Define "Bad Call"

mark renton · 29-01-2009 4:30pm #1

Need help with the definition of "Bad Call". Everywhere I go in poker circles I hear "Bad Call", "blaa blaa blaa cry cry cry bad call bad call" . Is it just me but these words seem vastly overused by anyone who is either caught bluffing, or does not want to be called. I have on occasion called with middle pair and even A high if i feel someone is bluffing, and when the chips are coming my way all I hear is bad call bad call. I have 2 pieces of advice for those who overuse these words (1) make the raise higher (2) dont put your chips accross the line in the first place.

smoothcall · 29-01-2009 4:37pm

starting this thread

5starpool · 29-01-2009 4:45pm

A bad call is what someone makes with no reason or rationale behind the decision other than 'I thought they were bluffing'. If you cannot expand on that any more into why exactly why they were bluffing (including a physical tell) then it is only making up a reason basically. Just because you might be right *this* time doesn't make it a good call without a logical reason for the action.

mdwexford · 29-01-2009 4:46pm

Sounds like you play good, keep it up.

mark renton · 29-01-2009 4:49pm

5starpool wrote: »

A bad call is what someone makes with no reason or rationale behind the decision other than 'I thought they were bluffing'. If you cannot expand on that any more into why exactly why they were bluffing (including a physical tell) then it is only making up a reason basically. Just because you might be right *this* time doesn't make it a good call without a logical reason for the action.

If poker was all down to logic then PistolPete would have his 10gs by now

5starpool · 29-01-2009 4:54pm

of course it is down to logic. This includes knowing your opponent and how he is likely to play. Just because he 'could' be bluffing, doesn't mean he is.

How often have you made those calls with bottom pair on a whim and been totally wrong?

DrJFF · 29-01-2009 4:59pm

there is no wrong or right answer to a bad call in poker imo

however starpool gives a good definition of it

it is mostly a difference of opinion, i actually find it quite helpful if people told me i've made a bad call cos it gives me info into their game and i can use that against them

no matter how "bad" i think somebodies call is against me, i would never say thats a bad call cos i don't want him to change his ways and inform him that he is playing badly vs. me

this is a problem i see a lot is people berate weaker players at the tables and either scare them away, make them play much more conservative

you should never tell someone off at the table unless you can gain something from it!

never teach the fish how to swim come to mind

keane2097 · 29-01-2009 4:59pm

john47832 wrote: »

If poker was all down to logic then PistolPete would have his 10gs by now

*facepalm*

mark renton · 29-01-2009 5:11pm

5starpool wrote: »

of course it is down to logic. This includes knowing your opponent and how he is likely to play. Just because he 'could' be bluffing, doesn't mean he is.

How often have you made those calls with bottom pair on a whim and been totally wrong?

How many times have you seen a player make a "Bad Call", and take in the chips?

phantom_lord · 29-01-2009 5:13pm

http://www.bluffmagazine.com/onlinefeature/gbucks.asp

keane2097 · 29-01-2009 5:15pm

phantom_lord wrote: »

http://www.bluffmagazine.com/onlinefeature/gbucks.asp

Pffft - Phil Galfond, who the hell is he?

mark renton · 29-01-2009 5:18pm

keane2097 wrote: »

Pffft - Phil Galfond, who the hell is he?

Another "GENIUS"(note the deep sarcasm) poker player... who says "BORINGLY" (more sarcasm) that we should all play the odds and we will all win in the end (end of sarasm)

phantom_lord · 29-01-2009 5:20pm

and that's why you're busto, and he's a millionaire.

Icarus152 · 29-01-2009 5:20pm

[ ] thread's future looks rosy.

happyoutscan · 29-01-2009 5:21pm

I only play online but it never ceases to amaze me the amount of ******* 'experts' giving running commentary and berating anyone and everyone for their calls etc etc etc.

I haven't a clue about the 'lingo' as I have only played at tables a handful of times. Me playing bad calls (and getting 'lucky') has forced MrPaddyPower to send me nice cheques on a few occasions!

Everyone to their own, everyone plays the game different. You make you're own luck unless you're too busy talking tripe to everyone else.

keane2097 · 29-01-2009 5:22pm

john47832 wrote: »

Another "GENIUS"(note the deep sarcasm) poker player... who says "BORINGLY" (more sarcasm) that we should all play the odds and we will all win in the end (end of sarasm)

WE HAZ A TROLL!!!11!!1!!1

Chucky the tree · 29-01-2009 5:24pm

Can we sticky this? Seriously.

DeVore · 29-01-2009 5:26pm

A bad call could be defined as a call which, if you were to repeat it many times in the EXACT SAME SITUATION, would (on average) result in you losing money in the long run.

DeV.

mark renton · 29-01-2009 5:29pm

DeVore wrote: »

A bad call could be defined as a call which, if you were to repeat it many times in the EXACT SAME SITUATION, would (on average) result in you losing money in the long run.

DeV.

perfect - about time too - tnks Dev - "the amount of times a player makes bad calls" so why do so many "Poker Players" go around overusing the words "Bad Call" when they havent followed the player around???

5starpool · 29-01-2009 5:29pm

john47832 wrote: »

How many times have you seen a player make a "Bad Call", and take in the chips?

How many times have you answered a question instead of asking one instead?

I have seen people berate someone for making a marginal call when they had reasoned why it was correct to make a call. I have seen people make silly calls for no reason, yet be right on that occasion. I have seen people make sily calls for no reason and be a mile behind. I have seen people make marginal calls for good reasons but be miles behind too.

I don't really think you want a conversation on this though, you just want to espouse your view that everyone except you is stupid.

mark renton · 29-01-2009 5:31pm

5starpool wrote: »

How many times have you answered a question instead of asking one instead?

I have seen people berate someone for making a marginal call when they had reasoned why it was correct to make a call. I have seen people make silly calls for no reason, yet be right on that occasion. I have seen people make sily calls for no reason and be a mile behind. I have seen people make marginal calls for good reasons but be miles behind too.

I don't really think you want a conversation on this though, you just want to espouse your view that everyone except you is stupid.

Im hanging my head in shame... I'm berating people who berate people

keane2097 · 29-01-2009 5:36pm

john47832 wrote: »

Im hanging my head in shame... I'm berating people who berate people

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsDLPDwsCZg

DeVore · 29-01-2009 5:38pm

Its possible, indeed probable that the people who say "bad call" when you call with ace high are simply annoyed that you called. Basic rationalisation, they tell themselves that SOMEONE must have played badly in the hand and it couldnt be them could it.

Other times it may well be a bad call. One with little or no reasoning behind it beyond "I want to see his cards".

Only the caller truely knows and only if he's being honest with himself. Which most aren't.

DeV.

El Stuntman · 29-01-2009 5:41pm

I don't think I've ever made a bad call

PM BCB or ollyk1, they should be able to give expert advice

thedini · 29-01-2009 5:47pm

keane2097 wrote: »

WE HAZ A TROLL!!!11!!1!!1

.

mark renton · 29-01-2009 5:49pm

thedini wrote: »

.
this is the fella that needed a 4 day poker strategy

Please check facts before you start personally commenting on other people

Zab · 29-01-2009 5:50pm

DeVore wrote: »

Its possible, indeed probable that the people who say "bad call" when you call with ace high are simply annoyed that you called. Basic rationalisation, they tell themselves that SOMEONE must have played badly in the hand and it couldnt be them could it.

Other times it may well be a bad call. One with little or no reasoning behind it beyond "I want to see his cards".

Only the caller truely knows and only if he's being honest with himself. Which most aren't.

DeV.

This is pretty much 100% correct imo. Second paragraph is the much more annoying one though, as the guy there obviously shouldn't be told told he's made a bad call, and it's clearly the loser's fault for trying to bluff the fish in the first place.

keane2097 · 29-01-2009 5:50pm

thedini wrote: »

.
this is the fella that needed a 4 day poker strategy

Sentence fragment is a sentence fragment...

thedini · 29-01-2009 5:51pm

john47832 wrote: »

Please check facts before you start personally commenting on other people

i apologise

Mr.Plough · 29-01-2009 6:15pm

peterswellman · 29-01-2009 6:22pm

john47832 wrote: »

(1) make the raise higher (2) dont put your chips accross the line in the first place.

1. I'm sure for some crazy reason your opponent might have though you knew what you were doing so decided to 'value-bluff' you. I have a severe doubt though that you know what this is all about. Make the raise higher :rolleyes:. there are alot more way to bluff that just bet big. Alot of people will sense weakness if you bet pits too big. Alas, not you it seems.

2. Yes of course, lets all wait for premium hands and make the game a complete luckfest.

People should never try and bluff idiots. They just won't grasp it. Liek sammy Farha said, Against a good player I don't need a hand but I do against a bad player.

Which category do you fall into Johnny ol' pea?

Define "Bad Call"

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