Now they want to take away our minimum wage

banshee_bones

zreba wrote: »

so you see, you can find cheaper accommodation now, you just need to wait until your old contract finishes and vuala

EH. by the time THAT happens i probably wont even be living in Galway, hopefully let alone Ireland for that matter.

taram

I work in a shoe shop and we all get paid 9.09+ an hour, regardless of our contracts/ages/sales skills which is bollocks. Three of us are full time, fully trained, and have 2+ years of retail experience and we get paid the exact same as the 16 year old gob****es who drink in the stockroom on a Sunday and they get paid double for it! Similarly we had a girl out "sick" with suspicious doctors notes and was seen out clubbing etc and she got full pay for 3 months. It's retailers who need to take a long look at where their funds are going, they're the ones paying out, not the government.

And yes, I'd be better off on the dole, but would be miserable.

Red Sleeping Beauty

taram wrote: »

I work in a shoe shop and we all get paid 9.09+ an hour, regardless of our contracts/ages/sales skills which is bollocks. Three of us are full time, fully trained, and have 2+ years of retail experience and we get paid the exact same as the 16 year old gob****es who drink in the stockroom on a Sunday and they get paid double for it! Similarly we had a girl out "sick" with suspicious doctors notes and was seen out clubbing etc and she got full pay for 3 months. It's retailers who need to take a long look at where their funds are going, they're the ones paying out, not the government.

And yes, I'd be better off on the dole, but would be miserable.

I don't thikn you can fairly apply the situation in your job to the whole of Dublin or the whole of Ireland.

If the 16yr old is drinking -report him
I don't think it's any of your business with regards girl out "sick". In your situation you need to work closely to what's specified in your contract and make sure that you're not taken advantage of/exploited.

taram

alan dunne 27 wrote: »

I don't thikn you can fairly apply the situation in your job to the whole of Dublin or the whole of Ireland.

If the 16yr old is drinking -report him
I don't think it's any of your business with regards girl out "sick". In your situation you need to work closely to what's specified in your contract and make sure that you're not taken advantage of/exploited.

Quite probably being taken advantage of, the girl who was sick was my partner fror my area in the shop, I did two people's work for 3 months for the same wage. And anything that happens on the weekend is ignored, as no managers work then. But that's another thread I guess...

Maybe it's just Cork so, can name about 10 different businesses where they blanket pay minimum wage workers, but guess if they got rid of the younger/less experienced ones the others would have to pick up the slack for the same wage :P

Red Sleeping Beauty

Sounds like you need to read the riot act to your boss.

Tony Broke

How thick are these ***** like :mad:

The dole is €200+, so why the hell would you work ( probably your arse off ) for 100 euro minus extra expenses?

Dropping the dole to €100 or getting rid of it completely ( anyone over 6 months knocked off ) and a whole load of other measures is the only way we are going to see cheap worthwhile employment again.

Nehaxak

Tony Broke wrote: »

Dropping the dole to €100 or getting rid of it completely ( anyone over 6 months knocked off ) and a whole load of other measures is the only way we are going to see slavery again.

FYP.

Tony Broke

What we have now is slavery.200 euro+ a week is too much, relative to what workers are getting now.Its crazy money and dont mind me giving me the car loans, credit cards, only an idiot gets a personal loan for anything besides a house or a way to make more money.

Nehaxak

Tony Broke wrote: »

What we have now is slavery.200 euro+ a week is too much, relative to what workers are getting now.Its crazy money and dont mind me giving me the car loans, credit cards, only an idiot gets a personal loan for anything besides a house or a way to make more money.

So your first thoughts are to blame people on the dole rather than IBEC and the likes of the other lobbyists and so called "employer groups" pushing for further reductions in the minimum wage, or the employers themselves who won't pay people more (if not less a lot of them as it's rarely enforced) than the bare minimum wage ?

As much as I'm not a union man, I detest rotten greedy employers and the scum that's in the likes of IBEC for degenerating workers rights and the very basic minimum wage.

The very last people, very very last, if ever even at all, I would blame would be people on the dole.

Tony Broke

The Dole is too high, wages are too high, profits for most companies are too low.We lived in a dream world for a few years and it has to end now for almost everybody!!

Employers are ****ed, they are not being greedy.

Nehaxak

Tony Broke wrote: »

The Dole is too high, wages are too high, profits for most companies are too low.We lived in a dream world for a few years and it has to end now for almost everybody!!

Employers are ****ed, they are not being greedy.

So what you want then in essence is people to work for your failing business for less money to keep your business running ? O.o

javaboy

Nehaxak wrote: »

So what you want then in essence is people to work for your failing business for less money to keep your business running ? O.o

Um yeah. Of course. Many businesses are failing through no fault of their own. Employees expected and received more money in the good times. It's only right that their salaries should be adjusted in the bad times.

Would you rather his failing business failed and had to let people go altogether than to see costs being cut sensibly with a view to long term stability and a return to profitability?

Tech3

Tony Broke wrote: »

The Dole is too high, wages are too high, profits for most companies are too low.We lived in a dream world for a few years and it has to end now for almost everybody!!

Employers are ****ed, they are not being greedy.

Agree totally with your post. The problem lies with the cost of food and energy prices are through the roof.

A normal Aldi store here has to pay the double the price for electricity compared to a store in the uk. This increases the price of product in that store and thus we need super high wages to survive in this country. If the government dont sort out the high cost of energy and food here it will be severly in debt in the coming years as they will have to fork out billions for the dole and less tax income. So back to the thread the minimun wage will have to be reduced at some stage but will have to be on the same scale as the drop in the cost of living.

Nehaxak

javaboy wrote: »

Um yeah. Of course. Many businesses are failing through no fault of their own. Employees expected and received more money in the good times. It's only right that their salaries should be adjusted in the bad times.

Would you rather his failing business failed and had to let people go altogether than to see costs being cut sensibly with a view to long term stability and a return to profitability?

Not every employee received more money and there were and still are a huge amount of workers struggling to make ends meet on a minimum wage.

If you can't even afford to pay the minimum wage and insist on blaming the pitiful amount of money given to people on the dole as a cause as to why you can't get employee's, well then you shouldn't even be in business, close it and get over it.
So yes I would rather see his business fail and the more this recession gets rid of these shambles of badly run businesses the better.

People might be better off financially on the dole than on the minimum wage, but that is the fault of IBEC and greedy employers who refused to share profits among their workers and NOT the people on the dole.
If anyone is to blame it's him for not running his business correctly in the first place and having backup or even exit plans/strategies thought about beforehand.
Anyone with any sense at all knew damn well this economy bubble was going to burst, it wasn't a matter of "if" it was a matter of "when". Failing to see that and failing to have strategies in place for that is not the fault of those on the dole, or your employees, but of those that run the business.
I have absolutely no sympathies for businesses run into the ground because of their own incompetence.

javaboy

Nehaxak wrote: »

Not every employee received more money and there were and still are a huge amount of workers struggling to make ends meet on a minimum wage.

If you can't even afford to pay the minimum wage and insist on blaming the pitiful amount of money given to people on the dole as a cause as to why you can't get employee's, well then you shouldn't even be in business, close it and get over it.
So yes I would rather see his business fail and the more this recession gets rid of these shambles of badly run businesses the better.

People might be better off financially on the dole than on the minimum wage, but that is the fault of IBEC and greedy employers who refused to share profits among their workers and NOT the people on the dole.
If anyone is to blame it's him for not running his business correctly in the first place and having backup or even exit plans/strategies thought about beforehand.
Anyone with any sense at all knew damn well this economy bubble was going to burst, it wasn't a matter of "if" it was a matter of "when". Failing to see that and failing to have strategies in place for that is not the fault of those on the dole, or your employees, but of those that run the business.
I have absolutely no sympathies for businesses run into the ground because of their own incompetence.

Fair enough. I get what you're saying and I share some of your views on it and the principle of the thing and all. But it's a case of cutting your nose off to spite your face if people expect to continue to get paid the same wages you did during the boom years*. Numerous businesses going to the wall isn't going to do people much good. A job at a badly run company is better than no job at all. And the less employees and business there are paying tax, the less affordable those dole payments will become. So the situation will only get worse.

It's a lot easier to fix/reform an economy or an ailing business than it is to start one from scratch. If people+unions don't accept that wages need to be adjusted regardless of whether the employer's or uncontrollable/unforeseeable external forces are to blame, then they'll bring the country to its knees and end up worse off anyway.

There's no point playing the blame game.


*Yes I accept not everyone got big money from the boom but my point still stands and still applies to those who are receving a minimum wage that was btw established during the boom years.

994

This is nonsense. Wages only represent a small percentage of employers' expenditure. This will squeeze the poor even tighter so that Fiachra and Yseult can afford an cor for little Saoirse - I mean, all her friends have one. As always, socialism for the rich and capitalism for the poor.

Peanut

994 wrote: »

...Wages only represent a small percentage of employers' expenditure...

Where did you get that idea from? Irish Ferries? :pac:

A quick search suggests that staff expenditure represents roughly 50% of operating costs for Irish retailers, as an example.

Highsider

Jesus....did'nt realise the minimum wage was that low. 8.65??? How can someone get by on that kind of money. Surely you would get more on the dole?

Heroditas

tech2 wrote: »

A normal Aldi store here has to pay the double the price for electricity compared to a store in the uk.

Sure about that?

sdanseo

Nehaxak wrote: »

The very last people, very very last, if ever even at all, I would blame would be people on the dole.

Except the ones who shouldn't or don't need to be on it. Such people are creaming the system.

Red Sleeping Beauty

sdonn_1 wrote: »

Except the ones who shouldn't or don't need to be on it. Such people are creaming the system.

I'm fighting a losing battle here :mad:

Politicians and millionaires (of which this country has many) cream the system more than that rotten pathetic no good loser/waste of space on the dole could.
When I say "that loser" I of course mean this fictitious person in everyone's heads that's actually creaming the system.

System ? What system ? More like the shitstem.

digitally-yours

I moved to UK from Ireland about 1 year ago when this all was about to unravel and I can tell you one thing for sure.

The price of food is almost half than what you pay in Ireland.

The vat in Ireland is 21.5 %

and UK vat is 15%

The competition here is really fierce for market share.

for example.

compare the mobile phone, broadband or landlines tariffs

The asset prices in Ireland are way over priced the infrastructure is not up to the mark. In good times the investment which should have been made to absorb any shock was not there or was negligible.

I believe Irish economy is going through some serious correction.

If they reduce the MIN wage that has impact on the purchasing power and that will result in further decline of the asset price. More fall in house prices more fall in rents etc.

All the foreign money in retreat Ireland faces a painful adjustment.


that's my opinion and I am sure there will be some who don't agree with me on this.

Spyral

We have the second highest minimum wage in Europe behind Luxembourg.

There is an argument that a high minimum wage can stifle employment levels as it leaves some companies unable to afford extra staff.

Cost of living is high.

In addition if we can afford to pay biffo about 240,000 and the president (who in fairness does sod all) about 260,000 then its a great, rich country and the minimum wage should be increased.

But no, a country which has too many politicians, a higher house which we can't even vote for and is so backwards its farsical can afford to pay biffo almost a quarter million + state pension should be looking at their own wages which are clearly inflated before chopping down the little guy's.

There is no point in working for minimum wage. Go on the dole, get 200+ euro a week and have all the free time to commit crimes and screw the country, just as the government are screwing it. The only difference - they do it under the guise of legality and government.

Red Sleeping Beauty

digitally-yours wrote: »

I moved to UK from Ireland about 1 year ago when this all was about to unravel and I can tell you one thing for sure.

The price of food is almost half than what you pay in Ireland.

The vat in Ireland is 21.5 %

and UK vat is 15%

The competition here is really fierce for market share.

for example.

compare the mobile phone, broadband or landlines tariffs

The asset prices in Ireland are way over priced the infrastructure is not up to the mark. In good times the investment which should have been made to absorb any shock was not there or was negligible.

I believe Irish economy is going through some serious correction.

If they reduce the MIN wage that has impact on the purchasing power and that will result in further decline of the asset price. More fall in house prices more fall in rents etc.

All the foreign money in retreat Ireland faces a painful adjustment.


that's my opinion and I am sure there will be some who don't agree with me on this.

Add to that we've to pay a TV lisence and RTE also has advertisements. The BBC in contrast (for all it's faults) doesn't have ads.

This website allows people who pay a fiver a month turn off the ads - RTE should too.

Eoin

alan dunne 27 wrote: »

Add to that we've to pay a TV lisence and RTE also has advertisements. The BBC in contrast (for all it's faults) doesn't have ads.

They have a much wider base of people to pay up. You really can't make a fair comparison between the two. It's about the same price these days, but only because sterling is weak at the moment.

Red Sleeping Beauty

The sterling has nothing to do with it - RTE get the TV Lisence fee and money from Advertisements and it's a bloody rubbish entity.

Regardless of this being on or off topic, it's a damn shame that people are forced to pay for a TV lisence. ESPECIALLY if they get their TV stations from a third party such as Sky or UPC and not directly from RTE , ie. digitally.

BBC (as far as I know) rolled out a freeview box thingy for digital TV - RTE ? Nah, we'll sit around with our thumbs up our hole while we spend the budget of a small African country on "professional" equipment and give important jobs to our inept family members and friends.

RTE can rot . Just like the rest of them

The_Minister

Alan, read what eoin wrote and respond/rebut it if you can.

Tech3

Heroditas wrote: »

Sure about that?

Was reported on prime time last week, there was a meeting to see why food prices were so much cheaper in the uk than here

spank_inferno

Well it seems like the ministers remark about reducing the min wage got little attention after the unions collectively smacked it down.

A lot of people have made some very good points here.

I can see the point made by some here that reducing the min wage helps adjust everyones wages down. Though I feel the numbers working on min wage are too few to have much of a downward impact on consumer prices overall.

Perhaps reducing it can help competitiveness. But we cannot forget the human impact of reducing the wages of the least of us. Whether it will work or not do those on the bottom rung deserve the hardship of finding out for the rest of us?

My opinion stands that the min wage should remain as is, but I would also say that it shouldnt necessarily be increased for the next 2 years.

Creating employment is the best way to get Ireland back on its feet.

I return to my previous point about waiver of Employer PRSI contributions for some time to help incentivise creating a new job.
Is there anyone here running an SME who would think its a good idea? Are the amounts saved too low for it to be worth it?
Should the gov be looking at employment assistance grants to boost the private sector?

Red Sleeping Beauty

eoin wrote: »

They have a much wider base of people to pay up. You really can't make a fair comparison between the two. It's about the same price these days, but only because sterling is weak at the moment.

BBC also have a much wider service. They don't just have 2stations. Every region in the UK has it's own BBC regional channel - Wales and Scotland have their own channel, as does London I think.

I don't see why RTE can't be run soley from the lisence fee.