Ways to regain money instead of hitting the Public Sector

OhNoYouDidn't

truthflyer wrote: »

Roll on the industrial action you will get NO sympathy!

I'm private sector and I would 100% support industrial action here. It is an ill thought out punitive attack on a sector of the economy that did not cause this mess. They are willing to take their share - this is too much.

Cowen is out of his depth and anything that escalates his departure is ok with me.

djpbarry

deisebabe wrote: »

This country is in dire straights because of a combination of the overpaid civil servants and contractors as well as financing refugees that come here to take the p*ss.

I think this is the third post I have read recently in which refugees are being blamed for our current economic crisis. I’m not sure whether I should laugh or cry.

Zionist wrote: »

A fireman is overpaid, you must say that him when he is cutting you out of a car or saving your life.

A Garda is overpaid when he is tackling hardened criminals and risking his/her life.

A Solider is overpaid when he/she is in chad etc putting his life at risk or doing CIT in Ireland.

A Nurse is overpaid when they are helping you in a hospital,delivering your children or saving your life...

Do all public servants fall into one of the above categories? Do all firemen, Gardaí, soldiers and nurses perform their duties to the best of their abilities?

truthflyer

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I'm private sector and I would 100% support industrial action here. It is an ill thought out punitive attack on a sector of the economy that did not cause this mess. They are willing to take their share - this is too much.

Cowen is out of his depth and anything that escalates his departure is ok with me.

Strike then, see if anybody cares.

You lot have burnt your bridges already.

The lack of "public services" would go largely unnoticed as you are so unproductive anyways

I just hope you don't get paid if you do strike but I expect you will as this government is spineless

guinnessdrinker

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I'm private sector and I would 100% support industrial action here. It is an ill thought out punitive attack on a sector of the economy that did not cause this mess. They are willing to take their share - this is too much.

Cowen is out of his depth and anything that escalates his departure is ok with me.

I would agree with OhNoYouDidn't. While the public sector is far from perfect, they do seem to be made out as scapegoats for the failing of the economy at the moment. What about the construction and banking sectors and the failure of the governments actions?

While the money being paid by public sector workers is going into their pension, the way it is being done is like a pay cut. Many mortgages were secured on the basis of what they were earning and these mortgages and other bills still have to be paid but now with reduced weekly or monthly wages.

Plus, this will lead to reduced spending due to the reduction in wages which will have it's own knock on effects for the economy.

stevoman

truthflyer wrote: »

Roll on the industrial action you will get NO sympathy!

its not about sympathy is about pressure. the civil service could pull out social welfare in the morning and the unions funds could well afford to pay them for weeks and weeks along with what sympathy money would come from other departments.

OhNoYouDidn't

truthflyer wrote: »

Strike then, see if anybody cares.

You lot have burnt your bridges already.

The lack of "public services" would go largely unnoticed as you are so unproductive anyways

I just hope you don't get paid if you do strike but I expect you will as this government is spineless

Whats this 'you lot' business? I'm private sector. But i have sympathy for the public sector as they are shouldering the brunt of FF mismanagement of the crisis.

What are the bets you want overtime scrapped but still demand an immediate Garda response and improved waiting list times in A&E and see no contradiction.

Loving the idea of spineless FF in relation to the public sector this morning.....

Total incoherence truthflyer.

stevoman

truthflyer wrote: »

You lot have burnt your bridges already.

The lack of "public services" would go largely unnoticed as you are so unproductive anyways

how have public servants burnt their bridges? they are the ones being attacked by the goverment and media even though thet are humans with familys and lives and aspirations aswell.

a lot of them havnt had the chance of getting overtime and the perks the private sectors have for the last tens years. there are plenty of lower paid public servants across the boards.

and branding it all as just the public sector is ridiculous there are so many different departmets and jobs its ridiculous. a carpenter and a bank manager are private sector. hardly the same job criteria.

grahamo

truthflyer wrote: »

Strike then, see if anybody cares.

Are you 12? Of course people will care. EVERYONE will be affected.

truthflyer wrote: »

You lot have burnt your bridges already.

A lot of ordinary people I know have no beef with any public sector workers. It seems to be the people who grew up with everything handed to them on a plate that are the begrudgers!

truthflyer wrote: »

The lack of "public services" would go largely unnoticed as you are so unproductive anyways

:D You keep telling yourself that.

truthflyer wrote: »

I just hope you don't get paid if you do strike but I expect you will as this government is spineless

People that go on strike don't get paid! they are paid a small allowance by their Union. Anyone in the workforce long enough would know that!

DJDC

I'm private sector and I would 100% support industrial action here. It is an ill thought out punitive attack on a sector of the economy that did not cause this mess. They are willing to take their share - this is too much.

Cowen is out of his depth and anything that escalates his departure is ok with me.

Think carefully. The situation is very precarious for Ireland right now. If the public sector goes on a prolonged strike, the country will go bankrupt. ISEQ will collapse, credit rating will plunge and IMF will be called in to deal with situation. As we have seen from some comments in this thread, there will a rise in extreme right and left wing sentiments and country will become a basket case.

The country is in big trouble, by going on strike you are just going make it worse. Anyone with a bit of sense will realise that.

Boggle

If the public sector goes on a prolonged strike, the country will go bankrupt.

If the welfare office strike for one week we will have 300,000 unemployed people who cannot afford to feed themselves or their family and bankruptcy will be the last problem we will have. I have said it before but they say that a country is 3 missed meals away from revolt.

A bit of Dail burning would be fun though...:p

OhNoYouDidn't

DJDC wrote: »

Think carefully. The situation is very precarious for Ireland right now. If the public sector goes on a prolonged strike, the country will go bankrupt. ISEQ will collapse, credit rating will plunge and IMF will be called in to deal with situation. As we have seen from some comments in this thread, there will a rise in extreme right and left wing sentiments and country will become a basket case.

The country is in big trouble, by going on strike you are just going make it worse. Anyone with a bit of sense will realise that.

Fearmongering aside I don't think it will be prolonged or a strike. The two tactics I have heard mentioned from within the service are to withdraw all staff from ministers offices and not pay social welfare payments.

There will be action, but we are a long way from a general strike.

I stand over my belief that some short term pain is needed to remove FF from office before they make the mess outlined above.

truthflyer

grahamo wrote: »

Are you 12? Of course people will care. EVERYONE will be affected.

A lot of ordinary people I know have no beef with any public sector workers. It seems to be the people who grew up with everything handed to them on a plate that are the begrudgers!



:D You keep telling yourself that.



People that go on strike don't get paid! they are paid a small allowance by their Union. Anyone in the workforce long enough would know that!

1, I won't be one of them.
2. You need to get out more and hear public opinion, the public service is VERY unpopular.
3. Excellent news, I would hate to think I had to keep contributing to the spongers while they are sat around on their laurels, oh I almost forgot they normally are!

irish_bob

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

No, they are being asked to put MORE of their own money in, pay the 1% levy and forego an agreed pay rise.

Thats a de facto 15% paycut.

Have a little think about that when the inevitble industrial action happens.

do me a favour and let me know when you plan to strike , that way i can plan my trip to the local green grocer , he always has to throw out a percentage of rancid tomatoes

stevoman

truthflyer wrote: »

Excellent news, I would hate to think I had to keep contributing to the spongers while they are sat around on their laurels, oh I almost forgot they normally are!

you are prob the most ill informed person i have come across on the politics forum. your arguements are crap to be honest.

are you home sick from school today by any chance?

jmayo

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Fearmongering aside I don't think it will be prolonged or a strike. The two tactics I have heard mentioned from within the service are to withdraw all staff from ministers offices and not pay social welfare payments.

There will be action, but we are a long way from a general strike.

I stand over my belief that some short term pain is needed to remove FF from office before they make the mess outlined above.

As someone who works in the private sector I find it weird that you carry such a torch for the public sector ?
Do you mind me asking do you have partner, parents in public sector ?

I believe I have asked you and others with the same opinion, in other threads where will we get the money to keep paying the public sector wages and pensions ?
All I ever get back is :
- tax the rich private sector executives
- tax landlords
- tax develoeprs
or
- it is not the fault of public sector workers so why should they pay anything
- it is the fault of private sector banks so why should public sector pay to rescue them

The first three should be done but it still would not pay the huge public wage and pension bill.

The last two are true to an extent, but there are culprits in public sector who did very well out of our boom years and in fact did nothing to prevent the housing bubble. Not everyone in private sector is at fault either.

Do we decimate services (cra* as they often already are) that public sector provides to the public, just so that the public sector employees can enjoy their pensions, perks and high wages ?

Do we tax private sector enterprise out of existence altogether, do we increase income tax back to 60% ?

If we refuse to tackle the deficit and the public sector spend we will reach a time when we can not borrow anymore.
What do we do then when ECB and even worse the IMF arrive ?

A little question for public sector workers and people who see their entitlments as correct ...

You cannot pay the household bills, your family's income is not enough anymore.
Do you
a) continue to spend as normal doing nothing about problem (if might go away)
c) continue to spend as normal but borrow even more to pay the bills
b) go ahead and build that new extension with another credit union loan
d) give the kids an allowance increase, after all you promised them and they half clean their rooms now
e) cut back on all expenses to try and work your way out of it

Answers on a postcard to SIPTU, ICTU, IMPACT, NBU, etc

stevoman

irish_bob wrote: »

he always has to throw out a percentage of rancid tomatoes

why? so you can throw them at somewhon who makes 31K a year, has a mortgage and kids and partner cant find work and now has to take a 6% decrease along with the 1% levy out of their wages. fair play.

truthflyer

stevoman wrote: »

you are prob the most ill informed person i have come across on the politics forum. your arguements are crap to be honest.

are you home sick from school today by any chance?

Sounds like the truth hurts!!

And I for one am delighted........

truthflyer

stevoman wrote: »

why? so you can throw them at somewhon who makes 31K a year, has a mortgage and kids and partner cant find work and now has to take a 6% decrease along with the 1% levy out of their wages. fair play.

Yep, more or less!!

I am selling tickets to the event..........:p

stevoman

truthflyer wrote: »

Sounds like the truth hurts!!

well not exactly. im just putting forward the arguement for other public servants. Personally what i lose as a public servant i gain straight back on the family income supplement which i now qualify for. plus that also waves the 1% levy aswell. :cool:

OhNoYouDidn't

irish_bob wrote: »

do me a favour and let me know when you plan to strike , that way i can plan my trip to the local green grocer , he always has to throw out a percentage of rancid tomatoes

I WORK IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR. How many times....

I must say, fair play to IBEC and the Indo, they have split the Irish workers in two. With worrying ease.

ionix5891

stevoman wrote: »

why? so you can throw them at somewhon who makes 31K a year, has a mortgage and kids and partner cant find work and now has to take a 6% decrease along with the 1% levy out of their wages. fair play.

average pay for the Public servants is €45,000
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/financial-crisis/83642bn-cuts-cowen-lays-it-on-the-line-1626313.html

thats quite a bit compared to private sector, and you get other perks and benefits and nice job security

Dictator

It's about time that the public sector coughed up, the private sector pays their wages and their pensions? this is madness, if any of the unions go on strike we should protest against them, enough is enough......., I agree that the teachers, garda, nurses, doctors and fire service provide us with an excellent service but the rest are questionable, One way of tackling the pensions would of been aged based. In private companies it's 5% of your salary for below 30's increasing upwards as you get older.

There's still alot of dead weight in the public that needs to be dealt with, suppose that for next year, our
politicians have worked hard enough for this year

OhNoYouDidn't

jmayo wrote: »

As someone who works in the private sector I find it weird that you carry such a torch for the public sector ?

I'm not carrying a torch for anyone. I see an ill concieved attack on workers rights to bail out failed and corrupt financial entities and I object.

jmayo wrote: »

Do you mind me asking do you have partner, parents in public sector ?

No. Partner private like me, parents; one private, one self employed.

OhNoYouDidn't

Dictator wrote: »

It's about time that the public sector coughed up, the private sector pays their wages and their pensions? this is madness, if any of the unions go on strike we should protest against them, enough is enough......., I agree that the teachers, garda, nurses, doctors and fire service provide us with an excellent service but the rest are questionable, One way of tackling the pensions would of been aged based. In private companies it's 5% of your salary for below 30's increasing upwards as you get older.

There's still alot of dead weight in the public that needs to be dealt with, suppose that for next year, our
politicians have worked hard enough for this year

the public sector pay tax too....

Dictator

tax back on the private sector's tax

OhNoYouDidn't

ionix5891 wrote: »

average pay for the Public servants is €45,000
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/financial-crisis/83642bn-cuts-cowen-lays-it-on-the-line-1626313.html

thats quite a bit compared to private sector, and you get other perks and benefits and nice job security

that €45k includes politicians, judges, surgeons etc.

the private sector equivalent does not include the self employed; developers, barristers, solicitors, GP's etc.

totally skewed statistic from, wait for it, the Indo.

stevoman

ionix5891 wrote: »

average pay for the Public servants is €45,000
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/financial-crisis/83642bn-cuts-cowen-lays-it-on-the-line-1626313.html

thats quite a bit compared to private sector, and you get other perks and benefits and nice job security

average pay across, county council, army, civil service, the navy, the air core, the nurse, the hse staff, gardai i can go on.

private sector, carpenter, bank manager, shop assistent , horse tycoon, hotel owner, bar man i can go on.

all of these in both sectors al have strikingly different jobs, so in my opinion thats a sweeping average.

if a clerical officer in the civil service for instance works for 40 years the highest pay they can ever get is.............. €39558. thats €5000 short of the average.

more codge from the papers.

grahamo

truthflyer wrote: »

1, I won't be one of them.

I'm sure you won't. you are quite obviously on another f***ing planet.

truthflyer wrote: »

2. You need to get out more and hear public opinion, the public service is VERY unpopular.

Would that be GENERAL public opinion, or middle class, silver spoon fed,Irish Indo fed opinion?

truthflyer wrote: »

3. Excellent news, I would hate to think I had to keep contributing to the spongers while they are sat around on their laurels, oh I almost forgot they normally are!

I doubt very much you contribute to anyone or anything.

Pal

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

No, they are being asked to put MORE of their own money in, pay the 1% levy and forego an agreed pay rise.

Thats a de facto 15% paycut.

Have a little think about that when the inevitble industrial action happens.

these people need their heads examining (as Roy Keane would say).

Public Sector contribute 15% of salary to their own pension and then go on strike because they put money in their own pension.

sorry. I am lost by this reasoning and more so by anybody who actually supports this lets hold the country to ransome attitude.

are we the beleaguered PAYE private sector supposed to top them up ?

GTF

Ronald Reagan showed the way.

oscarBravo

Polite notice:

This forum is for grown-up discussion.

Anyone who wants to take a holiday from this forum, keep throwing the childish crap around. Anyone who's interested in a serious discussion is welcome to stick around.