Sinn Fein these days

yomchi

Serenity Now! wrote: »

Whats my point?? lol

Crime didn't bother Sinn Féin, the PIRA's political wing, then but nowadays, according to their policy manifesto its apparently a bad thing that they want to tackle.
Don't tell me...they've a policy on double standards and hypocrisy too?

Sinn Féin worked with others in order to bring an end to the IRA's campaign and helped with others bring a peace to the island. Margaret Thatcher tried to label the IRA's war against British imperialism as criminal, it didn't work, it's a failed policy and is now the limp baton that yourself and like minded people try to beat SF up with. Move on my friend, it's not 1981.

yomchi

K-9 wrote: »

Fine "lets consider joining the Commonwealth" Gael?

riiiight...

dlofnep

SF would not go into Government with FF or FG. I assure you of that. Perhaps the Labour party.

As for SF as a party goes, it has my vote every time, and this year around - even more so. SF was the only party with the backbone in persist with the national question, knowing the stigma that would come with it. Does SF as a party have a sketchy past? Of course it does - It was involved in a political struggle against the type of nation who would see 14 people killed on the streets of Derry, and let the murders get away with it scot free. If you expect a rosey story under this sort of climate, you're not a realist. I suppose FF and FG don't have military pasts?

Modern day SF has embraced peace and politics. For years, many were quibbing on about it - And now that they have done it, all they have left to do is quib on about the past of SF, because current day SF has it's councillors across every city and town in Ireland working hard on behalf of the people. Where were the FF councillors today in Waterford for the Waterford Glass protest? The only councillor I saw on stage was a SF one.. The two leading trade union banners were held by SF members.. Say what you will about SF's national policies, but locally - they have done very well for themselves and that carries alot of merit for me.

I read something on the first page and I'll quote it:

Sinn Fein know they will never get into government, so they can afford to have these blown out unworkable measures that nonetheless appeal to their mostly dumb working class base and their northern patriots.

Those "dumb working class" as you put it, are the heart and soul of this country and have kept it running for decades. It's the same working class who are now shafted by the Irish Government, losing their jobs and pensions, while our Government bails out the rich elite bankers. You should show a little more respect to the working class people of Ireland. And if they give their votes to SF, it's only because SF actually gives a **** about them, while the likes of you label them as dumb. Coming from a working class family myself, I found that comment disgusting.

Bottle_of_Smoke

dlofnep wrote: »

SF would not go into Government with FF or FG. I assure you of that. Perhaps the Labour party.

Why would they not go into government with FF? I'm not trying to be antagonist, I just honestly think they would.

FG maybe not but that wouldn't matter as FG wouldn't go in with them.

LordSutch

Jon wrote: »

The IRA were involved in an armed campaign against the British or are you overly influenced by Margaret Thatcher?

Just to clarify things for those with short memories ~ The IRA waged an Armed campaign against the likes of me! the IRA were the enemy of the Irish people & the British people too. Mrs Thatch may have been a Stern, Immoveable, Intransigent old girl, but just like Churchill in WWII Maggie was the right antidote at the right time to counter the IRA threat, and she clamped down on them when she needed to (for all our sakes).

Sinn Fein will be lucky to have Four seats in the next Dail.

dlofnep

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Why would they not go into government with FF? I'm not trying to be antagonist, I just honestly think they would.

FG maybe not but that wouldn't matter as FG wouldn't go in with them.

Polar opposite policies I'd imagine. It would take a very new-minded leadership within FF before SF would enter Government with them. After recent events, I doubt Fianna Fáil would go into government with Fianna Fáil!

Camelot wrote: »

Just to clarify things for those with short memories ~ The IRA waged an Armed campaign against the likes of me! the IRA were the enemy of the Irish people & the British people too. Mrs Thatch may have been a Stern, Immoveable, Intransigent old girl, but just like Churchill in WWII Maggie was the right antidote at the right time to counter the IRA threat, and she clamped down on them when she needed to (for all our sakes).

Sinn Fein will be lucky to have Four seats in the next Dail.

Let's get one thing straight. Maggie Thatcher was a complete and utter bibe. She was despised by the working class people of Britain, and despised by the Irish people.

As for the IRA, they were not my enemy. What makes you so different to me that would make you a target? Do tell.

And as for seats, we'll see. Just because you say it, does not make it so.

yomchi

Camelot wrote: »

Just to clarify things for those with short memories ~ The IRA waged an Armed campaign against the likes of me! the IRA were the enemy of the Irish people & the British people too. Mrs Thatch may have been a Stern, Immoveable, Intransigent old girl, but just like Churchill in WWII Maggie was the right antidote at the right time to counter the IRA threat, and she clamped down on them when she needed to (for all our sakes).

Sinn Fein will be lucky to have Four seats in the next Dail.

I see you've elected yourself spokesperson for the entire Irish race.

Is it cold in Camelot today?

Fratton Fred

Maggie was PM for over ten years, not something that generally happens to someone who is despised. Ireland could do with a Maggie Thatcher today.

OhNoYouDidn't

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Maggie was PM for over ten years, not something that generally happens to someone who is despised. Ireland could do with a Maggie Thatcher today.

For every person who attends her funeral, 1,000 will be at the street party in Trafalger Square and elsewhere to celebrate her death.

Fratton Fred

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

For every person who attends her funeral, 1,000 will be at the street party in Trafalger Square and elsewhere to celebrate her death.

Like I said, sha was a lot more popular than people like to think. She broke the unions grip on the ountry for starters something I would love to see happen here.

dlofnep

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Like I said, sha was a lot more popular than people like to think. She broke the unions grip on the ountry for starters something I would love to see happen here.

Anti-union, are we Fred? And no - Thatcher will be remembered as a vile, hateful bibe who detested the working class in Britain.

Fratton Fred

dlofnep wrote: »

Anti-union, are we Fred? And no - Thatcher will be remembered as a vile, hateful bibe who detested the working class in Britain.

Not at all, I was a member of a union for a long time. What I am anti is greedy people using a union to secure inflated salaries and jobs for life. ESB and Eircom would spring to mind here.

akaredtop

Fratton Fred
You are spot on.Thatcher could see the greed in the unions and that is why she smashed them.We need a thatcher is country badly.Stand up to these overpaid bullies who lead the unions here. She would sort out the ESB fairly quickly. They are a like a bunch of hungry pigs with their snouts in the public trough getting fat on the backs of ordinary people.Long live Maggie Thatcher! We love you.

Nodin

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Maggie was PM for over ten years, not something that generally happens to someone who is despised..

.....in a proportional representation styled voting system. However as maggie never got more than 42% of the vote (her best ever result), yes indeed, its safe to say she was despised. 'Hated', 'loathed' and 'remembered with bitterness' are oft mentioned with regard to her, and quite rightly so. Her one grace was that she was at least relatively honest - you knew what you were getting.

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Ireland could do with a Maggie Thatcher today.

...like a hole in the head.

ionix5891

here we are in a middle of a financial crisis and sein fein cronies are still bickering about the 6 counties

bleh who cares?

if they get in power and go ahead with the corpo tax raises the outlined, the only remaining positive holding companies here will vanish, where will the "workers" work when the business are gone, dont tell me sein fein are planning some sort of a communist regime for us

Irlbo

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Maggie was PM for over ten years, not something that generally happens to someone who is despised. Ireland could do with a Maggie Thatcher today.

So you'd be in favour of empowering a woman who in her time in power,introduced poll tax despite the intense hostillity against it from every corner of British life,made jobless thousands of miners,in terms of Ireland(apparently the nationality you claim to hold despite being overtly pro-British and pro-'Northern Ireland') criminalised the republican movement and made scapegoats of republican prisoners and in general held extremely anti-Irish sentiment and a very old fashioned imperealistic to all issues she dealt with,this is who you want to lead this country,sorry mate but 'Irelands not for turning'

Fratton Fred

When did I claim to be Irish? I agree with a lot of what you say, but Ireland needs a leader with balls and Maggie had more cajones than the entire Dail put together.IMHO, PR does not work as you end up in the situation where we have minority parties in power and no one party has an overall mandate and therefore the ability to make drastic changes

ionix5891

Fratton Fred wrote: »

When did I claim to be Irish? I agree with a lot of what you say, but Ireland needs a leader with balls and Maggie had more cajones than the entire Dail put together.IMHO, PR does not work as you end up in the situation where we have minority parties in power and no one party has an overall mandate and therefore the ability to make drastic changes

if your not Irish, then why are you mucking in our politics section?

Fratton Fred

ionix5891 wrote: »

if your not Irish, then why are you mucking in our politics section?

I pay taxes in Ireland and I have a vote. I think that gives me the right to an opinion.

K-9

ionix5891 wrote: »

if your not Irish, then why are you mucking in our politics section?

Checks to see is this a SF thread. Ticks box.

ionix5891

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I pay taxes in Ireland and I have a vote. I think that gives me the right to an opinion.

fair enough

kmick

If Sinn Fein will never go into power with FF or FG then they are unlikely ever to get into power.

More likely is that they realise to get into power they have to get into bed with FF or FG like the PD's, Greens etc. This will lead to their destruction just as it did for the PD's and Greens.

Soldie

After taking a quick look at the Sinn Féin website I see the third link down from the left is 'History of the Conflict' and, upon clicking 'Policies', 'Irish Unity' is listed before Economy, Education and just about everything else.

Now, which party was it that was out of touch...?

guinnessdrinker

ionix5891 wrote: »

here we are in a middle of a financial crisis and sein fein cronies are still bickering about the 6 counties

bleh who cares?

I care.

ionix5891 wrote: »

if they get in power and go ahead with the corpo tax raises the outlined, the only remaining positive holding companies here will vanish, where will the "workers" work when the business are gone, dont tell me sein fein are planning some sort of a communist regime for us

I can't see SF getting into power anytime soon so I don't think you have to worry about them raising corporation tax.

dlofnep

ionix5891 wrote: »

here we are in a middle of a financial crisis and sein fein cronies are still bickering about the 6 counties

Bickering? FTR: Sinn Féin is a 32 county party, of which one of it's policies is Irish re-unification. Others include supporting workers rights and so forth or did you conveniently skip that?

ionix5891 wrote: »

bleh who cares?

Many people. I'm pretty sure you don't speak on behalf of the Irish public.

ionix5891 wrote: »

if they get in power and go ahead with the corpo tax raises the outlined, the only remaining positive holding companies here will vanish, where will the "workers" work when the business are gone, dont tell me sein fein are planning some sort of a communist regime for us

Sinn Féin's idea is to not have the Irish economy sustain itself on foreign investments that could walk out any day - ala Dell Computers - But rather promote internal companies and local produce. Countries like Norway have a high corporation tax rate, but yet - have a stable and prosperous economy with only a 2% unemployment rate, ranked second in GDP per-capita globally and first in the human development index.

I'm not an economist, but I can see merit in having a healthy balance between multinational dependancies and natural produce investment.

dlofnep

Soldie wrote: »

After taking a quick look at the Sinn Féin website I see the third link down from the left is 'History of the Conflict' and, upon clicking 'Policies', 'Irish Unity' is listed before Economy, Education and just about everything else.

Now, which party was it that was out of touch...?

And where on the website does it state that they are listed in terms of importance? :rolleyes:

Naturally the national issue is of great importance to SF, but the economy and fair distribution of wealth, free education, along with fair treatment of workers amongst other areas are also very important.

ionix5891

dlofnep wrote: »

Bickering? FTR: Sinn Féin is a 32 county party, of which one of it's policies is Irish re-unification. Others include supporting workers rights and so forth or did you conveniently skip that?



Many people. I'm pretty sure you don't speak on behalf of the Irish public.



Sinn Féin's idea is to not have the Irish economy sustain itself on foreign investments that could walk out any day - ala Dell Computers - But rather promote internal companies and local produce. Countries like Norway have a high corporation tax rate, but yet - have a stable and prosperous economy with only a 2% unemployment rate, ranked second in GDP per-capita globally and first in the human development index.

I'm not an economist, but I can see merit in having a healthy balance between multinational dependancies and natural produce investment.

im sure you don't speak on behalf of the Irish public either (as evident in weak support for SF) since we joined the EU the whole NI issue is moot, all there is left is Nationalist sentiment crap, nationalism never got anyone far, see Nazi Germany

also dont delude yourself countries like norway have a huge abundance of natural resources: fish, oil, gas, timber, minerals, hydro and wind energy potential. all we have are cows and fish, hell even the turf is almost all gone, all these hi-tech companies are here due to nice corpo tax rate, if it wasnt for them you would be in a field now tending spuds not surfing boards on a broadband connection and computer with some powerful circuits

your forgetting all the foreign companies are here supporting alot of small irish business like mine (google is customer in my case) raising the taxes will mean a chain reaction that will scuttle the economy

and none of yee Sein Feiners still answered the quiestion as to why Sein Fein made such a big deal of the "possible" corpo tax rate raise due to Lisbon, yet they want to raise the taxes even higher, a word springs to mind Hypocrisy

as for workers what will happen to their work when alot of the business leave?
care about workers my ass

last thing we need is another bunch of clueless half wits getting into government

.

Fratton Fred

dlofnep wrote: »

Sinn Féin's idea is to not have the Irish economy sustain itself on foreign investments that could walk out any day - ala Dell Computers - But rather promote internal companies and local produce. Countries like Norway have a high corporation tax rate, but yet - have a stable and prosperous economy with only a 2% unemployment rate, ranked second in GDP per-capita globally and first in the human development index.

Norway has black gold don't forget, which does tend to inflate the economy a bit.

If Sinn Fein want to protect workers rights by upping minimum wage then it is going to make Ireland an even more expensive place to manufacture in and could drive out even more foreign investment, worse still, Irish manufacturers will not be able to compete in the european market place so even home grown companies will suffer.

Worker's rights are fine, but companies and more importantly Ireland has to be competitive in the open market place, that is a simple fact of life.

Irlbo

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I pay taxes in Ireland and I have a vote. I think that gives me the right to an opinion.

And what nationality would you regard yourself?

ionix5891

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Norway has black gold don't forget, which does tend to inflate the economy a bit.

If Sinn Fein want to protect workers rights by upping minimum wage then it is going to make Ireland an even more expensive place to manufacture in and could drive out even more foreign investment, worse still, Irish manufacturers will not be able to compete in the european market place so even home grown companies will suffer.

Worker's rights are fine, but companies and more importantly Ireland has to be competitive in the open market place, that is a simple fact of life.

you are not gonna get an answer to your statement from SFers

they dont have an economic policy, simple as that

their policy is adding the population of 1million in the 6 counties (poorest part of UK, a welfare state, and huge public sector) to our existing huge public sector and 400,000 unemployed :mad:

i wonder whos taxes will pay for all that :rolleyes: