no competition and charge what you like. I know their is a protection there to prevent that but knowing the Governement they probably sell out for a slice of the cake. Cant wait till next election!