Kerry GAA Discussion Thread Mod Warning Post #4167

DDC1990

DDC1990 wrote: »

Way to put a downer on the day Brolly.

Absolute **** of the highest order.

Tomas is getting sick of his rubbish now.

What did he say ??

DDC1990

Deleted User wrote:

What did he say ??

****ing on about Gooch not being a leader and disappearing against Tyrone.

acequion

DDC1990 wrote: »

****ing on about Gooch not being a leader and disappearing against Tyrone.

I never used to mind Brolly too much,even found him entertaining at times but he just made an eejit of himself tonight. First he insulted Galway,after they winning their League,and Michael Lyster in the process, who hails from there. But his attempt to taint Gooch's legacy backfired badly with both Tomas and Wheelan barely able to keep a straight face and Lyster totally sick of him by that stage.

As for comparing the public reaction to Gooch's retirement to that of Princess Diana's death, cringeable in the extreme!

What a wally is Brolly!:rolleyes::rolleyes:

acequion

Absolutely delighted with today's win,though it's the first Dublin/Kerry clash I've missed in a while.

Now no question that the defeat will toughen up Dublin no end and they could well be unbeatable again in the summer. But it may also herald a decline. As I said in a post earlier today, no team dominates forever.

What is certain though is that it will hugely boost Kerry. To beat the Dubs in Croke Park is wonderful for them and though it might only be April, Dublin were playing with a full squad.Kerry were not.

So onwards and upwards, there's great reason tonight for optimism.:)

Powerhouse

acequion wrote: »

I never used to mind Brolly too much,even found him entertaining at times but he just made an eejit of himself tonight. First he insulted Galway,after they winning their League,and Michael Lyster in the process, who hails from there. But his attempt to taint Gooch's legacy backfired badly with both Tomas and Wheelan barely able to keep a straight face and Lyster totally sick of him by that stage.

As for comparing the public reaction to Gooch's retirement to that of Princess Diana's death, cringeable in the extreme!

What a wally is Brolly!:rolleyes::rolleyes:

In fainess a remark like "tainting Gooch's legacy" is 'cringeable' too. No player is entitled to a 'legacy'. All there is is opinion. People not being able to keep a straight face does not amount to a cogent argument. Not saying Brolly is right or wrong but he at least has the intellectual courage to offer an opinion while others are reduced to trying to keep a straight face. Why not just take him on on the facts about Gooch v Donegal/Tyrone? If the argument is so compelling and the truth so obvious then it should be easily made.

Fr Tod Umptious

Kerry people really need to stop getting upset about what Brolly says at this stage.

Remember what Star said in 2014 and leave it at that.

windy shepard henderson

great game today and great win , have to tip my hat to michael geaney who had a fine game today criticized him in the past , full back line was very strong , ye have a serious team developing with the likes of jack savage jack barry , and shanahan at the back

fitzmorris is a very shrued man in fairness but it wont be until august until ye get tested like that again even if we do beat limerick clare are in no place to give ye a scare like 2014 , and tipperary will most likley beat cork again who are a few years off the next level yet , the next few months might feel like an anti climax

Powerhouse

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Kerry people really need to stop getting upset about what Brolly says at this stage.

Remember what Star said in 2014 and leave it at that.

"Well, Joe Brolly what do you think of that?" Powerful argument in fairness. That'd put him back in his box.

The_Honeybadger

Powerhouse wrote: »

In fainess a remark like "tainting Gooch's legacy" is 'cringeable' too. No player is entitled to a 'legacy'. All there is is opinion. People not being able to keep a straight face does not amount to a cogent argument. Not saying Brolly is right or wrong but he at least has the intellectual courage to offer an opinion while others are reduced to trying to keep a straight face. Why not just take him on on the facts about Gooch's v Donegal/Tyrone? If the argument is so compelling then it should be easily made.

Brolly is a pot walloper. Gooch put up some good scores in those games but Brolly keeps claiming that he didn't 'stand up'. What a corner forward can do to 'stand up' besides score goals / points he is not clear on.

windy shepard henderson

DDC1990 wrote: »

****ing on about Gooch not being a leader and disappearing against Tyrone.

look he will always find somthing to pick at , he is a barrister for godsake he gets a kick out of it

acequion

Powerhouse wrote: »

In fainess a remark like "tainting Gooch's legacy" is 'cringeable' too. No player is entitled to a 'legacy'. All there is is opinion. People not being able to keep a straight face does not amount to a cogent argument. Not saying Brolly is right or wrong but he at least has the intellectual courage to offer an opinion while others are reduced to trying to keep a straight face. Why not just take him on on the facts about Gooch v Donegal/Tyrone? If the argument is so compelling and the truth so obvious then it should be easily made.

Ah here Powerhouse,the man is an eejit,simple as! He just harps on and on with whatever rameis he's having tonight. If you call that "intellectual courage" you have to be taking the piss!

What else could the other pundits do but laugh. The man rants. He doesn't allow cogent arguments.Despite their finding it hard to credit him with a straight face they still rubbished his arguments eg:

Brolly: "I never saw Gooch influence his teammates when playing Tyrone"
Tomas: "Actually I played with him and saw him do that at least 200 times"

That's cogent enough for me.

And there is nothing cringeable about "taint Gooch's legacy" The man was one of the all time greats. He'll still be talked about in 50 years. You'll see at least a street named after him in Killarney,I guarantee you!

Like Brolly,you may be uncomfortable with that level of praise,but once in a generation sportspeople like Colm Cooper are very worthy of it.

evolving tipperary

Michael Lyster destroys Brolly with one line:
"There were a lot of players who were overrated..." - dead eyes Brolly.
Brolly: "Jesus..."

Powerhouse

acequion wrote: »

Brolly: "I never saw Gooch influence his teammates when playing Tyrone"
Tomas: "Actually I played with him and saw him do that at least 200 times"

That's cogent enough for me.

Maybe cogent enough for you but that's because you cannot countenance under any circumstances any opinion which does not completely and utterly praise Gooch.

Look critically at what was said - Brolly questioned Gooch against Tyrone (a team with a 3-0 record against Kerry in the championship over six seasons right when Kerry were at their peak) but O Se replied without mentioning Tyrone at all. He completely ignored the question.

It is mind-boggling that some people here think O Se had the better of the argument. It would have served O Se better to watch the games against Tyrone again and have some kind of plausible reply for something Brolly was always going to bring up, rather than relying on apparently clever irrelevancies and smirks that will impress those who have already made up their minds but holds no water ultimately. He could have even questioned the word "influence" and questioned what precisely what Brolly meant by that and asked how that is measured. He might have pointed to Gooch's excellent creation of a goal against Tyrone in 2005. But maybe it's the prerogative of a multiple All Ireland winner to go into a discussion such as this underprepared operating off the top of your head and not able to discuss specifics.

But it's probably a reality, as someone suggested, that Brolly's background counts for something in this case. He is used to the idea of evidence rather than high-stool smirks as a means of constructing an argument. O Se simply doesn't get that.

Powerhouse

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Michael Lyster destroys Brolly with one line:
"There were a lot of players who were overrated..." - dead eyes Brolly.
Brolly: "Jesus..."

Again that's a pub line designed to get a big 'yahoo' from those looking on. Has no intellectual merit and means fcuk all in the context of the discussion of the merits of a specific player. Only someone desperately waiting for someone to say something, anything, to "shut the cnut up" would think such a bland cliche "destroyed Brolly". Lyster should have kept his mouth shut and we might have only thought he was incapable of original thoughts.

Powerhouse

Powerhouse wrote: »

Again that's a pub line designed to get a big 'yahoo' from those looking on. Has no intellectual merit and means fcuk all in the context of the discussion of the merits of a specific player. Only someone desperately waiting for someone to say something, anything, to "shut the cnut up" would think such a bland cliche "destroyed Brolly". Lyster should have kept his mouth shut and we might have only thought he was incapable of original thoughts.

Wow, you're really getting into this, aren't you?

I did like your line about Brolly and smirking. I like irony.

Powerhouse

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow, you're really getting into this, aren't you?

I did like your line about Brolly and smirking. I like irony.

Good man, you really got to the heart of the argument there. No real disputing Gooch's status after that I can tell you. You do strike me as having the kind of passive-aggressive intellectuaism that would like irony - the "wow" gives it away.

Powerhouse

Powerhouse wrote: »

You do strike me as having the kind of passive-aggressive intellectuaism that would like irony - the "wow" gives it away.

And you strike me as a man who is getting very wound up and resorting to ad hominem attacks.

The very wound up posts and ad hominem attacks give it away.

Relax, 'tis only a discussion about a Joe Brolly's punditry on an anonymous site. Read a comic and lighten up. Go on, give us a big ol' Brolly like smirk!

kerryjack

As a Kerry man I did think that the tributes to colm cooper was over the top no need for that yesterday in crime park the man hasn't died , colm was fortunate to be born in Kerry beside Fitzgerald stadium and played with great players watched lucral Gael last eve Eamon o Hara what a great player he was, they have been loads of great players down through the copper was great was he the best that ever played the game it's impossible to say

DDC1990

Powerhouse wrote:

Good man, you really got to the heart of the argument there. No real disputing Gooch's status after that I can tell you. You do strike me as having the kind of passive-aggressive intellectuaism that would like irony - the "wow" gives it away.

Gooch played Tyrone 4 times in championship football.

In 2003 (at 20) he kicked 1 point.
In 2005 he kicked 5 points (joint top scorer)
In 2008 he kicked 6 points (top scorer)
In 2012 he kicked 5 points (top scorer)

It's up to you if you'd rather blindly listen to Brolly and take what he says as gospel or you'd rather do a bit of research yourself and see that Brolly is taking absolute bollox.

Brolly is going to great lengths to lie about Cooper and his legacy for some bizzare reason. He claimed Tyrone never double marked Cooper last night. Absolutely laughable.

His point generally seems to be, Kerry lost 3 games against Tyrone. Cooper is Kerrys most important player. Ergo Cooper isn't a leader because Kerry didn't win. If Declan O'Sullivan slots that late goal in 2008 is Cooper now suddenly the greatest footballer of his generation, because Kerry would have won and Cooper would have been top scorer?

Whats funnier is the fact that he dismisses all the teams that Kerry ever beat as terrible teams, when it was the brilliance of Cooper, Moynihan, Ó Sé (X3) and O'Sullivan who made those teams look ordinary. But when Kerry lose it's because Gooch isn't a leader.

Listen to the regard in which he is held by every last one of his teammates, from club to county to country. That tells you more about his leadership than Joe Brolly will ever know.

Gael85

DDC1990 wrote: »

Gooch played Tyrone 4 times in championship football.

In 2003 (at 18) he kicked 1 point.
In 2005 he kicked 5 points (joint top scorer)
In 2008 he kicked 6 points (top scorer)
In 2012 he kicked 5 points (top scorer)

It's up to you if you'd rather blindly listen to Brolly and take what he says as gospel or you'd rather do a bit of research yourself and see that Brolly is taking absolute bollox.

Brolly is going to great lengths to lie about Cooper and his legacy for some bizzare reason. He claimed Tyrone never double marked Cooper last night. Absolutely laughable.

His point generally seems to be, Kerry lost 3 games against Tyrone. Cooper is Kerrys most important player. Ergo Cooper isn't a leader because Kerry didn't win. If Declan O'Sullivan slots that late goal in 2008 is Cooper now suddenly the greatest footballer of his generation, because Kerry would have won and Cooper would have been top scorer?

Whats funnier is the fact that he dismisses all the teams that Kerry ever beat as terrible teams, when it was the brilliance of Cooper, Moynihan, Ó Sé (X3) and O'Sullivan who made those teams look ordinary. But when Kerry lose it's because Gooch isn't a leader.

Listen to regard in which he is held by every last one of his teammates, from club to county to country. That tells you more about his leadership than Joe Brolly will ever know.

Wouldn't take much notice of Brolly. He is just taking over the baton from Liam Hayes on how to wind Kerry up.

TheCitizen

Much prefer Brolly as a pundit to Tomas O Se. Even though I wouldn't always agree with Brolly, he is interesting and at times is on the button and will say things others won't. Whereas OSe is a bit of a sycophant. Brolly is right about Cooper, a very talented player but not as good as some have made him out to be since he announced his retirement from inter county football.

quad_red

TheCitizen wrote: »

Much prefer Brolly as a pundit to Tomas O Se. Even though I wouldn't always agree with Brolly, he is interesting and at times is on the button and will say things others won't. Whereas OSe is a bit of a sycophant. Brolly is right about Cooper, a very talented player but not as good as some have made him out to be since he announced his retirement from inter county football.

Brolly does have some interesting things to say but the chip on his shoulder is immense. Patting Tomas on the back during the Sunday game to 'settle' a score that some Kerry man once told him Derry were a good team for the league. And now he gets his 'revenge'. Just pathetic.

Open the paper and he's article talks about some Kerry hooligans jeered him before a Kerry minor game. Brolly told them Gooch would play like crap that day and told them he'd meet them after the match. Lo and behold he returned to the spot at half five that day but the Kerry fans didn't keep the challenge he had set them:

As Brolly senior and junior reached Croke Park, they were faced with the Kerry minor team.

Then the players spotted me. Someone roared "It's Joe Brolly" and a chant to started to swell from nowhere, like those impromptu chants that break out on the terraces at Parkhead or Anfield. "Gooch, Gooch, Gooch, Gooch, Gooch, Gooch," they chorused, creating a wall of sound like a thousand angry baboons. Throngs of Kerry supporters all around joined in. As the intensity increased, Rory was pulling my arm frantically. "Let's go daddy, please, let's get out of here." "Stand your ground son," I said to him.

I blew kisses to them. Then I signalled them to quieten down, waving them to silence with two hands. "Lads," I shouted, "I'll see you all back here at this exact spot at half-past five. We'll reflect on how Gooch got on today." As we ploughed through them, the chant resumed, becoming almost deafening. "Gooch, Gooch, Gooch, Gooch, Gooch, Gooch."
Kerry beaten - Cooper did score four points that day, two from play - Brolly returned to the site of the earlier encounter.

At half-past five, I went back and stood in the exact same spot. No-one showed up. "They're not singing anymore," I sang quietly to Rory, who burst out laughing.

That's one of the most pathetic things I've ever read.

jimmytwotimes 2013

TheCitizen wrote: »

Much prefer Brolly as a pundit to Tomas O Se. Even though I wouldn't always agree with Brolly, he is interesting and at times is on the button and will say things others won't. Whereas OSe is a bit of a sycophant. Brolly is right about Cooper, a very talented player but not as good as some have made him out to be since he announced his retirement from inter county football.

Joe feels the need to sh1t over everything Kerry do. Has been equally dismissive of cork so maybe he just doesn't like the south coast

Hard to take the man seriously when it's a constant effort at a wind-up.

Kerrydude1981

But it comes down to this, in 30 years time,people will be still talking about the likes of the great players of the 60s/70s and the likes of the great players I grew up watching and some I am still still watching,Martin O Connell,Colm O Rourke,Maurice Fitz,Stephen O Brien,Peter Cannavan,Trevor Giles,Seamus Moynihan Padraig Joyce,Diarmuid Connolly,The Brogans,the O Se's, Colm Cooper the list is endless,

Brolly will be remembered for blowing kisses

kerryjack

Kerrydude1981 wrote: »

But it comes down to this, in 30 years time,people will be still talking about the likes of the great players of the 60s/70s and the likes of the great players I grew up watching and some I am still still watching,Martin O Connell,Colm O Rourke,Maurice Fitz,Stephen O Brien,Peter Cannavan,Trevor Giles,Seamus Moynihan Padraig Joyce,Diarmuid Connolly,The Brogans,the O Se's, Colm Cooper the list is endless,

Brolly will be remembered for blowing kisses

Good oneðŸ˜ðŸ˜ðŸ˜

PressRun

I think the reason he was harping on the way he was last night was because he made this claim about Cooper a couple of years ago and then felt like he needed to be "consistent". He's one of those people who never wants to admit they were wrong or that they simply said something foolish for attention once upon a time, and so they keep digging just to make a point.

He knows he's talking bollox, he just doesn't want to admit it and lose the argument.

Kerrydude1981

PressRun wrote: »

I think the reason he was harping on the way he was last night was because he made this claim about Cooper a couple of years ago and then felt like he needed to be "consistent". He's one of those people who never wants to admit they were wrong or that they simply said something foolish for attention once upon a time, and so they keep digging just to make a point.

He knows he's talking bollox, he just doesn't want to admit it and lose the argument.

He is the Eamon Dunphy of the GAA

Powerhouse

Deleted User wrote: »

And you strike me as a man who is getting very wound up and resorting to ad hominem attacks.

The very wound up posts and ad hominem attacks give it away.

Relax, 'tis only a discussion about a Joe Brolly's punditry on an anonymous site. Read a comic and lighten up. Go on, give us a big ol' Brolly like smirk!

Sorry, I can't relax. I'm too wound up. This is very serious. More serious than you think. I cannot possibly smirk under those circumstances. Can I blow you a kiss instead? Just a light one, not in any ad hominem :eek: way like.

Powerhouse

PressRun wrote: »

I think the reason he was harping on the way he was last night was because he made this claim about Cooper a couple of years ago and then felt like he needed to be "consistent". He's one of those people who never wants to admit they were wrong or that they simply said something foolish for attention once upon a time, and so they keep digging just to make a point.

He knows he's talking bollox, he just doesn't want to admit it and lose the argument.

What argument? Joe Brolly has put up an claim and nobody has yet dealt with it. All we get is a wink and nod "who-the-fcuk-does-he-think-he-is-and-I'd-like-to-punch-him-for-not-thinking-like-I-do but I'll-laugh-anyway-just-to-show-how-sound-I-am" response.

There is no argument. That would require a two-way process.

Brolly's point is very simple. Cooper was brilliant on days when Kerry won well, there was lots of space and everyone around him was going well. On other days against Donegal and Tyrone when Kerry struggled he was, in Brolly's view, far less effective. Given the reaction tio Cooper's retirement which seeks to raise him to very exalted heights in the rankings it is a legitimate point to raise - this doesn't make him right or wrong, it just is a legitimate point to raise. If people want to rank him with Johnny Crowley and Mike Frank Russell as another very talented footballer who played in the forwards that's fine. But for GOAT purposes the bar is raised. Brolly's comments simply reflect that. And presumably if Tomas O Se felt confident of his ground on that one he would take him on directly and discuss his performances on those days cited by Brolly.

There are arguments against what Brolly is saying but (there's no nice way to say this) I really don't think Tomas O Se is really capable of rigorously constructing an argument like that. He does the fella-you'd-love-to-have-a-pint-with thing very well but that's about it.

Stoner

Kerrydude1981 wrote:

Brolly will be remembered for blowing kisses

He'll be remembered for this work on RTE and giving away a kidney (I think) over football now alright.

His performance last night has dominated the Kerry thread when you should be analysing a win. He could have waited until another day.