Roadside Shrines

fryup

I was listening to liveline today and they were having a debate about roadside shrines/memorials.

Some people were saying they were an eyesore, morbid and a distraction to drivers.......while others (mainly the relatives) were saying they were an appropriate gesture to there loved ones and a timely reminder to drivers to drive safely.

I sort of sit on the fence about it, i don't mind people putting flowers or a card at the spot where their loved ones died, but i draw the line at the more permanent shrines - i.e. the crosses and statues esp those big in your face ones.

How do you feel about it??...they're increasing in number each year..is it time to bring in regulations on them??

Plug

Its not like if there fag butts. Theres not too many.
I'd prefer to crash while looking at a nice woman than looking at a death scene memorial.

I think criticising how other people chose to mourn, is just about as low as you can go.

Turd Ferguson

Every time I pass one I think to myself "Thats a very unusual place to bury someone"

Biggins

For me, they serve three purposes.

1. They are a reminded how precious life is and how we should appreciate and stand up for the things we do have.
2. They are a personal mark of respect for those now gone.
3. If they are by a roadside, they also serve as a warning that dangers still exist at a particular bend and the costs that could be paid for ignoring such items, can be a heavy one.

1966

Moonbaby wrote: »

I think criticising how other people chose to mourn, is just about as low as you can go.

couldn't agree more - if these memorials give comfort to a family what about it?

FlutterinBantam

Ok what about if they are 40 metres high and 20 metres wide??

Biggins

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Ok what about if they are 40 metres high and 20 metres wide??

One example or GTFO please.

shenanigans1982

Closest you'll get.


http://www.briarpatchmagazine.com/batches/may07/Elmer3.jpg

Biggins

shenanigans1982 wrote: »

Closest you'll get.

http://www.briarpatchmagazine.com/batches/may07/Elmer3.jpg

Interesting. Pity one has to travel that far to find one that size!
We don't fall across them everyday here in Ireland do we?

ScumLord

What would happen if you crashed into one? Innocently. Would you, or your family have to replace it or would the people who put it there be in some way responsible for an obstruction?

FlutterinBantam

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Ok what about if they are 40 metres high and 20 metres wide??

You don't want to piss of the kind of people who pimp memorials that way.
Well not if you have a dislike of slash hooks and having your pelvis driven over and over by commerical vechiles.

Turd Ferguson

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Ok what about if they are 40 metres high and 20 metres wide??

Hey, that one is a life size statue of my ma :mad:

mike65

Heres the website for them (not kidding)

http://www.irishroadside.com/

The Tramore Road is a case in point. 11 of them over a 7 mile journey.

SoupyNorman

I was listening to that today, I dont have a problem with it too much however the guy whos daughter crashed into one writing off her car in the process was a good example how some are a little OTT. A sizeable solid granite object in the ditch can be hazardous.

dsmythy

mike65 wrote: »

Heres the website for them (not kidding)

http://www.irishroadside.com/

The Tramore Road is a case in point. 11 of them over a 7 mile journey.

I guess drivers on said road had better slow down then.

Biggins

mike65 wrote: »

Heres the website for them (not kidding)

http://www.irishroadside.com/

The Tramore Road is a case in point. 11 of them over a 7 mile journey.

It must be a serious bad road - and it begs the question what the heck is being done by the nearest local elected representative(s) to help cut down on the deaths?

mike65

The deaths range over about 60 years to be fair, its a grand road in itself.

Karoma

bravestarr082 wrote: »

I was listening to that today, I dont have a problem with it too much however the guy whos daughter crashed into one writing off her car in the process was a good example how some are a little OTT. A sizeable solid granite object in the ditch can be hazardous.

I didn't listen to that tripe, so forgive me if I'm missing out on the finer points of her argument, but on the face of what you typed: If you're in a ditch, you're already boned.

They're a sober reminder that crashes can lead to death. Leave 'em. I'm sure they have to get permission from the authorities over where/what they can put in place, so they're unlikely to actually cause accidents. If people are distracted by them... Maybe we should make some drivers wear blinkers because there are other distractions out there. Big. Scary. Distractions.

Myxomatosis

mike65 wrote: »

Heres the website for them (not kidding)

http://www.irishroadside.com/

The Tramore Road is a case in point. 11 of them over a 7 mile journey.

Websites design = shite

Websites content = shite. Who would be interested in browsing pictures of headstones? Apart from the immediate family perhaps.

Biggins

bravestarr082 wrote: »

...the guy whos daughter crashed into one writing off her car in the process was a good example how some are a little OTT. A sizeable solid granite object in the ditch can be hazardous.

...and how did she end up off the road in the first place?

A tree on the side of any road is a dangerous thing to hit too.
Do we remove all them by following that process of thinking!

shenanigans1982

Wouldn't have thought the Tramore road was that bad to have 7 of these on it. Especially when you consider how short it is. Would hate to think how many there are between Carlow and Tramore....one of the worst roads in the country.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Doesn't bother me.

If they are such a distraction to drivers we should build 8ft walls around every single road in Irleand so the poor bastards aren't "distracted".

They serve as reminders to those using the roads, be they motorists, cyclists or pedestrians. They may be morbid, but then again if it effects you that much you need psychological help. There IS something wrong with you.

Biggins, can't blame the local electorate on that really, there may be more to it than that. Say the majority that have died did not abide by the rules?

Biggins

Noel Fast Hitter wrote: »

Biggins, can't blame the local electorate on that really, there may be more to it than that. Say the majority that have died did not abide by the rules?

Quite possibly true but hard to say when we don't know if they are driver, passenger or roadside innocent victim also.

shenanigans1982

Biggins wrote: »

...and how did she end up off the road in the first place?

A tree on the side of any road is a dangerous thing to hit too.
Do we remove all them by following that process of thinking!

No thats just a stupid argument, we see hundreds of trees on any trip we take and pay no attention to them and while we see more of these memorials than we should they do take your attention away from the road which could easily lead to somebody ending up in a ditch or worse.

Biggins

shenanigans1982 wrote: »

No thats just a stupid argument, we see hundreds of trees on any trip we take and pay no attention to them and while we see more of these memorials than we should they do take your attention away from the road which could easily lead to somebody ending up in a ditch or worse.

Gee, I could say the same for every male/female that might attract the eye.
Maybe every roadside sign, poster, boarding - yea - lets remove them all.
After all, we are reading daily about how these things are causing loads of accident in our papers! :rolleyes:

Professey Chin

Biggins wrote: »

It must be a serious bad road - and it begs the question what the heck is being done by the nearest local elected representative(s) to help cut down on the deaths?

Most recent thing done to it was a resurfacing that made it worse then ever. Comin apart everywhere and its only a matter of time till thats 12:(

SoupyNorman

Karoma wrote: »

I didn't listen to that tripe, so forgive me if I'm missing out on the finer points of her argument, but on the face of what you typed: If you're in a ditch, you're already boned.

They're a sober reminder that crashes can lead to death. Leave 'em. I'm sure they have to get permission from the authorities over where/what they can put in place, so they're unlikely to actually cause accidents. If people are distracted by them... Maybe we should make some drivers wear blinkers because there are other distractions out there. Big. Scary. Distractions.

Biggins wrote:

...and how did she end up off the road in the first place?

A tree on the side of any road is a dangerous thing to hit too.
Do we remove all them by following that process of thinking!

No need for the self-righteous attitudes if you didnt hear it first hand.

His daughter was in a line of traffic travelling at a moderate speed, car in front jammed on, she swerved into the grass verge and had the monument not been there the car would have been ok, so the callers story goes.


As I said, I have no issue with the shrines/momuments but why do they need to be secondary gravestones, a plaque will serve the purpose intended and not cause any obstructions.

dollybird09

holy crap... that website with the pics of the memorials is creepy...ok I know someone is going to freak out that I just said that!!

I know its meant as a stark reminder to all of us to slow down and not put our family in the same position as those who have erected these memorials, at the same time I think the website is morbid. If the function of these memorials is to allow the family to remember, then why not visit the site / the graveyard rather than set up a website... its certainly not how I'd choose to remember a loved one

Bogger77

shenanigans1982 wrote: »

No thats just a stupid argument, we see hundreds of trees on any trip we take and pay no attention to them and while we see more of these memorials than we should they do take your attention away from the road which could easily lead to somebody ending up in a ditch or worse.

if seeing an object/cross/memorial/static object on the side of the road causes you to be distracted, you should not be driving. Simple.

as for the girl hitting one and totalling her car, boo hoo, "I'm a bad driver, I went off the road and hit a static object in the ditch and I'm blaming the object for it.", what if it was a cyclist who'd pulled in to let her pass, or those 2 ladies from up the road that go walking every evening standing in to let her pass.
Loads of what if's, but only one thing is certain, she left the roadway, in an uncontrolled manner, at such speed that she seriously damaged her car. She shouldn't be driving, if she cannot accept responsibility for it.

UpCork

I heard the debate on 'Liveline' today and to be honest, the families should be entitled to do what they want (within reason of course).

The inital woman who rang in made a valid point - she said her son (who was killed in a 'hit and run') didn't die in a hospital or in his own bed at home. This got me thinking, anyone of the older generation of my family (grandparents and their siblings) passed away in the same hospital here in Cork. We as a family dread having to go near the place as it evokes such bad memories for us. I know when I drive by the hospital, they are the first people that come into my mind - when I see the 'A&E' deparment for example, I can't help but think of the night my grandmother was brought in as she was sadly dying. Therefore, these families everytime they pass a particular road they are reminded of where their loved ones passed on. Only difference is really, you can't go erecting memorials in hospitals.

If they aren't too garish, aren't causing an obstruction and are in off the side of the road, then I don't see a problem and if it brings relief to the family, then what harm is it doing.

Bogger77

bravestarr082 wrote: »

No need for the self-righteous attitudes if you didnt hear it first hand.

His daughter was in a line of traffic travelling at a moderate speed, car in front jammed on, she swerved into the grass verge and had the monument not been there the car would have been ok, so the callers story goes.

awww, diddums for the poor girl, she was driving too close to the car in front, went to the ditch as she had not left enough space in front of her to safely stop, and they're blaming the static object, as I said above, tough.
Lucky for her, she's only responsible for damages to her car, and doesn't have to pay for the person in front's car.

Zebra3

So are these sort of shrines only put up for road accidents? If someone dies walking down a pedestrianised street do they get one put up for them as well? :rolleyes: I'd hate to have one of those tacky shrines outside my garden. I'd assume most of the people who have shrines put up for them are buried in some poxy graveyard, already taking up valuable land. (Imagine if all 6bn of us on the planet had to be buried in graveyards....)

Biggins

Zebra3 wrote: »

So are these sort of shrines only put up for road accidents? If someone dies walking down a pedestrianised street do they get one put up for them as well? :rolleyes: I'd hate to have one of those tacky shrines outside my garden.

Just a guess but I suspect anyone that puts these up on ANYONE'S wall - does so with their complete permission - otherwise it would be taken down in a flash.

Zebra3 wrote: »

I'd assume most of the people who have shrines put up for them are buried in some poxy graveyard, already taking up valuable land. (Imagine if all 6bn of us on the planet had to be buried in graveyards....)

Just imagine - the ground would be a lot more fertile as our bodies decompose!
Imagine that! Jeasus, that would be terrible. :rolleyes:

UpCork

Zebra, I think that's a bit harsh.

Thankfully I don't have first hand experience of this type of thing, but I have experienced loss and grief and to be honest different people do different things in order to deal with their grief. Whilst I mightn't like to walk out my front door every day and see a plaque saying 'x, y, z' died here, if I knew in my heart that a family somewhere had some solace because of it, then I wouldn't mind.

well Zebra, clearly you have had no first hand experience of losing a loved one in an RTA! Lucky you.

Here is a picture of the "shrine" that I erected at the spot where both of my children, aged 9 months and 3 years were killed. Firstly, it is comforting for me to be able to leave flowers at the site of their death rather than just in a graveyard, and secondly, seeing and this was renowned as one of the most dangerous junctions in wexford, it may warn others to be a little more careful. Say what you will, unless you have lost someone in this way, it's unfair to pass judgement.

ibarelycare

Biggins wrote: »

...and how did she end up off the road in the first place?

A tree on the side of any road is a dangerous thing to hit too.
Do we remove all them by following that process of thinking!

No, but why add some unnecessary hazards to the side of our roads??

Guy:Incognito

Moonbaby wrote: »

I think criticising how other people chose to mourn, is just about as low as you can go.

If they died in your front garden would you think the same?



Certain groups have gone overboard with one or too aswell, they are as big and gaudy as the gravestones that certain groups erect. (not nessecarily the result of crashes in at least one case).

1966 wrote: »

couldn't agree more - if these memorials give comfort to a family what about it?

Is that not what graves are for?

Biggins

ibarelycare wrote: »

No, but why add some unnecessary hazards to the side of our roads??

You mean like bad drivers who end up there, who can't keep their cars on the road in the first place.
And thats before they go off, hitting and road knocking down items. :rolleyes:

fryup

Is this just an irish thing??........or does it happen in other countries as well??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghost_bike

Biggins

Myth wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghost_bike

To be fair - never heard of them, never mind actually seen one.

Hands up who has actually spotted one in Ireland and say where are they?

The_Minister

Moonbaby wrote: »

I think criticising how other people chose to mourn, is just about as low as you can go.

6 feet low.


But, seriously, I don't mind if you mourn in the comfort of your own grave site, but don't do it in my face.

c - 13

Biggins wrote: »

You mean like bad drivers who end up there, who can't keep their cars on the road in the first place.
And thats before they go off, hitting and road knocking down items. :rolleyes:

Now in fairness, I cant speak for that girl in question but all crashes arent caused by bad driving, a very large percentage yes, but anyone could have an accident, a blow out, skid on something or whatever and not be able to control the car as the outcome. Doesnt mean they are bad drivers, just that they panic or shit themselves at the time.

In the event of something like that happening and the car winding up the ditch there's probably a higher chance of the person surviving if they dont crash into a granite monolith in memory of Decker McGowan who crashed his car on this same bad bend racing against his bud Anto.

So in summary, I have no problem with the small crosses and plaques and the likes but its when they start getting bigger then they become a hazard.

Lobelia Overhill

I don't have a problem with marking the site where someone died, but there are some memorials that are a bit too much ... there's one near me that's on a corner and is a proper cairn, if you don't know it's there, you wouldn't see it in the dark ...

There's another one that's in a 'dark spot' (due to trees etc) on the road, I was driving along at the speed limit and didn't notice a small crowd of people (all dressed in dark clothes) holding a memorial there - I only noticed them cos one of them moved as I was passing (I was watching the road, like). I thought that was a bit dangerous!

Mingey

Oh the ironing if a person were to crash and be killed from the distraction of a gaudy memorial.

syklops

Originally Posted by Karoma View Post
I didn't listen to that tripe, so forgive me if I'm missing out on the finer points of her argument, but on the face of what you typed: If you're in a ditch, you're already boned.

They're a sober reminder that crashes can lead to death. Leave 'em. I'm sure they have to get permission from the authorities over

One of the main points of the conversation was that you dont need planning permission for them.

As has been said before, a wooden cross is fine. A granite monolith could be an eye sore aswell as possibly a hazard.

The original caller was asking that legislation be brought to govern how/where/what size memorials are. The program then got hijacked by people who had lost loved ones and were offended by her comments. There was one woman who refused to leave and took over the show at one point. I think they hung up on her in the end.

ejmaztec

syklops wrote: »

One of the main points of the conversation was that you dont need planning permission for them.

As has been said before, a wooden cross is fine. A granite monolith could be an eye sore aswell as possibly a hazard.

The original caller was asking that legislation be brought to govern how/where/what size memorials are. The program then got hijacked by people who had lost loved ones and were offended by her comments. There was one woman who refused to leave and took over the show at one point. I think they hung up on her in the end.

Memorial pubs, houses and petrol-stations .....there's an idea.

Zebra3

Biggins wrote: »

Just a guess but I suspect anyone that puts these up on ANYONE'S wall - does so with their complete permission - otherwise it would be taken down in a flash.

Where did I say they were put up on anyone's wall? Why are you lying about what I'm saying and making rubbish up? Loads of these things are put up on raodsizes on public property.

Deleted User wrote: »

well Zebra, clearly you have had no first hand experience of losing a loved one in an RTA! Lucky you.

Here is a picture of the "shrine" that I erected at the spot where both of my children, aged 9 months and 3 years were killed. Firstly, it is comforting for me to be able to leave flowers at the site of their death rather than just in a graveyard, and secondly, seeing and this was renowned as one of the most dangerous junctions in wexford, it may warn others to be a little more careful. Say what you will, unless you have lost someone in this way, it's unfair to pass judgement.

If people are putting up stuff on public property I'll comment where I see fit. If the junction is so dangerous I assume it has an "accident Blackspot" sign then. If it doesn't, have you contacted the council to have one erected. Those signs are what warn people of highly dangerous parts of the road network.

And finally, I do know people who have been lost in road accidents and they haven't gone around littering the countryside with monuments.

User45701

I have no problem with them what so ever. people put shrine and croses on the side of the road if they want, hoever i would vote to ban them if i or anyone elce could not put something they want on the side of the road.

its a road, i doubt the people putting the shrines there bought or even rent that small patch of land, i see nothing wrong with memorials there i just think if they are allowed then anyone should be allowed to put anyhting (bar porno and raciest statements ect) on the side of the road

LorraineL

They don't really bother me all that much. I would prefer to see a simple plaque or cross but who am I to say how families should mourn.

Does anyone know the name of the place where there are loads of white crosses on a long stretch of road in memory of the people who died there. There are a load of them one after the other and it really brings it home how many people have actually been killed there.