Missing (stolen) library books

House of Wolves

Hey I was just wondering how do so many books get stolen from the library? also do people think its right to steal a book? the reason i ask is because i went to get a book and the majority of them are "missing"

spoonbadger

House of Wolves wrote: »

Hey I was just wondering how do so many books get stolen from the library? also do people think its right to steal a book? the reason i ask is because i went to get a book and the majority of them are "missing"

They're not missing.

The librarians just dont like you.

Time Magazine

House of Wolves wrote: »

Hey I was just wondering how do so many books get stolen from the library?

I suspect that if the answer were known, it'd be rectified. I always laughed that you could open the windows in the Berkeley, though.

also do people think its right to steal a book?

I think you know the answer to this one.

the reason i ask is because i went to get a book and the majority of them are "missing"

Which book?

Windows in the library here open fully. You often see plastic bags on ropes swinging from them!

House of Wolves

Macroeconomics by robert j. barro. i actually renewed it there online, but alot them have got missing. its annoying because il need it before my exams in a few weeks and the demand is going to rise pretty soon.

i know its wrong to steal the books, but I do understand why people would. im sure there is people on this that have done so and maybe they can justify themselves or maybe "friends they know"

Time Magazine

House of Wolves wrote: »

Macroeconomics by robert j. barro

I have a copy I almost never use. If you are willing and able to get to UCD, I'll lend it to you.

House of Wolves

Oh wow thats really nice! Thanks! eh yea i could get out to UCD in the next few days. i plan on meeting a friend there sometime this week. Would you be there in the evening time? Note i have only been in UCD once ever (for an open day) so im pretty clueless of the place.....

Time Magazine

Yeah I regularly stay in the library until pretty late so if you pick a day and I don't have plans I'll just have a study session. PM me and we'll sort something out.

Kwekubo

Were you looking for the book today? If so they might just be sitting out on trolleys/desks, only the library guards operate on Sundays so there will be a bit of a backlog in stacking.

Corruptedmorals

But how can you graduate if you have a book sitting on your records that you stole?

Time Magazine

Corruptedmorals wrote: »

But how can you graduate if you have a book sitting on your records that you stole?

So innocent for a girl with a name like that . You don't have the book issued out on your account before you steal it.

Neverwhere

stealing is wrong....duhhh!

Corruptedmorals

The Economist wrote: »

So innocent for a girl with a name like that . You don't have the book issued out on your account before you steal it.

Ah I was thinking..but the doors beep and then I saw the references to windows.

shay_562

Corruptedmorals wrote:

Ah I was thinking..but the doors beep and then I saw the references to windows.

The doors don't always beep. I accidentally (no, seriously) stole "The Tipping Point" back in first year - I was photocopying pages from it in Counter Reserve and had my bag in there with me because it was my first time in there and I hadn't seen the signs. When I was done I shoved the photocopies and the book in my bag without even thinking and wandered out - it was nearly a week before I found it in the bottom of my rucksack.

OP, what annoys me more is when people hide copies of books somewhere around the library that only they know, particularly when it's one copy of a book with many copies, because it means that you can't reserve *any* of the copies since the computer registers one as still being in the library.

House of Wolves

shay_562 wrote: »

OP, what annoys me more is when people hide copies of books somewhere around the library that only they know, particularly when it's one copy of a book with many copies, because it means that you can't reserve *any* of the copies since the computer registers one as still being in the library.

Yea that is real annoying. there is always the possiblity that someone is using it within the library but thats pretty rare. i guess some people just look after themselves and dont care about anyone else! not exactly suprising though.....

shay_562

shay_562 wrote: »

The doors don't always beep. I accidentally (no, seriously) stole "The Tipping Point" back in first year - I was photocopying pages from it in Counter Reserve and had my bag in there with me because it was my first time in there and I hadn't seen the signs. When I was done I shoved the photocopies and the book in my bag without even thinking and wandered out - it was nearly a week before I found it in the bottom of my rucksack.

OP, what annoys me more is when people hide copies of books somewhere around the library that only they know, particularly when it's one copy of a book with many copies, because it means that you can't reserve *any* of the copies since the computer registers one as still being in the library.

Counter reserve books are often untagged. I know quite a few people who gotten books out that way.

Caoimhe89

The worst thing I have ever seen done is when I was looking for an article for History. In the bibliography we had been given, it was listed under a journal and a book. I found the journal, went to photocopy it, only to find that the first page had been torn straight out. So I went to the book, only to find that the first page had also been torn out of that. And the worst thing is, when I told the librarian, all they said was "Oh, that happens all the time with Law."

Boston

Caoimhe89 wrote: »

The worst thing I have ever seen done is when I was looking for an article for History. In the bibliography we had been given, it was listed under a journal and a book. I found the journal, went to photocopy it, only to find that the first page had been torn straight out. So I went to the book, only to find that the first page had also been torn out of that. And the worst thing is, when I told the librarian, all they said was "Oh, that happens all the time with Law."

Yep. Complete bastards.

Unshelved

What can we do? Send the Library bloodhounds after them?

Report any damaged or defaced books to Library Staff and we'll do our best to repair or replace them.

People who steal or deface Library books should remember that if caught, they could be subjected to a ban from the Library and a major fine. They should also think about their classmates and how they are deliberately depriving them of important Library resources through their own selfishness.

claire h

Unshelved wrote: »

What can we do? Send the Library bloodhounds after them?

Oh, do, please! It is what book thieves, unless appearing in a Markus Zusak novel, deserve.

Re: hidden books - are shelvers ever asked to keep an eye out for books that might be in the wrong place? I've heard of people hiding books for months at a time, and in the same spot in the library, it seems strange that no one would reshelve them.

Borneo Fnctn

Unshelved wrote: »

What can we do? Send the Library bloodhounds after them?

Report any damaged or defaced books to Library Staff and we'll do our best to repair or replace them.

People who steal or deface Library books should remember that if caught, they could be subjected to a ban from the Library and a major fine. They should also think about their classmates and how they are deliberately depriving them of important Library resources through their own selfishness.

Out of curiosity, do you often catch people? It really is despicable. Theft is bad but sabotage is just low.

skregs

I've heard horror stories of people hiding books or defacing them because they're on a grading curve and theoretically gain more marks by screwing over everyone else

NADA

Unshelved wrote: »

They should also think about their classmates and how they are deliberately depriving them of important Library resources through their own selfishness.

LOL LOL LOL LOL LMAO.................... yeah

Thirdfox

Yes, happens in Law class - I wouldn't mind people getting expelled for wilful and malicious violations committed against books in the library - here in the US we have the honour code and people do get judged, sentenced and I believe in 2 cases last year severely reprimanded/expelled for breaching the code.

A university is first and foremost an institution of learning. Tearing pages out of books, defacing passages with black ink (drawing snails on the side while "wrong" can be funny for the right legal cases ) and doing that 'hide one book so no one can get a reserve against the remainder' (which I have all experienced in my 2 years studying at Trinity) is the lowest of the low. I shudder to think what kind of lawyers these people will become.

I have studied in a Chinese uni and am currently in an American one - both of their libraries seem to have less problems than ours (though a lot more resources are located on the internet and US students buy all their core books), I wonder are the punishments harsher/enforcement more strigent or more people simply have a better moral compass there.

As a side note - it is amazing how the honour code works here - professors trust students to take home a closed book exam, no one monitors us for cheating etc. etc. - but because people trust us to be adults (cheating in an exam ultimately harms ourselves) people act like one. However, for some reason I'm not sure we could introduce it into Ireland

edit:

Unshelved wrote: »

People who steal or deface Library books should remember that if caught, they could be subjected to a ban from the Library and a major fine. They should also think about their classmates and how they are deliberately depriving them of important Library resources through their own selfishness.

Like I said above - I'd be in favour of a much harsher penalty than a mere fine - suspension of the degree or even dismissal depending on severity.

And I'd say it's fine for them to be selfish - but their actions are not even helping themselves...do they believe they can "cheat" in court? Steal from opposing counsel? Lawyers get a bad rep from...well everyone, we certainly do not need people like this to join the profession and sully its name further.

This really angers me because I have witnessed it so many times (I used to think it was a joke until it actually happened). In fact my American law friends still think it's an urban legend (certain universities have a reputation here of having "bad" students who do this).

Not to be harping on about how great the US honour code is - but here, if all the books are out I can log onto the system and email one of the people who has taken out a copy and ask them if I can borrow it for a few hours/days etc. afterwards I'll just return it to them. How great is that?



Rant over.

Thirdfox

Thirdfox wrote: »

Yes, happens in Law class - I wouldn't mind people getting expelled for wilful and malicious violations committed against books in the library - here in the US we have the honour code and people do get judged, sentenced and I believe in 2 cases last year severely reprimanded/expelled for breaching the code.

A university is first and foremost an institution of learning. Tearing pages out of books, defacing passages with black ink (drawing snails on the side while "wrong" can be funny for the right legal cases ) and doing that 'hide one book so no one can get a reserve against the remainder' (which I have all experienced in my 2 years studying at Trinity) is the lowest of the low. I shudder to think what kind of lawyers these people will become.

I have studied in a Chinese uni and am currently in an American one - both of their libraries seem to have less problems than ours (though a lot more resources are located on the internet and US students buy all their core books), I wonder are the punishments harsher/enforcement more strigent or more people simply have a better moral compass there.

As a side note - it is amazing how the honour code works here - professors trust students to take home a closed book exam, no one monitors us for cheating etc. etc. - but because people trust us to be adults (cheating in an exam ultimately harms ourselves) people act like one. However, for some reason I'm not sure we could introduce it into Ireland

edit:

Like I said above - I'd be in favour of a much harsher penalty than a mere fine - suspension of the degree or even dismissal depending on severity.

And I'd say it's fine for them to be selfish - but their actions are not even helping themselves...do they believe they can "cheat" in court? Steal from opposing counsel? Lawyers get a bad rep from...well everyone, we certainly do not need people like this to join the profession and sully its name further.

This really angers me because I have witnessed it so many times (I used to think it was a joke until it actually happened). In fact my American law friends still think it's an urban legend (certain universities have a reputation here of having "bad" students who do this).

Not to be harping on about how great the US honour code is - but here, if all the books are out I can log onto the system and email one of the people who has taken out a copy and ask them if I can borrow it for a few hours/days etc. afterwards I'll just return it to them. How great is that?



Rant over.

For those who did the BESS law course, it is obvious that some of the cases have been on the reading lest for a long time as there are many, many years of sardonic comments aimed at bess people on some of the journals.

Makes for much more interesting reading the case itself!

Thirdfox

I've read some hilarious commentary on cases before - a lot of abuse directed at homophobic judges, verses telling a plaintiff what she can go do to herself etc.

That's why I prefer to read the physical books over online references

Unshelved

Re: hidden books - are shelvers ever asked to keep an eye out for books that might be in the wrong place? I've heard of people hiding books for months at a time, and in the same spot in the library, it seems strange that no one would reshelve them.

Go to the Duty Librarian's desk and fill out a query card. We'll do our best to track the hidden book down for you.

Boston

Thirdfox wrote: »

I have studied in a Chinese uni and am currently in an American one - both of their libraries seem to have less problems than ours (though a lot more resources are located on the internet and US students buy all their core books), I wonder are the punishments harsher/enforcement more strigent or more people simply have a better moral compass there.

As a side note - it is amazing how the honour code works here - professors trust students to take home a closed book exam, no one monitors us for cheating etc. etc. - but because people trust us to be adults (cheating in an exam ultimately harms ourselves) people act like one. However, for some reason I'm not sure we could introduce it into Ireland

I don't think you're being fair to students here. In general its amazingly easy for people to cheat on assignments and course work, a certain number will and the majority won't. This isn't out of fear of being caught but rather their own moral code.

Additionally the problem is that trinity simply isn't serious about punishing those who do cheat. There is often an attitude that if we don't acknowledge it, it will go away. (typically Irish) even an attitude that if students feel the need to cheat then that is somehow the lectures fault. I remember one lecture going to great lengths to persuade me not to start formal proceedings against cheats I'd caught red handed, as it would be a black mark on the course as a hole. Basically the appearance of having honorable students is more important here then the actuality of it.

But rant aside, it is generally easy to spot cheats, even in take home closed book examinations. Catching people is never the problem, having the balls to adequately punish the students once caught is the problem. Your university seems to have the resolve to do this, trinity simply doesn't. Nothing to do with individual moral code.

Caoimhe89

Thirdfox wrote: »

I've read some hilarious commentary on cases before - a lot of abuse directed at homophobic judges, verses telling a plaintiff what she can go do to herself etc.

That's why I prefer to read the physical books over online references

I have absolutely nothing against the commentaries in the margins; they're all over the older books in both English and History. And they're hilarious. Especially about Wilde/Milton/Irish nationalism. It's only when a book is maliciously defaced so that others cannot use it at all that it becomes a problem.

lilmizzme

Caoimhe89 wrote: »

I have absolutely nothing against the commentaries in the margins; they're all over the older books in both English and History. And they're hilarious. Especially about Wilde/Milton/Irish nationalism. It's only when a book is maliciously defaced so that others cannot use it at all that it becomes a problem.

Yeah, anything to distract me from those assignments! The funniest is when strangers start having conversations in the margins, as in one writes "Hey" Some other randomer (i assume) replies "Hello" the the conversation goes on for ages...was getting whole life stories over about 4 margins! Excellent stuff!!

Prof.Badass

The door does beep sometimes (i've seen it), but i also managed to accidentaly steal a book my friend had taken out (he left it on the desk and i thought he owned it so i took it to our lab to give it back to him).

Maybe certain types of books can get through (i'm not the most avid studier so i'd know less than many 1st years about the workings of the library).

I managed to trick my friend into holding the book for a few seconds and ran off. good times .